Pufftrees

Was just reading the latest news about a new 2 door coupe designed to compete with Porsche, the SLC. But upon reading the review this jumped out to me:

"... This engine will be a new AMG development called the M177, which will boast of an output of 485 horsepower. This engine will be first seen in the upcoming C63, while an S variant of the engine is also being developed, which will then have an output of 550 horsepower."

I may be late to the party, but this seems to be indirectly confirming a biturbo V8 for C63. I hadn't seen any threads on the M177 and nothing came up via search for figured this might be new news to some.

JamE55

With all these developments (M177) and AMG still can't blast past the 600hp figure?

I get that there's the V12's which are rated over but why can't they make something over 600hp in a C or E class? Marketing maybe? Yes there's Brabus and all these other tuners but why not come from the factory standard? Just a thought.

ced357

This is very exciting news for the little C. Imagine the possibilities

tfthach13

I think slapping on HP isn't the direction that MB wants to head in. I think they want an overall balanced car specific for each of their classes. Slapping on HP is something that Dodge/Fords do very well, but they aren't exactly the most balanced cars (i.e. SRTs, Shelbys, etc.).

I'm sure MB can push the V8 TT well past the 600HP mark if they wanted, but from a consumer stand-point, it's useless.

_timothy

isnt it exactly what the AMG consumer wants? the typical consumer buys the 250/300/350. enthusiast wants the beast.

tfthach13

Yes, for the most part. But 600HP in a c-class? Can you really imagine that??

TTA850

600hp would be epic, at this point 500hp is becoming the norm, and 550 might as well be 500 in many people's eyes but break 600 and your in an elite group. Hopefully we get a twin turbo v8 for the next round that even if it comes with under 500hp stock might be able to be tuned to 600ish which would be just right

rage2

4.0L V8 TT. Low end torque will be missed, especially at high elevations.

Merc63

Ill take a 6.3l blower any day of the week

mr747

Agreed hopefully one day

callmiro

The TT 4.0L V8 in the new Audi S7 makes over 400 lb/ft it hits 0-60 in 3.9....that's alot of low end

I don't think Benz will have a problem matching/beating that as a reference

forcefed6.4ford

A TTV8 will pull down low way harder then a NA V8. 2 small turbos will spool stupid quick and pull through to red line. The only thing better then twins is compounds. Both are better than super charging.

GRam

I took my car to the dealership a few weeks ago so the provincial MB rep could check out some issues with the clear coat on my wheels (bought the car used with 3500 miles, but had small pinholes in the clear that I never noticed til a month after I had the car, rep was awesome and approved a re-finish on all 4 wheels this fall, so shout out to MB of BC ).
Anyways, during our conversation, I asked about the upcoming C63's, and if they'd be going the smaller V-8 TT route. He got a sly grin on his face and nodded enthusiastically lol.
So in 18 months I'll be passing down my lightly used sedan to the wifey for a new coupe for myself

Point2Point

Turbo cars do better than NA cars at high elevation. The lower density air running into a normally aspirated motor is less effective in the burning of fuel. A turbocharger can jam higher density air into the motor. The downside is that the turbocharger will be spinning harder, which generates greater heat and wear.

forcefed6.4ford

Turbos can still struggle at altitude. The effects just aren't as noticeable as with a NA engine. They wont be spinning faster. Slower in fact.

Ive seen trucks run a full second or more slower at Bandimere in Denver then down at Enis

TTA850

Temperature and humidity tend to affect a turbo car more than altitude/barometric pressure. My '89 GTA has a turbo V6 and I've raced in da ranging from -1000 to +4000, with performance being fairly consistsnt at similar temp/humidity but the higher da (lower air density) causes the car to be slower to spool. So thankful for the transbrake in those situations. As long as the turbo is capable, and the system used closed loop boost control, it should spin faster to keep the boost the same in a higher altitude situation. I know my car is older tech but just my observations from my combination and not saying its a rule.

forcefed6.4ford

If MB opts for twin vgt turbos the tuning capabilities will be epic.

Jycke

Because for many customers who would be willing to buy more expensive models, like the V12's, would end up buying the C/E-class. Bad business.

rage2

Yea, top end, can't beat a turbo car at elevation, the 63 V8 TT's make advertised HP here at 3700ft, while the 6.3 NA motors make 100+hp less. The area under the curve is what changes significantly. Low end, you don't spool until a lot higher rpm's compared to sea level, hence, poor low end torque. I drive a CLS550 4.7L V8 TT, and I can't even chirp my all seasons off the line, but it'll match my C63 BS from a roll.

Driving the 6.2L NA for several years now, I've been spoiled by low end insta-torque. It's awesome for daily driving.

forcefed6.4ford

If, and I hope they are, vgt. Nothing would touch them.

coladin

I drove the new S6 and it was pretty powerful but I felt it was similar to what everyone else is developing out there, like the MB TTV8s. If it weren't for the traction at the start, the Audi I think from a roll felt weaker than the MB TTV8s. Nice, but it sounded warbly and did not inspire any emotional attachment. Part of the reason why I decided to get a 2014 C63 instead. These cars connect with their drivers like no other!

sighting

I believe the M177 will be a 4L Bi-Turbo V8, 495hp base and 525HP PP, first planned for the new C63 then it will make it into the SLC / c190 which will have a 550HP Version.
Then a planned Black series of the SLC which should have 600HP.

Now lets just hope that its just a software pluming upgrade difference and not an internal diffs.

zibby43

AMG is stealing away more potential M customers than ever by producing more balanced cars.

I believe that is the path they should stay on. Please AMG, leave behind the reputation that AMG cars are merely straight-line brutes that fall apart on the twisty roads.

roadtalontsi

i like the v12 comment. "they are over-rated" haha ignorance is bliss.

Maverick1975

Ditto, that combination is just off the charts for low down torque