zach1328

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rivcal4life

As far as I know, it is now the fastest recorded/reported 500E ever. The record was held by Gerry_VZ up until today, with a ~12.89 @ ~108

I am sure there is a faster 500E out there. Someone with a supercharger, or some crazy dude in Switzerland with 4 or 5 turbos, but they haven't reported on the forums. :-/

RHW

If it is not "reported" on the forums,
then it does not count.

Congrats!

Zach,
RivCal put in his time and learned the ropes on a 300e, before escalating his game.

AMGDave

A longer burnout may help, also adjusting tire pressure. You were running drag radials, correct? What psi? After your burnout (in the waterbox, I assume) did you do a second/short dry burnout before staging? At any rate, limited-slip should eliminate the wheelspin issue; and a 2.65 ratio would eliminate the 3-4 upshift just before the finish line...



12.79 @ 110? YEAH, baby, YEAH! Congrats! So when's the 150 shot coming?

Jovsky

Yeah! I second. Congratulations Justin (Rivcal) for a good job with your 500E. Man! I am so envious and thinking of going back from W202 to W124.

JSe420

Real good stuff rivcal.
I definitely need a set of those front camber plates. Any good sources?

rivcal4life

Thanks everyone!

Dave, yes I was running Nitto 555R drag radials. I tried various pressures, with that particular run at ~15psi. I ran the right side a tad lower than the left, because at equal pressure, it did ALL the spinning. I have a video of the run, which shows my burnout. About 3-4 seconds in 1st gear, with a shift into 2nd and another second as I pull out of the water box. I lowered the PSI down to about 12 for the next run, and got a LOT of wheel hop. It may have been due to a slightly shorter burnout, but it will take some more experimentation to get it all sorted. An LSD is at the bottom end of a pretty long list of things I'd like to do. Considering the cost, it won't be on the table for a while. As for the 150 shot, I may just stay at 125 until I can get the power to the ground and see what it's really capable of. I really think 12.5xx would be achievable when I get her to hook. The MPH supports that.

Jovsky, thanks man! I am sorry I did not get around to inviting you this time. You would have had a blast! Hopefully next time I remember to shoot you a message. We needore Benz guys representing.

JSe420, I may be able to locate you a set local to me BNIB. They would be about $400 if the seller still has them. Plus shipping of course. PM me if you're interested.

AMGDave

Justin, is your wheelspin only at launch, before NOS activates? Or are you spinning only after the NOS engages? Or both?

Based on your 60' time for the record run, you may have one tenth left on the table. My best ever 60' with stock gears, no LSD, and street tires was 2.083, or nearly a tenth quicker than yours (and that was at 2700' elevation, btw). With LSD (and 2.65 gears) my best has been 2.052 (at 2700') and 2.059 (at sea level). The discrepancy is because at sea level, I was running the wider/heavier wheels & tires... with the flyweights mounted it may have dipped into the 2.04x range at sea level?

Another variable is the '92 engine seems to be a hair slower than my '94, but even with the '92 engine and heavy wheels I managed a 2.085 at sea level a few months ago. My wife's '92 500E is just a hair slower at takeoff, best 60' was 2.118 at sea level with 17" wheels/tires and 2.65 Quaife LSD.

Typical 60-foot times to shoot for would be around 2.10 (plus or minus a couple hundredths), at any rate if we can get your car to hook it should be around 12.69 with NOS!

rivcal4life

There was a very tiny screech on launch, with the majority of the spinning coming on nitrous activation. See for yourself!

Brett, I filmed them facing forward for you! Check out that speedometer climbing!

Bergwerks Nitrous W124 500E Drag Race 12.794 @ 110.82 MPH

Bergwerks Nitrous W124 500E Drag Race 13.415 @ 108.52 MPH


Dave, I have heard before that 1 tenth in your 60' is worth 2 tenths in your ET. What were your ET's in relation to your 2.0xx 60' runs compared to your 2.1xx runs?

Also, I do believe the car is capable of 1.9 60's. I have also been in the 2.0xx range without nitrous, so I don't see why I wouldn't be able to (pending traction) with the juice. See the video, there is a lot of spinning going on in the first 60 feet. So much that I am actually faster without nitrous activating.

PS: In the first vid, you can see a red EVO in front of me staging. In the second video, I am actually racing him. Theres a reason you never see his car, I got him by over 2 tenths with a .078 RT to his .618.

AMGDave

Wow.

1) I love the video. What camera are you using, and what mounting bracket do you have? I need to set up something like this in my cars!

2) Your burnout is too short and moves forward too quickly. When the tires break free, get back on the brakes hard enough to keep the car in place for a couple seconds, then slooooooowwwwwwly let it roll forward so it's spinning them on "dry" pavement, and gradually let the RPM's come down as you ease forward. I'm sure you've seen this before, but check out this video of my burnout (12MB download - no YouToob, sorry). Notice how my car is almost stationary for the first 5 seconds, then rolls out slow at first, then quicker? Then is followed by a second/short dry hop? Try to duplicate that, and if you still have traction issues, fry the tires even longer. (Seriously!)

3) It's weird how the tach doesn't seem to move smoothly, matching the speedo. I can't tell for sure if that's just wheelspin or not. At the shift points it also seems a little odd. Hmmm. Click here for a video of what I'm used to seeing (without NOS, of course) but notice how the tach & speedo are in synch at all times. 20MB download, btw.




1 tenth in the 60' will gain you at least 1 tenth in the ET, but that's about it. It will not gain you 2 tenths unless you were having traction problems mid-track which were also cured, in that case yes the ET may improve more than 1 tenth. Otherwise, no.



It may be possible... but as you said, the traction issues must be solved. On both my 500's, the single biggest improvement was LSD, it has 99% eliminated wheelspin (with street tires) on both cars under normal conditions. Did you see my post on the LSD thread, btw? The factory LSD should be available once again in about 2 months or so.



Heh-heh. Nice job! A good RT can make a quicker car lose if his RT is bad enough. Any RT under 0.100 is very, very good and if you can consistently manage ~0.050 you will be able to do very well in bracket racing (as long as there's no wheelspin and the car is consistent otherwise). At any rate, 0.078 at the tree is fantastic, try to keep that up!

rivcal4life

1) Camera is a Flip Ultra. I will be upgrading to a Flip Ultra HD this month. The mount is a Delkin Fat Gecko Mini, which is a suction-cup style.

2) I would like to hold my burnouts longer, but without an LSD, my car tends to walk to one side unless I am pulling forward and correcting with the steering wheel. I will try again in the future once I get the hang of balancing pressure in these drag radials.

3) I was actually going to ask you about my tach, and what you think might be the cause. It sometimes does this even without NOS. I had hoped that it was a dislodged magnet on the flywheel (as you had on your car) but during my tranny rebuild, I saw first hand that they were in place and intact. I think my next step is to try that 015 EZL I have and see if that cures it. Do you think I will lose timing with that unit Dave? If the EZL doesn't cure it, I may need a new tach.

I had not seen your post regarding the availability of the factory LSD. That is awesome news! Though, not so awesome for my wallet. I guess I will have to start saving!

ronmiller609

I love this thread. Great Work Justin!

austinholloman

Man, what a nice ride. I miss my W124 so much some times.

Saijin_Naib

Justin, would you ever consider something like this?
http://www2.oregonscientific.com/cat...on-Camera.html

I'm using the ATC5k for all my videos and the quality is about as good as any other 640x480 CMOS camera, but this does do significantly better and has G-Force recording and an optional GPS module. You can overlay these data on your videos. Pretty neat IMO.

AMGDave

Cool! I assume you stick the Gekco onto the rear door window? I gotta get me a similar setup.



ROTFL! You think it's bad now? It's worse with LSD. Almost every burnout gets sideways. It's sort of a good thing, as when it goes sideways, you know for sure both wheels are spinning. Otherwise it can be hard to tell. That's half the reason LSD helps... you always get both tires warmed up. With the stock open diff, half the time I'd have one warm tire and one cold. At any rate - just get used to it, keep the burnout going a LOT longer, and counter-steer as necessary. If you have to, back up a little and do a second full burnout, if there isn't room for a second short one after your main burnout. I'd also call Nitto tech support and inquire about recommended pressures, but I suspect something around 18-22psi might be a decent ballpark. (?) Best to double check though.



Does the tach not read accurately, i.e. you can hear the engine sound not matching what the tach indicates? I'm not sure if a different EZL will have any effect, but it wouldn't hurt to test it out for grins. I wouldn't worry about the 015- EZL being slower, both my 500's currently have '92 engines but the one with the 015- EZL is actually a tad quicker (however, I don't believe the EZL has anything to do with it - I believe the timing curves for the 5.0L EZL's are all nearly identical for WOT power production, although I wouldn't mind being proved wrong).



Yup - it is good news! But it really all depends if the price remains the same after they are back in stock. Years ago the price was significantly higher, like about double, which would make the Quaife actually cheaper. If the current price remains the same, it's a good deal. Otherwise, the only bargain route will be to obtain a used one and replace the clutch pack, however the cost is nearly the same after parts & labor are factored in, which makes the new unit more attractive - if/when they're available, that is.

rivcal4life

Month late, crappy iPhone pictures are better than no pictures at all, right? No? Well, too bad.





Almost forgot! Ive got a couple vids from outside the car on Jan. 8th! Looks like I was wrong Brett, they do let us do outboard cameras!



Also, one cruddy fly-by for those who may find interest.

AMGDave

SWEEEEET! So how do you like the Silver Arrow stopping power compared to stock?

Saijin_Naib

Subscribed. Liking the rims man, very clean. How much do they weigh for you?

Yeah, most venues allow outboard with the understanding that you have it secure enough that it isn't going to go flying.

You should run a dual-camera setup. If you have something like Adobe Premiere Elements you can easily do PiP video. I'm fond of an inside or from rear-deck facing forward (as the small picture) and one from the roof or mirrors showing the driving. Gives you an interesting perspective on what it looks like both for the driver and on the track

Great videos man.

dernt

Hi Justin,

Nice work! Can you give details on the fuel pump? Does it replace both factory pumps? Fit in factory locations? Where did you get it?

AMGDave

Yup, you were right. See below. I'm still trying to determine exactly what this guy's engine setup is, all I know is he's making ~400hp normally aspirated, and has a 100-150 shot of NOS. And he's in Poland. Check out the gnarly 60' times!

The four runs on this uber-500 were:
12.266 @ 186.46 kph (115.86 mph)
12.320 @ 186.74 kph (116.03 mph)
12.426 @ 186.84 kph (116.10 mph)
12.471 @ 185.18 kph (115.07 mph)

rivcal4life

Brett: The wheels are around 16LBS each.

Jerry, the pump is a Walbro GSL392 and does replace both factory pumps. It pumps 255 liters/hr, which is good for somewhere around 400hp. The place I got it from was located in Los Angeles. I found them on ebay, though they did not have a kit directly for our cars. I had to call and ask them to build one, which only requires swapping of a few small fittings (all included). Cost was $115 shipped.

Dave: Way to rain on my parade!

AMGDave

Justin - 16 lbs each? Seriously? WOW. I might have to get a set myself! Remind me again on the model name, size, & offset?

BTW, didn't mean to rain on your parade... just giving you some incentive to bump to a 175 shot and dip into the 11's!

rivcal4life

Weelllll.... to be fair, that spec was taken from a website, not by myself. I will have to weigh one naked some day. OZ SuperLeggera 17" x 8".

AMGDave

Where did you buy them, btw? All I can find is the SuperLeggera III which is different...

Saijin_Naib

Not to put a damper on this, but my friend had these on his GTI and he found them to bend very easily. But, that is also in pothole ridden North NJ by NYC.

In any case, you can find sets of them for sale at various forums, and like any 5x112 rim, many dubbers have them. Check VWVortex if you have an account or if you know someone on there they may be able to hook you up.

I'll ask my friend for you Dave and see if he can point me at a set.