mjsbenz

How did you arrive at your percentage. That is not what most of us are seeing.

Mike26Mercedes

texex91 can you explain your comment?:


LOL--please tell me you are kidding


I used Edmunds TMV to buy mine too off the dealer lot.

steve_0

Long time BMW driver made the switch just yesterday:

2017 E300 (52,150)
Sport Wheel Package(650)
19" AMG wheels (500)
Rear spoiler (350)
Leather (1620)
Prem Package 2 (6800)
Ventilated seats (450)
Burmeister (850)
Dest (925)
Total: 64,295
Discount 5974 (9.2%)
Total: 58,320 + tax and fees

Lease
36 months
792/month
1500 total out of pocket
10k miles per year

Overall I'm pleased with the deal and look forward to a brand change for a bit. I loved BMW but wanted to decrease overall payment as this is a business car and they wouldn't match my desired total 36 month output.

Though going from a twin turbo v8 to a 4cyl may take a bit of getting used to!

ngerstman

My dealership is offering near no discount($1,000) on my ordered e43 that has a sticker of $91,000. This is looking like an increasingly bad deal considering most people here are getting 8-9% discounts, so the effective pay up to go from the 4 to the 6 is looking increasingly insane, in the zone of $15,000-20,000. That's a spicy meatball! And all I really wanted was effectively an e400, don't care about the AMG badge, give me a nicely equipped e and a 330hp v6 and I'm done. Regards. Ned.

HBerman

I recall that the $1k amount was what I speculated when you first posted your question earlier last year. The E43 is just not worth it. I now have about 2400 miles on my vehicle which has all of the bells and whistles except for the V6 and the special AMG leather (P3, Air Body, Pano, Leather, Dual Displays, etc.) My MSRP was $76500 and I received about 9.0 % in discounts. I also believe that the V6 is in its last year and will be superceded by the 6 cycl in-ine turbo in 2018. You're right that you are basically paying a premium of more than $15000 just to have the V6.

ngerstman

I may pursue my plan b which has been to buy a 2015 Audi s8 with around 15,000 miles cpo'd. Can find those for around $75,000 for a car that had an msrp of $125,000. Different but pretty cool as mobile living room rocket. Regards. Ned.

joebe

My wife's E300 4Matic Sport with pretty much all the bells and whistles had an MSRP of $77000. We purchased it in Nov. for $70,000 about a 9% discount.
Joe

steve_0

I thought about the E43 as well and couldn't justify it. Its technically comparable to a BMW 540 not even a 550 for. Go get one of those. It should be quite a bit less money.

ngerstman

Never liked the BMW interiors, find them boring and dated. Going to check out some cpo s8's, 520hp beasts, just not sure I want something that big, know I don't need it that big. Thanks. Regards. Ned.

SirJulian

Hey guys, long time viewer, first time poster.

I emailed a guy at the Mercedes Dealership for a quote on a 2017 E300 4matic and He emailed me this quote for MSRP of 59,825. 36 Month lease for 660 a month with 4500. Out of pocket 10k miles a year. The vehicle includes Package 1, Sports package, comfort box and burmester sound system.


This is my first time buying/leasing a car let alone a Benz.
Does this sound like a good deal? What specific questions should I ask?

Lanzz

SirJulian - you would want to know, among other things: 1) The discount from MSRP, 2) The money factor they are using 2) the residual (which is somewhere in the range of 60ish%) 3) The doc fee and any other up front fees. Once you have all that info, you can calculate what they payment would be. I think $4500 out of pocket and $660 for a P1 car is a bit high - you will need to push, but there's room in there for the dealer to come down. If you read some of the posts here, discounts from MSRP range from 5-10%, depending on model, dealer and local market. And many dealers mark up the money factor (mine did). They can't mess with the residual, but you need to know it in order to understand how they are calculating the payment.

Sorry for the long message - hope this helps.

c4004matic

89k zero discounts. E 43 fully optioned including 20 in rims and matte paint.

makris0000

I got pricing and was supposed to take delivery of my E300 on the 2nd but due to a family emergency I had to put it off. The deal I have is as follows:

2017 E300: Polar White/Nut Brown MB-Tex, 19' AMG Wheels, Pano roof, P1, rear deck spoiler.

MSRP: $59,765
$8,000 discount
$3K down
36 & 48 month term (the difference between price was $1)
$596 a month (includes tax)
12K annual miles
Includes: window tint, maintenance for the lease and paying the last 2 payments of my Jeep lease

This was the deal I was able to make with my local dealership. I also have a discount from the American Bar Association which would bring my payment down even lower but I did not have a chance to do it.

660 a month for a 59K car does sound pretty high I think you can get that lowered with shopping around.

mjsbenz

If you want to make sure that your monthly payments AND drive off costs are fair and reasonable, you need to get quotes from 3 dealers.

Compare both monthly payments and drive off fees with each. A lower monthly with a higher drive off fee might be a worse deal.

Lastly, it is not all about the $$$$. Convenience and approach to how customers are treated are very important as well.

The E43 premium is not cheap.

SirJulian

Thank you. It definitely helped. I emailed the Sales person back asking the MSRP discount (I told him a friend got 9% discount), the money factor and the residual, and the fees.

He said he can do 9% discount, the money factor is .00116 and residual is 61, and the fees are the following: lease acquisition is 1095, tax is around 2300, first month payment, registration and doc fee is 75.

etaynor

Good Information. How do you use the "money factor"? What is the math?
Thanks

Lanzz

SirJulian - when I plug those numbers in, I get the following: 9% off the sticker would give you a selling price of $54,500. Assuming the .00116 money factor and 61% residual, $1095 acquisition fee and $75 doc fess, with $4500 out of pocket, I see a payment of about ~$578. I am not sure what state you are in so this is approximate, as tax is handled differently in each state. Feels like he ran the numbers using a much smaller discount than 9%. One last thing - one you arrive at a deal you like, you may want to consider a much lower total out of pocket - that out of pocket money is simply pre-payment of expenses, and it disappears in the event the car is totaled before lease end. I generally go very low out of pocket and higher payment, because in the event of the total loss, gap insurance picks of the difference and I keep my money.

mjsbenz

Good advice about minimizing the out of pocket expenses.

I have a few additional observations.

1. If you have extra money (in lieu of a down payment) consider using multiple security deposits (up to 10x your monthly lease payment rounded up to the nearest $50) to reduce the money factor (interest rate). For example, if you use 10 MSDs, your money factor goes from .00116 to (.00116-0.0007) which nets to .00109. Converting to interest rate, multiply by 2400. Your lease payment goes down because of the lower interest rate and that savings creates an annual ROI of 12%. Anyone who has extra cash should use MSDs.

2. The standard bank fee is not $1095. It is $795 and dealers can mark up (referred to as padding) those fees (and also the money factor too). I never pay more than what is the factory suggested price of the bank fee.

From what we can tell from the dealer quote you received, I would quickly seek other dealer quotes.

SirJulian

Hi if it's not to much to ask, do you have a copy or screenshot reflecting the discount or stating the discount you received on your Mercedes Benz and can you post it if you don't mind. Thank you!

mjsbenz

Where are you located and do you have more than one MB dealer to obtain a quote? The reason I ask is that you need to burn some shoe leather and obtain a few quotes. Then you have something to show the dealer you prefer.

Asking someone to post their actual lease or deal sheet is a lot to ask and could **** off the selling dealer too.

SirJulian

I'm located in NYC. I've gotten in contact with multiple dealerships since speaking with that one dealer and I'm just waiting for a reply back now from the others. I was just asking to see a deal sheet, cause I was speaking with the original dealer and he said if he can see a deal sheet, he can possibly match that offer.

jumpman726

$91K for an E43 seems insane. Some of you might want to consider a new 2016 S550. Another member posted in the S-Class forum that there is about $22,000 in discounts available on a 2016 S-Class. It just depends how low your dealer is willing to go, and if they still have a 2016 model on the lot. Here's the post I'm referring to:

https://mbworld.org/forums/new-s-cla...es-2016-s.html

c4004matic

I really don't get why any sane person would lease a car. Even with MBs steep depreciation leases are giving you the shaft since at the end of the lease all the money you have spent leaves you nothing in return. If you buy the car you at least have a vehicle that is worth 50% what it cost you to put down on a new vehicle the next time you feel the need for a new one.

Lanzz

C400, the key is that the residual used to calculate the lease may not reflect the actual future value of the car. The E300 has a 3 year residual of 61% - which is very high for most any vehicle these days.

Given that the actual value of an E300 may be less than 61% in 36 months, that "market risk" is being borne by the lender, not the lessor. And meaning that my payments during the lease term do not fully reflect the depreciation, which is fine by me...

Also, the money factor is often subsidized, so the cost of money is no more than what I might borrow to buy (and in many cases, less than the 5-7% I can earn on my own cash without taking much risk...)

Your argument about the absence of a future down payment can be thought of in reverse - I didn't put anything down on this lease, so, I won't have anything to put down on the next one - that is fine. I don't use vehicles as a store of value, only as transportation, paid for out of my expense budget, not my capital budget.

I know it is sort of like a Pepsi vs. Coke argument, but there are many situations where it works out fine in terms of total cost of ownership, flexibility and insulation against market risk and risk of loss.

mjsbenz

I have leased Mercedes and BMWs for many years and let me explain why.

1. I want a new car every 3 years and hate the selling process.

2. MB and BMW subsidize (referred to as subventing) the residuals that are the estimates of what the car is worth at the end of the lease. In the case of my new 2017 E300, the residual percentage is 60% of the "MSRP" under a 3 year/36K miles lease. No way will the car be worth that high an amount at the end of the lease. Think about it. The subvented depreciation is a lot less than if I took the risk.

3. No risk of ownership. If the car is totaled, I am not negotiating with the insurance company. Whatever the agreed insurance proceeds is what MB finance gets and the "upside down" payoff is covered by GAP insurance. If the car is badly damaged and then repaired, no diminished value to me. I walk away. In 1990, we were driving our 1987 Audi 5000 which we purchased new. With all the issues of unintended acceleration, I decided to trade it in for a new 1991 E Class. The trade value was so low because no one wanted the Audi. If I had leased it, the financial hit would not my problem!!! But it was. I began leasing from that point forward.

If I was the type to hold onto my car for 6 or more years, then buying it might make sense; but based on my requirements, leasing is the only way to go.