C63 or M4?
04-25-2014, 10:57 AM
#51
04-25-2014, 10:59 AM
#52
Owning the latest, newest model to come out is an appeal to me. Complete vanity, but I enjoy having what is new and in the begining is rare... and to not have the "old" model for 5-7 years is appealing too. So the nod goes to the M4 for that.
I would have to do what I did when I bought my C63. Back to back test drives.
There is a BMW & Mercedes dealership about 1 mile apart where I live (Rt 17 in Ramsey NJ area). I did multiple back to back test drives of the two cars and the C63 just felt better overall. The sound and the torquey feel, along with a very raw sporty steering feel jumped out at me. The M3 wasn't very torquey, so it felt slow. It's exhaust note is too quiet... and the chassis felt more balanced, but I liked the steering "feedback" of the C63 better.
When the M4 comes out, I would have to do the same "back to back" test drive to see what happens.
I'm guessing it will be very much the same. The M4 will have better chassis feel and balance... and that will be it.
A V6 Turbo will not sound anything like the muscle V8. Its getting electric steering so thats a negative too. Its a bit more powerful but it's still not as much power as the C63.
So I think its quite simple. What "looks" better to you - can't discount looks. It's important.
And what would you rather have?
C63 - More Power & Great Steering Feedback & Decent Chassis Balance
or
M4 - Less Power & Steering Feedback (to be determined, electric) & Great Chassis Balance
To me the C63 still has more pro's vs. con's. C63 still wins - but I'd like to drive the M4 when it makes touch down.
I would have to do what I did when I bought my C63. Back to back test drives.
There is a BMW & Mercedes dealership about 1 mile apart where I live (Rt 17 in Ramsey NJ area). I did multiple back to back test drives of the two cars and the C63 just felt better overall. The sound and the torquey feel, along with a very raw sporty steering feel jumped out at me. The M3 wasn't very torquey, so it felt slow. It's exhaust note is too quiet... and the chassis felt more balanced, but I liked the steering "feedback" of the C63 better.
When the M4 comes out, I would have to do the same "back to back" test drive to see what happens.
I'm guessing it will be very much the same. The M4 will have better chassis feel and balance... and that will be it.
A V6 Turbo will not sound anything like the muscle V8. Its getting electric steering so thats a negative too. Its a bit more powerful but it's still not as much power as the C63.
So I think its quite simple. What "looks" better to you - can't discount looks. It's important.
And what would you rather have?
C63 - More Power & Great Steering Feedback & Decent Chassis Balance
or
M4 - Less Power & Steering Feedback (to be determined, electric) & Great Chassis Balance
To me the C63 still has more pro's vs. con's. C63 still wins - but I'd like to drive the M4 when it makes touch down.
04-25-2014, 11:26 AM
#53
MBWorld Fanatic!
Have any of you even heard the exhaust of the new BMW M4? The car literally sounds like a lawnmower, and I will be providing you with a short clip of some revving sounds of the M4. Not only does it sound horrible, but in the video you can clearly hear the man say, "it sounds like my Prius." 0:12 seconds
Honestly, anybody who buys a M or AMG car is looking for straight performance. Even though BMW tried to accomplish better fuel economy, this still shouldn't be the reason to put a series car engine in an M car and just tune it to 420HP. The smart car enthusiast, would buy a 335i with the M package, and tune it to M4 standards. You will save money and have an M car.
Enjoy
BMW F82 M4 Start and Rev - YouTube
Honestly, anybody who buys a M or AMG car is looking for straight performance. Even though BMW tried to accomplish better fuel economy, this still shouldn't be the reason to put a series car engine in an M car and just tune it to 420HP. The smart car enthusiast, would buy a 335i with the M package, and tune it to M4 standards. You will save money and have an M car.
Enjoy
BMW F82 M4 Start and Rev - YouTube
PL
04-25-2014, 11:40 AM
#54
MBWorld Fanatic!
I agree 100%, these super sedans have all gotten pretty damn good!
I was / am an avid M division fan. However I am not naïve to the fact other manufacturers have caught up in terms of performance / handling. Aesthetics Is subjective.
I was ....this close to pulling the trigger on an E90 M. After really sitting down and considering the options, the C63 to me was the better street car.
The New M3 is a great looking car, the sedan is a beast in the flesh, those rear fenders are enormous!
All in all, as an enthusiast we cannot discredit the competition. Competition will only afford better engineering and in-turn produce better vehicles for the everyday consumer.
I was / am an avid M division fan. However I am not naïve to the fact other manufacturers have caught up in terms of performance / handling. Aesthetics Is subjective.
I was ....this close to pulling the trigger on an E90 M. After really sitting down and considering the options, the C63 to me was the better street car.
The New M3 is a great looking car, the sedan is a beast in the flesh, those rear fenders are enormous!
All in all, as an enthusiast we cannot discredit the competition. Competition will only afford better engineering and in-turn produce better vehicles for the everyday consumer.
04-25-2014, 11:43 AM
#55
MBWorld Fanatic!
This is the same story generation after generation. I would hope the M's would progress.
Either way im confident the new C63 will have atleast 50HP and 50LBTQ over the New M's out the box.
Tuned, both cars will be fast no doubt. But as in the current gen cars the AMG should be a quicker.
Either way im confident the new C63 will have atleast 50HP and 50LBTQ over the New M's out the box.
Tuned, both cars will be fast no doubt. But as in the current gen cars the AMG should be a quicker.
04-25-2014, 11:47 AM
#56
I agree 100%, these super sedans have all gotten pretty damn good!
I was / am an avid M division fan. However I am not naïve to the fact other manufacturers have caught up in terms of performance / handling. Aesthetics Is subjective.
I was ....this close to pulling the trigger on an E90 M. After really sitting down and considering the options, the C63 to me was the better street car.
The New M3 is a great looking car, the sedan is a beast in the flesh, those rear fenders are enormous!
All in all, as an enthusiast we cannot discredit the competition. Competition will only afford better engineering and in-turn produce better vehicles for the everyday consumer.
I was / am an avid M division fan. However I am not naïve to the fact other manufacturers have caught up in terms of performance / handling. Aesthetics Is subjective.
I was ....this close to pulling the trigger on an E90 M. After really sitting down and considering the options, the C63 to me was the better street car.
The New M3 is a great looking car, the sedan is a beast in the flesh, those rear fenders are enormous!
All in all, as an enthusiast we cannot discredit the competition. Competition will only afford better engineering and in-turn produce better vehicles for the everyday consumer.
order that with the ceramic brakes and get a tune you have an awd M5 rival..the car will run 12/115 stock! I've seen even lower, 11.7 range
and it's 20k$ less than the E63 or M5
and gets 26 mpg on the highway
rated higher (purely subjective) than the e63 and M5
http://www.caranddriver.com/comparis...omparison-test
http://media.caranddriver.com/files/...-e63-amg-1.pdf
ALL cars ae getting exponentially better
it comes down to preference (saying one is 'better' is silly)
I am a long time ///M owner and have had an Audi RS4 also
having said that, the C63 is amazing and as good overall as any of them
Last edited by Ingenieur; 04-25-2014 at 11:49 AM.
04-25-2014, 12:29 PM
#57
Super Member
Last edited by w204_Generic; 04-25-2014 at 12:32 PM.
04-25-2014, 12:33 PM
#58
MBWorld Fanatic!
Not the same engine,
That exhaust you posted could also be the BMW M Performance exhaust. Which I am sure will be available for the M as well.
Either way you slice it, the Turbo 6's sound weak. As they inherently will be compared to the big V8.
That exhaust you posted could also be the BMW M Performance exhaust. Which I am sure will be available for the M as well.
Either way you slice it, the Turbo 6's sound weak. As they inherently will be compared to the big V8.
It probably was a little harsh, because I am really disappointed about the release. Anyways, now that you listened to the BMW M4, I would like you to listen to the F30 335i in comparison. They both have the same engine, but in my opinion, this is what the M4 should actually sound like. Sounds 100% better.
Soundcheck: BMW 335i xDrive Start up & Sound - YouTube
Soundcheck: BMW 335i xDrive Start up & Sound - YouTube
04-25-2014, 12:39 PM
#59
Super Member
Last edited by w204_Generic; 04-25-2014 at 12:47 PM.
04-25-2014, 12:48 PM
#60
MBWorld Fanatic!
I purchased the C63 (pre facelift gen) because to me its a keeper. The styling is elegant but purposeful. The M156 is a fantastic power plant. I love to hear how many people forget how "tunable" the M156 really is. I mean come on guys with a 800 dollar tune we are getting 50+ Horses! let alone the tq increase!
For an NA engine that's huge! Coupled with a good set of headers. Our cars are doing mid 400's to the wheel! With enough tq to pull extremely hard on a tuned M3!
Ideally a stage 1 SC on the M156 is the ultimate compromise between old-world muscle (big v8) and new gen "tuning" with the FI setup. You maintain the linear power band of the NA motor with the SC setup + keep the overall drivability of the car relatively stock, of course with the bump in HP / TQ. You don't even have to change your exhaust!
Unfortunately the mass of AMG owners do not venture nearly as much as the M guys do into tuning. The market for AMG tuners are relatively small. So you get this perceived notion that the M's / RS's / S' etc are better "tuner" cars.
Oh well, I will be gladly driving my 6.2 guzzler for years to come. Enjoying every gurgle and roar on down shift!
For an NA engine that's huge! Coupled with a good set of headers. Our cars are doing mid 400's to the wheel! With enough tq to pull extremely hard on a tuned M3!
Ideally a stage 1 SC on the M156 is the ultimate compromise between old-world muscle (big v8) and new gen "tuning" with the FI setup. You maintain the linear power band of the NA motor with the SC setup + keep the overall drivability of the car relatively stock, of course with the bump in HP / TQ. You don't even have to change your exhaust!
Unfortunately the mass of AMG owners do not venture nearly as much as the M guys do into tuning. The market for AMG tuners are relatively small. So you get this perceived notion that the M's / RS's / S' etc are better "tuner" cars.
Oh well, I will be gladly driving my 6.2 guzzler for years to come. Enjoying every gurgle and roar on down shift!
a real sleeper is the new Audi S6
order that with the ceramic brakes and get a tune you have an awd M5 rival..the car will run 12/115 stock! I've seen even lower, 11.7 range
and it's 20k$ less than the E63 or M5
and gets 26 mpg on the highway
rated higher (purely subjective) than the e63 and M5
http://www.caranddriver.com/comparis...omparison-test
http://media.caranddriver.com/files/...-e63-amg-1.pdf
ALL cars ae getting exponentially better
it comes down to preference (saying one is 'better' is silly)
I am a long time ///M owner and have had an Audi RS4 also
having said that, the C63 is amazing and as good overall as any of them
order that with the ceramic brakes and get a tune you have an awd M5 rival..the car will run 12/115 stock! I've seen even lower, 11.7 range
and it's 20k$ less than the E63 or M5
and gets 26 mpg on the highway
rated higher (purely subjective) than the e63 and M5
http://www.caranddriver.com/comparis...omparison-test
http://media.caranddriver.com/files/...-e63-amg-1.pdf
ALL cars ae getting exponentially better
it comes down to preference (saying one is 'better' is silly)
I am a long time ///M owner and have had an Audi RS4 also
having said that, the C63 is amazing and as good overall as any of them
04-25-2014, 12:54 PM
#61
MBWorld Fanatic!
Just because the engine is the same size doesn't make it the same engine bud.
Take a read of the below link and see why its so different. And yes those changes make a world of difference in engine dynamics.
http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=893611
Take a read of the below link and see why its so different. And yes those changes make a world of difference in engine dynamics.
http://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sho...d.php?t=893611
04-25-2014, 01:02 PM
#62
Super Member
I was referring to engine size as the same...Not actual internals.....Obviously it's not the same internal wise. 335i has the N55, the M4 has the S55.
Last edited by w204_Generic; 04-25-2014 at 01:08 PM.
04-25-2014, 01:11 PM
#63
MBWorld Fanatic!
That's not what you said in your original post 
You said the same engine.
Either way, i'm sure the aftermarket exhaust companies will have something nice for the F8x M's. Should make the exhaust note a bit more "tolerable" hehehehe.
Cheers.
You said the same engine. Either way, i'm sure the aftermarket exhaust companies will have something nice for the F8x M's. Should make the exhaust note a bit more "tolerable" hehehehe.
Cheers.
04-25-2014, 01:14 PM
#64
Super Member
I should have been more specific and added size to my post then.....
04-25-2014, 01:29 PM
#65
MBWorld Fanatic!
The S55 is not identical to either of those motors, but it's similar in some ways. One could say the N54 and N55 helped get the ball rolling on the S55.
For example, the new M power plant shares the same bore and stroke as the standard motor. However, the internals on the new motor are entirely different and so is the induction process.
It's worth noting that the S55 is the first "M" motor that is produced alongside the standard BMW motors. It is no longer being assembled by M.
06-12-2014, 03:13 AM
#66
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C63 Coupe 507 Ed
Hello,
Thanks for this forum.
I am a current owner of a E46 M3, its getting old now.
In the process of trading this in for a new 507 series C63 or a M4.
unsure which one to get, but after reading this forum, sounds like the C63 is the way to go.
I am looking for a brand new white one in Australia.
thanks guys
(sorry english not very good)
cheers
Thanks for this forum.
I am a current owner of a E46 M3, its getting old now.
In the process of trading this in for a new 507 series C63 or a M4.
unsure which one to get, but after reading this forum, sounds like the C63 is the way to go.
I am looking for a brand new white one in Australia.
thanks guys
(sorry english not very good)
cheers
06-12-2014, 04:01 AM
#68
Hello,
Thanks for this forum.
I am a current owner of a E46 M3, its getting old now.
In the process of trading this in for a new 507 series C63 or a M4.
unsure which one to get, but after reading this forum, sounds like the C63 is the way to go.
I am looking for a brand new white one in Australia.
thanks guys
(sorry english not very good)
cheers
Thanks for this forum.
I am a current owner of a E46 M3, its getting old now.
In the process of trading this in for a new 507 series C63 or a M4.
unsure which one to get, but after reading this forum, sounds like the C63 is the way to go.
I am looking for a brand new white one in Australia.
thanks guys
(sorry english not very good)
cheers
06-12-2014, 08:12 AM
#69
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2009 C63
All that, I still want the &^%ing M3 (or M4)!!
And while I have my mind set on an E-350 4Matic Wagon to trick out in the future, I will absolutely not pass up a good deal on an M Car. Park it right next to the C63 for some proper Ying-Yang hi-performance balance. A sledghammer and a...........hmm. I dunno. What to call the M-Car? Whatever. Something nice.
So, if I'm you and thinking new, a 2015 M205 C-63 might be worth the wait. Seems you'll only be waiting a tad more - if at all - than for an M3/4 since both are still not on the market, as someone else has noted. No, not a loud & obnoxious M156, but 4.0 liter in which AMG will liikely tune the power & sound to make us all (sort, but not really).................forget the M156. Did I just say that?
Translation? Win-win for you. Both amazing cars.
06-12-2014, 04:03 PM
#70
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2011 C63 AMG
I went with a 2011 C63 AMG CPO over an M3 because it is my DD. The C63 makes me smile even when I'm doing 30 km/h through a school zone. The C63 always sounds and feels great. I bought the C63 for its 6.2L engine and have not been disappointed.
06-12-2014, 04:06 PM
#71
Super Member
06-12-2014, 04:23 PM
#72
06-14-2014, 01:38 AM
#73
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2012 Diamond White C63 Coupe
Decide if you want to have the NA engine or go for the new engine coming in 2015.
Personally, I recommend picking up a used C63 from 2012 + and spending the saved money in some go-fast mods/wheels
Personally, I recommend picking up a used C63 from 2012 + and spending the saved money in some go-fast mods/wheels
06-14-2014, 01:43 AM
#74
MBWorld Fanatic!
The S55 was derived from the N55, sure, but they are not identical.
S55 specs:
•3.0L inline 6 cylinder engine (S55) with two mono-scroll turbochargers (whereas the N55 has one, twin-scroll turbo)
◦3,027 cc (compare to 2,979 cc of N55)
◦89.6mm over-square bore / 80mm stroke (compare to 89.6mm stroke / 84mm bore of N55)
◦Derived from N55 engine
◦Direct Injection
◦VALVETRONIC
◦Double-VANOS
◦Closed-decked crankcase (4.4 lbs / 2kg lighter)
◦Twin-wire arc-spray coating (instead of liners) in cylinder bores reduce engine weight
◦20 lbs lighter than V8 S65 engine (from E90/E92 M3)
•430 HP (approximately) from around 5000-7300 RPM
•"far beyond" 369+ LB-FT (500 Nm) from under 2000 RPM to over 5000 RPM
•Slightly above 7500 RPM redline
Last edited by zibby43; 06-14-2014 at 01:45 AM.
06-14-2014, 01:56 PM
#75
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2011 C63 AW
Man, BMW dipped their tow in the V8 pool for a short period of time. I thought the M3 addition of 2 cylinders was their to stay. Used to be an M roadster, M3, and an M5. Now it's M this and M that; the speciality is getting diluted.
