When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.
why does a guy that drives a w204 c63 go specifically to the GT forum and call the GT the so called "flagship"?
I think that those of us that own the car are obsessing about this **** far less than those that do not own it. Personally, I'm so busy making money, I rarely drive my car. Nonetheless, I would still like to buy yet another sports car that I probably won't drive that often. lol
While I tend to agree that the AMG badge should remain on top of the line models, I believe MB is using the Porsche playbook.
Everyone screamed bloody murder when Porsche came up with the Boxster, Cayman, Panamera,Cayenne and Macan. However the popularity of those models and the huge profits allow Porsche to invest R&D and create the 911 variants and the 918 as there is not enough people buying 911s to sustain it.
I agree with you and have given up on all other models in the AMG lineup. I will never buy another, but was hoping that they wouldn't destroy the GT with the 43 if that happens.
I have my dealers first GTBS allocation was hoping that it just might hold its value, but the way things are going that doesn't look good.
As far as porsche, AMG has nothing to compare with them. My 17 911 turbo s is the best all around sports car I've ever owned!
Porsche continues to produce cars that hold and/or exceed msrp in a very short time.
That isn't my opinion it's just the facts like it or not.
I just don't think that a v6 c class with a c43 badge on it makes the AMG GT any less special. The C43 only bothered me when I was a w205 c63s driver.
If AMG came out with a GT43 it would use new inline 6 turbo they just developed and probably deliver 400 hp and cost over 90k with a few options. So what?
I agree with you and have given up on all other models in the AMG lineup. I will never buy another, but was hoping that they wouldn't destroy the GT with the 43 if that happens.
I have my dealers first GTBS allocation was hoping that it just might hold its value, but the way things are going that doesn't look good.
As far as porsche, AMG has nothing to compare with them. My 17 911 turbo s is the best all around sports car I've ever owned!
Porsche continues to produce cars that hold and/or exceed msrp in a very short time.
That isn't my opinion it's just the facts like it or not.
911s and 911 Turbos are outstanding cars. They have evolved over decades. I have owned Porsches before and will probably own them again. I just don't see what all the *****ing is about.
While I tend to agree that the AMG badge should remain on top of the line models, I believe MB is using the Porsche playbook.
Everyone screamed bloody murder when Porsche came up with the Boxster, Cayman, Panamera,Cayenne and Macan. However the popularity of those models and the huge profits allow Porsche to invest R&D and create the 911 variants and the 918 as there is not enough people buying 911s to sustain it.
The big difference here is that Porsche added model cars and not a Turbo, Turbo-S at 60K.
Porsche was a brand that made one model car
and MB made many.
Comparing AMG with Porsche is comparing apples to oranges.
Porsche did not need to acquire 9ff, for example, to make a true exclusive supper car, MB did and now it is nothing but an option.
When AMG's "supper" car is siting in dealerships for months and over a year, when the almost 2 times more expensive Porsche's "family" sedan (turbo< ) sits in the dealership for about an average of 26 days...
Doesn't this tell the MB-AMG approached the exclusivity/performance the wrong way? Do not get me wrong I love my E63s wagons, the 2016 is nothing but spotless. I can put my MtB and road bikes on the roof, pack all my biking gear and go biking with my girlfriend. But if Audi got off their *** on brought the RS Avant I would drop the AMG in a NY minute.
But the AMG does not compare in exclusivity feel with my 911Ts. I had a 9ff until 2010 and in 2005 when the car got dropped at 9ff instead at their dealership here in the USA, the dealer called me to tell me that the car got delivered to the WRONG person and it was going to be a delay on the delivery LOL. Talk about exclusive.
Can you imagine the most "exclusive" car that MB produces today with a moped engine? You will be able to pick up one in about a year!
IMHO, AMG and its GTs is very much like a Boxster when you compare in exclusivity. When I drove mine I only had a smile for a couple of weeks, then I saw 3 in the small island I live! and now there are over 20 of them at the different dealerships in the Seattle area with months and literally a year on the lot!
Not even the up and coming Seahawks players that have money for the first time buy a GTs.. Literally a fully optioned red GTs was "gifted" to one of them and a few weeks after, the car was sent back in a truck to the dealership with a little under 500mi in the clock! the dealership is literally 3 blocks from the stadium and he did not even want to drive the car back to the dealership. LOL
I think that a more fair assessment is comparing AMG with Lexus. I am not trolling but how I feel.
why does a guy that drives a w204 c63 go specifically to the GT forum and call the GT the so called "flagship"?
I think that those of us that own the car are obsessing about this **** far less than those that do not own it. Personally, I'm so busy making money, I rarely drive my car. Nonetheless, I would still like to buy yet another sports car that I probably won't drive that often. lol
Couldn't agree more. Including the fact that most have zero time spent driving GT.
Back to making money lol. ..,..
I just don't think that a v6 c class with a c43 badge on it makes the AMG GT any less special. The C43 only bothered me when I was a w205 c63s driver.
If AMG came out with a GT43 it would use new inline 6 turbo they just developed and probably deliver 400 hp and cost over 90k with a few options. So what?
Not to beat this to death.
When the GT came out mb/AMG said that this car would not have a 43 model. They boosted and sold this car as being designed and built completely by AMG which makes it somewhat special.
IF they make a 43 model and put in a production engine,not hand built by AMG, it will take away what made the GT special/unique.
This is just MY opinion and I'm NOT trying to force it on anyone.
I sent my message of displeasure when I spent 190k on another brand
i agree for the most part with OP about brand dilution but the AMG GTS still looks absolutely stunning. when i see one coming it doesn't resemble an SL in anyway even though in pictures it does.
for under 150k what else can you get that gives performance and presence? and don't say porsche they are a dime a dozen
i agree for the most part with OP about brand dilution but the AMG GTS still looks absolutely stunning. when i see one coming it doesn't resemble an SL in anyway even though in pictures it does.
for under 150k what else can you get that gives performance and presence? and don't say porsche they are a dime a dozen
In the beginning this was 100% true, but now look at all the models of the GT and the possibility of a 43 is just disturbing haha.
BTW have you ever asked yourself why there are so many porsche on the road. It's not because they're cheap
I must be missing something. The AMG GT4 was introduced 8 months ago and is a version designed for GT4 racing and based on the GTR.
Plus 4 door concepts have also been out within months of the introduction of the GTS. Not the actual pics naturally, but it'll be something like this...
The big difference here is that Porsche added model cars and not a Turbo, Turbo-S at 60K.
Porsche was a brand that made one model car
and MB made many.
Comparing AMG with Porsche is comparing apples to oranges.
Porsche did not need to acquire 9ff, for example, to make a true exclusive supper car, MB did and now it is nothing but an option.
When AMG's "supper" car is siting in dealerships for months and over a year, when the almost 2 times more expensive Porsche's "family" sedan (turbo< ) sits in the dealership for about an average of 26 days...
Doesn't this tell the MB-AMG approached the exclusivity/performance the wrong way? Do not get me wrong I love my E63s wagons, the 2016 is nothing but spotless. I can put my MtB and road bikes on the roof, pack all my biking gear and go biking with my girlfriend. But if Audi got off their *** on brought the RS Avant I would drop the AMG in a NY minute.
But the AMG does not compare in exclusivity feel with my 911Ts. I had a 9ff until 2010 and in 2005 when the car got dropped at 9ff instead at their dealership here in the USA, the dealer called me to tell me that the car got delivered to the WRONG person and it was going to be a delay on the delivery LOL. Talk about exclusive.
Can you imagine the most "exclusive" car that MB produces today with a moped engine? You will be able to pick up one in about a year!
IMHO, AMG and its GTs is very much like a Boxster when you compare in exclusivity. When I drove mine I only had a smile for a couple of weeks, then I saw 3 in the small island I live! and now there are over 20 of them at the different dealerships in the Seattle area with months and literally a year on the lot!
Not even the up and coming Seahawks players that have money for the first time buy a GTs.. Literally a fully optioned red GTs was "gifted" to one of them and a few weeks after, the car was sent back in a truck to the dealership with a little under 500mi in the clock! the dealership is literally 3 blocks from the stadium and he did not even want to drive the car back to the dealership. LOL
I think that a more fair assessment is comparing AMG with Lexus. I am not trolling but how I feel.
Also this Porsche talk and exclusivity is pretty tiresome.
Every company finds their own formula for success. Porsche has. Mercedes has. Porsche realized a long time ago that it couldn't survive as a company simply on 911 sales alone. It downsized in the sport car category and jumped in the SUV & sedan segment. This is where is the money comes from while the 911 continues to define the brand.
Nothing wrong with that. More power to them.
Mercedes is a much larger car company and and their customer-base is much more diverse. AMG's help the brand but do not define it. Just like BMW's M's, they are a very profitable segment that used to be strictly building-up production models. Just recently (with the SLS and now with the GT) there are independent models rolling out but all these are financed by the sale of smaller AMG's and now AMG decorated cars.
AMG is definitely growing faster than Porsche
The big difference here is that Porsche added model cars and not a Turbo, Turbo-S at 60K.
Porsche was a brand that made one model car
and MB made many.
Comparing AMG with Porsche is comparing apples to oranges.
Porsche did not need to acquire 9ff, for example, to make a true exclusive supper car, MB did and now it is nothing but an option.
When AMG's "supper" car is siting in dealerships for months and over a year, when the almost 2 times more expensive Porsche's "family" sedan (turbo< ) sits in the dealership for about an average of 26 days...
Doesn't this tell the MB-AMG approached the exclusivity/performance the wrong way? Do not get me wrong I love my E63s wagons, the 2016 is nothing but spotless. I can put my MtB and road bikes on the roof, pack all my biking gear and go biking with my girlfriend. But if Audi got off their *** on brought the RS Avant I would drop the AMG in a NY minute.
But the AMG does not compare in exclusivity feel with my 911Ts. I had a 9ff until 2010 and in 2005 when the car got dropped at 9ff instead at their dealership here in the USA, the dealer called me to tell me that the car got delivered to the WRONG person and it was going to be a delay on the delivery LOL. Talk about exclusive.
Can you imagine the most "exclusive" car that MB produces today with a moped engine? You will be able to pick up one in about a year!
IMHO, AMG and its GTs is very much like a Boxster when you compare in exclusivity. When I drove mine I only had a smile for a couple of weeks, then I saw 3 in the small island I live! and now there are over 20 of them at the different dealerships in the Seattle area with months and literally a year on the lot!
Not even the up and coming Seahawks players that have money for the first time buy a GTs.. Literally a fully optioned red GTs was "gifted" to one of them and a few weeks after, the car was sent back in a truck to the dealership with a little under 500mi in the clock! the dealership is literally 3 blocks from the stadium and he did not even want to drive the car back to the dealership. LOL
I think that a more fair assessment is comparing AMG with Lexus. I am not trolling but how I feel.
I agree with your analogy Wolfman. My concern is that if I own (luckily not with the AMG GT model), I would expect Mercedes Benz AMG to give me some "exclusivity" on the AMG GT model lineup since this is the new flagship that took over the SLS.
With Porsche at least they did not W***e-out the GT2 and GT2RS being turbo, GT3 and GT3RS being Naturally Aspirated, GT4 being mid-engine. so the GT series by Porsche delineates differences and NOT bundle them all up as the same thing over and over, unlike what what AMG GT did for the GT series. To me that is very aggravating for people spending$150K and you have a "Garden Variety" of AMG GT models as if there is no C-Class, E-Class- S-Class, CLS- Class, G- Class and more Classes.
Drive safe-PORSCHE Lover,
amgfan1
Originally Posted by Wolfman
Also this Porsche talk and exclusivity is pretty tiresome.
Every company finds their own formula for success. Porsche has. Mercedes has. Porsche realized a long time ago that it couldn't survive as a company simply on 911 sales alone. It downsized in the sport car category and jumped in the SUV & sedan segment. This is where is the money comes from while the 911 continues to define the brand.
Nothing wrong with that. More power to them.
Mercedes is a much larger car company and and their customer-base is much more diverse. AMG's help the brand but do not define it. Just like BMW's M's, they are a very profitable segment that used to be strictly building-up production models. Just recently (with the SLS and now with the GT) there are independent models rolling out but all these are financed by the sale of smaller AMG's and now AMG decorated cars.
AMG is definitely growing faster than Porsche
From the planet where I do not need to drink my own cool-aid and being able to come to terms that I bought a regular car pumped by marketing, being able to sell it and learn from my mistake.
I currently own 2 other AMGs that I am happy with, which at lest on my neck of the woods is a lot more rare than the GTs. But I have no delusion of exclusivity about them
As with everything, different expectations... and since I do not get attached to cars as they are temporary toys I do not have to pretend.
I am glad that people like their GTs, but this has nothing to do with the fact that AMG has become new "luxury" line for MB. Not much more special than a checkbox in an options list.
Any MB can be an AMG. Anyone can buy a new AMG if they have $, even if they have no record with the factory. Exclusive is when only a few chosen can and only after proving a history with the brand.
From the planet where I do not need to drink my own cool-aid and being able to come to terms that I bought a regular car pumped by marketing, being able to sell it and learn from my mistake.
I currently own 2 other AMGs that I am happy with, which at lest on my neck of the woods is a lot more rare than the GTs. But I have no delusion of exclusivity about them
As with everything, different expectations... and since I do not get attached to cars as they are temporary toys I do not have to pretend.
I am glad that people like their GTs, but this has nothing to do with the fact that AMG has become new "luxury" line for MB. Not much more special than a checkbox in an options list.
Any MB can be an AMG. Anyone can buy a new AMG if they have $, even if they have no record with the factory. Exclusive is when only a few chosen can and only after proving a history with the brand.
No cool aid here man. I don't need marketing to buy my cars like you did. I realize genuine value/performance in a car when I see it.
Guys like you need to have that "exclusive " moniker attached before you really suck down hard. The reality is the exclusivity you refer to is the real con.
No cool aid here man. I don't need marketing to buy my cars like you did. I realize genuine value/performance in a car when I see it.
Guys like you need to have that "exclusive " moniker attached before you really suck down hard. The reality is the exclusivity you refer to is the real con.
I deem you the new "emperor new clothes" winner.
you are cool I am not. makes you happy? build a wall and deny the truth... wise you are indeed
Don't you wish there was an ignore on this forum...I know I do
At least we agree that the AMG badge/name should have been kept on the "Top of the Line" models.
However when you speak of R&D in all fairness, PORSCHE did develop a great product out of the CAYMAN model. That is the "2015 EVO Car of the Year", PORSCHE GT4. The car is mid-engine (proper placement of an engine, with some great 911 engine parts). So good I added one to my stable.
Talking about many 911 models, how many models does AMG have now with the proliferation (maybe more of an anomaly) with these fungus-like growing AMG 43 models?
Drive safe-PORSCHE Lover,
amgfan1
Originally Posted by emericr
While I tend to agree that the AMG badge should remain on top of the line models, I believe MB is using the Porsche playbook.
Everyone screamed bloody murder when Porsche came up with the Boxster, Cayman, Panamera,Cayenne and Macan. However the popularity of those models and the huge profits allow Porsche to invest R&D and create the 911 variants and the 918 as there is not enough people buying 911s to sustain it.
[QUOTE=amgfan1;7065353]At least we agree that the AMG badge/name should have been kept on the "Top of the Line" models.
However when you speak of R&D in all fairness, PORSCHE did develop a great product out of the CAYMAN model. That is the "2016 EVO Car of the Year", PORSCHE GT4. The car is mid-engine (proper placement of an engine, with some great 911 engine parts). So good I added one to my stable.
Talking about many 911 models, how many models does AMG have now with the proliferation (maybe more of an anomaly) with these fungus-like growing AMG 43 models?
Drive safe-PORSCHE Lover,
amgfan1
Here we go again. "It's the 2016 EVO car of the YEAR" so it must be unique and valuable......"So good I added it to my stable ".
Theres your GT4 !!!! It's a Cayman Florence. Ugh
I deem Florence to be first runner up in the new "Emperors new Clothes " contest. Thank you for participating my dear friend. Hope to see you in Illinois winter soon.
I agree with your analogy Wolfman. My concern is that if I own (luckily not with the AMG GT model), I would expect Mercedes Benz AMG to give me some "exclusivity" on the AMG GT model lineup since this is the new flagship that took over the SLS.
With Porsche at least they did not W***e-out the GT2 and GT2RS being turbo, GT3 and GT3RS being Naturally Aspirated, GT4 being mid-engine. so the GT series by Porsche delineates differences and NOT bundle them all up as the same thing over and over, unlike what what AMG GT did for the GT series. To me that is very aggravating for people spending$150K and you have a "Garden Variety" of AMG GT models as if there is no C-Class, E-Class- S-Class, CLS- Class, G- Class and more Classes.
Drive safe-PORSCHE Lover,
amgfan1
By any measure, the AMG GT range is the upper mid-price segment. It is becoming the flagship by brand identity, not by price. Flagships by price are the 65 series models.
The SLS models were in that price range as well (apart from the Black Series) and that was partially due to the low production volume. Exclusivity was a side-effect. Gt is a better car by any other measure.
The AMG GT is and will be the halo car for some time to come.
I also give AMG/MB some slack in terms of getting things ironed out; they just shouldn't deny quality issues and fix things fast. But they stood up a car that in its first iteration is pretty much at eye height with a "high-end" main-stream 911, a machine that has been finely tuned for decades.
I cannot spell you out ROMEOE55. You must be the brightest Dumb Bell brought out in this planet earth.
You still have my standing offer to race your UNPAID AMG GT against my latest acquisition Dodge Viper ACR-Extreme. Now this TOY BUBBA will for sure fire kick your A$$ by the curb. I suggest tune the heck out of your AMG GT and meet me here at the Joliet Autobahn and I will pay for the closure of the track, just so my ACR-Extreme can use your AMG GT to wipe the skid marks my ACR-Extreme will put on the track. You know where to find Joliet Autobahn is BUBBA? The standing offer to race is for you to accept. I'd love to donate your pretty GT to my favorite charitable institution here in Illinois.
This is what your GT will be looking at from start to finish of the race BUBBA. I hope your GT have PPF as these fat wide tires kick up a lot of loose debris on the track.
Drive safe-PORSCHE Lover,
amgfan1
Here we go again. "It's the 2016 EVO car of the YEAR" so it must be unique and valuable......"So good I added it to my stable ".
Theres your GT4 !!!! It's a Cayman Florence. Ugh
I deem Florence to be first runner up in the new "Emperors new Clothes " contest. Thank you for participating my dear friend. Hope to see you in Illinois winter soon.[/QUOTE]
Well, this thread will get interesting if AMG introduces a C43 Black Series.
My view is:
I don't think the 43's are bad cars.
I think the brand needed leader models to bring in a new crowd into the showroom.
I think the 43's belong under the Mercedes-AMG brand. Smart move.
But I firmly believe tHE 43's should not of been tagged AMG with badges all over them.
They should of been kept as a sport model, a tuned by AMG version if you will.
This would of left the 43 owner yearning to move up to a real blooded (45,63 or 65) hand built AMG.
Now AMG, for example, has classified the owner of a $100k E63 as an overprice E43 with a bigger engine. Why spend a $100k on a car that looks just like a $60k model. Take the time and make a side by side comparison of a C43 and a C63s. Then ask yourself, is the C63s really worth the extra money. I say no. The 43 is a hell of a deal and only 1 second slower. Are you really going to track the car?
So If I paid for a C63s, I would feel like an idiot for spending the extra money and that is what Tobias achieved. He has recreated the Benz/Chrysler embarrassment years all over again where Benz owners were told, "hey nice Chrysler you have there". Those who lived it remember it well.
I firmly believe AMG was in a very unique position where they could offer a ultimate model in every class size. Porsche just doesn't offer such a selection models, so all that is left is to offer many of the same model. It worked for them, but that does not make it the right recepie for AMG.
Does Ford tag every Mustang as a Shelby? Why not? Because a Shelby is a monster Mustang and everyone knows it. Putting Shelby badges on every Mustang would dilute the image and that's why they don't do it.
As for the GT, well Tobias seems to think he can do just like Porsche. The more models the merrier.
And now a 4 door GT 43-63-63s. As for the depreciation, well, I think once they start face lifting these GT's there will be a bunch of models with old face, a bunch with new face and so new model with old face will dévaluante quickly as they won't do them all at the same time. Therefore New will look old.
Let's not forget the disastrous intro with so many problems these cars had including driveshafts falling off. Yes I know they fixed most of it but what a disastrous intro to a new flagship model. And now to boot many have transmission issues with the 43's.
To conclude, I just want to say I worked hard to move up to an AMG, proud when I took delivery and 6 months later the 450's came out and ever since, I've had a disgust for my car and want out of it asap. 3 years later, I can't off load it without a major financial loss. I hate the car and I want out of AMG, the sooner the better.
Hello PT63s, hope all is well with you. Not sure if it will be "Interesting", more like "Depressing." That will really be the day, WHEN they make the 43 Black Series.
Drive safe-PORSCHE Lover,
amgfan1
Originally Posted by PT63s
Well, this thread will get interesting if AMG introduces a C43 Black Series.
Now with even the "limited" special "edition 50" edition of the GTC and GTC roadster. I wonder if those limited edition will be numbered? 50 to US sounds very small amount... Wonder if people will really jump on them...
Well YTD sales results are in and WOW!!
looks like the GT is not doing so well.
Sales are down -20% so,far. Big downer !
Surprising considering sales of AMG in general are up and they added GT models
Maybe the GT will be more exclusive than many think.
Well YTD sales results are in and WOW!!
looks like the GT is not doing so well.
Sales are down -20% so,far. Big downer !
Surprising considering sales of AMG in general are up and they added GT models
Maybe the GT will be more exclusive than many think.
Not surprising, there are over 18 GT/s in the Seattle area alone! I bet soon you will be able to pick a 16/17 new for under $100K.... I saw the guy I sold mine a month ago and he is happy with it. Good for him
02-23-2017, 10:07 AM
as if there is no C-Class, E-Class- S-Class, CLS- Class, G- Class and more Classes. 
