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Old 10-22-2013, 04:49 PM   #51
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I met Oona Scheepers at a meeting the other day. She is a South African that is head of interior design at VAG Group. (VW/Audi)

I mentioned to her that some on our forum disliked the display/interface in some new Benz cars. Her retort was that almost all European cars would be similar over the next few years. That it places the display in the right place from a view & touch screen perspective & does not compromise ventilation etc in the process. As she said the shear real estate on a S Class dash made integration easier but not as a touch screen ~ it's out of easy reach ergonomically. She sees them all becoming capacitive touch screens over time. (I hate fingerprints & goo on touch screens & prefer hard buttons ~ touch screens are dirt cheap to implement ~ the McLaren MP4 12C touchscreen looks so cheap in a car like that)

She believes that people will get used to it & that i Drive type controls have a limited future due to customer resistance & complexity. I guess time will tell. Customer resistance from the US might have Ms. Scheepers rethinking free standing screens like she put in Dr Martin Winterkorn's pet project UP.
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Old 10-22-2013, 05:04 PM   #52
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Originally Posted by Glyn M Ruck View Post
I met Oona Scheepers at a meeting the other day. She is a South African that is head of interior design at VAG Group. (VW/Audi)

I mentioned to her that some on our forum disliked the display/interface in some new Benz cars. Her retort was that almost all European cars would be similar over the next few years. That it places the display in the right place from a view & touch screen perspective & does not compromise ventilation etc in the process. As she said the shear real estate on a S Class dash made integration easier but not as a touch screen ~ it's out of easy reach ergonomically. She sees them all becoming capacitive touch screens over time. (I hate fingerprints & goo on touch screens & prefer hard buttons ~ touch screens are dirt cheap to implement ~ the McLaren MP4 12C touchscreen looks so cheap in a car like that)

She believes that people will get used to it & that i Drive type controls have a limited future due to customer resistance & complexity. I guess time will tell. Customer resistance from the US might have Ms. Scheepers rethinking free standing screens like she put in Dr Martin Winterkorn's pet project UP.
Vee vill get uzed to it!! What a stereotypical point of view from a German company! By any chance, did she work at MB when they created the R Class? History is full of this nonsense. Remember when Sony could prove Betamax was technically superior to VHS?

As regards the MB approach, guess again, Ms.Scheepers....

The evidence already shows the diversity in this arena, and that, of the Big German 3, MB has cornered the poorest design. But, if she is at Audi, they are executing this far better already, per the A3. Watch that space on MB ....things will change sooner rather than later. Those of us who are on our way out the door may look back one day if we're not too happy where we go next.
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Old 10-22-2013, 05:14 PM   #53
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Old 10-22-2013, 05:17 PM   #54
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Originally Posted by Glyn M Ruck View Post
I met Oona Scheepers at a meeting the other day. She is a South African that is head of interior design at VAG Group. (VW/Audi)

I mentioned to her that some on our forum disliked the display/interface in some new Benz cars. Her retort was that almost all European cars would be similar over the next few years. That it places the display in the right place from a view & touch screen perspective & does not compromise ventilation etc in the process. As she said the shear real estate on a S Class dash made integration easier but not as a touch screen ~ it's out of easy reach ergonomically. She sees them all becoming capacitive touch screens over time. (I hate fingerprints & goo on touch screens & prefer hard buttons ~ touch screens are dirt cheap to implement ~ the McLaren MP4 12C touchscreen looks so cheap in a car like that)

She believes that people will get used to it & that i Drive type controls have a limited future due to customer resistance & complexity. I guess time will tell. Customer resistance from the US might have Ms. Scheepers rethinking free standing screens like she put in Dr Martin Winterkorn's pet project UP.
That's interesting to hear as I've heard that the iDrive and COMMAND style controllers are getting really good/acceptable but systems like MyFordTouch and Cadillac's CUE are getting ripped for being too difficult to use in a moving vehicle.

Good for an iPad in your lap, not so much mounted to your car's dash.
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Old 10-22-2013, 05:40 PM   #55
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i think my next car might be a JAG XF
I rather like the new E400 twin turbo coupe but I could see a new F Type in my garage next to the old wire wheeled banger.

At the moment I love my ultra low mileage CLK.
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Old 10-22-2013, 05:47 PM   #56
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Vee vill get uzed to it!! What a stereotypical point of view from a German company! By any chance, did she work at MB when they created the R Class? History is full of this nonsense. Remember when Sony could prove Betamax was technically superior to VHS?

As regards the MB approach, guess again, Ms.Scheepers....

The evidence already shows the diversity in this arena, and that, of the Big German 3, MB has cornered the poorest design. But, if she is at Audi, they are executing this far better already, per the A3. Watch that space on MB ....things will change sooner rather than later. Those of us who are on our way out the door may look back one day if we're not too happy where we go next.
Yeah ~ at least with Betamax which was superior it became a professional format for many years thereafter in Super Beta form.
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Old 10-22-2013, 05:50 PM   #57
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Doa forget the Jag. Remember why the British like warm beer, because Lucas the prince of darkness, make the electronics. I gave up my 5 Rovers and my Jag V12 E type, because they could not make them stay away from the dealer. Not the dealers fault, just poor engineering and assembly.
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Old 10-22-2013, 06:05 PM   #58
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i think my next car might be a JAG XF
So you're not okay w/ a non-integrated nav screen but you're okay w/ buggy and gimmicky pop-up gearshifter, vent covers, and capacitive glove box switch? Okayyyyyyy....


Quote:
Originally Posted by Sportstick
Remember when Sony could prove Betamax was technically superior to VHS?
I thought Betamax really *was* supposed to be superior to VHS in terms of audio and/or sound quality. I lack sufficient knowledge in that area to be able to comment about those kinds of issues, but widespread acceptance should not be confused w/ technological or even ergonomic superiority, IMHO. Minivans really do make much more sense in many ways than do SUVs....


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She believes that people will get used to it & that i Drive type controls have a limited future due to customer resistance & complexity
Interesting. I, like Bleser, would've thought the opposite. A controller doesn't require you to move your body from a position that is ideal for driving (but a touch screen would, regardless of whether it's integrated or not.... However, I do have rather short arms, so maybe it's just me). I would've assumed that a controller/mouse w/ touchpad capability (esp handwriting recognition) would've been the future....

The Jaguar F-type is very fetching, but I think for the same price I might prefer the Boxster? Never driven either, though. Also doesn't quite have the street presence/gravitas I think a Jag should have....

Last edited by alsyli; 10-22-2013 at 06:14 PM.
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Old 10-22-2013, 07:03 PM   #59
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does offer a lot of tech not offered at this price point before:

http://www.benzreport.com/2015-c-cla...ures/#more-900

click on the press release at the bottom of the post for comprehensive info
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Old 10-22-2013, 08:56 PM   #60
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I thought Betamax really *was* supposed to be superior to VHS in terms of audio and/or sound quality. I lack sufficient knowledge in that area to be able to comment about those kinds of issues, but widespread acceptance should not be confused w/ technological or even ergonomic superiority, IMHO. Minivans really do make much more sense in many ways than do SUVs....
I think we agree, but I may not have made my point well. I was trying to say that regardless of how much technical superiority the Germans may claim for these lollipop nav screens, the market will always be right and will always win. When folks don't want them, the lab data on reach or sight lines will not matter.
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Old 10-22-2013, 10:05 PM   #61
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OMG!!!!! I really hate this tablet. what is mb thinking.
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Old 10-22-2013, 10:49 PM   #62
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@Sportstick,

Good thoughts on that. It does make sense to move in this direction to allow cheaper integration of non-nav cars, but that in a way doesn't make sense as it seems more and more cars just put a screen there anyway and leave out the nav/gps software. Maybe this allows them to remove the screen altogether for non-multimedia package cars.

This interior is great, but as always, show me the entry-level trim. I'll be we're looking at an interior with every bell and whistle, some of which won't even come to our market, and totals close to $60,000. Show me the C250 $45,000 interior.
actually it looks to me like its the Premium 1 and Multimedia Package interior in a Sport model. I am guessing the base interior will be similar, just with some less pizzaz (no black ash wood trim like we see here), just regular old aluminum dash trim ,etc...like how it is now. I mean the base C class and premium 1 now arent that different, save for technical differences (heated seats, HK audio, Homelink, Dual Climate control, etc).
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Old 10-22-2013, 11:11 PM   #63
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I thought Betamax really *was* supposed to be superior to VHS in terms of audio and/or sound quality. I lack sufficient knowledge in that area to be able to comment about those kinds of issues, but widespread acceptance should not be confused w/ technological or even ergonomic superiority, IMHO. Minivans really do make much more sense in many ways than do SUVs....



The Jaguar F-type is very fetching, but I think for the same price I might prefer the Boxster? Never driven either, though. Also doesn't quite have the street presence/gravitas I think a Jag should have....
Betamax was clearly superior in both picture & audio. The crap format won the consumer war because the largest market for VCR's was NTSC which was crap anyway.

I've been in Johannesburg for the last 3 weeks & driving a friend's Boxster S on & off. In some respects it's the best car Porsche makes but other than the great driving dynamics it is somewhat boring & lacks feel-good factor. I do like the latest styling but they could do a lot better with the interior.

Benz' future acceptance is going to be the Asian market & what they like. That's where they will earn the most going forward. South Africa consumes 66% the number of Benz cars that the US does annually actually making the US a very small market for them at very unattractive margins.

I'll bet the W205 meets or exceeds all sales expectations.
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Old 10-22-2013, 11:48 PM   #64
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OMG!!!! I just hope the E class keep the actual interior design for the next couple of years, otherwise will be very difficult for me to keep with MB!!!
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Old 10-23-2013, 02:19 AM   #65
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I think we agree, but I may not have made my point well. I was trying to say that regardless of how much technical superiority the Germans may claim for these lollipop nav screens, the market will always be right and will always win. When folks don't want them, the lab data on reach or sight lines will not matter.
Thanks for the clarification. Yes, we agree.... Except I think that most people probably will find it acceptable since they're not as picky as enthusiasts who post on an internet forum. Which is unfortunate, but....


Quote:
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I've been in Johannesburg for the last 3 weeks & driving a friend's Boxster S on & off. In some respects it's the best car Porsche makes but other than the great driving dynamics it is somewhat boring & lacks feel-good factor. I do like the latest styling but they could do a lot better with the interior.
I generally prefer cold Teutonic perfection to warm British soul. Don't know when they last updated the Boxster's interior, but I assume the next one will look a lot like the 911/Cayenne/Panamera (I actually rather like the Panamera's interior....)? Or perhaps the upcoming Macan?

On an unrelated note to any of the posts (but indirectly related to the next-gen C-Class), Consumer Reports apparently reviewed the Infiniti Q50 and the new Lexus IS.... And felt that both cars are inferior to their predecessors. The IS didn't even make it to their "Recommended" list. Ouch. I actually rather liked the G25 I test drove ~2 yrs ago but felt that the steering felt very artificial (although very nicely weighted) and the interior rather cramped, given the exterior dimensions. Will be interesting to see how these cars sell and how the W205 stacks up....
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Old 10-23-2013, 07:52 AM   #66
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The Panamera's interior is beautiful. Exterior is an acquired taste but improved in the latest generation.

I know what you mean. I'm restoring my S Type at present & trying to improve areas of these cars that were known to give trouble. e.g. cooling system, Lucas crap etc.
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Old 10-23-2013, 08:27 AM   #67
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I think the interior is great. I can live up with the screen... it is not that bad after all.
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Old 10-23-2013, 08:58 AM   #68
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OMG!!!! I just hope the E class keep the actual interior design for the next couple of years, otherwise will be very difficult for me to keep with MB!!!
I respectfully hope you are wrong. IMO the E-Class has the most boring MB interior currently. Sure they tarted it up a bit after the facelift. However, the screen for the NAV is still tiny & the materials are still mostly cheap
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Old 10-23-2013, 09:57 AM   #69
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the materials are still mostly cheap
Where are the materials in the E interior cheap?
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Old 10-23-2013, 10:03 AM   #70
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Where are the materials in the E interior cheap?
I'm wondering the same, but first, perhaps he could give us his definition of "cheap". I find it varies quite a bit and may merely mean subjectively looking less ornate or complex in design than he might wish. The actual cost and quality of the parts used in a lesser "eye candy" design may not be his criteria.
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Old 10-23-2013, 10:25 AM   #71
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Most of the interior dash and door trim are all plasticky/synthetic?

cheap for me as far as trim is not pleasing to touch. While I can accept that in a C, in an E I would want more. Perhaps the designo route if I had to live with the car. But for me, I can do better with other choices.

My whole point being: With the launch of the 2014 S & the upcoming C the future for the E is brighter as far as the interior as per my requirements.
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Old 10-23-2013, 11:00 AM   #72
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I actually preferred the launch interior 08-11 cars (no surprise since I have one) rather than face lift. Loved being able to hide screen completely, made for sporty look, I honestly never have the screen shown.

However....the W205 interior looks fantastic! No complaints. I love the floating screen. Why does everyone have to conform and have a screen with a dash hood over it? Then the entire dash shape gets changed. This is a different take Mercedes is going for with several of these models, and I like it a lot. 100 percent supportive of that decision. Honestly, I don't understand the complaints on it. Makes dash look better, and the screen is right there where we need it.

Well done. Sadly, I wish you could still get the car Made in Germany.

Also, with the CLA now out, I suspect the C Class price will be adjusted for W205 and pushed more up-market.
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Old 10-23-2013, 01:59 PM   #73
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The reason for the hood is the same reason that Barnes and Nobel sells so many simple touch Nooks. Unless it is night time you can't read the screen on the glossy tablets, especially after a few days of someone's finger prints poking at it. Even with hoods, many speedometers are unreadable in the glare of a sunny day.. The "on windshield displays" were tries before in the '90's and you couldn't read those either.
Designers are like politicians. They should go home for awhile and stop changing things for the sake of change. There is nothing better about the new interior, it is just different. I am surprised Consumer Reports isn't worried about those screens becoming projectiles and the requirement for drivers to reach out of position to use them. Since politicians can't help themselves and need to make new laws to feel useful, eventually the use of interactive electronics will be banned!
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Old 10-23-2013, 02:14 PM   #74
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So is this nav screen/tablet retractable? I'm guessing, no?

By the way, this new C as well as the upcoming GLA will be produced in Alabama for the US market.
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Old 10-23-2013, 03:09 PM   #75
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Where are the materials in the E interior cheap?
they arent, but i felt like the current C class has pretty much 90 percent of the interior of the E materials wise. Also, who's genius idea was it to put FAKE CUPHOLDERS in the E class
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