HIRO63

I cant explain so please watch video below. Its made by tuner called "Spoon" in Japan. It makes your car handle better, smooth, etc

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zWyUD...eature=related

HIRO63

Here is picture of Rigid Collar for C63.

_AMG_

Very nice find HIRO! Definitely worth looking more into.
How much are these for the C63?

jspAMG

I need some of those for a lot of cars... Who is their US Distributor? Anyone know? This sounds like a job for Keith.

Jim

HIRO63

Retail price I think is 19,000 yen for front and 19,000 yen for rear. So total will be 38,000 yen ($475 USD). Since right now its 80 yen to $1 so it will be expensive. Spoon holds Pat for the product so I think that you only can buy thru Spoon.

HIRO63

I found Spoon english website and they do have dist all around the world so maybe you can buy from there?
http://www.spoon.jp/eng/

Jae Duk

Thought spoon makes parts specifically for Hondas?

HIRO63

Spoon is special for Honda cars but for this product they have for most of cars out there including C63. They do make fast Honda cars.

iatacs19

This product actually makes sense and it's reasonable in its claims unlike most of the stuff I see posted here.

BK63amg

Very interesting...I'd like to see somebody install them and provide a write-up on the experience to see if it's worthwhile.

noodleman

seeing how our engines are huge, i can see this having great benefit for the front mounts.

iatacs19

It's for the sub-frame not the motor mount.

wankeldude

if the aluminum is soft enough to creep like that I would think you'd better be prepared to encounter constantly loose subframe bolts over time.

I personally don't think there is any value to this.

dacatz

it is a nice product...but what happen if i own a fwd vehicle and i need to drop the subrame to remove transmission? i am sure having this product and driving the car after one winter....the subframe will not be able to drop again....due to salty road!

TexasEngineer

Why would you install a performance product on a fwd economy car? I saw that you have a Prius listed next to your C63. I don't think is makes any sense to install any performance equipment on a Prius, but to each their own.

I believe these collars are Aluminum, so they won’t degrade quite like bare steel will. Also if you have structural rust issues bad enough to fuse components to the unibody, these collars should be the last of your worries. In theory, these collars might actually help avoid corrosion issues as they keep the individual steel components from touching one another.

1Lop2K5C

I dont think you understand, the demo is on a Prius. The product isnt fwd specific and from my take on OP, there is a C63 kit.

TexasEngineer

I understand perfectly well that the product is not fwd specific. It is quite obvious if you watched the video or looked at the website. I was replying to dacatz's comment on rust problems he anticipated on his prius. I was also commenting that it is kind of silly for someone to install a performance product on an economy car. I don't think you understood my post.

vdubpower

this is basically saying that mercedes or other manufacturers are making crap products

if this was really the case those bolts would have sheared right through after a short time, if there was so much play....we obviously dont see that do we..

TexasEngineer

That is absolutely not true at all. There is always deflection (movement) in mechanical joints. In fact, there is always deflection in solid structures as well. Nothing is perfectly rigid. This product merely claims to do two things, make the chassis more rigid and also make for truer alignment. If you think there is absolutely no movement in you sub-frames and that they site perfectly flush, pull them and take a look. You might be surprised.

Your statement is kind of like saying, "the tuners on this forum are basically saying that Mercedes or other manufacturers are making crap products, because the claim to get more performance out of the car than was there originally."

vdubpower

sometimes i do think that, esp with the immense influx of tuners... amg, m sport, all the hi end manufacturers have yrs of research to optimize a product and then all of a sudden tuners are making products taht are considered head over heel better.....now im not saying this is all the cases..theere are good tuners out there...amg was obviously good enuf to get bought by meredes...i just sometimes find it hard to beleive there are so many issues or faults that need to be improved when u are buyiug top of the line M and AMG and RS cars out there

i bet someone showed up outside the bugatti factory with a chip in hand to give his blessing on the veryon

TexasEngineer

Engineering, designing, and building a product is always a balance between price and performance. There is always something left on the table performance wise. Sometimes it is done on purpose by the manufacturer as part of a tier system. MB does this quite often (i.e. C63 at 451hp and the e63 at 507hp). Most often compromising performance is done to reduce costs. Engineers and designers set goals and targets for performance. How you achieve these goals is balanced against economics, ascetics/desirability, regulations and so on. This process often leads many areas that tuners can exploit. A perfect example on most 63 AMGs is the exhaust manifolds. It would have been more expensive for AMG to developed a more efficient manifold, but it obviously would have netted decent hp. They chose not to as they were able to meet their hp goals without it. On the other hand, the SLS has more efficient manifolds, because it has different goals and economics in its design.

wankeldude

You honestly think AMG/MB wouldn't throw in 12 pieces of aluminum at a cost of $3 if it made that much of a difference?

noodleman

it'd cost AMG/MB way more than $3 for them to put this collar on their cars. There are a ton of other costs that would be associated with the actual part for AMG/MB to pay up.

The perfect analogy is Microsoft. They could add two lines of code in framework somewhere to make everyone lives easier, but the man hours required by MS to do this is ridiculously high (project planning, design, code, peer review, testing, deployment plans etc). the same two lines of code you could add in yourself in 5 min would cost MS something like a month to do (not an exaggeration).

wankeldude

The team that worked on the windows gui was 60-90 people. adding two lines of code does NOT take a month.

http://www.winrumors.com/microsoft-e...t-the-company/

BLKROKT

Ooooooh a 6yr old thread resurrect!

Just ordered these after doing quite a bit of research on them and finally tracking down a full set on eBay. Making my push now to get the car track-ready for spring - also have KW Clubsports and adjustable end-links on the way, and might pick up a full set of KMac bushings as well.

There are going to be a lot of changes all at once, but I'll let you guys know what we find when we take apart the subframe to fit these Rigid Collars. Got the idea from Phil Chow's post here: https://mbworld.org/forums/c63-amg-w...ml#post6925307

Here's the info video in Japanese:
And in English if that's more your thing:

Plenty of reviews out there, and a lot of theoretical debate on whether or not they are effective - here's a decent laymans-type write up: http://www.speedhunters.com/2011/06/...s_to_the_gt_r/

Decent engineering debate here a few pages in: http://www.iwsti.com/forums/gr-suspe...ollar-kit.html

Thoughts? The theory is.... sound I guess, and they were inexpensive enough to give it a shot. With the addition of stiffer bushings all around, and adjustable control arms/bushings/camber plates, I think there could be some benefit here....