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Adjustable front camber/caster bolts install 1999 W210
Not true eccentric bolts but bolts with a slot and groove cut into one side. This slot and groove can be placed at the 3 o’clock or 9 o’clock position to shift the lower control arm inward or outward 3mm. This 3mm shift translates into 20’ (minutes) or 0.3 degrees of camber or caster change. The washers have protrusions that fit over the V-shaped ears on the side *away* from the slot and groove. The washer then holds the bolt tightly into the new position and prevents the bolt from slipping back into the neutral or factory original position.
My car had -0.7 degrees on driver’s side front, -1.4 degrees on passenger side front. An eccentric bolt was already installed in the caster (front bolt) position; camber bolt (rear position) was factory original. No luck getting spring compressors onto the spring due to a stuck sway bar link bolt that prevented me from lowering the sway bar out of the way. The spring puts a lot of pressure on the bolt! I removed the original bolt using a floor jack and adjustable head pry bar. There are several points which are available for leverage but I could only have done it with the adjustable-head pry bar. Due to the steering assembly, I could not use a punch or another bolt to drive out the original camber bolt. Very much a PITA to get the old one out and the new one in; call it an hour or so before I figured out which techniques worked.
Installed the adjustable bolt front to rear, then rotated slot and groove inboard and fastened. This pulled the lower control arm inward and reduced the camber to -1.1 degrees; still not good enough. One can trade caster for camber; in this case I rotated the caster bolt so the groove was outboard. This “swung the lever” of the lower control arm and reduced caster by about 0.3 degrees but moved the camber end of the control arm inward to give me additional positive camber. Final measurement for camber was a negative 0.7 degrees on the passenger front and it matched the driver’s side measurement.
Used a water level and floor tiles to level the car, set up strings to measure toe, and then adjusted tie-rod ends to obtain my desired toe-in.
From what I could find online, the toe-in angle front should be 0’ to 20’. This translates as zero degrees to 0.33 degrees. Taking the tangent of the angle and multiplying by the physical diameter of the rim (19.5” or 495.3mm) equates to a measured distance of zero to 2.9mm that the front of the rim should be inward more than the rear of the rim. Adjust, measure, adjust other side, measure, curse loudly as moving one moved the other…finally got it to zero toe-in driver’s side and 0.5mm toe-in passenger side. (I prefer zero toe-in on my cars).
I’ll have a separate post on the adjustable rear camber bars. Photos below are mine with the exception of the W208 picture which I pulled from another post. I’m grateful for the other post because I expected true eccentric bolts and was having the hardest time figuring out how the heck the slot and groove bolts were supposed to work.
THE OTHER ALTERNATIVE IS TO FIX IT RIGHT THE FIRST TIME WITH K-MAC
The industry standard front suspension "fluted or slot bolts" for Camber and Caster only offer minimal 0.3 degree of adjustment and only this one offset non-adjustable position.
K-MAC latest kits fully resolve both this lack of travel and precision by providing 4 times the adjustment range with the patented design also allowing precise/accurate single wrench (ongoing) adjustment. And there is no disassembly required each time.
Premature inner edge tire wear, steering pull, reduced traction - any of these a result of curb knock damage, altering suspension height, fitting of wide profile tires, load carrying can now all be accurately catered for.
Added bonus with K-MAC is not only overcoming the lack of "full adjustment capability" on Mercedes models to allow to return vehicle to factory specs - both Camber and Caster as well as Toe - but also the 4 front and 4 rear K-MAC bushings at same time replace the highest wearing suspension bushings!
Another feature is that with the K-MAC rear kits (unlike adjustable arms) they're designed to adjust the lower control arms inwards to resolve premature inner edge tire wear/improve traction.
While adjustable arms move the top of tire outwards reducing all important top of tire tire to outer fender clearance. K-MAC rear Camber kits also include additional Toe adjustment which is important to compensate for the new found rear Camber facility.
With all K-MAC kits no special additional tools are required.
seems to me that bbirdwell posted his DIY in good faith. seems a little weak to use his thread
as a soapbox to boast of your product, regardless of its merits. as a sponsor you will always
have this edge so why 'photo bomb' his post?
@ raymond: I thank you for your support and wise words, Sir.
A message to K-Mac
@ K-Mac representative...
I fully concur you make a quality product. If I was lowering my car I would purchase your product; it's well-engineered and good stuff. I can't complain about the cost because I work in a R&D organization; quality design and work costs money.
May I recommend you design a front camber/caster kit that does *not* require replacing the front bushings? A lower cost kit for those of us with a *stock* ride height who just want the ability to adjust our alignment? If your company had a lower cost kit available for my situation, I would have purchased it even at a slightly higher (10%? 20%? 30%) cost compared to the underwhelming "groove and slot" bolts. I'm an Engineer; the "groove and slot" bolts work in an very simplistic way but they could be better and I'm willing to purchase a product that appeals to me.
Understand I come from decades of driving Mazda Miatas with true eccentric bolts; very easy to set my alignment exactly where I want it without having to spend hundreds of dollars of hard-earned money. How about you provide an "in-between" solution for those of us transitioning into the Mercedes mystique?
It's not as lucrative as your top-of-the-line kits but it captures those of us on the borderline. Then we might transition into your top-of-the-line kits with further profit for you.
You can also apply this to the rear camber kits. Full-cost kit with upper and lower control arm bushings for those who want it all. A somewhat lower cost (but still profitable for you) kit for those who just want to bring their camber back in line while keeping their stock wheels and tires. If you had assembled the upper camber bars into a ready-to-order kit for me, I would have gladly purchased them from you rather than spending 8-10 hours of my time researching the information. My time is worth money to me.
If you don't go for it folks like me will just spend money elsewhere. Look at your product sales distribution versus Mercedes sales distribution. Are you selling 20% of your product where only 8% of Mercedes are sold? If so, you're missing on a large market.
No disrespect intended. I hope your business strategists see where I'm going....
May your business prosper and make my Internet searches much less time consuming!
seems to me that bbirdwell posted his DIY in good faith. seems a little weak to use his thread
as a soapbox to boast of your product, regardless of its merits. as a sponsor you will always
have this edge so why 'photo bomb' his post?
(just my perception)
Certainly was not our intention or that it would be interpreted that way!
Yes bbirdwell is to be commended and has done an excellent write up re DIY installation of the front slot bolts.
Our only excuse would be observing the frustration re majority of owners going from one dealer to the next or alignment to alignment shop and still chasing an accurate alignment when all the operator has to work with at best is the miniscule .3 of one degree adjustment with the slotted bolt system.
Many owners simply not aware that since the mid '90's Camber and Caster adjustment facility was deleted from all models.
Yet altering height, wide profile tires, curb knocks - accurate adjustment is essential to return vehicle to within factory specs.
"With all K-MAC kits no special additional tools are required. "
LOL! I would love it if you would produce a product to back up this statement! I spent a considerable amount of time working out the techniques to swap out the camber bolt (the caster bolt was already replaced).
Will you provide an adjustable-head pry bar? Or a turnbuckle bar ala Firebird/Camaro suspension bushing replacement? Or a nylon strap with tensioner?
Look...I'm not ridiculing you here. You have a potential market of thousands of individuals who would like to do this. Or at least hundreds of shops and clubs who would purchase or rent the tool.
Put your engineers to work designing a tool to ease the install of true eccentric bolts. And the same or another kit for the install of eccentric bolts and bushings for your top-of-the-line kits. I can't help. Any ideas I have are intellectual property of my employer; you're on your own. It's possible. Do it!
How about you supply the top-of-the-line kit with all tools to hold lower control am in place and the bushing removal/installation tools? Customer credit card is charged the cost of the tools, customer uses tools, then returns tools, K-Mac refunds most of the charge.
If your company provided me several hundred dollars worth of tools to do the job myself, but the final cost to me is only $50 to $95 for the use of the tools, I'd say it was well worth it. And it would encourage me to purchase your product.
As a backup, have a list of shops in the customer area who can install your product.
@ raymond: I thank you for your support and wise words, Sir.
A message to K-Mac
@ K-Mac representative...
.... I can't complain about the cost because I work in a R&D organization; quality design and work costs money.
:-)
We're certainly on the same wave length there!
Do appreciate your input and the fact is we have more international patents on product design than all other Camber, Caster kit companies combined. Patents on all 6 basic suspension designs from struts, through to ball joints and pivoted arms.
Have been manufacturing kits longer than anyone else with the World's largest range Audi to Volvo.
Re lower cost kit - we do so for all the A and B models along with the new current CLA class. Plus commercials - these high mileage vans certainly need adjustment to compensate for costly/premature inner edge tire wear - All Sprinter and Vito vans. These OEM design suspensions allow for this. They retail for $110 per front kit.
Remembering "aftermarket industry" is just that. We are along after OEM. But not being a company to watch others / sit on the fence - we always relish a challenge and MB World members will be the first to know if we can improve, simplify our current designs for all the other1968 to 2014 models.
I'm a day late and a dollar short on this post but I wish I'd known about this particular spring compressor before I started the job. This would have made it easier compared to my external spring compressor. Like I posted earlier, I'm still learning about Mercedes.
Cost shows as $129 plus $33 dollars shipping. Limited use unless one owns Mercedes for years but still a good buy for the home mechanic.
My thanks to the K-Mac rep for engaging in the conversation.
Not true eccentric bolts but bolts with a slot and groove cut into one side. This slot and groove can be placed at the 3 o’clock or 9 o’clock position to shift the lower control arm inward or outward 3mm. This 3mm shift translates into 20’ (minutes) or 0.3 degrees of camber or caster change. The washers have protrusions that fit over the V-shaped ears on the side *away* from the slot and groove. The washer then holds the bolt tightly into the new position and prevents the bolt from slipping back into the neutral or factory original position.
My car had -0.7 degrees on driver’s side front, -1.4 degrees on passenger side front. An eccentric bolt was already installed in the caster (front bolt) position; camber bolt (rear position) was factory original. No luck getting spring compressors onto the spring due to a stuck sway bar link bolt that prevented me from lowering the sway bar out of the way. The spring puts a lot of pressure on the bolt! I removed the original bolt using a floor jack and adjustable head pry bar. There are several points which are available for leverage but I could only have done it with the adjustable-head pry bar. Due to the steering assembly, I could not use a punch or another bolt to drive out the original camber bolt. Very much a PITA to get the old one out and the new one in; call it an hour or so before I figured out which techniques worked.
Installed the adjustable bolt front to rear, then rotated slot and groove inboard and fastened. This pulled the lower control arm inward and reduced the camber to -1.1 degrees; still not good enough. One can trade caster for camber; in this case I rotated the caster bolt so the groove was outboard. This “swung the lever” of the lower control arm and reduced caster by about 0.3 degrees but moved the camber end of the control arm inward to give me additional positive camber. Final measurement for camber was a negative 0.7 degrees on the passenger front and it matched the driver’s side measurement.
Used a water level and floor tiles to level the car, set up strings to measure toe, and then adjusted tie-rod ends to obtain my desired toe-in.
From what I could find online, the toe-in angle front should be 0’ to 20’. This translates as zero degrees to 0.33 degrees. Taking the tangent of the angle and multiplying by the physical diameter of the rim (19.5” or 495.3mm) equates to a measured distance of zero to 2.9mm that the front of the rim should be inward more than the rear of the rim. Adjust, measure, adjust other side, measure, curse loudly as moving one moved the other…finally got it to zero toe-in driver’s side and 0.5mm toe-in passenger side. (I prefer zero toe-in on my cars).
I’ll have a separate post on the adjustable rear camber bars. Photos below are mine with the exception of the W208 picture which I pulled from another post. I’m grateful for the other post because I expected true eccentric bolts and was having the hardest time figuring out how the heck the slot and groove bolts were supposed to work.
Hope this helps someone else.
Hi, can you confirm whether these bolts have just the one groove or two? I heard form another post that this part # has two, but looking from your pictures it has one?
Thanks for all the informative reading. As I am currently reinstalling both lower control arms - just replaced all four bushings - and found that my driver side forward and aft bolts were both UNNOTCHED, but my passenger side forward and aft bolts were both NOTCHED. What I want to know is whether I should be removing the driver side unnotched bolts and replacing them with the notched kind AND the notched washers. I will be working on the front end for a few more days so I have time to make the swap, but since I have both inner adn outter Tie Rods removed AND I am installing Eibach lowering springs and Bilstien Sport shocks. I thought I better get this right now. I will of course have it all alligned as soon as I finish. Any advice is greatly appreciated.
Thanks for all the informative reading. As I am currently reinstalling both lower control arms - just replaced all four bushings - and found that my driver side forward and aft bolts were both UNNOTCHED, but my passenger side forward and aft bolts were both NOTCHED. What I want to know is whether I should be removing the driver side unnotched bolts and replacing them with the notched kind AND the notched washers. I will be working on the front end for a few more days so I have time to make the swap, but since I have both inner adn outter Tie Rods removed AND I am installing Eibach lowering springs and Bilstien Sport shocks. I thought I better get this right now. I will of course have it all alligned as soon as I finish. Any advice is greatly appreciated.
C-
Replace them while you have it apart. That way you have the option to adjust alignment when needed. If no adjustment is necessary, have the bolts placed in the "neutral" position (i.e. notch up or down, not side to side).
I have rebuilt three Land Rovers and a '67 mustang in the US. I live in the UK. I am research scientist so none of the above should be beyond me. However:
After fitting a rear camber strut today on my W210 E class 300TD it became very apparent that the front camber bolt positioning was very wrong.
I have now fitted the bolt in every possible combination and have found one position that is marginally better albeit less than satisfactory. In comparison to the possible 1.25 degrees, I can adjust on the rear, the front bolt does absolutely nothing or makes things worse.
Currently the forward-facing washer has its V-indent towards the wheel. At the rear of the bolt, the V-indent is facing towards the engine. The groove in the bolt is facing towards the wheel at 9 O’clock. The OPPOSITE direction to the V-indent on that side.
When turning the bolt, the ONLY time I can get the arm to move is when it emits out a load click and the groove faces directly downwards. OTHER times turning the bolt, so the grove is either at 3 or 9 O’clock does nothing.
The wheel is most definitely still kicking outwards at the bottom. The car is far from warn out. Many of the parts appear brand new. She is a 21 one year old spring chicken with only around 140,000 miles on the clock.
Can anyone help please? I suspect there is a technique I am not using or something very fundamental that I am doing wrong.
Check front control arm bushings to see if they are collapsing. If they are 21 years old, I would replace just on general principle. FWIW, the front bushings on my 1999 W210 were replaced at ~14 years of age and they needed it.
While performing the work, I did not rotate the eccentric bolt as that runs the risk of disturbing the "tabs" on the inner and outer sides of the subframe where the bolt is inserted. I inserted the bolt with the groove facing the engine to pull the lower control arm inwards 3mm. At the same time, I had to use an adjustable pry bar to manually shift the control arm inward enough to insert the bolt. I remember it as being a PITA to get the bolt back in.
Just for information, on the W211 the tabs are located in the metal center of the bushing; this hole is wider than it is tall. The W210 has metal bushing centers without tabs; just a cylindrical hole.
So, W210, tabs on subframe. W211 tabs in bushings.
Thanks for your reply. I was being a bit dim. I have drawn this to make it completely transparent. I was reading the Mercedes image wrong. I assumed the "!" was for the spring and was assuming that the thread end of the bolt was shown. Good call on the control arm bushings. The arms got replaced a couple of years ago. Or at least I thought they were. A garage and MOT. It’s better now but not good as the rears.
05-16-2014, 05:59 PM
