Bardman

Wouldn't a turbo cut in to the exhuast note though? Would be a shame to muffle one of the great aspects of the C63.

Exhibit13

While I know there are pros and cons of both turbos and superchargers manufactures (Mercedes included) have been moving away from superchargers and going turbo over the last few years so there must be a bigger advantage with turbos. Other than the new hellcat motor (6.2l 640hp) from dodge and the old caddy cts-v (which is dated and should be replaced soon so it will be interesting to see if they switch to turbo or not) everyone else seems to be using turbos.

whoover

The main reason is European pedestrian safety standards. There must be a "crumple zone" of dead space beneath the hood to absorb the energy of an impact with a struck pedestrian's head before it hits an engine component. Twin turbos, nestled low, can meet these standards while a centrally mounted supercharger in the center of the engine can't.

Pedestrian safety standards have a lot of impact on European auto design.
http://www.caranddriver.com/features...fatter-feature

Bardman

Would think emissions standards would be driving move to turbo charging over supercharging also.

whoover

I don't think there's much inherent difference in emissions between them. Why would there be?

Bardman

My understanding is that turbos are more fuel efficient than superchargers (ie - all things being equal in terms of power/torque, you can extract more mpg from a turbo charged engine than a supercharged engine).

ecampbell

interesting......

whoover

Less engine power is consumed by a turbocharger since it's using the force of the exhaust stream, which would just be wasted, instead of being a drag on the engine. But that's partially offset by the backpressure that slightly reduces engine efficiency. In any case, that's not an emissions issue. Both exhausts can be as "clean" as each other.

It might be a slight CO2/mile issue since it's an efficiency factor, but it's pretty slight. Any forced induction system produces an engine that uses less fuel under part load than the equivalent N/A engine of the same peak power, so I don't see calling the slight difference in efficiency a green issue at all.

whoover

Back in the days when the S55 Kompressor was the hot car, and MB announced they were scrapping the engine because of new pedestrian safety regulations, the automotive world let out a loud "WTF?" But now we have twin-turbo engines that are better. That's progress.

Tuners who sell blowers that fill the crumple zone are skating on thin ice. Just like you can't legally remove pollution equipment, if jurisdictions with these pedestrian safety laws wanted to go after the supercharger vendors they could. These aren't (yet) North American regulations so we don't think about them much, but I bet the European tuners do.

mr747

did you speak to sonny about going turbo??

Tinbucket

Brabus putts a twin turbo 6 liter V12 from the six hundred into the C 63 between the fenders.
Surely someone has the parts for thec63 engine. I've heard the C63 engine is smaller that the 5.5 they put in the SLK?

roadtalontsi

owning 540whp blown c63 and turbo supra - that makes around the same on pump gas. I can tell you turbo lag sucks. The blowers only become a limitation at higher boost levels where they run out of efficiency, but even then you have to ask yourself how useful is 700whp on the street? lol. Putting on two turbos in a real tight engine bay has alot of problems. heat management for one, lack of space, 2 turbos, 2 wastegates, new exhaust manifolds/headers, intercoolers, remake the intake manifold as i doubt it would hold boost very well. Lots of drawbacks and the cost would far outway the blower kits available. Not to mention there would be no benefit. You'd lose the off idle crazy torque blower make from lag. Top end power would be the same as the blower. Weistec has already done the homework for you. You can make all the power in the world with the 156 once the internals are built up. Finding a transmission to hold it all is the problem.

Read some of the cls/e55 threads on turbos vs blowers. single compound kits and twins. they are all limited by stock internals of the engine.

johnnyblaze

I've pitched the idea several times, but after everything is said and done with our motors, you may as well drop an M157 in the car and call it a day. Would be less of a headache. Probably cheaper also.

E55 guys are going turbo route right now. Its coming out pretty well. Right now they are running into tuning issues at high boost (throttle cut). There is one turbo build that is using a stand-alone system that should be finished very soon. The two below are using standard tuning methods on the stock ECU.

Heres a couple of builds, good read

RedBullJnky

https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/...omplete-3.html

http://instagram.com/p/oj41HWlTUx/

http://instagram.com/p/oZ8VNDlTfe/

Chawkins2001

https://mbworld.org/forums/w211-amg/...orn-bip-4.html


http://s138.photobucket.com/user/cha..._3384.mp4.html

G55K

Is a Supra your only experience with a turbo charged car? You can't compare a Supra with today's turbo set ups. Properly sized turbos have minimal lag. Turbos are far for efficient, there's no parasitic loss, etc. I enjoy both roots blowers and turbos. Just depends on my mood.

schmick325

Its been done.

Brabus did a TT ML63 and also Rado has a TT SLS

w204nyc

My friends has a 370z with a GTM Twin Turbo and I cant really feel any turbo lag.

b16

You're talking about making 700whp from a 3.0L inline 6. Yes, that will take a huge turbo which will have a lot of lag.

Put two smaller turbos on a 6.2L v8 to make another 200 hp? Not as much.

roadtalontsi

Turbo cars I currently own....
3.5L v8 tt lotus esprit
fd mazda rx7 1.3L tt - forsale anyone want to buy it? very suprising low end torque.
2.0L and 2.3L t eclipse gst and gsx
3.0L t supra

I can honestly say I've driven every modern benz with the exception of the slr and sls black series. Yes turbo technology has come along way, These new 5.5L "63" motor suck compared to the old school 55 kompressors in the torque department. Sure turbos are more efficient and dont have parasitic loss this is true, but there is still lag guys. supercharger technology has improved too. The twin screws make full boost off idle instantly. For a street car it's way more desirable. Why does it matter that you aren't gaining the power free of robbing alittle power? are you worried about mpg? it's already a 6.2L lol

go look at those links posted. The e55 stock kompressor car with a big single vs the tt cls55. It's a cheaply built and rear mounted turbo - probably the worst way to mount a turbo but the guy admitted the idea was to do it cheap. Look at the dyno comparison. same top end, however the stock kompressor is killing it while those twins spool up. if this was compared to the updated twin screw wiestec kit it would be just like the stock kompressor + single turbo kit with way less parts and complications.

G55K

What do you mean that the new 63 motor sucks in the torque compared to the 55 kompressor? The 63 makes more torque then the 55k.

You have a great collection of cars but I now understand why you equate turbos with lag. Drive a new 991 turbo, a GTR, or E63S. Turbo lag is hardly noticeable. Don't get wrong. I enjoy the instant torque of a supercharger. But, turbos are the way to go when it's possible.

RNS-11Z

Sonny would of tuned it if I did turbo it. He can custom tune any boosted c63. I would of installed turbos etc here in Qld then send the car to him to finish installation and tune it.

JumpinJim

Guess you guys weren't around then, but Kleemann already did a twin turbo M156 years ago back in 2007.


http://www.worldcarfans.com/10712272...ml63k-bi-turbo

mr747

He had a stage 3 weistec kit and I was going to purchase it off him but I was too late

I will be paying him a visit when it's time

RNS-11Z

I would highly recommend going through sonny for any boosted c63 in oz. give us a buz when your ready to go ahead and il give you my insight as to why. I hope you do it soon bud!

mr747

Ok mate will do

jrcart

First off, it can be done and has been done on an M159 which is nearly identical to a M156 only dry sumped.

It has nothing to do with $$, I have plenty of it and you dont see me trying to put turbos on any or my cars. Case and point, there is a tt M159 SLS in California, they have had lots of problems with it, tuning was a nightmare and it makes less hp and tq than my Weistec 3.0L twin screw powered SLS. So while somebody is trying to figure out how to squeeze a couple turbos into the engine bay of an M156 powered car I will be out running 8's with my SC's M156.......case closed.