Bad AAM or Ignition switch???
11-17-2014, 02:17 PM
#1
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2001 ML 430
Bad AAM or Ignition switch???
Hi
I am new to this forum and recently had an issue with my 01 ML430, I drove to the store turned off the car when I came back and tried to start the car it did not crank I had lights on the dash but no crank after getting the car home tried some of the test listed here on other threads I jumped the k8 relay the car will crank, I tested the terminal 15 in fuse panel has 12v, I do know that the AAM is somewhat bad as my keys wont stay synced to the car but this has been going on for years but it never stopped the car from running how can I check to see if the ignition switch is bad and or will the AAM cause the car not to crank for this year car as I understand that in 01 they removed the DAS from the AAM, is there something else that I am missing I should be checking?
Thank you for your help.
I am new to this forum and recently had an issue with my 01 ML430, I drove to the store turned off the car when I came back and tried to start the car it did not crank I had lights on the dash but no crank after getting the car home tried some of the test listed here on other threads I jumped the k8 relay the car will crank, I tested the terminal 15 in fuse panel has 12v, I do know that the AAM is somewhat bad as my keys wont stay synced to the car but this has been going on for years but it never stopped the car from running how can I check to see if the ignition switch is bad and or will the AAM cause the car not to crank for this year car as I understand that in 01 they removed the DAS from the AAM, is there something else that I am missing I should be checking?
Thank you for your help.
11-17-2014, 05:51 PM
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Hi thanks for your reply but I don't have a scanner truck is in my garage, I was also having an issue with the car getting stuck in first gear turning the car off would resolve the first gear problem then the last time I turned off at the store is when it would not start again no crank do you know if the aam would cause the car not to crank?
11-17-2014, 09:59 PM
#4
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A problem like this indicates a bad starter. After waiting a while you were able to start it.
When the next event occurs, jump the relay immediately. If it cranks then it is another problem. If it doesn't then it is the starter.
When the next event occurs, jump the relay immediately. If it cranks then it is another problem. If it doesn't then it is the starter.
11-17-2014, 10:29 PM
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Hi thanks for your reply but its not he starter I can start the car by jumping the k8 relay and key in pos 2 when I check the k8 relay I have power 12v on socket 30 and socket 1/85 but don't seem to have ground on socket 2/86.
11-18-2014, 04:39 PM
#6
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Have you jumped the relay when it does not start using the key?
11-18-2014, 04:47 PM
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yes I indicated that in my last post I can jump the k8 relay and the car will start with the key in pos2. I am leaning more towards the starter cutout switch as I was having issues with the truck stuck in 1st gear right before this happen.
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11-19-2014, 09:15 AM
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11-19-2014, 07:39 PM
#10
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I don't know how long the no start issue lasts until you can start it normally, but you will have to have someone to turn the key for you.
When the problem occurs, do the following with a fashioned jumper wire, one end in the slot and use the other end to take a reading. Be advised, when inserting the jumper wire in the slot it must touch the silver contact to get a proper reading:
1. remove the relay and turn the key to pos. #2
2. then with a DVOM, individually test slots 30 & 85 for 12v.
3. if so then have someone turn the key to start and hold it there and you check slot 86 for a GROUND signal.
4. if not, then remove the lower cover surrounding the steering column (only 3 screws and access the Ignition Sw.
5. then have the assistant turn the key to start while you test the WHITE wire for 12v.
Do you understand everything?
When the problem occurs, do the following with a fashioned jumper wire, one end in the slot and use the other end to take a reading. Be advised, when inserting the jumper wire in the slot it must touch the silver contact to get a proper reading:
1. remove the relay and turn the key to pos. #2
2. then with a DVOM, individually test slots 30 & 85 for 12v.
3. if so then have someone turn the key to start and hold it there and you check slot 86 for a GROUND signal.
4. if not, then remove the lower cover surrounding the steering column (only 3 screws and access the Ignition Sw.
5. then have the assistant turn the key to start while you test the WHITE wire for 12v.
Do you understand everything?
11-19-2014, 07:51 PM
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I don't know how long the no start issue lasts until you can start it normally, but you will have to have someone to turn the key for you.
When the problem occurs, do the following with a fashioned jumper wire, one end in the slot and use the other end to take a reading. Be advised, when inserting the jumper wire in the slot it must touch the silver contact to get a proper reading:
1. remove the relay and turn the key to pos. #2
2. then with a DVOM, individually test slots 30 & 85 for 12v.
3. if so then have someone turn the key to start and hold it there and you check slot 86 for a GROUND signal.
4. if not, then remove the lower cover surrounding the steering column (only 3 screws and access the Ignition Sw.
5. then have the assistant turn the key to start while you test the WHITE wire for 12v.
Do you understand everything?
When the problem occurs, do the following with a fashioned jumper wire, one end in the slot and use the other end to take a reading. Be advised, when inserting the jumper wire in the slot it must touch the silver contact to get a proper reading:
1. remove the relay and turn the key to pos. #2
2. then with a DVOM, individually test slots 30 & 85 for 12v.
3. if so then have someone turn the key to start and hold it there and you check slot 86 for a GROUND signal.
4. if not, then remove the lower cover surrounding the steering column (only 3 screws and access the Ignition Sw.
5. then have the assistant turn the key to start while you test the WHITE wire for 12v.
Do you understand everything?
1st the truck has not started since the issue has occurred.
2nd I have already tested the ign switch white wire and do have 12v.
3rd on k8 relay slot 30, and 85 I do have 12v on key pos 2 I did not check for ground on 86 when key is pos 3 but will check this if this is not the relay you are speaking of then please let me know which relay
11-19-2014, 08:00 PM
#12
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Yes I think so
1st the truck has not started since the issue has occurred.
2nd I have already tested the ign switch white wire and do have 12v.
3rd on k8 relay slot 30, and 85 I do have 12v on key pos 2 I did not check for ground on 86 when key is pos 3 but will check this if this is not the relay you are speaking of then please let me know which relay
1st the truck has not started since the issue has occurred.
2nd I have already tested the ign switch white wire and do have 12v.
3rd on k8 relay slot 30, and 85 I do have 12v on key pos 2 I did not check for ground on 86 when key is pos 3 but will check this if this is not the relay you are speaking of then please let me know which relay
11-19-2014, 08:41 PM
#13
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Let's go to the source, the starter.
Remove the R/F wheel and then the fender liner and the starter will be visible.
Check for corrosion at the braided ground strap. If there is none.....
With the key out of the ignition, jumper the solenoid stud to the battery stud. A good starter will crank the engine.
Remove the R/F wheel and then the fender liner and the starter will be visible.
Check for corrosion at the braided ground strap. If there is none.....
With the key out of the ignition, jumper the solenoid stud to the battery stud. A good starter will crank the engine.
11-19-2014, 08:54 PM
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2001 ML 430
Let's go to the source, the starter.
Remove the R/F wheel and then the fender liner and the starter will be visible.
Check for corrosion at the braided ground strap. If there is none.....
With the key out of the ignition, jumper the solenoid stud to the battery stud. A good starter will crank the engine.
Remove the R/F wheel and then the fender liner and the starter will be visible.
Check for corrosion at the braided ground strap. If there is none.....
With the key out of the ignition, jumper the solenoid stud to the battery stud. A good starter will crank the engine.
11-19-2014, 08:57 PM
#15
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But you said the truck has not started since the issue. Please be clear about what you write. I'm under the impression that you can't start it at all.
11-19-2014, 09:10 PM
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sorry for the mis understanding I mean with the key I was responding to you post to make it clear I cant start the car with the key but I can as posted in post 5 " start the car by jumping the k8 relay and key in pos 2" this is whee I am so far do not know what activates the k8 relay. is it the AAM or the starter lock out switch or something else??
11-19-2014, 09:49 PM
#17
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The AAM is only used to provide voltage to the starter relay, which you have and there is no further use of the AAM in the starting process.
Below is a diagram of the starting circuit. Note that when the ign. is turned to start, the WHITE wire provides voltage to the EAM, which in turn sends a CAN message to the ECM, which then provides a GROUND circuit to the starter relay.
And yes, the Starter Lock-out could be a problem but you would have to have a code in the ETC to support that theory. Without a scanner it will be difficult.
Below is a diagram of the starting circuit. Note that when the ign. is turned to start, the WHITE wire provides voltage to the EAM, which in turn sends a CAN message to the ECM, which then provides a GROUND circuit to the starter relay.
And yes, the Starter Lock-out could be a problem but you would have to have a code in the ETC to support that theory. Without a scanner it will be difficult.
11-19-2014, 09:55 PM
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The AAM is only used to provide voltage to the starter relay, which you have and there is no further use of the AAM in the starting process.
Below is a diagram of the starting circuit. Note that when the ign. is turned to start, the WHITE wire provides voltage to the EAM, which in turn sends a CAN message to the ECM, which then provides a GROUND circuit to the starter relay.
And yes, the Starter Lock-out could be a problem but you would have to have a code in the ETC to support that theory. Without a scanner it will be difficult.
Below is a diagram of the starting circuit. Note that when the ign. is turned to start, the WHITE wire provides voltage to the EAM, which in turn sends a CAN message to the ECM, which then provides a GROUND circuit to the starter relay.
And yes, the Starter Lock-out could be a problem but you would have to have a code in the ETC to support that theory. Without a scanner it will be difficult.
11-19-2014, 10:01 PM
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11-20-2014, 06:26 AM
#20
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Since you have voltage at the WHITE wire you you tun the key to start, the next step would be to check its next travel location, the EAM.
Locate the EAM near the upper part of the steering column and access conn. #4, wire A8 WHITE. Hold the key to start and check for 12v. If so...............
Locate the ECM in the fuse box and access conn. #4, wire #35 GREY. Hold the key to start and see if there is a positive signal or a negative signal.
Additionally you can perform the added test at the ECM as you will already be there.
Locate the EAM near the upper part of the steering column and access conn. #4, wire A8 WHITE. Hold the key to start and check for 12v. If so...............
Locate the ECM in the fuse box and access conn. #4, wire #35 GREY. Hold the key to start and see if there is a positive signal or a negative signal.
Additionally you can perform the added test at the ECM as you will already be there.
Last edited by Maj. Dundee; 11-20-2014 at 06:29 AM.
11-20-2014, 06:43 AM
#21
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Seriously, you should get yourself a scanner, that can read engine, trans., ABS and air bag.
Its very difficult for me to provide all these procedures solely because you cannot have the codes read.
Its very difficult for me to provide all these procedures solely because you cannot have the codes read.
11-20-2014, 07:21 PM
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Seriously, you should get yourself a scanner, that can read engine, trans., ABS and air bag.Amazon.com: Autel MD802 MaxiDiag Elite Scan Tool: Automotive
Its very difficult for me to provide all these procedures solely because you cannot have the codes read.
Its very difficult for me to provide all these procedures solely because you cannot have the codes read.
11-23-2014, 01:02 PM
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Seriously, you should get yourself a scanner, that can read engine, trans., ABS and air bag.Amazon.com: Autel MD802 MaxiDiag Elite Scan Tool: Automotive
Its very difficult for me to provide all these procedures solely because you cannot have the codes read.
Its very difficult for me to provide all these procedures solely because you cannot have the codes read.
P0700
P0715
P0748
are any of these related to it not cranking? I am sure its the cause of it sometimes not shifting out of first gear.
11-24-2014, 01:06 PM
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11-25-2014, 06:21 AM
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