RichardM98

Based on those comments I don't believe MB has made any changes in its master Factory Approved Service Products. Anyone who wants to find out the MB factory recommendations for their car can go to that document.

There was a fellow out here (not this site) a while back who posted that a oil was approved by MB. He produced what appeared to be a MB document as his proof. It turned out that the document had been prepared by a third party training company not MB. It seemed to say the oil was approved but later in the same paragraph it said it was not. The point is there's lots of info floating around the internet -- some true, some false and some malicious. I just hope everyone can sort out the difference.

MarcusF

The answer is "it depends". If it meets MB spec, then sure, it's fine. If it doesn’t meet the spec, you may want to look at the data sheet. Specifically, the cSt rating at 100°C (normal operating temperature). You may want to also compare the warmup numbers 40°C. That's what will tell you weather the oil is hard on bearings. Exxon Mobil provides data sheets for most of their oils. I don't see one listed for "High Mileage" 5W-40.

Here is a very basic web page on why some oils are better choices than others.

Phil C55

OK, then lets list facts:

MB229.5 is the spec for the oil used in gas engines that are in an AMG

MB229.51 is the spec for oil in diesel engines by MB

Mobil1 0-W40 European oil doesn't meet 229.51 because it was made for gas engines and their needs

Mobil1 5-W40 ESP doesn't meet 229.5 because it was made for diesel engines and their needs

Unless you have a diesel AMG, you should put in Mobil1 0-W40 because it DOES meet the spec by MB and the 5-W40 DOESN'T.

I guess in the end, since it is easily available, why wouldn't an owner want to use the correct oil instead of going out of their way to use the wrong? The Arizona arguement doesn't hold up because both oils are 40 weight when hot.

JonMBZ

I am not going to keep restating the same thing over and over, but if you read the document it says dealers are not even required to carry 0W40 as 5W40 is fully backwards compatible. I am not trying to win anything here and I have listed everything I thought would help you guys. If you choose to not agree with it, then continue not to use it. It's honestly not that big of a deal either way to me. Trust me I am only trying to help you guys being a fellow enthusiast.

Viper98912

Yup, I think there is enough information here to support whether each individual prefers to use 0w-40 or 5w-40

SMP

Maybe you should get your facts straight. Pick up a quart of 5-40 ESP and look at the back label and it says "Approved and exceeds warranty requirements for GASOLINE and diesel engines that require oil that meets MB-Approval 229.51". I bought a brand new Black Series CLK63 with an extended 7year/100K mile warranty. Obviously not a diesel engine in that car. Why would they not only recommend that specific oil for that specific car, but also use it when I bring the car in for service and put it in writing on the service record? If the engine detonates because of wrong oil, who do you think is going to pay for the repair? Do you really think MB is that stupid???

hgerhardt

Why don't you all just go by this: http://www.startekinfo.com/StarTek/o...tedDocId=10119 which are the official MB oil specs? My M156 AMG engine is allowed to use 229.5 or 229.51. And somewhere on this forum someone mentioned that the preferred oil for the M156's is 5W-40 Mobil1.

Phil C55

I would say YOU need to get your facts straight. What you seem to be missing is most gas engines call for you to follow spec 229.5 NOT 229.51. Your CLK63 has a 156 engine and is one of the few that can use either spec. The C55 has a 113 engine and it calls for the spec of 229.5 the facts are right here from the MBUSA web site.

http://www.startekinfo.com/StarTek/o...tedDocId=10119

I did notice that if you choose to follow 229.5 on a 156 engine you are to use the 0-W40 oil only.

TemjinX2

its that old saying, "if it aint broke, why fix it"

JonMBZ

This is denoting the use of 0W-30, 5W-30 not 5W40

SMP

I tried to make a point. According to your post 229.51 was ONLY for diesel engines. And yes, when I first bought the car in Nov. of 2007 there was no 5-40 ESP, and the car came from the factory with 0-40. Which makes me wonder, if I can use both oils in my engine, why wouldn't you be able to?

Phil C55

Why MB says a 156 engine can use either is through their testing. Logic would say that if it works fine in a 156 engine then lets just make all gas engines meet 229.51, but they didn't do that. I guess it needs to be viewed as not so much 229.51 is only for diesels, but that an oil that meets 229.51 doesn't meet the spec of 229.5. Since the vast majority of gas engine MBs call for 229.5, the 229.51 isn't right for them. Neither one is a higher level of spec or better than the other, just different. It's the addittive package the goes into 229.51 that makes it perform well in diesels, they tend to be REAL dirty. Good quality oil is good quality oil, that said, 5-W40 has been diesel oil for decades. There was an independant Porsche shop in Chattanooga TN. back in the mid 80s that swore by Shell Rotella T (diesel oil).

I remember twenty years ago when my wife had a new Pontiac that called for 5-W30 and I thought "what do they know, it needs to be heavier" so I put in 10-W30 and it rattled on start up. It never did that on the 5-W30, so I immediately changed back to 5-W30 and the rattle left. Lesson learned, turns out the people who design, test, and manufacture do know more than the guy at home.

RichardM98

If you want to use the factory approved oil then follow the document I referenced and others have linked to. There have been and will be endless debates about what is okay among end users. Will your engine blow up when you start it if you use a non-approved oil? Of course not. What you are playing with is wear (ie longevity), easy starting and gas mileage. I use factory approved fluids and filters because I plan to keep my car as long as possible. But nothing is guaranteed. I'm just hedging my bet.

Good luck.

mikekuriger

i only use royal purple. you will notice a difference

JonMBZ

Hopefully this helps everyone sleep at night

Phil C55

Hey Jon, what is the column with the Xs for? Just curious, it also seems odd that Mobil is too stupid to print on their own oil that the 5-W40 meets BOTH 229.5 and 229.51. They felt it was important to print the 229.51. I'm not arguing at all, just making observations. The StarTek current approved sheet on line doesn't jive with the screen you posted...........how in the world is anyone supposed to understand all this when MB is inconsistant with their own info.

JonMBZ

I think them adding it is still new I have been a part of these discussions before and the info was not available at that time. Mobile is probably not allowed to put it was approved until it was fully tested or maybe it is known in their world that 229.51 oils work in 229.5 spec cars.


http://www.mbz.cc/229.5.jpg
http://www.mbz.cc/229.5_2.jpg

RLx02

didn't they get sued for false advertisement?

C32_Underdog

hey lets not get carried away here. I have never seen so many documents and citations just to prove a single number on oil weight...

So to wikipedia we go, and we ALL already know this! The first number is just the viscosity rating when cold.

"The idea is to cause the multi-grade oil to have the viscosity of the base grade when cold and the viscosity of the second grade when hot. This enables one type of oil to be generally used all year. In fact, when multi-grades were initially developed, they were frequently described as all-season oil. " Wikipedia.

HOWEVER, there is more involved with the C32 AMG. Here is why I think the 0w matters, and that only mobil 1 0w-40 should be used:
The simple fact is our car has a high pressure supercharger. It is imperative that the supercharger and other associated parts be properly lubricated, ESPECIALLY on start-up. The 0w rating allowed the oil to flow like water once the car has started, and this basically allowed the oil to lubricate like water, then get hot and become 40w.

Turbos are different but a somewhat similar concept. Turbo timers allow oil to both lubricate on startup, and allows excess oil to be exposed of during shut down.

JUST FOLLOW YOUR INSTRUCTION MANUALS. 0w-40 Euro Formula. And ONLY MANN FILTERS YO!

mikekuriger

I hadn't heard, but it's entirely possible.

60n5pt1

found this on AMGmarket.com

Mercedes-Benz recommends only the use of Mercedes-Benz approved synthetic motor oil for all vehicles equipped with the Flexible Service System (1998 & newer). Below is a List of Mercedes Approved Synthetic Engine Oil (1998 – 2004 Models):

•Mobil 1 SuperSyn European Car Formula 0W-40 | MB Sheet: 229.5
•Castrol Syntec European Formula 0W-30* | MB Sheet: 229.5
•Pennzoil European Formula Ultra 5W-30* | MB Sheet: 229.5
•Quaker State European Formula Ultra 5W-30* | MB Sheet: 229.5
•ELF Excellium 229.5 5W-30* | MB Sheet: 229.5
•Mobil 1 ESP Formula M 5W-40 | MB Sheet: 229.5•Mobil 1 SuperSyn European Car Formula 0W-40 | MB Sheet: 229.3
•Castrol Syntec 5W-40 | MB Sheet: 229.3
•ELF Excellium LDX 5W-40 | MB Sheet: 229.3
•ELF Excellium LDX 0W-30* | MB Sheet: 229.3
•Quaker State Full Synthetic European Formula 5W-40 | MB Sheet: 229.3
•Pennzoil Synthetic European Formula 5W-40 | MB Sheet: 229.3
•76 Pure Synthetic Motor Oil 5W-40 | MB Sheet: 229.3
•Kendall GT-1 Full Synthetic Motor Oil 5W-40 | MB Sheet: 229.3
•Motul 8100 E-Tech 0W-40 | MB Sheet: 229.3
•Motul 8100 X-Cess 5W-40 | MB Sheet: 229.3
•Shell Helix Ultra 5W-30* | MB Sheet: 229.3
•Shell Helix Ultra 5W-40 | MB Sheet: 229.3
•Valvoline SynPower MXL 0W-30*| MB Sheet: 229.3
List of Mercedes-Benz Approved Synthetic Engine Oil (2005-2009 Models):

•Mobil 1 SuperSyn European Car Formula 0W-40
•Castrol Syntec European Formula 0W-30*
•Pennzoil European Formula Ultra 5W-30*
•Quaker State European Formula Ultra 5W-30*
•ELF Excellium 229.5 5W-30* Mobil 1 ESP Formula M 5W-401
•Valvoline SynPower MST 5W-30*
* Not approved for use in AMG engines.

NOTE: As of model year 2007 diesel engines must only use 229.51 approved engine oil.

60n5pt1

It seems according to the author both formulas are too thick cSt at 40 deg C but are both fine at cSt at 100 deg C 78 - 100 range viscousity. This high mileage formula is too thick.

trs888

There is a post on AMG Private Lounge board that is responded to by "AMG Information"...basically the AMG moderator... it says:

"Thank you very much for your post. This occurs as the automotive fluid standards have changed in the meantime (in May 2008)

AMG recommends the use of the following oils:

- Mobil 1 5W-40 for M156 engine (63er models)
- Mobil 1 0W-40 all other AMG engines (as well the AMG diesel engines that was used for the C 30 AMG)
- Mobil 1 5W-50 SLR engine

Before that change, the Mobil 1 0W-40 was used for the 63 models as well.
We hope that this information helps.

Best regards
AMG Private Lounge Team"

http://www.mercedes-amg.com/privatel...ecommends+oils

nardeezy@yahoo.

Unless you're part of the Mercedes Engine Design team, we may never know the real reason, but my gut tells me that the reason for also recommending 5w40 may have something to do with some of the 156 engines having that rattle issue due to the different metals.

nardeezy@yahoo.

I looked at the work order from my last "Service A" and Fletcher Jones of Fremont, CA used Mobil 1 5w-40.