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Just an updated for anyone interested. I have had my car back now for a couple weeks.
New shocks all the way around, new rack and pinion and new Micheline A/S 3's Y rated.
Since I had the shop do the alignment who works on my Father in Law's C63 AMG the car just seems to handle better and better each day as the tires wear in.
I am finally happy with the way the car handles .. struggling to get here since last november..
The Micheline Pilot Sport A/S 3 tires are by far the best handling tire I have ever drove on they are quiet and smooth but track the road like the car is on rails.
The car originally had P Zero Nero all seasons 94H's on it and they were terrible. The car felt squirmy, was very very loud tire noise and simply annoying and no fun to drive on. I would highly recommend the Micheline Pilot Sport A/S 3' and I am one picky SOB.
Alignment has a big affect on handling. Maybe your dealers alignment rack isn't calibrated correctly. Our hunter tech comes in once a month to calibrate ours.
Alignment has a big affect on handling. Maybe your dealers alignment rack isn't calibrated correctly. Our hunter tech comes in once a month to calibrate ours.
I agree with you 100%. Which sucks for me and all of their other customers considering I've paid for several this year from their dealership.
I also have the Pilot Sport A/S 3's and love them, but I wouldn't say they are quiet. Traction is excellent in all-weather, but they are pretty noisy compared to most other tires. Definitely something I can live with.
My car is EXACTLY the same. I just recently posted thread. At highway speeds th ecar hops around on freeway. Steering is way to light. I have constantly have to put input through steering wheel, otherwise my car will be on other side of freeway. It feels as if cars rear tires wanna break loose and overtseer any minute. This only occurs at highway speeds. Not the tires, because Ive had this problem with stock wheels/tires, and now have got 19" TSW and still have same problem.
I am taking my car into world-motorsports tomorrow for the FM intercooler. I will ask their techs about this problem. I trust them because they are very knowledgable, and have every single MB equipment for any MB authorized repair. Will update soon.
Well I spoke to soon earlier. The problem has returned several months ago. I have been reluctant to post about it as I am at the point where I am just tired of talking about it. I have not bothered contacting the dealer as no one believes me or even bothers trying to fix the problem.
I can steer the car with my pinkie. I wanted to keep my car as I love the look of the W204, 2014 being the last year of the W204 and the wheels are something you do not see all the time. I enjoy having something different.
I have spent months reading and thinking and researching. I have come up with 2 things so far.
Something I noticed, whether this is of any significance I have no idea, I noticed that on every alignment printout Caster is left blank. I thought for a minute why would this be? I had a front end collision which left 3 rims bent, a bubble in the front right tire and all 4 shocks and rack being replaced.
I never received an alignment printout from the dealer so I have no idea if they ever bothered to check caster.
I contacted the non dealer alignment shop that my father in law uses for his C63. Their managers response was "We never check caster because usually that is factory set and cannot be changed" WTF! What if it is out how would you know.... He said he had no idea but it is something they cannot check or change.
I am wondering if I have a lower A arm that is tweaked yet they managed to get the alignment in so nobody bothered to inform me about it. The alignment could be in with the caster off from what I have read. The caster would affect high speed stability and that seems to be the issue I am having. Driving slow the steering is tight like it should be. The faster I go the lighter it gets and the more correction the car requires to keep on the road. The steering becomes so light you could drive with your pinkie. Keep in mind I have had the car to the dealer about 12 times. Their service manager even got mad at me telling me in a very angry way that there is nothing wrong with my car.
I drove another car identical to mine.. same wheels and everything awhile ago at the dealer and the steering felt great but nobody could tell me why. Their answer, they could not feel a difference, they said it felt the same to them. I call BS.. They have no idea what the problem is and could care less in bothering looking into it any further.
Another scenario. I noticed something over the weekend. It just sorta happened and clicked after it happened. I have been so frustrated over all of this I have not really been driving the car unless I have to and I wont let my wife drive it because I do not trust it on the highway.
We took the car out for a drive over the holiday weekend. Same old... steer with your pinkie... frustrated I stopped for gas. Since the weather was nice we sat at a picnic table and had a soda.. After getting back in the car mysteriously the steering was tight again.. makes no sense.
The only thing in the steering system that I am aware of that has not been replaced is the power steering pump. The dealer claims they checked it.
rack and tie rod ends have been replaced and are brand new OEM parts.
I have a year and 4 months left on my lease and I am dreading every minute of it because I have grown to hate my car. I purchased a sports sedan that feels like a 1970's Buick to drive. I cant wait to drop this darn thing off and leave it at the dealer.
Very interesting thread. I've noticed how there is a wide discrepancy in the feel and handling of these cars reported on here. Some people think the car is too stiff and others report excessive body roll and soft suspension.
When I first got my car I thought the steering was excessively light and sensitive. That no longer appears to be the case but the dealer has torn my car apart a few times already.
A little off topic but the best feeling steering out of any manufacturer I have felt has usually been from Mazda. Most German cars feel a bit disconnected.
Yes your are right in your observation. I have noticed that as well.
I am at the point where Im just throwing my hands in the air and saying F... it.
(Just to clarify when I purhcased my 2014 C300 AMG Sport my wife had a 2014 Sport with 17" wheels mars red. We recently traded since her lease was up to a 2015 non sport, non luxury)
I learned my lesson. I did not test drive my car. However, My wife had the exact same year and for whatever reason I loved driving hers. It always handled better and felt as if it had more power. It just felt SPORTY.
My car has never felt the same. No matter how many trips to the dealer provided no results and just caused them to label me as a "problem customer". It didnt matter that I spent close to 50 grand with them and that my wife did too.
The bottom line is in our families case her 2015 Electric steering Non sport runs circles around my 2014 C300 AMG sport with top of the line Michelin Tires.
I just got back from a test drive again. No difference.
The best way to describe my issue other than the lack of power. The steering in my car makes you feel like your playing one of those video racing games with a fake steering wheel controller. No feedback no resistance. This makes taking turns in a sports car dangerous. It over-steers way to easy. No matter how fast your going the steering feels the same.
My wifes 2014 never felt like this and she only had the 17" wheels. Her steering had some heft to it.. some resistance when cornering. Mine does not.
So anybody who asks I tell them. If you are looking for a sports sedan that is actually sporty do not get a W204 C300/C350 the hydraulic steering is terrible and the rack and pinion ratio is not tight enough to be called a sports sedan.
I did not test drive the car because we owned one already. I was expecting to get a car that was BETTER a than my wifes 2014 because I was stepping up to the AMG sports package with the better wheels and tires on it. That was not the case. My experience has been a terrible one and I simply cannot wait to get rid of this POS.
I have driven a 2016 Loaner C300 non sport and call me crazy but that car felt way more sporty than my sport! Makes no sense but that is my personal and humble opinion.
So when the time comes if i can afford it I will be getting a C43 and if not another new 2017 C300. I have now since driven a bunch of loaners and know that I am happy with them. This time i will insist on driving the car i plan on purchasing to make sure that particular car meets my expectations since as you said above there seems to be a lot of inconsistencies from the factory and it shows in car to car driving dynamics and performance in the same model lineup which should never be the case.
one more thing. The C300's come with either Continental Tires or Pirelli tires.
When we first got my wifes car it came with Pirelli tires. I had already had a run in with Pirelli tires on my 2014. I insisted that if they dont change them we wont buy it. They finally gave in and took continental tires off of another loaner with similar miles. The car handles great. We could not be happier with her 2015. In sport + it actually feels like a sports car and it isnt even a sport!
My suggestion for what it is worth Pirelli tires suck. If your going to purchase one of these cars and it has Pirelli tires on it... DONT DO IT! You will regret it. That is my opinion and you have been warned.
I had an indy shop owner tell me that there can issues that aren't easily detectable. He said something about a subframe of some sort that can appear to be straight after taking an impact. He was telling me he had a bad one and a new one on his shop floor side by side and he couldn't tell any difference between them.
I wish I could remember more about what he had said.
Overall, I'm happy with my handling but I haven't been able to keep my car in alignment for some reason. I'm going back for my 3rd one this year. It keeps drifting right. I've driven plenty of w205 C300 cars and they usually feel a little looser to me. I've even lost traction with them a couple times where I feel my car would have stuck to rails.
Makes sense. Nobody has looked that deeply into my situation with my car.
They were paving the interstate where I lived a year and a half ago. They quit for the day and where the new pavement met the old there is always a drop off. I was going towards the high side of it. I had no idea until it was to late as there was no "bump" sign. This was a bit more than a bump. Not sure what else it could have thrown out of whack.
Mine drives perfectly fine. I just feel that my car is not as peppy as it should be and the steering should be much tighter. My wifes 4 cylinder turbo feels much faster than mine. If I could get the steering sorted out I could always keep my car and have it tuned. But it doesnt make sense to drop $1200 in tuning if i am not happy with how it handles. Infact throwing more power at a car that isnt handling properly is a stupid idea. Money well saved for a down payment on something better in another year I guess.
Upate: I am sure someone will have something to say about this however I wanted to update everyone just in case someone else out there may be having the same problem and possibly my information will save them all of the headache that I have had to endure.
My car is really finally fixed.
Now.. almost exactly a year ago today I had my rack and pinion replaced. This weekend I dug up my old invoice from Mercedes Benz. For whatever reason It never hit me before until this weekend. It was not what was on the list of parts but what was missing. You guessed it! Power steering fluid was not listed! CHF-11S Petosin.
Now I have checked my PS fluid over the past year and level was always fine so I never thought anything more about power steering fluid. Also in my defense the dip stick is JET BLACK and there was no foaming or anything that stood out of the ordinary so once again I never thought anything of it.
The picture above is a clear Pepsi bottle filled with power steering fluid out of my car.
I found the above picture on the internet to show as an example for clarity. The glass on the right is NEW CHF-11S Mercedes Benz approved power steering fluid. The one of the left is used power steering fluid.
I noted on my invoice that my car had 22,500 miles on it when I had the rack installed. Today my car has around 34,000 miles on it. So it has been roughly 11,500 miles since the rack and pinion was installed.
My question is this.. How in the world if the mechanics had put in brand new fresh fluid last year with the $2500 rack and pinion would the fluid be this black and milky looking in only 11,500 miles? As far as I know there is no recommended service interval for Power steering fluid from Mercedes Benz. It is not changed or serviced during your normal A and B services. So that tells me that Mercedes assumes that it "may" last the duration of the life of your vehicle. (BS)
Now my wife and I purchased a cheap $15 fluid transfer hand pump. I pumped out the power steering fluid into the Pepsi bottle and a few other bottles I had laying around. I dumped in fresh fluid. Started the car and had my wife move the steering from lock to lock 5 times. We then repeated the process.. I drained the power steering reservoir and refilled it with fresh fluid. We repeated this for about 36oz or 1 quart of fluid. Then I verified that the level was at MAX 20 DEG C. Which is about 70 degrees F which was slightly lower than the ambient temperature of my garage. The other mark is Min / Max 80 c which is closer to 170 F and the engine sure was not at Normal operating temperature yet and the garage was no where near that hot.
We cleaned up and took a test drive.. Holy cow my steering felt tight again Instantly. I could feel the resistance in the wheel. I always drive with my hand at 12 O clock.. and when you slightly move your hand left to right you can now feel resistance pushing against you in either direction. Taking corners there was now resistance. The steering had no more oversteer and finally had some good old heft to it.
So there you have it folks... In my humble opinion Mercedes re used my old power steering fluid when they installed the rack. The oil also had a slight milky hazy look to it. The oil has to be contaminated like they dumped it into a bucket that had a tiny bit of coolant in it or some other substance. It was not water .. water should cause a different reaction in oil than my situation.
I still feel that I need to flush a lot more out or have a shop open the system and flush it out properly. I am not sure I trust the Mercedes dealership anymore with my car.
I find it funny now that the Mercedes Service manager was practically yelling at me in the showroom telling me there is nothing wrong with my car when all I did was add a quart of fresh power steering fluid and it changed the steering feel of my car by night and day.
I never thought to check the fluid itself I guess because I assumed that ASE certified mechanics would do their job correctly. Its really sad now that I feel I have to double check everything they do from here on out.. I have a clear lack of trust for these people..
Decide for yourself with the pictures. I am glad my car handles good again. My next goal is to have it flushed properly and thoroughly and report back here if that causes any more of a change.
I hope this helped someone out there. So yes power steering fluid needs to be changed. In my personal opinion I would have it flushed in these cars every 2 years.
Not surprised I have had many issues with my service in the pass.
But being very very mechanically incline I was a big stick in their rear end for repairs.
Fluid should always be replaced especially when a new rack and pinion was installed.
Just follow the same pracedure you just did in several hundred miles and you should be fine.
Glad it's sorted now.
I have been watching this thread.
I had no helpful input so I didn't post.
Normally I'd be in disbelief at how a dealership could do this but mine is the same way!
Unbelievable how a group of AST's can do such a terribly unethical job. Having loose suspension on the highway is flat out dangerous.
I am glad you've taken care of. I would check again in a 5-10k miles or so to ensure the issue came from when the fluid was transfered and not a small leak anywhere. May be hard to believe but some weird things can happen with hydraulic systems. Could be a seal that seats under pressure but comes loose and may create a venturi when pressure is relieved. Could also be a hairline crack in reservoir allowing contaminants in. Who knows.
You said that it didn't look like water because of the milky haze, but I have seen water with high TDS do similar things when it emulsifies. Probably not but I would suggest checking again to ensure it stays good.
07-01-2015, 10:45 AM
