Heisenberg

So I was taking a look at the new C Class Coupe (in C63S form) and thought maybe some others might find the size comparison interesting, so I am posting it here. Figures were taken from the eBrochures that can be downloaded from the Mercedes-Benz UK site, which seems to be updated much quicker than the USA site. Their online configurators reflect the expected changes for MY17 including the cabriolet.

Obviously the C and S coupes are completely different beasts. I'm considering a C63 coupe on a 24 mo lease, anticipating the refresh of the C217 in MY18-19. While I expect the C217 exterior changes to be minor tweaks of the bumper, headlights, trim pieces, etc., changes to the guts of the car will likely be substantial with new high speed data bus, the unified 1920x720 screens running the new COMAND with much more flexibility and better menu structure, and presumably the M176 with 600+ hp as in the E63S coupled with the 9-speed transmission.

Fully loaded, a C63S will be less than half of the price of the S63. It's M176 is good for over 600hp with an aftermarket tune $3500 or less. And it is a much lighter car. C class is of course noticeably smaller although it might just be large enough for my needs (occasional use of rear seats by teenage daughters). I expect the ride quality and overall 'luxury' to be significantly inferior, though... On the outside, the C217 certainly is more beautiful, but the C205 is attractive too.

I absolutely realize that something new and better is always right around the corner, but if I'm going to buy outright a ~ $200k car (MSRP on my S63 config about $204k) that is guaranteed to tank in value, I'd rather do it at the start of a new cycle where I won't be tempted to trade it in in 2-3 years. Leasing a S63 makes no sense for me, as I cannot claim it as a business expense and the MBF lease deals completely suck based on low residuals < 50% @ 36 mo and MF > 5%. Makes more sense to buy it for cash or partially finance at near 2%. BMW, Audi, and Porsche lease deals are far more tempting, although I don't particularly want anything they offer. I am watching MY15/16 resales of S63 and S65 coupes, too... given the lack of major changes, buying a pre-owned makes more sense than buying new. But the chance of getting the exact configuration/color I want is close to zero.

Anyway sorry for rambling... here are the size schematics of the C217 and C205.

WSH

No one "needs" an S65 or S63....

If short of cash, would just 24mo lease cheapest new C?300 until had cash to comfortably 24mo lease a new 65

IMO, massive difference 65 vs 63 in safety/reliability/smoothness (crap MCT of 63) and aesthetics (crap leather of 63 interior), worth every penny of delta

Would argue a 2yr leased 65 is best value car on planet incl vs any other MB (incl C?300) or any $1MM Fiat or VW w/their dubious, inept safety engineering

Heisenberg

It's not about being short of cash. Unlike some here, I tend to keep cars I purchase outright for a long time; I just don't like getting raped on resale value after just 1-2 years, particularly after paying 8% in sales tax. It's easier to accept the depreciation after driving it for 4-5 years. I only leased my CLS63 because I knew I wanted to move into a S Coupe in a couple years.

So you think a 2yr S65 lease is the best car value on the planet ? Maybe you were being facetious, if not you must not be on planet Earth... Agree it is a fantastic car but that lease is around $5,000 a month; $120,000 is a lot to rent one for two years, don't you think ?

As far as differences between the S63 and S65, here are my thoughts:

• Interior leather. It's absolutely identical, assuming one opts for the designo Exclusive in the S63. I don't think I've seen a single S63 without it, at least in the USA. Only difference is the leather roofliner in the S65 versus alcantara in the S63. Alcantara is more expensive than than leather, for what that's worth.
  
• Transmission. I would not say the MCT is crap, but it is a weak aspect of the car for sure. It has improved it over the years, with exception of the stalling issue, definitely a safety concern, but that has now been resolved. The 7sp in the S65 is nothing special, it's a basic automatic tranny. Maybe new 9sp transmissions will be a big improvement, although if it is just more gears probably not.
  
• Suspension & Drivetrain. Airmatic/4MATIC versus ABC-MBC/RWD. So here it depends on if one needs or wants all wheel drive. I don't need it here in the desert, but still like having all wheels driven as it helps traction. ABC-MBC/4MATIC would be ideal if they weren't mutually exclusive. Both ABC and Airmatic are notoriously unreliable out of warranty; Airmatic is cheaper to fix with availability of Arnott struts.
  
• Engine. Both the V8 and V12 are fantastic powerplants. Sure I would prefer the 12 cylinder, even with its older technology and higher fuel consumption, as it is more powerful and equally important has inherently superior balance and a better exhaust note thanks to firing order. But the S63 is still faster to at least 60mph, because of the weight savings and particularly 4MATIC.
  
• Trim. Satin versus glossy silver trim, conjoined versus separated tailpipes, all black versus chrome accent grilles. 16/5 spoke wheels. Badging. Nothing at all substantive here, the cars look exactly the same except for these minor differences. Overall I do prefer the S65 styling elements though.
  
• Options. Several options on the S63 are standard in the S65. As built my configuration is $258,575 for an S65 and $205,835 for an S63, identically configured except for omitting the 'warmth and comfort package' which I don't need here in Arizona. So it is about $53,000 less.

I am watching pre-owned S65 Coupes. There are few low mileage 2015 available for as low as $168,000. We will see if one with a color combo I like becomes available

COOPERDB

`


All of post #1 has been in my thought process

And the last paragraph is spot on

Post #2 is correct

Mine would have fewer options than yours

I want CCB's and white metallic


I was really hoping that the new 9 speed

would be in this MY

Maybe we will see the DOG released this coming week


Thank-You
D.B.


`

Sanch

The standard c205 dimensions (attached) are not the same as the AMG model.

The correct width for the AMG is 1877mm and the length 4750mm - Slightly longer and wider than the standard models... I know this as I've placed an order and am eagerly awaiting delivery.


DB - The 9 speed would be great, but I have a feeling this will only be seen in the brand new models being released like the w213 e class etc...

Heisenberg

Only the S550 models get the 9sp for MY17.

Suspect the S63 will get it along with the M176 for MY18/19... doesn't seem like AMG is interested in retrofitting it on M157 vehicles, even though it should handle the torque per specification.

I find the 7sp MCT in my CLS63 decent, if not great. It's smooth in C and shifts fast in S/S+/M. And the race start works well, too bad this feature was omitted on the S63. Despite AMG massaging 600+ hp out of the M176, I still think the M157 is as least as good an engine for the 4,700+ lb S63, as it is capable of higher HP and particularly TQ, albeit with an aftermarket tune.

I also think the current S Coupe exterior is just about perfect, there is really nothing I want to see changed. On the inside, I was hoping it would get the W213's more seamless 1920x720 displays and new COMAND software, which allows some configuration of the instrument display and looks to have much improved menu structure. But I guess there is always some hope they will allow a COMAND update to the existing models, once the W213 is released.

RJC

I for one dislike the flimsy column mounted shifter...a nice sport type console mounted one would be much more befitting the coupe; sedan not so much. In addition to our '16 S coupe, we just bought a '17 Audi Q7 (with 21's...only way it looks good), it not only has a nice console placed touch pad but a great looking console shifter.

Some MB vehicles already have the 9G...the new GLE Coupe 450 and the new GLC. Several people on the new GLC forum are reporting problems with the 9G and I experienced heavy occasional clunking during shifting when we tested the GLE coupe when it first debuted.

I hope MB gets the 9G right (and soon) in both AMG and non AMG applications, as it was touted by MB to be a very smooth shifting trans.

jbattan

I spoke to the product manager for the 9G – Tronic at the Frankfurt auto show last year. He said that it usually takes the AMG folks about 2 to 3 years to incorporate new transmissions into their products. The 9G – Tronic can support 1000 Nm of torque, so that's plenty for all of the existing engines.

The MCT is the ONLY thing keeping me from ordering an S 63 Cab.

Heisenberg

I just looked at the Q7 interior. Wow it is nice... looked at a Q7 two years ago for my wife and it was badly out of date, they did a good job on the redo.

Agree 100% about the column shifter. Would much prefer it on the console (like the AMG GT or CLS) than the steering column, and there is plenty of room for it. Also wish the column shift paddles were fixed to the steering column so they did not rotate with the wheel, rather than atached to the wheel itself.