JPetros2008

Hey guys. Made a post about a week or so ago about swapping out new calipers onto my car. They are the same exact calipers (except painted blue instead of the regular silver). Bought them from a parted out C63 locally on craigslist.

Anyway, I finally put the calipers onto my car with my friend's help. Took about 3 hours total. We've run into a bit of a problem though. We're trying to flush the brake fluid (and I've never done this before, but my friend has). We tried using a method where we press the brake pedal, but that wasn't working at all.

Then, we went to Advance Auto Parts and bought a pressure bleeder system (pictured below). We didn't get any use out of it though, because we feel like there is no way to pressurize it. There is no cap that we can close the container with like in this video:

(4:50 mark).

Is there something else we were supposed to buy as well? Any help would be greatly appreciated. As of right now, my car is stuck in his garage and I can not drive it at all. Even when I press the pedal all the way down, I can not shift it from Park into Neutral or Drive.

bhamg

I've never used a pressure bleeder before but I'm about to buy this one. You can clearly see the cap that enable the reservoir to be pressurized.



Do I see a similar (black) cap in the top of the case in your photo?

zcct04

Here's a DIY on YouTube for your brake bleeder, part 1 (of 9?)
Part 1 - Part 2 - etc . . .

and here's one from the Motive Power web site:

This string may also help:
https://mbworld.org/forums/c-class-w...ed-brakes.html

Good luck!

Jasonoff

You showed a video of a pressure bleeder (Motive) and a picture of a vacuum bleeder.

Which one are you trying to use?

Mort

You need to buy the adapter for the MB reservoir to attach to your Motive pressure bleeder. The 1100 European is the adapter you need.

http://motiveproducts.3dcartstores.c...ter_p_114.html

abcut973

Very helpful DIY.
I used a pressure bleeder from Harbor freight that i was able to connect to my air compressor when i installed my painted calipers.

chief63

I used the motive power bleeder and followed the youtube instructions and worked out good, strong pedal, remember the order is very important.

Jasonoff

Did the 1100 seal well? I'm curious if the 1109 is worth the extra cheese.

http://motiveproducts.3dcartstores.c...109_p_100.html

EROD

What you purchased is a Vacuum Bleeder...different than a pressure bleeder like the one the video. To use your vacuum bleeder, attach one end of the rubber hose to the to the brake bleed valves on your calipers and the other to the bleeder. Attach one of the catch bottles to the lid. Pump the bleeder a few times and it will create a vacuum in the catch bottle You then open the brake bleed valve by loosening it and the vacuum will 'suck' out the fluid. Keep pumping the bleeder to maintain a constant vacuum until you've sucked out all the old fluid or the catch bottle fills up (if it fills up first, make sure you retighten the bleed screw first before you change out the bottle otherwise all sorts of air bubbles will get into the brake lines). I've used both types of systems and both work though I prefer the pressure bleeder as it a neater system.

JPetros2008

Didn't realize there was a difference. I found a youtube video that actually uses the exact kit I bought.


Should be pretty easy to get it done now. Hopefully we get a chance to get it done tomorrow. I'll let you guys know when it's done and hopefully I won't need anymore help!

Thanks a lot guys!

Mort

The 1100 adapter works fine. The 1109 has a swivel to ease turning it on and off the reservoir. Either will work fine. The pressure bleeder is much better than a vacuum bleeder from my experience as I have used both. Use the vacuum bleeder to siphon out the old fluid from the reservoir before filling it with fresh fluid then you don't have to flush all that old fluid through the brake system.

If you are using the vacuum bleeder be very careful not to let the reservoir go dry and suck air into the master cylinder. Some master cylinders will trap the air and have to be removed from the car and be bleed on the bench.

GL

Jasonoff

It's also aluminium instead of plastic. Cheers for the info on the 1100.

JPetros2008

Guys,

The vacuum bleeder ended up being a dud. Not sure if we just don't know what we're doing, but we pretty much did exactly what the last video I posted said to do. I think there's a big difference in the fact that we are using completely different calipers to do the flush whereas they were just flushing the old fluid out from the calipers that were already on the car. We vacuumed and vacuumed, but it was taking forever and we were getting almost nothing, but bubbles and some liquid. Eventually we just gave up and I ordered the Motive Pressure Bleeder ( ) recommended by bhamg. I also ordered the Super Blue ATE Brake Fluid so that we should easily be able to see when the new fluid is going in.

My only questions now are:

1. Is there something we were doing wrong that you can figure out based on my terribly described posts so far?

2. We will follow the videos posted describing how to use the Motive Pressure Bleeder, BUT is there anything we have to do differently since we are using new calipers that didn't have any brake fluid in them before we installed them onto my car?

Fluid and bleeder should be here by Thursday so hopefully we can figure it out by then....thanks for the help so far guys.

JPetros2008

also, i searched through a couple other threads and wanted to know if we need the STAR system to properly bleed the brakes? if so, i might as well just get the car towed to mercedes which i really wanted to avoid if possible.

bhamg

Someone posted recently that even the Motive system was marginal (i.e., amount of pressure) due to ABS. IIRC they stated a vacuum bleeder would NOT work, only pressure. So, you may indeed need STAR to cycle the ABS but give the Motive a shot first. Obviously most of us are starting with a fluid-filled system which would make the job much easier. GL.

Jasonoff

Why not just have your car towed to the dealer and have them flush the fluid?

If you have no clue what you're doing I wouldn't recommend monkeying around any more with a critical safety system.

JPetros2008

i feel like we SHOULD be able to do it, but we just don't know if it's not possible on this car. for example, given our situation with new calipers that didn't have any fluid in them, can the brakes still be bled without the STAR system and using the Motive Pressure Bleeder? if the answer is no, then obviously i'll just get it towed and then have it done.

otherwise, i'd ideally like to avoid the towing and flush fees if we can just do it ourselves.

Critter

First of all when you put the "new" calipers on they were probably near empty of fluid so when you pushed the brake you displaced minimal fluid into two empty calipers, now when you released the brake pedal you could have drawn air back towards the reservoir. Since the master cyl piston is about 1 inch in diameter you are trying to push 12 1 inch cylinders with it, see where I am going. What you should try is using gravity to assist you or prefill the calipers using a hypo/needle then install lines onto the calipers, open bleeder screw of the one furthest away from the master, make sure reservoir if full and remains topped up all through this process. When fluid is seen coming out of the bleeder, close this bleeder and then open the opposite caliper bleeder to allow air to escape and the fluid to come out. Place a line on the bleeder head to direct fluid into a bottle instead of just running down the caliper Making sure fluid is topped up in reservoir as it is removed from caliper.
Now with both cyls pre/bled start using you pedal method to further remove air from the system or if you now have brakes but low pedal, take to dealer for complete flush of the brakes, driving with caution for sure. Hopefully you only changed the front two calipers, all four will be a lot of fun. Remember 1 inch master cylinder piston pushing 12 pistons in front and 8 in the back.
Brakes are very important next to steering and should not be attempted without mechanical knowledge and expertise of what you are doing. A Benz is not the best first car to work on the brakes due to it's complexity. The above method is just an example and not meant to be the end all to beat all. Owner beware!

Mort

I bled the brakes on my car with a Motive Pressure bleeder and am sure it will do the job on your car.

Jasonoff

The 1109 worked very well

roadtalontsi

you shouldnt need star daig to cycle the system it's not sbc. You should be able to use the pressure bleeder. you going to need a decent amount of pressure, at the shop we run about 30psi. remember on the calipers with 2 bleeders to do the outside first and inside second. also start with the caliper furthest away/longest brake lines. Its going to take quite abit to get all the air out since the calipers were off. your going to need like 3 bottles. Even the old school way of press down brakes, open bleeder, close bleeder, raise pedal - should work its just going to take a while these arent little baby honda brake calipers. consider it a work out day for your legs haha.

Ingenieur

I've used both with success on similar braking systems

with the vacuum one did you leave the reservoir cap loose?
although you are pulling a vacuum on the system what is actually doing the work is atmospheric pressure, it's pushing the fluid thru the system, the vacuum is just helping/speeding the process up

also you have to turn the nipples a few turns, get them really open

as some one said perhaps open all the nipples and keep the reservoir topped off until you see fluid dripping from them
then close them and pressure or vacuum bleed each corner

JPetros2008

well, the pressure bleeder worked, but we had a problem with one of the screws that bleeds the caliper on one of the front brakes. got the car to work enough so that we could get it to drive.

took it to a shop the next morning that specializes in mercedes repair and service (dealership had no availability for this weekend) and told them the full story of what had happened. they took the car in and checked it out and were telling me that the brake fluid container was cracked and leaking along with 3 out of 4 brake lines so i might as well get all 4 brake lines replaced. quoted me $1100ish to get it all fixed up. i texted my friend and he told me there was no way that was possible.there were no leaks from the car overnight in my garage so i didn't really know what to think. took it to another place and they bled all the old fluid out and everything is good to go. asked them if there was any leaks anywhere or anything and they said not at all.

sucks that it's so hard to trust anyone these days. glad everything is fixed now though and i definitely won't be messing with the car anymore.

thanks for all the help though guys.

roadtalontsi

wow that's shady as ****. Glad you didnt trust them and got your car taken car of for a reasonable price. ive had similar encounters with my friends and brakes plus/just brakes type places. they wanted to replace calipers on a 4 yr old car with 30k miles on it, all 4 rotors and pads, and the master cylinder. car realistically only needed rear pads, front pads and rotors. they also overtorqued the **** out of the lug bolts after i argued with them on my friends behalf. there reasoning for calipers was the inner pad was wearing more then the outter. which is normal to an extent, however any more than 15-20% more than the other i'd consider unusual. I asked him where he was trained. he replied with "OJT". Im like is that some school or what? "no, on job training". I was like yeah, were done here. they proceeded to insult my friend and I. This is exactly why I steer people away from those places.

abcut973

Glad you got your car back to normal. As for the shop trying to rip you off that is really dishonest! Thankfully your good sense told you to avoid them
Now enjoy your car safely.