Ekselent

As for the intakes and exhaust, that was my project last winter. I was looking for a custom 3 inch exhaust system for an SL65 and I couldn't find anything. The most I found was downpipes from Kleemann, Speedriven, and Supersprint and mufflers from Meisershaft, Renntech, and there was prob a few more. So instead of just buying some down pipes from one company and mufflers from another with no mid section I had my shop do a custom 3 inch mandrel bent exhaust from the turbos all the way to the tips




The flange from the existing exhaust was hacked off and bored so it could fit the 3 inch piping. As it goes down the mid section at the end you can see the dual electric exhaust cutouts. That way instead of driving with no mufflers I could open and close the valves for how loud I wanted the car. Finally as it goes to the high flow mufflers and out the stock exhaust tips. The exhaust system have 3 addition V bands one where the downpipes meet the mid section, one where the mid section meets the cutouts, and one where the cutouts meet the lower section.

I have few questions....
-Are those mufflers Dynomax race bullet mufflers 24215?
-I have order them. Now I have muffler delete.How have the sound changed after you install them?
I found this clip
http://www.dynomax.com/sounds-of-dyn...bullet-muffler

Thank you.
Juha

Thericker

A lots to be gained w/these heat monsters in cool air w/negative DA, as far as I know EVERY RECORD on near stock 65's IE ecu/tcu drag rads... Has been in Negative DA w/cool air etc... Not to take ANYTHING AWAY from your 10.99 but I'll bet $1,000.00 bux if it was the reverse and you ran in Posistive +400 DA @ higher Ambient temps that 10.99 just wouldn't be... These v12 turbos require cool dry air @ or near Sea Level on a sticky good hooking track or, a similarly modded 65 would be in the low 11's @ best

Speedriven1

Seeing our name tossed around a lot in this thread so here is some clarification on the numbers aspect. This is base boost on pump gas.



For various reasons, not all information is available to the general public but you should get a pretty good idea of what is going on if you know how to read these.

As previously stated, Jody's runs were done on pump gas 5+ years ago and a lot has changed since then.

r_martin126

Very nice looking base run. Is boost tapering down to ~17psi at redline on the higher boost runs also?

euphoriaDSM

Might be a dumb question but I come from dsm's and supras but why is everyone staying around the 20-25psi range? I'm sure the car can handle 30+psi long before it hits any fuel cut. Do the turbos not generate any more power from the 25psi range?


Also wanted to point out that the car pictured with the front mount cai isn't a sl. Our hood latches are right in the middle of the pathway where piping would run making it much more of a pain to do.

Thericker

I know Jody saw 700 whp on hi octane he told me... I was more doubting V12ttEnthusiast being able to gain ANYTHING CLOSE TO 830-840 whp even on q16 w/all his port/polish etc mods & 1 off intercooler setup etc.. no Doubt if Zax63's S65 build ran in colder weather on 100-109 he'd of made 700 whp.. Per Zax63's post when build was finished he noted pump 93 got him..
Ths was w/your latest ECU/TCU w/everything but trunk res.. It was Done in May of 2014 I think race gas is a must, as Zax63build had a superior CAI maybe the missing trunk reservoir full off ice? not trying to discredit your exceptional builds, I think every 65/600 just doesn't have the same potential depending on mileage etc..

This is what brought my interest further into V12ttenthusiasts beyond lofty expectations..

AMG-Driver

When you look at the tiny little blades and housings from the stock turbos, this should answer your question. And second with 6.0 Liter displacement you have a LOT of air being used to build up boost efficiently...

@Speedriven

Thanks for the Dyno-Graph. Is the Graph with billets, stock turbine housing and Intake, Coolers etc. in a 65 or base boost in a GT30-Headers-Turbo-Car ?

euphoriaDSM

That does not answer my question at all.

AMG-Driver

When you come from Supras, you should know a lot about turbo sizes, Turbo efficiency, housings and that more boost sometimes means not more power..

There is also another reason why we don't see more than aprox.22 PSI, but I don't want to go into more details. This is the tuners part to figure out...

ChrisTinaBruce

Thanks for sharing the build. Sweet setup.

carlsturm

You'll need to update your engine plate. You're taking this engine beyond AMG's one man one engine to at least two men one engine

This is one of the most enjoyable posts to follow.

BmwBob335

Do you have an eta on completion? And who is doing the work? I'm Curious how it will run. Any day we will get snow and car will either go to storage or I will send it for some work. Still tossing around what tuner and what route to go.

V12TTenthusiast

Sorry I've been sick this past week (not sure if I caught something from all the people over thanksgiving or during the AMG meetup in Rockvile MD)

I got an email from the MB dealer in Kansas that I ordered my parts from, looks like all the parts from Germany are in and all the parts will be here Monday. After that shouldn't be long, only thing left is finishing fabbing up the top mount inter coolers and finish up any work left on the turbo. The inlet where the intake and the turbo meets looks like is gonna be hacked off and fitted with a larger inlet pipe. As for the other pipe where the air exits into the TB, my tuner is see if there is any benefit in making that tiny pipe larger or not, problem that could arise is loss in velocity.







I picked up my old blades last week, they are 2.5 inches in diameter. As you can see from the new billet wheels that come up all the way to the top are about 1 CM taller then the OEM cast wheels and the blades are redesigned.

But now all the parts are here looks like it will be done asap. Looks like the turbos on an R230 V12 might also wiggle out of the sub frame like they do on the S/CL's, my tuner is gonna see if it possible. If it is, it should save people a lot more time to do the turbo swap then the suggested 20 hr book time for the job.

V12TTenthusiast

Honesty I have no idea what mufflers they are I had my tuner just pick out what ever he thought best and would fit my car, but I'll ask him tomorrow and let you know, but im sure there prob just any old generic high flow mufflers. As for the sound it has a nice growl still and no drone with the high flow mufflers and no cats but it doesn't have as a loud sound as no mufflers and no cats when you hit the redline. That's why I did the dual electric cut outs so I could toggle the sound.

When the cutouts are open the car is very loud esp when car shifts after the redline when it makes loud popping sounds, but when you have a headache and you don't want any drone at 40-50 mph then cutouts are nice to have to have the exhaust flowing back to the high flow mufflers.

If you want the best of both worlds and control the sound, pay an additional 350-450 for cutouts and you can fit them in the midsection no problem. You can either opt for remote control or put a toggle switch in the car. I put mine above the OBD II port.

pjdough

Great read, thanks to all! Keep us posted and GL with the improvements...

CafeRacer87

Very cool build, subscribed. GL!

V12Godspeed

Subscribed! Lets see what the results are, any way you put it you will not be where you started, something has to come out of it.

I am dropping my motor in January and will be finally installing the Black series turbos. Would be nice to see what they make.

fxrs1955

Even though I drive a 55 I've been following this, the results should be exceptional.

Ekselent

Thank you.
My Dynomax mufflers arrive today.

Regarding your engine uppgrade.
I understand fully why you're doing it this way . Of course the bigger turbos make more power for sure but I have not read or seen anybody else who have do it this way. No facts... only assumptions.
If you don't get enough of power you need only install bigger turbos and I'm 100% sure you gone get more power vs who install only the bigger turbos because you already have the head work done....
Good luck

Juha

V12TTenthusiast

I found out the mufflers that are used are just universal Borla Mufflers with a 3 inch inlet for the exhaust piping and a 2.5 inch outlet for the tips. Engine gets reassembled starting Monday of next week, and mostly likely the custom top mount intercoolers the end of following due to Christmas break. After that all that's left is tuning.

I found a good deal on some spare heads so I might start doing more aggressive work on the other pair throughout the year. I'm even after putting 30k of miles during my 2 years of ownership I'm still at 63k miles which is a lot imo for mix city/highway driving in Washington D.C area. Four months of not driving my car was bad enough and I'll prob have to keep it away for another 2 more months while its winter here, so I have time to put my body kit on.

But as for a big turbo kit I feel in all honesty that's all year project. It's one thing to fab up the kit but most of the work is tuning. From what I've seen from a few friends that have crazy custom turbo/supercharger kits, tuning can take around 1-2 years easily. Usually shops won't spend all there time tuning a car for several hours at a time. From what I've seen there will be times every 1-2 weeks where hours are put into the tune, but the shop conducting the work usually has to keep working on other cars in the shop that they can bang out quick to keep themselves in business. Furthermore if you don't live near a major tuner your either left with the option of shipping the car off, or going through a local shop that is a dealer for a tuning company, but can take longer to tune since that all depends on both shops.

At 63kish miles I want to put another 30-40 miles on it before I replace it with another performance car as my daily while I can let my current car sit as long as it needs to. Plus I figured with all the mods I'm doing now there could be a 50/50 chance I'm gonna have the transmission bust on me at some point *knock on wood* and do a rebuilt transmission. If I did a big turbo kit now, then no question the transmission needs to be rebuilt. Finally idk how much turbo lag is in a big turbo kit and I do a lot of my work in the city so I'd prob be in a car jerking all over the place. For now I want something that has good power as well as daily drive-ability, once I get a replacement, then i'll do a crazy big turbo kit, without the need to drive it since I have something else for my performance needs.

Ekselent

Somebody else have also upgrade the V12 engine.. 860 hp..... and maybe 1000 hp next

here is the Facebook
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Merce...67679540088587

Thericker

Edit: I didn't note his 0-200km @ 10.62 that's FAST.. & 0-270km @ 19.89.. This S600 is hauling D ***...Deff has the 860 HP.. Those tires were obviously toasted & 0-100km is very hard to hook.. let alone they still ran a more than respectable #...

Ekselent

Here you can read a little more about the specs this engine have......
I'm little bit confused... they use OEM turbos. Modified in Germany.
I think this power level is enough for me. Must try to find out which company in Germany have made this turbo upgrade.

http://totalcarmagazine.com/classica...es-benz_ko860/

Thericker

Great stuff! thnx for sharring... Though bulk of hp/tq in this swap is they utilized a 65 engine vs 600.. Then went to town.. Marcin/Speedriven MORE THAN PROVED the internals are completely fine w/MUCH, MUCH, higher rwhp/tq Speedriven pushed a true 850 rwhp 970 rwtq, that equals 1,036 BHP nearly 1200 Crank torque, NO engine component failure whatsoever (though rebuilt tranns is obvious)

Very interesting they went w/Air to Air Intercooler vs OEM Air to Water... So basically Billet Turbo swap vs in their vid they show giant Aftermarket snails.. They're obviously quoting Crank hp/tq #'s which = a very healthy 705 rwhp.. Wish they would've gone Air to Water IC's they left a ton of hp/tq on table IE further cooling Intake air would've added 50+ whp easily... I'm certain their trick true Ram-Air CAI added to the 700+ rwhp..


Most BRILLIANT part of this build!!!! Marcin, what about this Flux Capacitor ECU/ESP Bypass gig? Make your OWN version & then we can see truly wicked 1000-1500 whp when coupled to Speedriven gt30-35 turbo builds. You noted ECU/ESP freaks out when going North of 850 rwhp.. (Sounds better than Dyno Mode or line-lock etc? This is extremely interesting no? Or is your problem MORE related to JUST ECU itself? I want a "Skull Button!" damnit! I'd have 1000-1500 WHP etched into it! If Marcin, could make this work??

Entire article on this build was a pleasure to read, ANY contact phn # etc for this guy? His writing was the Cherry on top of this build.. Death shove from back lol.. Soundtrack from Jurassic park etc etc pure gems...

Just found this vid... Mercedes KO 860 vs Lamborghini and Porsche accele…:





Sent from my Samsung Galaxy Tab®|PRO

AMG-Driver

Interesting Built! I posted this car a while ago over in *********...(another forum)

What is most impressive to me is, to couple an M275 with the "can bus" from the old S-Class and to make everything running good, electronically...

As for the horsepower output, o.k. the say 860 Crank-HP. It would be interesting to see on which dyno, because I am not a fan of comparing speedo videos. We don't know the calibration of the Speedo in that car...

I know Crank-Power is not so important in U.S.-Tuning. But for us in Germany it is, because we use different dynos etc.

Real 860 Crank-HP is more in the 740-750 WHP Range than 705 RWP. And I doubt that this is possible with the original Turbo housing and stock headers. No doubt the car is fast, but I doubt this Crank-HP with the stock Turbine Housing and stock headers. If, than only with the Black Series Turbine Housings (with changed internals).

I know everyone here calculate always 18% losses from the drivetrain, but there is a mistake in this calculation. Luke, the owner of Renntech Germany explained it to me and you can trust me, he knows his stuff.

When a stock SL65 has factory rating 612 Crank-HP (which I found out to be true in different cars) this is approx.500-505 RWP. o.k. so approx.18% drivetrain loss. Then you tune your car.

The losses in the gearbox rise also with the tuning, BUT BY FAR NOT SO MUCH AS THE Horsepower RISES!!! This is the important point. The losses nearly stay in the range they were measured with the stock car. The losses are also nearly lets say 100-120 HP in the 860 Crank HP Car. So this relates to lets say 740-750 whp.in this S Class. I cannot explain it better in my "bad english in the morning", but I hope it is understandable.

O.K. and know I am curious, what SET-UP they want to come up with to get over 1000 HP. I wish them good luck!!