Glyn M Ruck

+1 - Excellent advice from Mark & John.

Also important is to hold the bolt while tightening the nut to prevent damaging the three position slot in the castor bush/bearing which would render it useless.

pejaife

Aolsen, What size bolt and nut are holding the upper part of the strut as mine is an allen bolt.I replaced my lower control arms yesterday and got stuck with upper's.

Thanks in advance.

FrankW

Glyn,

hope you will read this...lol

i've been monitoring how my front tire wears on the outside with the chulk trick that ppl use when they go on the track to see how much they are rolling on the sidewall. i've noticed that with my aggressive driving style that the front seems to be riding on the sidewall on hard cornering causing nose to push.

as you know i got couple camber/caster bolts that i never put in (since the pulling to the left cured itself somehow), so i'm thinking about putting in the bolts for camber dialing it to -1 degree. want to get your opinion on this.

Glyn M Ruck

Hi Frank. dialing in some negative camber is the right way to go & will help.

splinter

Sourced aftermarket bolts to additionally adjust camber.

Front = +/- ~1.75°:
http://www.spcalignment.com/componen...AFrom&to=USATo


Rear = +/- ~1.25°:
http://www.spcalignment.com/componen...AFrom&to=USATo

Glyn M Ruck

Very interesting splinter. That's what I love about the US. You can get everything there!

CA-OR-CLK320

confirmed, need 4 bolts.

jkowtko

I have a couple of questions on the fluted bolts and their movement within the bushing (I am planning to replace struts in the near future) --

1) Are they 3-position bolts? So you can place them in the middle position as well? (From a diagram I saw earlier it looked like they had a slightly larger diameter than the stock bolts.) If they are 3-position bolts, then how do you orient them in the middle position? You have to make sure the flutes are not lined up with any of the tabs or else the bolt will have play in it. I am guessing that the fluted bolts are intended for an offset position only.

3) Regarding tightening while suspension is loaded, just trying to confirm the geometry here. The inner collar of the bushing looks like it does not rotate, and the arm looks like it can have upwards of 45 degrees of travel. So when the bolt is tight are we saying that it can accomodate 20-25 degrees of rotation withing the bushing in either direction without ripping through the tabs? If so, then when you tighten the bolt with loaded suspension you would have to ensure that the bolt it rotated to it's center of rotation w.r.t. the bushing tabs. Or does the bushing itself bend under rotation? Obviously the stock non-fluted bolt in the middle position can rotate in the bushing no problem -- it's the dynamic behavior of the fluted bolts that are still unclear to me.

mleskovar

The bushing central bolt does not rotate once tightened regardless of what hole its' in. When installing leave the bolt loose and apply the normal static load (wheel on ground) to allow the bushing to position itself.....then tighten the nut with a wrench holding the bolt so it doesn't move. The central part of the bushing doesn't move under normal operation. Make sense?

jkowtko

Yes, that clears up things a bit -- thanks ... so these bushings rely on the rubber flexing with control arm travel? And do all of the (stock rubber) suspension bushings for MB work this way?

Thanks. John

mleskovar

Yes, and there is also silicon oil in them.

I think these are the only silicon oil filled bushings in this model. The front torque bar moves slightly inside rubber mounts.

RedStripe

I've found this on eBay
http://www.ebay.com/itm/BMW-Mercedes...#ht_587wt_1141

But seems to be the same cost as the Mercedes OEM puller using the PN supplied by Splinter.

Are either one acceptable or is there a better alternative?

splinter

$85 plus S&H?

I’ve loaned mine out to members in good standing several times. Always found its way back home.
If you’d rather, PM a shipping address and it’ll be headed your way tomorrow.

phister

sometimes if you go to an autostore they'll let you go to the back and will you use their tools their for free.

MountainStone

This instruction is unclear to me; are you recommending lowering the car to the ground with the wheel mounted to load the suspension and then raising it again to gain access to the nut/bolt? Or did you find it possible to torque the bolt with the car on the ground? The only method I could figure out was to place a second floor jack under the steering knuckle and jack up the suspension, then crawl back under the car and tighten the bolt.

That style puller will not work on the ball joint of the lower (rear) control arm due to the lack of clearance over the nut/stud. You will need a puller of this configuration: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Mercedes-BMW...9c09c7&vxp=mtr
(sorry for the long link) You can also search eBay for 'Mercedes ball joint tool' for less (or more) expensive iterations of this design. A pickle fork and hammer will also work and are cheap and available at any parts store, though it is a less elegant solution.

RedStripe

I appreciate the offer john. That's super nice of you. I'll take you up on it whenever I have the new camber arms/bushings and torque arm bushings.

I did succesfully remove the rear tie rod with a fork and BFH. However I did tear the boot, so will need to replace it in the future. More concerned about the front right now. Thanks for the link though, that's cheap enough to warrant purchasing it and have ready when I do replace the rear.
Unless of course John's tool, which looks smaller, works on the rear as well - and in that case I'll proceed with the rear at that time.

Glyn M Ruck

The best place to tighten the bolts is standing in the pit beneath a decent 4 wheel alignment machine.

splinter

You’re entirely correct regarding access to the lateral/camber arms’ ball joints.

The specific tool used in this instance depends almost entirely on what the technician is attempting to ultimately accomplish.
Of course the strut must also be removed from the hub carrier to R&R our longitudinal/caster arms.
I’ve successfully used the scissor type pullers and pickle forks in the past, although they invariably resulted in torn dust boots.
Obviously that’s not an issue if one intends to junk the entire arm.

On the other hand, it’s probably prudent when pulling otherwise sound arms (e.g., during bushing replacement) to minimize ancillary damage. YMMV

Alternatively, drive-on ramps will also suffice.



Anytime…the offer still stands. Good luck with getting yours squared away.

jkowtko

I'm planning to replace control arms later this year so I want to make sure I get this right --

The Haynes manual also suggests that you "carefully raise the steering knuckle with a floor jack to simulate normal ride height" before tightening that bolt. Regardless of method, it sounds critical that the bushing rubber is not twisted when the suspension is "at rest", which is where it's going to be virtually 100% of the time. I imagine this has a significant effect on the life of the bushing. This also says something for parking the car on an uneven surface.

jkowtko

I would also like to clarify the need for and use of the fluted bolts --

* Do the bolts work in the center position or only the offset positions? It looks like if you tried to place one in the center position you risk positioning one of the flutes over a set of tabs and introducing play into the system.

* Are the offsets (and therefore fluted bolts) needed for normal alignment, or are they only needed when making caster/camber corrections from altering ride height? Let's assume no frame damage, and I assume replacement struts will maintain the stock suspension geometry ... ?

Thanks. John

Glyn M Ruck

The fluted bolts can be used in all 3 positions but you have the stock bolts anyway if this worries you. You only have toe adjustment on the front without fluted bolts. Fluted bolts are required for any castor or camber adjustment. Even on a car with a straight frame you really require them to get the alignment truly in spec & stop pulling with the camber of the road which requires dialing in one more degree caster on the passenger side of the vehicle (max 2 deg) & typically 10.6 & 9.6 degrees.

mleskovar

I didn't have a problem tightening the bolt with the car resting on all four wheels.

This would work if you get it right but how would you know? Probably wouldn't be off by much but why take a chance. As Glyn said, a pit is ideal.

Also, it's not necessary to remove the ball joint to replace the bushing.

RedStripe

This $%#& eccentric bolt won't go in my strut to hub bolt hole (the only bolt hole, there isn't an upper/lower).

I got 81260 from SPC.

The small inner tab on the washer will NOT go inside the bolt hole.

Even if it would, the design of the strut bracket won't allow the tabbed washer to rotate 360 degrees to dial in camber.

This is a $30 piece of crap.

yeloaw

Thanks for the heads up, I was about to order the SPC parts, but I guess there still isn't a solution to correct camber

Glyn M Ruck

Please talk to splinter about this issue. He has used these bolts. His car has Koni Yellows fitted.