enjracing

hey guys. I am about to pull the trigger on a 2005-2007 sl500, but the ABC failure propensity is really freaking me out, and none of the 3rd-party warranty co's that I've researched will cover that. with that said, did merc fix the issue more on the 06-07's, or they just as prone to leaking and overall failure? also, what can I check for when buying the car that it has been fixed already under factory warranty, or if it is a ticking time-bomb type of deal. on average, what kind of mileage are they starting to fail? thanks for any help.

funymuny

Fwiw...about the 3rd party warranties, I would have expected that buying an exclusionary policy would cover the ABC system/components. Granted, the exclusionary contracts are typically the most expensive. Maybe I am missing the boat on that.

About the ABC components...I went through some anxiety when I purchased my 2004. Honestly, I bought the car, it had a lot of maintenance/repair records, but I knew nothing of the ABC system. I went through a period where I wanted to sell it to avoid a problem. It had sagging in the front, sometimes. I flushed and changed filter. Not much change, in fact it was worse for a few days (which I understand is common) but then not much. Sagging is not so much a problem itself but is typically indicative of some leakage in the valve block. Anyway, I finally read enough to understand the basics of the system and stopped being concerned about it. It's a hydraulic system. Hydraulic systems have been reliably used for decades in airplanes, jets, construction equipment, etc. They do require maintenance.

I wound up selling my 2004 and purchased a 2011. I'm not sure I would agree with the statement that the ABC systems, statistically, are prone to leaking and overall failure. Those cases are definitely out there. Struts can sweat/leak. Hoses can go for sure. From my limited reading I do not understand that there were any complete redesigns of the system for the years you mentioned, or even later. I believe in the R231 (2013???) they began to make ABC optional.

For me, I love the car so got another one. It is still under factory warranty and CPO will follow that. Have not decided what I will do for coverage beyond that...may roll the dice. Realizing this comment is unsolicited please understand it is well-intended. If a few thousand dollar repair bill is a problem, a used 230 may not be the car to look at buying...because that is a possibility. Even with some DIY skills and a good indy. It was not my experience. Personally, I believe the ABC tragedies are overstated when considered against overall production. But it is mechanical so things can happen. Maintenance seems to be the friend of the ABC system.

Below is what I believe to be a great write-up of the ABC system and its components. Best of luck...Mark

http://mercedes-abc-drive-carefully....70707255917117

enjracing

thanks for the detailed reply, mark. I agree with what you said and will take it all into consideration. tnx!

funymuny

Most welcome. Another point...the valve blocks can be reconditioned, which to me means opened up, cleaned out and o-rings replaced. Lots of info exists on that as well but I paid a fellow in Texas to do it ($300 plus shipping) since he claimed he had done many without any resulting problems. The sagging in the front stopped after he reconditioned it, which supports the contention that sagging after engine shut-off is a slightly leaking valve/o-ring. The accumulators (particularly the large ones) are fairly easy to replace. Having said that I tried to remove the rear one and simply could not access one nut/fitting on the block to remove a hose so I stopped. Was not having a problem in the rear anyway...I was just in the mode to do it since I had the front block/accumulator off. I believe the way to do the rear is to get the tool to separate the hoses at the quick disconnects, although some have commented they were able to remove (and replace) the block/accumulator in the rear.

My point is that the major components of the ABC lend themselves to some DIY efforts, thus not so expensive. Getting into the pump/struts/sensors is probably above what I would want to tackle...on a car I really care about/not just a project car. Best of luck...Mark

enjracing

yes, seems like some of it can be a DIY venture.


the car that i'm looking at is a 2006 with 29,000 miles. hopefully, it was well taken care of and has no impending doom as far as the ABC goes.

funymuny

Yes, hopefully. I hope the same about the 2011 I recently bought that had under 22k miles. In the end we can never really know but one school of though about these low mileage cars is they have not been driven enough for the problems to show themselves. Some can say higher mileage cars have had the problems repaired. All kinds of opinions out there. I still stand by my original comments...I believe the propensity of the ABC system to be a big problem is overblown. They are complicated cars so things can go wrong. Maintenance is your friend. But they are fun to drive and they offer some pride of ownership, imho. I believe maintenance records are key, although at 26k miles, there may not have been much. A Service A and B but if other work was performed or issues researched would definitely be nice to know. Just a thought...and I offer this as I have lived the evolution in my like of the SL...consider going one model year higher for the larger engine...550. The additional 85 or so hp really doesn't mean anything with normal driving but I know that was one of the motivating factors for my upgrade. Either way, you will enjoy the car. If something happens just address it and move on. Buy it right and feel good about it. It may cost some more money and it may not. That's just part of the deal with these. Mark

enjracing

yes, that is def a way to look at it. bottom line....it's a fingers crossed kinda deal to some extent.


I wonder though what the percentage of the cars have experienced abc failure. I wonder if it's as low as 5%, or as high as maybe 40%? I guess there is no way of getting that info.

BlownV8

I would say 99.9% by the time an ABC equipped car hits 80,000 miles that it will have some ABC failure. Many have issues much earlier. Probably 50% or more will have an ABC related issue before 60k miles.

It is an absolute pain in the ***. I would not own an ABC equipped Mercedes out of warranty ever again. Don't take it lightly because it will fail and it is always at the worst possible time.

enjracing

bloody hell. what about this....if the car has under 30k on the clock and has been well card for, would it be a safe bet to get as I won't be keeping it more than for 2 years max and won't put more than another 30k on the clock (totaling 60k miles when I sell it).

funymuny

I cannot imagine there are stats/facts to support that statement. But I am guessing.

Following is an article/thread from a German company that repairs ABC suspensions/components. According to them it is all about maintenance with the ABC system. They claim to have a car with all original ABC components that has 260,000 miles. They changed the ABC fluid/filter every 20,000 miles. Further into the thread there is a translated version. A good read I believe.

https://mbworld.org/forums/sl55-amg-...t-article.html

BlownV8

It's the hydraulic hoses that burst. Those take out the pump if it is driven for more than a few minutes. The small bits of metal then contaminate the control blocks and orifices. I was on my third pump and umpteenth host by 90k miles. BS about the maintenance. Mine was maintained to the hilt. Still failed.

Maybe the systems don't do so well I the V12's where the engine bay is scorching hot. That may have something to do with more frequent failure. Every time I turned around it was something else going out on the ABC. Like I said, never again out of warranty will I own an ABC equipped MB.

I do believe that changing the fluid and filter yearly as well as all the rubber hydraulic hoses every 50k should be part of a scheduled maintenance plan on any V12 equipped MB with ABC. However, just having fresh fluid will not save you from other ABC failures. It will definitely help.

funymuny

They are complex machines, no question. Any of the active suspensions are more prone to problems; maybe the MB hydraulic suspension more prone than most. Dunno. Yep, dry pumps are not good. One way I looked at it when I bought my 2004 was for $20k give or take that is a lot of car. $100k new. Yeah, I know that $100k is inflated, most lease, never buy, etc. But either way, it is a way cool car and very expensive. If I had spent $5k or so on the suspension I'd still have a way cool car for $25k. There is a point I wouldn't feel very good about putting money into it but on the flipside, once the problem is resolved it's good for a long time. I wouldn't throw $5k out the window for fun but I have it stashed in my mattress so I wouldn't miss it.

BlownV8

Do yourself a favor and do the coil over conversion.

m-svt-amg

Jusr finished my abc rebuild. It was rough, especially because i replaced all 4 struts (3 were leaking and the 4th was a might as well), replaced all accumulators, and had to replace one of the valve block assemblies after rebuilding both due to a bad solenoid.

That said, parts totalled under 4k sourcing them myself instead of from a dealer. Dealer would have charged over 5k for just the struts lol.

Labor was killer... i didnt have the tools for all that.

In my research, i found there is an updated abc control module that pulses rather than shuts off when the car idles, presumably keeping the valves and seals from sticking.

There is also an updated filter to prevent debris from dominoing into other parts of the system. (A magnetic filter is also available, but i would assume this is specifically for pump failure, and the micron filter should be used as well for other grime)

ABC failures seem to be from lack of use, rather than overuse from what ive been able to find. I know thats true in my case.

funymuny

Excellent point...re lack of use versus overuse. I have heard the same, generally, regarding hydraulic systems and specifically from my indy who has a CL with the ABC. He said the best thing you can do to reduce ABC problems is drive the cars. Also he commented that when sitting at a light cycle ride height a few times. Anything to keep all the pieces moving and lubricated.

m-svt-amg

Right!

Im still considering updating the abc control module. Should be between 800 and 1200.

The updated unit pulsing at idle sounds like mercedes knew valves sticking was the primary cause of failure. Overpressurizes the system until it springs a leak... or 10.

BlownV8

I drove mine more than 20k miles per year so not driving it isn't an issue either. It!s a function of time, mileage, and heat that destroys the hoses and other components. There really is no sweet spot for driving or not driving the car. It's going to fail sooner or later. Best you can do is change the fluid and filters, at least, once a year and all rubber hoses every 5 years or 50k miles to ensure you limit your failures.

ABC is the only thing that makes these cars unreliable. Take that out and you have a pretty solid car. The members that removed ABC have been very happy.

Tommyboy928

on my 2004 front collapsed,, had big leak 60 k km, to solve this, i got some superstuff to seal the leak from www.icelube.net and car does not leak or have no issues, this is more than 4 years ago,i sold car 2 years ago, and i talked with new owner ,and he has no issues still with abc. on the new 2007 that has upgraded ABC system i added some teflon addetive in ABC and powersteering oil to prevent any issue in future, plus engine treatment, gerbox, and aft. can higly recommend all this stuff, i used on 4 SL i own so far sisne year 2000, and all this cars ,i been driven them like i stolen them. Not changed ,or overhaul any moving parts on any off them.

TTtodd

Bloody hell indeed !!
I recently purchased a 30k car and was thinking the same thing. On my way home from the purchase the ABC light came on.
Short story is I just finished installing a new sweating expansion hose and replaced the others in front while I was in there. Also replaced the right rear strut as well as the spring arm bushings. All on a 30k mile car that appeared to be in perfect condition. Oh well, it is in perfect condition now.

On the upside I used genuine MB hoses. MB must have upgraded the hoses as the new ones look much more robust than the ones I took off.

F1BHP

It sounds like the answer to the original question is probably yes a newer car will be more reliable as improvements to the control unit, filter and hoses have been made over the years. I am guessing some others also. What we do not know however is what year models were these improvements made.
I have not seen any facelift model cars report any issues so I must assume that the improvements have worked or these cars have not done significant mileage yet.

BlownV8

No, that is not a good assumption. In 2003, the owners were saying mine is more reliable than the 2000 model until theirs starting failing. In 2005, the owners were saying their car is more reliable than the 2003 models until theirs started to fail. In ........ I think you get the picture. Every new owner thought their ABC was more reliable than the previous model. It's a function of heat, time, and mileage. They will all have the same issues.

F1BHP

Agreed, hence the last part of my post. We will have to wait and see if the improvements on the facelift will work.

Gpgtp

I have an 04, 66k miles, im the second owner (first owned it till feb. this year), car was maintained at the same dealership since day 1 and I just got done replacing the abc pump and 2 accumulators. first had totally failed.