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As some of you may have read, I had a scary experience at VIR a couple of weeks ago. My front right 2-piece rim almost came undone. I lost 11 of the bolts that hold the 2 rim pieces together, and all others were lose. I felt a slight vibration during the last lap, turned into the pits and by the time I arrived at my parking spot in the pit area, I heard an air leak and the front right tire lost pressure.
The right rear rim also showed the beginning of the same issue, with one bolt already missing and 4 lose.
VIR is a fast track, with a top speed of around 155 - 160 in our cars. Needless to say, this could have ended very, very badly.
I was very upset, and sent all 4 wheels immediately to the manufacturer, ADV-1. Those rims had been expensive and I wanted to get to the bottom of what really happened. I already had a suspicion beforehand, and ADV-1's checking of the rims confirmed the suspicion (without me telling them anything about what I thought might have happened beforehand).
It turns out, that 2 rims had loose bolts and 2 were absolutely fine. the 2 with the problem happened to be the two I had some cosmetic repairs done on. The work was done by a local, well reputed, body shop. I think they outsourced the rim work to a local wheel repair facility. Without my knowledge, the wheel repair shop disassembled the rims to execute the repair (repaint the rim centers) and reassembled them incorrectly, with insufficient torque and no Loctite. I never suspected a thing, and assumed they had just repainted the center without disassembly.
ADV-1 was very good about the whole thing. I agreed to have the rims refinished while there and replace one barrel, that showed a slight out of roundness. They were forthcoming in giving me a good price.
I chalk it up to learning and will make sure it never happens to me again.
That is actually my plan. I will get a set of forged monoblocks with R-Compounds as dedicated track wheels for next spring. I'll use the 2-piece ADV-1s for every day street driving in summer. I also have a set of 18 inch wheels for snow conditions, but I hate how the car handles on narrow Blizzaks, so I'll minimize the time I have those on.
But ADV1's reputation and poor business practices over the years have lead me and many other enthusiasts around the world to be cautious of the brand.
If they were a budget wheel, I would imagine things like this may slide. but 6K+ for a set and having them warp / crack / come apart prematurely there are no excuses for it.
Kriston,
I do not quite follow your rationale. Let's assume, hypothetically, you own a wheel company and you make the world's best rims. Then a wheel repair shop disassembles a customers wheels and recoats them. Different from your factory standard and current best approach, he also coats the flange where the wheels get bolted together and leaves the powder coat on when he bolts the rim halves together.
The owner of the rims then goes to track the car, where the rims get hot repeatedly. The powder coat between the flanges (that should not be there) compacts, the bolts lose their torque and work themselves lose. The rims come apart, the driver of the car loses control and totally wipes out. He ends up in hospital and the car is a total loss.
Would you say that is your fault as the rim factory owner and offer to cover for the damage?
I'm not going to lie, when I glanced at the photos of the wheel and saw ADV1, I felt uneasy.
I'm sure they have improved their quality and business practices over the years but I will never forget about the 360Forged days where they scammed a ton of people on every forum and ran off with the money. No matter how much SEO and marketing they have put into clearing up their name, you don't forget about these things.
Anyways, I'm glad you are okay and the wheel failure wasn't directly the manufacturers fault.
But ADV1's reputation and poor business practices over the years have lead me and many other enthusiasts around the world to be cautious of the brand.
If they were a budget wheel, I would imagine things like this may slide. but 6K+ for a set and having them warp / crack / come apart prematurely there are no excuses for it.
That is actually my plan. I will get a set of forged monoblocks with R-Compounds as dedicated track wheels for next spring. I'll use the 2-piece ADV-1s for every day street driving in summer. I also have a set of 18 inch wheels for snow conditions, but I hate how the car handles on narrow Blizzaks, so I'll minimize the time I have those on.
Off topic but what is wrong with the narrow blizzaks on the car? I am looking at purchasing a set from a forum member and do not want to regret it.
SHould I go with Vredestein Wintracs? I had those on my S4 but that was Quattro and didnt need a fully dedicated snow. Do the C63 need a dedicated snow tire on them through the winter or can they get by with a winter performance tire?
There is nothing wrong with Blizzaks. They are actually very good for what they are for - winter and snow. Mine are LM25, so intended for cold, wet, and limited snow. I am living in southern Ohio, so they are appropriate for here. Next I may even go up to wider than that, but even so, winter driving with that setup does not handle anywhere near as well as the summer tire setup (255/305) I have with Michelin Sport Cup 2s.
Just pick your tires for the conditions you need them for: Occasional bit of snow and tires to get you home in an inch or 2 - or continuous and sometimes deep snow in Canada, need different tires and sizes.
There is nothing wrong with Blizzaks. They are actually very good for what they are for - winter and snow. Mine are LM25, so intended for cold, wet, and limited snow. I am living in southern Ohio, so they are appropriate for here. Next I may even go up to wider than that, but even so, winter driving with that setup does not handle anywhere near as well as the summer tire setup (255/305) I have with Michelin Sport Cup 2s.
Just pick your tires for the conditions you need them for: Occasional bit of snow and tires to get you home in an inch or 2 - or continuous and sometimes deep snow in Canada, need different tires and sizes.
Ok good. I am likley picking up mine next week but not mounting them until necessary (when temps are averaging 40 everyday not mid 70s like today!).
Have you compared Sport Cup 2 to PSS? I was considering Sport cup 2 for next spring with 19s and leaving the stocker 18s for winter duty.
Yes, I have compared PSS and PSC2s by driving lead/follow at NCM with a friend of mine - he in an M4, I in my C63. He could not get more than 0.9 g lateral force on his M4 with PSSs, I could go to 1.2 g in my PSC2s. He could not keep up in curves.
Yes, I have compared PSS and PSC2s by driving lead/follow at NCM with a friend of mine - he in an M4, I in my C63. He could not get more than 0.9 g lateral force on his M4 with PSSs, I could go to 1.2 g in my PSC2s. He could not keep up in curves.
Wow. I have loved the PSS since they came out but you have just sold me on trying the SC2 now. I think those will be my summer tire next season.
anyone who says expensive wheels don't crack is drunk, I have a set of 4 vorsteiner rims that are $2k+ a pop without tires.. 2 cracked, 1 rear that basically ripped apart, So spending thousands upon thousands on rims is a waste of money, even my stock 18 AMG rims are cracked ...I've been rollin on some cheap *** canadian made rims for 7-8 months now with 0 issues. I barely drive my car because I work from home and the roads i drive on aren't that bad...wheel companies in general just suck *** in 2015, infact a lot of companies suck *** in 2015, *cough* mercedes w205 *cough*
Last edited by avery.whss; 11-06-2015 at 03:40 PM.
Ofcourse the refinishing company can be blamed for this issue. BUT over the years ADV1 have had issues just like you had mentioned, with new out of the box wheels. for instance ADV1 have been caught red handed forging TUV documents. The owner had bankrupt the company and skipped out on quite a few people who had deposits on wheels. They re-drilled 20 hole centers to 30 holes and claimed it was for weight savings. Only to have the wheel fall apart very similiar to what happened to yours. Things like this just make me cringe.
I rather not "hope" that my wheels will stay together after any type of use. Like I said before, if this was a budget wheel brand much of this stuff would slide. At this price point they better be up to snuff.
Myself along with many other enthusiasts are generally reasonable people, but when you have a plethora of legit manufacturers making wheels at the same price point, with decades more of motorsport history and technological advancements in weight reduction / alloy compositions. The choice is easy.
Originally Posted by Wobble64
Kriston,
I do not quite follow your rationale. Let's assume, hypothetically, you own a wheel company and you make the world's best rims. Then a wheel repair shop disassembles a customers wheels and recoats them. Different from your factory standard and current best approach, he also coats the flange where the wheels get bolted together and leaves the powder coat on when he bolts the rim halves together.
The owner of the rims then goes to track the car, where the rims get hot repeatedly. The powder coat between the flanges (that should not be there) compacts, the bolts lose their torque and work themselves lose. The rims come apart, the driver of the car loses control and totally wipes out. He ends up in hospital and the car is a total loss.
Would you say that is your fault as the rim factory owner and offer to cover for the damage?
Had I had all that info, I would not have bought ADV1. At the time, I did not know any of that.
That said, your examples are from events past, and I do not see a causal connection between fabrication of the rims and the issues I had, mainly because the 2 rims that were not refinished were fine, while the 2 refinished ones weren't.
All that said, I will get myself dedicated monoblock track wheels with R - compounds tires. Probably from Forgeline, since they are so close that I can drive by and get them measured up at the factory. I agree I do not want to have to worry about rims. I am confident enough with the ADV1s, to continue using them for street driving in summer.
11-01-2015, 08:43 AM
