grizzly111

I was very excited to see the listing as I have been looking for a BS. ....Then I saw the price....ridiculous. Especially considering it has a very average 20,000km on the dial and doesn't even have the aero package.

Redbook reckons these should go for around $180k. I'd be interested at that price. This is far from a collectors car yet, esp with that amount of MILEAGE on the car.

Didn't they sell for $245k BRAND NEW??

Are BS in the US selling for more than they were released at? In Oz other limited import, second-hand BS with less mileage are selling for way less than original price.

abcut973

For sure it is overpriced!!!
In the US used non-aero package BSs sell for 100k to 105k at the moment.
I know aussies prices are higher than here but you shouldn't be above MSRP of a aero package.
Unless this car is the only used BS on the market (you know the offer/demand effect).

mr747

It's just a joke what prices you pay here

You cam pick up a clk black for 150k so it doesn't surprise me the guy wants 250

charliekay

This is the one that was $289k last week. It came down $10k in 1 week. Don't be surprised if it comes down more in the near future.

Maverick1975

This second hand car was originally advertised for $300k before on road costs. My partner and I are looking at buying another BS(for her) and convinced this dealership that price was uncompetitive. Brand new my car cost $275k with optional wheels and satin paint option so this original price for a second hand car with that mileage was ambitious. Prices in Autralia are based under a totally different tax structure and have zero relationship with US prices. This is only the second used BS I have seen advertised for sale in Australia since the car was released so supply is very limited and Australia is one of the highest per capita sales markets globally for AMG so no shortage of demand.

ab0bab0i

How are import regulations in AUS?
Is it possible to import one from US?(LHD tho)

waldo99

My BS has same spec as that car, but also has Cargraphic headers and hand crafted exhaust and tune with only 3,400 kms........I wonder what it's value is?

I doubt I am a seller as this is the last of the big cube naturally aspirated engines. The end of an era!

When I drive my car around the traps in Sydney I get heaps of people stare at the car.....

Bardman

I think a new 507 is a much better deal than this.

Firstly you can get a sedan which IMO looks better than the coupe, secondly you get a new car rather than second hand, thirdly (is that a word?) you can tailor the options (colours etc) to your preference. (and the 507 wheels look better)

What do you lose with the 507?

- 3 HP (not much to say there)
- Skinnier rear tyres (this is probably the biggest loss)
- Track ready oil cooling (not really a problem for me)

charliekay

You can't be seriously comparing a Black Series to a 507, yes they may both shared the forged internals and other engine pieces from the SLS, but the difference go far beyond HP and tire sizes, and even if you get past the difference in body styling and amazing aggressive wider track of the Black Series you are still forgetting that the Black Series is made for true driving/tracking enthusiasts, the differences in suspension, driveline, weight reduction (beyond the few kgs you save from forged engine internals), aero kits, etc.. makes a big difference in the way the car drives and handles.

Yes $280k for a used Black Series might sound steep, but it is the only one on the market and I am sure someone with enough $ that missed the first allocation will jump on it.

I know if this was closer to $200k I would seriously think about it, so I am sure there are people out there that it is worth a little more to.

Remember it is a dealer selling it, so if you are registered for GST you can get 10% back, long term as a business expense you wouldn't lose too much money. After deductions and depreciations and because of the exclusivity it won't actually depreciate that much and you get to drive it around. Not a bad deal if you ask me.

Remember CLK BS are still going for $180k +. In 6 years I guarantee you that your 507 will have lost more than $100k, where are the BS wouldnt have.

grizzly111

You can only claim GST back on a vehicle if it's used soley for business purposes. Unfortunately I won't like to justify to the ATO during an audit what I'm doing claiming this sort of vehicle in my business. Even as a partial claim.

Besides the maximum GST credit you can claim is about $5700.

Now regarding the price - I had no idea it was on the market previously for even more!

The guy that compared the BS to a 507 has a point though. There is a significant difference between the 507 and BS in overall performance terms and look but at the end of the day we're talking an almost $100k difference for a second hand car with mileage.

The cheapest CLK black is selling for $145k with only 13k km on the dial. It's lost over 50% from new. They just cant sell them.

charliekay

I agree with you completely but the $6k in GST input credits plus other deductions can make it worthwhile for some people.

I know there is a $100k price difference between the BS and the 507, but there is also a $100k price difference between a CLK63 and a CLK63 Black Series.

People pay for exclusivity. I agree with the fact that this particular BS is a little over priced, but the market dictates price at the end of the day, so lets see if it sells at that price or if the price comes down.

Bardman

Only on the track. For street driving there is no material difference between the two cars. So from a street drivers' perspective, you wont notice the difference until your kids/friends want to get in the back and you are reduced to folding the front seats to get them in.

So, then you look at it as a track car. It makes no sense. Its too heavy, it has poor weight distribution, and it lacks the precise gear control of a DCT gearbox. A Porsche, a GT-R, even a Lotus make much more sense on the track.

I seriously doubt that the C63BS will be worth $170k in 6 years time. Modern cars don't age well. Technology changes so quickly that cars just become out of date. Add to that that it will be the old body shape, and that its performance will be eclipsed by the next generation and you will see the price come tumbling down.

Don't get me wrong, I like the BS, but I would take a brand new 507 at around $170k, over a used BS at $280k any day of the week.

charliekay

No offence mate but you obviously don't know how special the C63 BS is if you think it does not make sense as a track car. Did you know that the BS went around the Nurburgring faster or within 1/2 second of the likes of many Porsches, Gallardos, and much faster than any Lotus.

We are not talking about tracking the car at the 24 hours of Spa, or Le Mans, we are talking about regular guys who enjoy taking their car to the track for some fun, the C63 BS will punish any regular car on the track in Australia, stock for stock.

Between a $170k 507 and $280k BS, I would probably take the 507 as well, but long term the BS will depreciate alot less than the 507, if you want to think otherwise because you have a 507 and want to feel good then that is up to you, but that facts are the 507 is another C63, the BS is a limited run of 32, just like the CLK BS, yes their may not be demand for them, but people can afford to hold on to them until someone comes along that cant say no to the price.

Bardman

The 911 Carrera S lapped the ring 7 seconds faster, and the GT-R lapped the ring 26 seconds faster. The BS is about 40 seconds quicker than the fastest Lotus I could find, however.


I fully expect my 507 to depreciate horribly, I just expect the BS to depreciate horribly as well. Its depreciation percentage may be less, but in absolute dollar terms I don't think there will be any material difference.



In any case, if you look at what I wrote initially:

And now finally your reply:

It looks like ultimately we agree.

grizzly111

I used to own a Lotus and can safely say that I'm not surprised it gets murdered on the Ring. It's just too fast a track for it. Unless the Lotus is non-stock and massively upgraded it can't compete with the high powered stuff. I tell you what though, it really teaches you how to be a good driver. IF you are a good - no GREAT - driver the Lotus will reward.

They are best on tighter and shorter tracks.

neoprufrok

I agree with you at this price, the BS is overpriced. I know. I own one. But to say that the 507 is close is inaccurate at best. The BS has way more than just wider track and a body kit. It has fully a adjustable suspension, better aerodynamics, and its tuned from the factory to go fast not only in a straight line, but in the curves. It's hard to find a factory car like it. Magazine and track times are not always a good marker for performance, but you'll see that the BS was the second best driver's car in Motor Trend's best driver's car last year. It also got around Laguna Seca pretty fast.

In the end, buying cars as an investment is dumb. You buy it, you enjoy it, and you keep/sell it. But to say that the 507 is close is not right.

BTW, the CLK63 BS over here still sells at 70k and its almost 6 years old. Still has not lost 50%. And there are more of them here in the US than the new C63 BS.

Jycke

There seems to be a lot of arguing between the 507 and if it is comparable to the BS. In my opinion they are not, but a 110 k AUD premium for the bs is inanse and should not be considered. The 507 is fine as it is for the track, install KW suspension and you make it so much better (i did, it is fantastic with the DDC). I own neither the 507 or the BS, but i just don't think it makes sense to pay that much more for basically the same car in daily drive use. You can't go wrong either way, but the C63 BS will lose value the same as other cars do. Maybe percentually less than the 507, but more $$$

Bardman

I'm not trying to be argumentative, but I'd like to understand these statements better.

Wider track and wider rear tyres, and body kit I understand. (for me these are the biggest plusses of the BS over the 507).

Fully adjustable suspenion. I see this as a track only benefit. For street driving I dont really see a benefit. I'm sure its nice to know you can adjust it, but in practice I think this would be rarely used for street driving.

Better aerodynamics. If we are talking about an improved drag coefficient, I can't imagine it would have a noticeable effect on your street driving. If we are talking about the optional aero package, again I don't really see this as having any street benefit at all.

Tuned from the factory to go fast around curves. What does this mean? I think this is just refering to the points above.

If I look at these I think, there are some great track improvements that the BS has over the 507, but for street driving there aren't really any. Then when I think about a car that I want to take to the track, and a BS is not really my first choice there.

If I could buy a new BS for 20k or less on top of the price of a 507 (and ideally it came in sedan form also ) I would be happy to go for one, but anything over that and I really wonder what I am paying for.

neoprufrok

I understand what you are saying, but the car is the ultimate track expression of a C series. It's what its meant to be. Of course, an Ariel Atom or Caterham would be faster and likely more fun on the track. But if you have an affinity for MBZ cars and maybe the C class, this the most extreme OEM example of that car.

As for adjustable suspensions... many of us have coilovers for whatever reason. I have a KW V3 on my Daily driver RS4 which sees occasional track time. Why would I track an RS4? Because I want to love the car as a manual V8 sedan AWD car and occasionally I like to hear it sing at 8250 rpms. Of course there are faster cars, but I want MY car to be as fast as it can be on track.

For street driving? I drive in a very spirited way over Skyline here in Northern California. In fact I take any car on this road. Aside from the MP4 that I drove once on this stretch, the BS is the most enjoyable driving car I had... Am I driving 10/10ths... no. Am I driving 8/10ths.. .yes. And I can say pretty confidently I was having a better time driving my BS than I did a C63 sedan (which I have) - but it was still enjoyable.

My point is that these RS, black, etc cars are ultimate track/sport expressions of their respective lines. Not everyone will track them, but some will and that's not to beat the crap out of a track spec lotus cup... but to let their car sing to its fullest.

I don't fault anyone for doing that or paying money for that... that's up to them.

Pickles

A Black Series is a Black Series, simple as that.
Having said that, $280K is too much money,...there's better value around than that.
Cheers, Pickles.

charliekay

The price has come down again, not alot, but $275k now.