drsaab

So just a general question, mainly for people on the coasts because you already have a great supercharger network for long distance travel...

Did you drive the Tesla model S and why did you chose s550 over that?

history... I have sold over 1000 cars with my own dealership, Driven mostly everything out there except 150k + exotics. I have had plenty of S classes, E classes, ls460's and 7 series. I do like MB.



I got a "base" model S85 rwd with auotpilot 2 mos ago and 4000 miles later, it is like nothing else. Basically like driving a magic air carpet. Can't really put it in words.

There is instant and totally silent power (more than the s550), it is buttery smooth (more than the s550), cheaper to run vs s550, and great upgrade-able tech, seats 5 + 2, great styling, more cargo room with 2 trunks, ability to pre heat or cool the cabin from your phone, and has a Full tank (250miles) every morning.

I drive 35-40k miles a year and have a E350BT with distronic plus as my last car. I can do these miles and more in a Tesla without any issues on range. I have driven it long distance travel and about every 3 hrs you stop for 30 min at a supercharger to charge up, get a coffee etc.

cost is about 95-100k loaded (s85 RWD), AWD is 5 km more. minus 7.5k to 10k incentives from feds. so similar to a base S550.



It does not have massage seats, auto close doors, some of the "Plush" of the benz.

But those seem irrelevant and unnoticed once you drive the Model S daily.

So why did you choose one over the other?

If you have not driven a model S, from someone who has a lot of car experience, you should go try one out, you might be pleasantly surprised. I do hope MB builds a useful Electric car with good range.

BluetecKING

I like the s550 more because the backseat is more luxurious. The massaging seats are just amazing, the calf support, and the pillows just scream luxury. Whereas the tesla is smaller and seems to have less legroom. I do love the interface of the tesla though. I am buying for luxury and in that the s class takes it all day. With the lower gas prices I don't mind paying for it.

drsaab

Good points. The Model S just came out with amazing recaro next gen front seats, but the back seats are basic and have less legroom. It is a very wide car, but length wise between the E and S. Model S is a car meant more for driving vs being a passenger for sure.

Quadcammer

the tesla interior is absolute dog****. For that reason alone I would not buy one.

I'm also not a believer in electric cars, but thats besides the point.

jenz

Interior, interior, interior it isn't even close

Long3494Qut

Interior is weak. Very weak. Minus the techs.

alshaikh85

Interior of Tesla is now where to be called luxury compared to the S Class. I also find the overall design of S Class far superior in all aspects. If you factor out the electric motor element of Tesal, which is the main differentiator, I find it very hard to justify the price they are asking for. Add to this, the fact of limited range and long refueling time and then you should actually reverse the question: Why would you buy a Tesal model S when you have a much better option out there

Streamliner

I live in Newport Beach and Teslas are everywhere. I do believe the exterior is quite good looking and much better looking than the current S Class sedan. When it comes to the interior, however, there is NO comparison, with the MB standard interior being far better and the Nappa & Exclusive Nappa interiors light years ahead of the Tesla. When I think of getting into a life threatening accident, do I want to be wrapped in a bigger, heavier car, designed and produced by a company that has been engineering some of the safest cars on the planet for over a CENTURY, or in a car designed and engineered by a start up tech company? In addition, the Tesla doesn't have several of the other safety, comfort & convenience features, such as Distronic, Parktronic, Collision Avoidance, Lane Keeping, MBC, etc. Lastly, and a big one for me, the Tesla won't make it from Newport to Napa Valley on one charge. The Tesla sedan is a very nice car, but is clearly several rungs below the S Class, in many important ways.

Cptdenny

Last year at about this time I test rode the Tesla sedan. At the time I owned a 2009 E320 Bluetec. I found the Tesla ride to be about equal to the E class Mercedes.
The Tesla was faster but the interior with that huge center screen look like it was an after thought add on from Walmart. The space between the front seats was wasted. Over all the interior felt & appeared low rent.

Personally, if the Tesla wasn't electric, it would be a $40K car.
The plus is there's a superstation 6 miles from my home next to one of my favorite restaurants. I really wanted to fall in love with the Tesla.

The negative, these super stations will become over crowded with long waiting times once more of these Tesla's hit the road and prices come down.

I also test rode the Rolls Ghost & the Bentley Flying Spur, the 2014 S550 rode better and has more bang for the buck plus updated technology than the Rolls & Bentley. European magazine writers voted the S550 world's best luxury sedan.

Jason B

What that the new model flying spur? It was just redesigned.

BeachBunny

I bought a 2015 E350 instead of the Tesla.

For me it came down to a few factors:
1) Range, range, range. I'm in Florida, where it's hot about 350 days a year, humid 365, thus the AC will need to run all year 'round on the car, reducing the already paltry range of the car. Even at 3am last night the AC at my condo was still running, and we're in the middle of January. I'm also on the road most of the time. I'm fortunate enough to have condos in the cities I'm in most often, but there's at least 2 days a week where I'm driving >85 miles a day. THEN there's the issue of if I travel to a hotel where I doubt I'll find a place to charge up the car, and how long it takes to charge on 110v.

2) Interior. This is usually my #1 requirement of a car since I spend so much time in it. The Tesla's interior just feels unfinished. Awesome for a prototype but just needs another 2-3 rounds in the design department to make it look cohesive. The facelift 2015 E interior's quite nice, definitely on par with the W221, but definitely not the W222. Still better than the Tesla's, and I have the massaging driver's seat. Also have the laminated acoustical glass, which basically means no wind noise nor noise from other vehicles except the idiot with straight pipes on a bike.

3) The touchscreen. I HATE touch screens in cars and hate large screens in cars. Blame the Infiniti Q50 and Lexus infotainment systems for this. I want to be able to reach over and grab a knob for the radio without looking. Same goes for the AC controls. I should be able to do it without taking my eyes off the road. As much as the media *****es about COMAND and its lack of touch screen, it's been designed so that it can be operated without distraction. Yes, it takes a little bit of time to learn, but after my first 150 miles with the car (literally, the second day I had the E), I mastered most of it.

4) Distronic+ w/Steering Assist. This is the #1 reason I bought a Mercedes over another Infiniti. Out of the 2,000 miles I've driven, I'd say Distronic has driven 1500-1800 of them. Then add in the safety systems. My E paid for itself this week when I was driving 45 mph and someone pulled out 4 car lengths in front of me. No problem for the E. Distronic was right on top of it. Other cars may have "automatic cruise control" but even the best of the competitions' is still a good 5 years behind Mercedes Distronic+.

5) Longevity. I like Tesla and really hope they'll do well. I'm glad to see someone's making an electric car that isn't a sh*tbox. BUT, where will Tesla be in 5 years? 10 years? How will the car and its batteries hold up after 200,000 miles? I've been averaging 200,000 miles and 10 years on my last two cars. And what do I do for service? In many areas you have your choice of Merc dealers to choose from and you'll get a loaner car.

To be honest, I really wanted an E300 diesel hybrid. Not because I'm a treehugger or anything like that, but the idea of getting 65-75mpg out of a full-size car fascinated me. I also wanted to put a digital display in the back window "Current MPG: 68 mpg. Suck it, Prius owners."

Cptdenny

It was a left over 2013 Flying Spur I test rode. It did ride better than the Rolls Ghost though.

I Also test rode the Lexus LS460 minutes after test riding the 2014 S550 I ended up purchasing. The S550 made the LS460 look like a high priced Toyota (which it is).

drsaab

Not that any of you may care but here is my take on the responses. First let me say I am 20+ years younger than the "avg" demographic of the S class buyer which is age 61. I am a techie so I like the latest gadgets, I drive a lot so Efficiency is important.

And I specifically posted this for people who have actually driven the tesla, And I guess I should state the new Autopilot equipped Tesla that is released post oct 2014. They are quite different from early models in tech and quietness and Build Quality. Nice to have this discussion with owners of the great W222.


"Interior of Tesla is now where to be called luxury compared to the S Class. I also find the overall design of S Class far superior in all aspects. If you factor out the electric motor element of Tesal, which is the main differentiator, I find it very hard to justify the price they are asking for. Add to this, the fact of limited range and long refueling time and then you should actually reverse the question: Why would you buy a Tesal model S when you have a much better option out there "

YES, The S is the best of the large gas powered sedans and the interior is amazing. I think the Model S is far more sporty looking and younger more clean modern looking, which it should because the S class fits perfect what it should look like for the avg demographic. You cant take out the electric motor and battery and say its overpriced cause that is the drivetrain. Your Mercedes Drivetrain is a large part of the cost of the S550 of course. Low range and long refueling... You get a full tank every morning. So if you drive MORE than 200-250 miles a day, then you have to "REFUEL/RECHARGE". I would guess this happens 10 days a year when on a road trip. 355 days a year you drive Less than 250 miles in a single day, and the tank is FULL every morning. Its hard to relate to a gas car because you do not get that FULL TANK every single day. And for longer trips the superchargers are a 30 min stop every 3 hrs, Which most ppl do already. So for those10 days a year you will be losing 2 hrs of your life on a 700 mile road trip for 3 supercharges. I think many (not all ) owners of S classes would fly 700 miles vs drive as well.

People feel that in 250 miles you have to shut down to recharge which Is "retarded", but This 250 RESETS every morning, so it is only relevant if your doing more than that in a single day.

As far as the Drive, I already stated above my thoughts after 1000's of cars, I feel it drives better than the S550. The power is instant. The S85 has the same 0-60 time as the S550 (5 sec in general testing) but in the real world of freeways and traffic, 30-50 and 50-70 is way Faster in the model S than the S550 and equals Mercedes AMG models because of the INSTANT full torque available at all speeds.

Cost wise it is cheaper, A loaded Model S85 runs about 100k minus the 7500 tax credit so really 92500. The S with Drivers assist is more expensive. The P85D awd Model S is 25k more but is s65/s63 AMG performance (0-60 in 3.2 sec).

repeating from my first post...
There is instant and totally silent power (more than the s550), it is buttery smooth (more than the s550), cheaper to run vs s550, and great over the air upgrade-able tech, seats 5 + 2, great styling, more cargo room with 2 trunks, ability to pre heat or cool the cabin from your phone, and has a Full tank (250miles) every morning.

"interior being far better and the Nappa & Exclusive Nappa interiors light years ahead of the Tesla"

True

"When I think of getting into a life threatening accident, do I want to be wrapped in a bigger, heavier car, designed and produced by a company that has been engineering some of the safest cars on the planet for over a CENTURY, or in a car designed and engineered by a start up tech company"

The model S beat every car ever tested, and broke the testing machine in the rollover test. 5.4 star rating. only 1 fatality in a model S so far and that is someone who drove over a 400 ft mountain cliff in California.

"In addition, the Tesla doesn't have several of the other safety, comfort & convenience features, such as Distronic, Parktronic, Collision Avoidance, Lane Keeping, MBC, etc."

This is no longer true, It has a full "autopilot" suite with all of these except MBC which is the Mercedes suspension. 1/2 of this is out already with software, the rest will be out in a few months. If you visit the Tesla website after jan 12th it Is updated with detailed AUTOPILOT descriptions that exceeds the S550. It does have smart air suspension, but not MBC level. The model S will soon even park itself in your garage per Elon musk, but I am not so sure about that

"Tesla won't make it from Newport to Napa Valley on one charge"

true 440 miles needs a charge. But if you stop anyways in this drive for a bathroom break, coffee, snack, your about 10 min behind the gas car in total drive time.

"Last year at about this time I test rode the Tesla sedan. At the time I owned a 2009 E320 Bluetec. I found the Tesla ride to be about equal to the E class Mercedes. "

The Tesla has improved since that time, specially after oct 2014. I had a W211 and W212. No one I have had in the car feels like I downgraded, but sure the floor mats and felt are less dense plush for sure. The Tesla S85 with 19" wheels and Air Suspension rides better than an E class and equal to a S as far as suspension. The 21" wheels degrade it similar to a S with 21" would ride.

"Personally, if the Tesla wasn't electric, it would be a $40K car."

true, because the batty and motor are worth about 40k. But so is the MB complete drivetrain in a S class. The S550 without any Drivetrain is probably about 50-60k.


" The negative, these super stations will become over crowded with long waiting times once more of these Tesla's hit the road and prices come down. "

So this is an unknown, they keep building more. I have never had a wait yet, but again these are used only when over 250 miles in a day not for a "fill up" around town. The newer model 3 tesla probably wont have Free supercharging at its price point.

"1) Range, range, range. I'm in Florida, where it's hot about 350 days a year, humid 365, thus the AC will need to run all year 'round on the car, reducing the already paltry range of the car. Even at 3am last night the AC at my condo was still running, and we're in the middle of January. I'm also on the road most of the time. I'm fortunate enough to have condos in the cities I'm in most often, but there's at least 2 days a week where I'm driving >85 miles a day. THEN there's the issue of if I travel to a hotel where I doubt I'll find a place to charge up the car, and how long it takes to charge on 110v. "

I drive 110+ miles a day, in the cold too. Remember Full tank every morning. upto 225 mi per day with full blast AC on and no range issues. AC does not take much energy so maybe a 10% loss of range vs Heating the car is about a 15% decrease in range. So Florida is more ideal than Northeast where I am. Plus you can PRE COOL the car, open the sunroof, all from your phone. 110v gives 4mph charge, slow. Most destinations have a supercharger close and now many hotels are installing 240v chargers for 30-60mph charging.

"2) Interior. This is usually my #1 requirement of a car since I spend so much time in it. The Tesla's interior just feels unfinished. Awesome for a prototype but just needs another 2-3 rounds in the design department to make it look cohesive. The facelift 2015 E interior's quite nice, definitely on par with the W221, but definitely not the W222. Still better than the Tesla's, and I have the massaging driver's seat. Also have the laminated acoustical glass, which basically means no wind noise nor noise from other vehicles except the idiot with straight pipes on a bike."

So this is a personal preference. I have went from the W212 to Model S and no one in about 25 ppl have said it looks worse as far as the dash goes, it is 25/25 in favor of the Tesla dash. But this is personal taste, we all have the right to choose what we like.

"3) The touchscreen. I HATE touch screens in cars and hate large screens in cars. Blame the Infiniti Q50 and Lexus infotainment systems for this. I want to be able to reach over and grab a knob for the radio without looking. Same goes for the AC controls. I should be able to do it without taking my eyes off the road. As much as the media *****es about COMAND and its lack of touch screen, it's been designed so that it can be operated without distraction. Yes, it takes a little bit of time to learn, but after my first 150 miles with the car (literally, the second day I had the E), I mastered most of it. "

They are different in the Q and LS, the Q is dangerous, it is so low and hard to use/see. The LS is all nanny protected with 1/2 features off when driving. Sync in fords, Cue in Caddies, all are crap. If I had those touch screens, the MB is way better I agree. The model S is no comparison, again personal choice, but after 2 month of ownership the simplicity of the touch screen is great.. I have went back to my w212 after a month of Tesla driving and felt is not efficient. Quite Useable, but more clicks, button presses etc to get to what I need to do.

"4) Distronic+ w/Steering Assist. This is the #1 reason I bought a Mercedes over another Infiniti. Out of the 2,000 miles I've driven, I'd say Distronic has driven 1500-1800 of them. Then add in the safety systems. My E paid for itself this week when I was driving 45 mph and someone pulled out 4 car lengths in front of me. No problem for the E. Distronic was right on top of it. Other cars may have "automatic cruise control" but even the best of the competitions' is still a good 5 years behind Mercedes Distronic+."

Again Autopilot features equal and will surpass the MB. I have Distronic+ on my MB and waited till tesla came out with a Autonomous system. The tesla website will detail this. It is also upgraded over time, which Distronic is not unless you buy a newer model.


" 5) Longevity. I like Tesla and really hope they'll do well. I'm glad to see someone's making an electric car that isn't a sh*tbox. BUT, where will Tesla be in 5 years? 10 years? How will the car and its batteries hold up after 200,000 miles? I've been averaging 200,000 miles and 10 years on my last two cars. And what do I do for service? In many areas you have your choice of Merc dealers to choose from and you'll get a loaner car. "

So this is big since I drive 35k+ miles a year. I only bought a MB with the UNLIMITED CPO warranty. (remember I have sold 1000+ cars and seen it all). I also waited for Tesla to have a similar warranty. It has 8 yrs Unlimited miles on the drivetrain and batty. The highest miles tesla is about 110k in 2 years so far. One thing is the car has very few maintenance parts. At 200k miles you do not worry about transmission, oil leaks, sludge, cat converters, manifolds, etc etc. The car is actually simple. All the crap in an Old S550 that freaks used car buyers out don't exist. The Air suspension is the most risky part in a tesla for needing a long term repair. So in 8 yrs 250k miles, I am covered. After that I prob would not own a 2015 S550 or this Tesla. Neither would you. If I Did, I think the Tesla will be more reliable long term out for it has so few wear and tear moving parts relative to the S550 . There is almost no "maintenance" needed on a model S vs a S550. No service a, b, or the $1500 40k services etc etc. Just rotate tires, and fill up windshield washer, and brake fluid flush every few years mainly. Even at 8 years out.


Anyways not to create a argument. Great to hear both sides. Again some like vanilla, some like chocolate so no incorrect answer. With this kind of money you should drive everything out there so I would recommend you re evaluate the Tesla and DRIVE it for a extended test drive to feel the buttery smooth and silky drive it has.

I felt that for the 100k, this was something the "DRIVES" totally unique and is far advanced vs all the other nice/nicer/supernice sedans out there.

It is great to be a consumer with all these choices in new technology for vehicles in the next 10 years. In 2 years Model S has outsold the S class so many ppl agree. Competition creates better products for us all. Look at where Samsung Galaxy 5 has come vs IPhone. Both have to improve more rapidly and we win. I see the model S as the new IPhone like disrupter for cars.

BeachBunny

AC draws a bit more than "10%". Figuring the car has a 36,000 BTU AC, you're looking at least 4.5kW per hour right there, minimum, and I'm being conservative. I've not taken an in-depth look to see what Tesla's chosen to use. Could easily be closer to 6kW-8kW depending on inefficiencies.

Re: advanced driving features, the S is here and now. Tesla's features "will be" available at some future date. Tesla's been good about delivering results, but these are complex systems, not something to be taken lightly. MB's been working on Distronic in some form since the late 1980s. Also, there's a HUGE difference between your 2010 Distronic+ and the current Distronic+ w/Steering Assist. I usually have Distronic going all the time in my car, especially city driving. The older DTR+ was good for highways, but not as great at city driving.

Re: reliability, time will tell. The Tesla has fewer moving parts, BUT many more fragile electronics subjected to extreme loads and extreme conditions. Heat, moisture, and vibration are not kind to electronics. Batteries don't like to be charged fast or get hot either. Also, inverters fail, AC motors fail. I see it with industrial machinery, refrigeration, and elevators all the time. If electronics were reliable, I'd be in a different line of work.

UrBusted

Well, one thing I would like to say in the S63 vs Model S P85D is that the Tesla isn't a car which you can track. I mean literally, you can't track a Tesla. Not that many people would be doing that everyday. Also, the company is too new to get parts. People have been waiting months to source windows, panels e.t.c. There are no superchargers on any of my routes around the UK, and unless I want a major diversion it won't be possible to find a place to charge it. Once again, the interior is what won my family over as well as the high end speaker system. In my opinion, its a bit nicer to drive, but I test drove the old model s. Finally, before someone says it is better for the environment, according to recent studies it appears to be otherwise due to fossil fuels, making and destroying/recycling the battery e.t.c.

Wolfman

This thread feels like deja vu since this was all discussed to the nth degree on the forum before.

The four wheel drive version sounds like a great improvement over the standard P85 and the updated interior bits are certainly helping.
I certainly like that Tesla is pushing other car manufacturers to innovate at a more aggressive pace, wether it's EV or Hybrid tech.

Personally, I'd get a Tesla in a heartbeat if it would just look different; either a sedan or coupe.
Just don't care for the hatchback design and it's starting to look a bit dated IMO.

Cptdenny

The Tesla may seem to cost less to run presently, but those expensive batteries will need replacing once the warranty is out. I've read that you should figure in another $2K a year amortizing for those battery replacements. You're not getting a free lunch there.

With the price of gasoline falling, the fueling costs gap between the Tesla & the S550 is narrowing. Throw in the battery amortizing and it may become a wash.

The auto pilot feature promised is just that, a promise. You can't state at this time it's better than the Benz's version. You're stating opinion here, not fact.

I've been on top of Tesla's improvements which have pi$$ed off current owners that are now stuck with a greatly deprecated same year model. This no doubt will continue as it has with our PCs. Every few months something new & improved that makes your current model obsolete. I'm not talking just software improvements here.

We don't know if Tesla will be around in 10 yrs. it's owner is taking some risky gambles in other areas that could bankrupt his company overnight.

As for waits at superstations, on the NJ Turnpike there's only 4 stalls at its superstation. This right outside NYC. I can imagine the Tesla owners just waiting over an hour for their turn at the stall.

As I've stated before, I hope Tesla succeeds but I'm not ready to play lab rat with my $100K+ cash.

MBNUT1

Wish I could afford either. The Tesla is a compelling vehicle

Terminator2029

A slightly different perspective: after a quick test-drive of Tesla P85+, a friend of mine (mid-30s) has experienced a major car sickness that he has never had before in his life. He was sitting on the back seat.

From official sources: Car (motion) sickness is the results from your body sensing a discrepancy between what you see and what you feel.

The above statement truly depicts my personal opinion on Tesla.

Quadcammer

Is this gonna be another thread where an electric car fan/owner tries to convince us all why the tesla is the better choice than the s-class?

Benzfooled

I see the similarity between the two cars as price point alone. As been covered, with the Tesla, one is paying a premium for the battery technology and the freedom from the gas pump. Beyond that, quality of materials and overall fit and finish is a step down from the S class.

drsaab

I do hope the Electronics are more reliable than the wear / tear components of a gas engine. We will not know for a bit. The Autopilot is as good now as DTR+ in city except steering assist. So that is true for today, DTR+ is better than Autopilot. The Battery temperature regulation system in the Tesla is supposed to be phenomenal. Max loss has been 4% range in 100k miles yet.


Yep, You can not track the Tesla. You can run the hell out of it on any road in the US since we are limited to lower max speeds. Interior of MB is better.

The Dual Drive models seem to be amazing at handling and snow since the traction control is instant because it is electric and instant response to the axle.

Elon is taking risks. Gigafactory etc. But he has created the first Car company in USA in like 50 years. So he is slowly acheiving some of his remarkable goals. I am in the Northeast and have not yet heard / experienced any wait time issues on chargers up here. They do upgrade the car randomly and rapidly without waiting for model years. It makes a lot happy and pisses off some.


I have heard this from the P85D because it pulls 0-30 in like a second and is 1.3G of force. Not from the P85+ and not from the driver because they are in control and know what they are attempting. No difference than some roller coasters that launch you without expecting it.

I guess you have not read the posts above. There is Interesting discussion on both sides. In the 100k + category there should be some pretty smart buyers I assume.

Synopsis is MB has way better interior, more tried and tested, A safer bet, Better Stereo, more luxury.

Tesla in my opinion Drives better/smoother, looks more modern, has more tech that is up-gradable, is cheaper to run (for at least a 10 year life span).

Explanation of why it is better for "ME" was already done above in the other posts already.

I do not have any friends/acquaintances with this $ value car so that is why I was asking opinions of ppl who have driven / owned wither of these models. Peace out.

Munich77

drsaab I would love to see some pictures of your Tesla .

drsaab

Driveway



Shows pearl white at night



After tinting Windows

I got a new 2015 C Class loaner while servicing my E350 BT today. 2000 miles on that car, Power steering went out! They had to come pick it back up.

As far as those that say its like a mini S class.. not even close. I don't think it drives as well or is as quiet as my W212 either. Tranny kept looking for a gear and was roughly shifting. It was a C300 4matic.

C280 Sport

I have driven the Tesla and the 222 S Class. I would take the S Class all the time every time. Only thing the Tesla has over the MB in my opinion is performance. However, many cars are faster then the S so who really cares. The interior is some of the worst I have ever seen in the Tesla. It also is not even a luxury car to me nor does it look, feel or drive like one. Other then the price tag I do not even see how it is comparable to the S Class. They are very different cars for very different people I feel.