Airmousam

Impossible, BMW is the design benchmark of the 21st century for crying out loud!

Peter, went thru these threads and wow what a terrible experience...glad it was finally resolved and good luck in the hunt for your next car

Munich77

LOL that comment about BMW made me laugh. I needed that. BMW is the only manufacturer that thinks having a water pump exchange interval of about 55K is acceptable.

K-A

You kids realize that design and mechanical reliability are completely separate, right? The E Class isn't too good at either I guess, so I can understand if not!

BMW revolutionized car design thus far this century. The M-B's you're all in, are EXTREMELY influenced (read: copy off of) Bangle-era BMW designs. Like it or not, it's a fact, and anyone not sniffing the M-B kool-aid too closely will realize that.

M-B's are hardly the reliability benchmark of late. BMW's have improved greatly recently, and mine is by far more reliable than my M-B's were, so far. BMW has come a long way in fit/finish than you guys talking about pre-2011 models are referencing. The E60 has nothing to do with the quality of the 2013+ F10. It's like saying M-B's are quality disasters because I had a W220 that was a POS. My W212's didn't fare well after some age, nor were they fit/finish perfect when I got them (thus resulting in numerous trips to the dealer on all of them). My BMW has so far, in terms of initial quality, "aged" a lot more gracefully (no rattles to boot, which is never the case with newer M-B's, from my many experiences with or in them).

fintail

W212 is copied off a Bangle catastrophe? Now you're just trolling

K-A

It absolutely is. Flame surfacing, the entire interior is completely alike with the E90 and E60, the dash placed screen (which BMW started), the COMAND knob which is a ripoff of the iDrive knob, the "lava lamp" graphics in the facelift taillights are straight off of the BMW "invented" taillight graphics. Pre-W212 M-B's were all completely differently designed inside, and the W212's interior is more like an E60 or E90 than it is a W211, no doubt.

BMW made discordant, angular designs popular with the E65/E60, which M-B ran with during the W221 generation (including "Bangle Butt" on that model) (which peaked during the W212). Then BMW went back to round, while M-B were scrambling to try and "fix" their angular designs, resulting in uncharacteristic "about-face" facelifts to go round again, like BMW. The W212 facelift was said by many to be M-B's attempt to try and look as much like the F10 as they could (the front with its smoother lines and "sporty" grille, the lava-lamp taillight graphics, the BMW inspired rear diffuser that "lifts" at both ends, which M-B implemented very haphazardly).

Even little things like how BMW has thickened its chrome window trim at the end are now being done by M-B, on the new S and C Classes.

I know on an M-B board nobody will want to see it like that, but it's the truth. BMW set the design standard, and M-B has followed, in vast respects. BMW hasn't copied any design traits off of M-B for an extremely long time.

instantfob

Munich77

KA looks like BMW is also a recall leader....which I guess makes super reliable. I would be terrified about a car with the Vanos bolt problem (http://www.nytimes.com/2014/04/11/au...src=recpb&_r=0). It reminds me of the problems with N54 and the fuel pump problems. BMW also said that only a few cars were affected.

fintail

E60 interior influenced W212? E60 interior is angular? You've been in an E60 before, right? I have some doubts. W212 has flame surfacing? Can you find one single credible voice from anywhere agreeing with those opinions? Of course you can't. You can also prove that BMW "invented" what you claim, seems funny that MB would wait so long to blindly copy something so important. Maybe it's time to stop kneeling at the Bavarian altar on this venue. You like your car, you don't need to defend it this way. We get it. I am the only one taking the bait. Take the hint.

W211/220 design language simply became old and tired, especially the boring curvy dash/center stack. An angular interior is more MB tradition. I doubt you've experienced anything older than that 220, however.

" said by many"

You said it. Now please, well, put up or shut up

I wonder if the amount of F10s with fuel delivery issues is more than W212s with clunky transmissions...

I won't waste any more space here, sorry for falling for it

threeMBs

Can this OT discussion be taken elsewhere, please? This thread is an important reference to anyone with a potential of similar issues and is being convoluted with unrelated posts. Thanks.

finman

please don't engage KA... too painful

PeterUbers

Update:

To date, MBUSA has agreed to refund all my cash, still waiting to actually hear back to drive in to the dealership to and pick up the check for $74k and the remaining check for the 4 year service plan and the extended warranty. I still have the dealership's CLS550 loaner, and as far as I know, my car, that I still have the title too, is on the rack waiting for parts.

This is a very very slow process. I get a kick out of people that think you can snap your fingers and "just get your money back." Patient is a virtue apparently.

Thanks again for all your support guys, I certainly do hope this documentation on the site helps others, I know for a fact via PMs that it has helped a few get resolutions.

I truly do not believe there is a known fix for this transmission issue, the C300 "clunk" drama continues as well on the w204 forum. It's really amazing.

pamiboy

So Peter, have you decided (or at least narrowed down the list) on your next car? We are interested in what would that be and how is your experience in that car compared with E550.

PeterUbers

I would like to drive the a6, the 550i.... But at the end of the day I'm still a huge fan of Benz and feel there is nothing else like it, I'm looking at the 2015 cls550 with the 9gtronic if it has a smooth transmission or at least one without a clunk

drsaab

I haven't driven the a6 but was at an vw auction last week and the 2014 A6 prestige pkg has the best interior out of the Benz/BMW/etc group.

The way they have done the instrument cluster and graphics is sweet. They also have a lot of the tech or more. You should look for a Demo S6. 90k new. Prob in the 70k range for 2014 used. Also the 2014 A6 tdi is rated well. My local dealer has a used 2014 CPO for 60k with everything and a 74k msrp.

Munich77

All three are great choices - I would add the S6 into the mix. The BMW is great if optioned right - problem is to get the right options. I did not realize that the CLS will get the 9 speed soon.

Raymond Lee

Yes, this trans jerk problem is all over. My car is 2012 E350 BlueTec with 4th and 5 gear up shift jerk. Had dealer replace transmission but it does same thing. 1st time they had in shop for 1 month. This time it is into 2nd week with no answer.

PeterUbers

Are the s line cars as expensive to maintain as the amg cars??

SolidGranite

No. They are very comparable to the Mercedes 550 line. The RS flavor is more like AMG.

Munich77

Only thing I don't like about Audi is that the dealers don't give too much of a discount. Even having to have winter tires is not a turn off.

Raymond Lee

I don't think MBZ knows what is causing transmission jerk problem. My dealer seems to be taking instructions to do various thing but they are not having any luck! Some people are having luck getting refunds on the car or new car.

Airmousam

Have not had an issue, but these tranny issues suck....hope they figure it out

K-A

Sheesh, you'd think 10+ years with the same tranny would teach them a thing or two about it.

I'm not a big Audi fan, but the S line cars do seem cool. E550's and 550i's have become so "unspecial" aesthetically than the E350's and 535is, i.e they look identical, whereas back in the day, the V8 models got some little exclusive details (it's basically a telling sign as to how changing the car market is, where big motor cars become more irrelevant). I believe the "S" Audi's, even though technically comparable to the "550's", have a lot more aesthetic variations, and perhaps even more performance variations.

Audi's don't discount much, but that's a good thing. M-B and BMW look less premium (which is how they're priced) when they have to slash prices just to get people to buy (or "rent") them. The W212 being the worst offender to where MBUSA makes it appear as if they have to give them away to keep up the sales figures they want to show. Audi's are a much worse value, but the way they treat their sales are more sophisticated. Less incentive to lease, more incentive to actually afford the car you're trying to buy. I respect it, but I like BMW's and M-B's more to the point where an Audi not being attainable for the same value obviously isn't enticing to me.

PeterUbers

K-A, I don't care what they say about you, you do have a wealth of interesting information, thanks for sharing.

K-A

Thanks, Peter. I appreciate that.

PeterUbers

Just got all my cash, in full -- thanks again to all of you for your support, I'll definitely be back in 2015 for the CLS550, will miss my E.

Thanks also to SolidGranite -- my brother in arms, thanks for all your wisdom and advice.