stealing door lock security code
11-14-2008, 03:51 PM
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'08 GL 320CDI
stealing door lock security code
I had not heard of this until a friend emailed me about a new concern that I wanted to share with everyone. Apparently there is a new device that has been created that can clone the security code from your vehicle's remote when locking your vehicle. According to police, the way it works is, let's say a thief wants to break into your vehicle while in a parking lot. He/she will hang out in their own vehicle and wait for some unsuspecting motorist who locks their car with the remote as they go do some shopping. The thief's device can read and retain the locking security code as long as they are in close proximity of the vehicle they want to hit. Once the motorist is out of sight, the thief, who figures to have at least a few minutes, simply unlocks the vehicle and grabs anything worth grabbing, and is gone. From what I understand, and to play it safe, it is recommended that motorists hit the interior door lock button when leaving the vehicle. That way, there is no security code that can be intercepted by some thief waiting in the background. I know we take for granted, the convenience of using our remotes which we certainly pay a premium for, but just beware of this possibility that may be lurking out there.
11-14-2008, 04:04 PM
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2008 GL 320 CDI
I had not heard of this until a friend emailed me about a new concern that I wanted to share with everyone. Apparently there is a new device that has been created that can clone the security code from your vehicle's remote when locking your vehicle. According to police, the way it works is, let's say a thief wants to break into your vehicle while in a parking lot. He/she will hang out in their own vehicle and wait for some unsuspecting motorist who locks their car with the remote as they go do some shopping. The thief's device can read and retain the locking security code as long as they are in close proximity of the vehicle they want to hit. Once the motorist is out of sight, the thief, who figures to have at least a few minutes, simply unlocks the vehicle and grabs anything worth grabbing, and is gone. From what I understand, and to play it safe, it is recommended that motorists hit the interior door lock button when leaving the vehicle. That way, there is no security code that can be intercepted by some thief waiting in the background. I know we take for granted, the convenience of using our remotes which we certainly pay a premium for, but just beware of this possibility that may be lurking out there.
In any event, valuable items such as laptops should not be left in your car anyway, since a determined thief could always smash a window to get them.
11-14-2008, 04:36 PM
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2007 E63
This is an urban legend (see, e.g., this article on Snopes.com). Today's technology uses a rolling code system to prevent this. Also, I don't think the GL's doors can be locked manually while the driver's door is open.
In any event, valuable items such as laptops should not be left in your car anyway, since a determined thief could always smash a window to get them.
In any event, valuable items such as laptops should not be left in your car anyway, since a determined thief could always smash a window to get them.
11-14-2008, 04:45 PM
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Any AMG Thats Around..
they use this device in "gone in 60 seconds" .... I believe they grabbed the code for the Escalade and the Garage Door....
It might be movie magic...
It might be movie magic...
11-14-2008, 07:23 PM
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GL450 (Alabaster White/Black Interior)
I remember watching one of the national news programs about a year ago regarding this topic. They were discussing this issue as it related to BMW's and they interviewed a "previous" thief who said that stealing codes was possible. I was also a little skeptical in that I thought that cars like garage door openers had rolling codes to prevent this from occuring. With that said if they are sophisticated enough to steal the codes maybe they could figure out the rolling sequences. The way I figure, if someone wants to steal your ride they are going to steal your ride.
11-15-2008, 01:31 PM
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2004 RX330, 2008 Scion xB, 2001 Honda Insight Hybrid, 2010 Toyot Prius v ATP
This is an urban legend (see, e.g., this article on Snopes.com). Today's technology uses a rolling code system to prevent this. Also, I don't think the GL's doors can be locked manually while the driver's door is open.
In any event, valuable items such as laptops should not be left in your car anyway, since a determined thief could always smash a window to get them.
In any event, valuable items such as laptops should not be left in your car anyway, since a determined thief could always smash a window to get them.
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11-16-2008, 12:43 PM
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'07 GL 450, '02 S 80 T6
Originally Posted by iluvmys65amg
What if you use the Keyless Go button on the door handle to lock the doors??
11-16-2008, 09:34 PM
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It is impossible to lock the Benz without using the key fob. Keyless entry may not be better as the fob sends and recieves from the car to let you lock or unlock by pushing the button on the door handle.
If you dont believe me, try locking your benz without using the key fob.
If you dont believe me, try locking your benz without using the key fob.
11-16-2008, 11:54 PM
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'07 GL 450, '02 S 80 T6
Originally Posted by robalo220
It is impossible to lock the Benz without using the key fob.
Originally Posted by robalo220
Keyless entry may not be better as the fob sends and recieves from the car to let you lock or unlock by pushing the button on the door handle.
Originally Posted by robalo220
If you dont believe me, try locking your benz without using the key fob.
11-17-2008, 12:35 AM
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2005 C Wagon (No snickering please!)
The device mentioned, if it even exists, can only record the code in use before you pressed the button. After you press, a new code is created. It is created only for that one key. The EIS can determine if a key sent the code, because serial number of the key is transmitted as part of the rolling code. As the actual key serial number is never revealed in the RF link from the key to the car, a snooper with a sniffer cannot steal your car.
Now, if you insist on leaving the laptop on the seat, leave a fifty on the keyboard so the thief can buy a new battery charger. Times are tough.
Now, if you insist on leaving the laptop on the seat, leave a fifty on the keyboard so the thief can buy a new battery charger. Times are tough.
11-17-2008, 02:32 PM
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2007 GL320 CDI, 2001 TJ Rockcrawler, 2005 Scoobie STI
I would be more worried about cloning the RFID chip that is located in the keyfob for keyless go...
I have no idea what type of security technology is used by the Mercedes keyless go system, but it is based on RFID technology...
Crooks have already figured out how the clone the RFID tags for California's Fast Track toll road transmitters, so hopefully Mercedes is a few steps ahead of this technology...
If the key fob RFID chip could be cloned, a thief could simply walk up to the car, touch the door handle and unlock the car, climb in, push the start button and drive away... Of course they would have to be in relatively close proximity to the key fob in order to be able to clone it (maybe 12 inches or so).
I have no idea what type of security technology is used by the Mercedes keyless go system, but it is based on RFID technology...
Crooks have already figured out how the clone the RFID tags for California's Fast Track toll road transmitters, so hopefully Mercedes is a few steps ahead of this technology...
If the key fob RFID chip could be cloned, a thief could simply walk up to the car, touch the door handle and unlock the car, climb in, push the start button and drive away... Of course they would have to be in relatively close proximity to the key fob in order to be able to clone it (maybe 12 inches or so).
11-17-2008, 05:32 PM
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2008 S65 AMG, 2005 SLR McLaren
Well I hope nobody can get into my GL550...My wife drives it and I know that She and I both use the keyless go option when locking/unlocking and I all can say is that if someone breaks into the truck when shes in it...Im not gonna stop hearing the aggravation from her!! 
11-17-2008, 07:45 PM
#14
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Going to differ with you on this. I only use the door handle buttons to lock and when unlocking just touch a handle to unlock. IOW, I never press any buttons on key fob to lock/unlock.
Try doing that without the fob in your pocket (make sure the fob is about 30 feet away from the car and then try it). It has to be near the car. If it isn't, how does the car know to lock and unlock itself. I was referring to a benz without keyless entry.
Doubt if fob is actively sending/receiving from the car. I believe that KG sensors are in the doors and these sensors check/poll for fob in a certain proximity when locking/unlocking. Would love to see complete details on this, though.
I only use the door handle buttons to lock and when unlocking just touch a handle to unlock.
Try doing that without the fob in your pocket (make sure the fob is about 30 feet away from the car and then try it). It has to be near the car. If it isn't, how does the car know to lock and unlock itself. I was referring to a benz without keyless entry.
Doubt if fob is actively sending/receiving from the car. I believe that KG sensors are in the doors and these sensors check/poll for fob in a certain proximity when locking/unlocking. Would love to see complete details on this, though.
I only use the door handle buttons to lock and when unlocking just touch a handle to unlock.
11-17-2008, 07:54 PM
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Oknish, I was referring to the fact that you must have the fob within 8 to 10 feet of the car for the buttons to work on the door handles. Try it if you dont believe me.
My wife had the fob in her purse and I dropped her off at the door of a school function, when I parked, I realized I didn't have the fob because I could not lock her E350 with keyless entry. I had to go find her, get the fob and go back to the car and lock it. I still say the fob "talks" to the car to let it know to open or close, etc.
I drive the GL 320 without keyless entry. If you are standing outside the vehicle with the door open, try hitting the lock button. It will lock then unlock. You physically can not lock it without using the fob.
My wife had the fob in her purse and I dropped her off at the door of a school function, when I parked, I realized I didn't have the fob because I could not lock her E350 with keyless entry. I had to go find her, get the fob and go back to the car and lock it. I still say the fob "talks" to the car to let it know to open or close, etc.
I drive the GL 320 without keyless entry. If you are standing outside the vehicle with the door open, try hitting the lock button. It will lock then unlock. You physically can not lock it without using the fob.
Last edited by robalo220; 11-17-2008 at 07:57 PM.
11-18-2008, 03:49 PM
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C220
If they want in, they'll break a window. It takes less cash and time. If they're going to break into your GL, better with the scanning tool than a crow bar - less mess. Just leave the expensive stuff at home and they'll pass you over.
11-19-2008, 02:45 PM
#18
haha.. this is an urban legend.
every time the button is pressed a new hash is generated out of a "private key" the remote has.
the truck on its end has the "public key" and decrypts the signal and acts accordingly if the signal has been encrypted with the proper private key hash.
thus all eavesdropping is out-of-date the moment it was recorded.
even remote garage openers have that nowadays.
now, the only vulnerable situation is when you "teach" your garage door opener in your vehicle by pressing the "learn" button on the garage opener mechanism. at this point the garage opener transmits its private key hash and if anybody other than the remote control is listening and records the hash- they can gain access to your garage door opener.
this is the very abbreviated version of what is happening.
alex
few cars
every time the button is pressed a new hash is generated out of a "private key" the remote has.
the truck on its end has the "public key" and decrypts the signal and acts accordingly if the signal has been encrypted with the proper private key hash.
thus all eavesdropping is out-of-date the moment it was recorded.
even remote garage openers have that nowadays.
now, the only vulnerable situation is when you "teach" your garage door opener in your vehicle by pressing the "learn" button on the garage opener mechanism. at this point the garage opener transmits its private key hash and if anybody other than the remote control is listening and records the hash- they can gain access to your garage door opener.
this is the very abbreviated version of what is happening.
alex
few cars
11-19-2008, 06:31 PM
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'07 GL 450, '02 S 80 T6
Originally Posted by alx
every time the button is pressed a new hash is generated out of a "private key" the remote has.
the truck on its end has the "public key" and decrypts the signal and acts accordingly if the signal has been encrypted with the proper private key hash.
the truck on its end has the "public key" and decrypts the signal and acts accordingly if the signal has been encrypted with the proper private key hash.
