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Anyone considered the Vantage vs GTS

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Anyone considered the Vantage vs GTS

 
Old 02-11-2019, 02:12 PM
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Although I have not owned the new Vantage. I went from a 2016 GTS to a 2017 DB11. I was very happy with my GTS, but when the new Panamericana grille came out I was looking to either replace my GTS with a 2018 GTx model or switch to something more exclusive. Having owned a 2009 Vantage 8 years ago, I thought I would give the DB11 a try. I traded my GTS for a launch edition DB11 June of last year, big and costly mistake.

The ZF 8-speed is a slush box. Unless you leave it in auto and comfort mode, shifts are jerky, twitchy or nervous depending which driving mode you are in. I usually like to put it in S+ and use paddle shifters. It was so disappointing that I just put it in auto and let it do it’s thing. I tried to track it once and it has so much torque, but unfortunately, the gearbox just couldn't deliver all that power to the pavement properly and halfway through the 1st session, I stopped and headed back home.

With my GTS, I would shift gears not because it needed it, but because how I felt, the throttle blips on the down shift sounded awesome and the DCT was so smooth and crisp. I have DCT in my Huracan and Cali T, but AMG's DCT beats them all. I understand that DB11 is more of a GT car than sport, but with 600 HP and quarter Million price tag, you would expect a decent gearbox.

I test drove the new Vantage, the ZF tranny behaves a little better than the one in DB11 but it still is not a DCT and as others have mentioned, as beautiful as it is in the back, the front looks like someone hit it with an ugly stick.

I had a 2018 F-Type R for a short while which had a 8-speed ZF gearbox and what a difference! I don’t know what Aston does with the mapping, buy IMHO, the gear box in modern Astons are the weak point. I preferred my single clutch 2009 Vantage over the DB11. Don't get me wrong, DB11 is very beautiful and exclusive car with fantastic ride in comfort mode and lots of creature comfort, they just did a poor job with the gearbox.

After 7 months of frustration with my DB11, I traded it for a new 2018 GTS last week. My GTS is being delivered from CA this week, I can't wait to get back into another GTS!

Another negative point on Aston is how much it depreciates, probably as bad as McLaren. I lost $40K in 7 months and I bought my DB11 used $83K below the $261K sticker.

Sorry, but I am biased and love AMG! The GTx series are the best driver cars I have ever owned.

Last edited by N-4Speed; 02-11-2019 at 02:19 PM.
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Old 02-11-2019, 03:39 PM
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Wow. Pays to lease on this car.
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Old 02-11-2019, 04:14 PM
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Originally Posted by AMG 17GT View Post
Wow. Pays to lease on this car.
This one looks good no??? I still need to drive the dang thing.

https://www.ogaracoach.com/vehicle-d...ca-id-26979239

Last edited by Vic55; 02-11-2019 at 04:16 PM.
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Old 02-11-2019, 04:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Vic55 View Post
This one looks good no??? I still need to drive the dang thing.

https://www.ogaracoach.com/vehicle-d...ca-id-26979239
GTS long in tooth Vic?

yeah, that interior is way cool. Not so sure about that exterior grey. But great MF no doubt.
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Old 02-11-2019, 05:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Vic55 View Post
This one looks good no??? I still need to drive the dang thing.

https://www.ogaracoach.com/vehicle-d...ca-id-26979239
Sits like a 4x4 with the ***** house interior dude..
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Old 02-11-2019, 05:58 PM
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Gotta say the red interior does look a bit like Ronin's idea of a ***** house.
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Old 02-11-2019, 06:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Vic55 View Post
This one looks good no??? I still need to drive the dang thing.

https://www.ogaracoach.com/vehicle-d...ca-id-26979239
I think it is a great idea to drive one before committing and not just a short 10 minutes drive while the salesman is distracting you. I was mesmerized by DB11's gorgeous, voluptuous exterior and beautifully done interior. The 1,000 watt B&O further distracted me. I would test drive it several times on different road conditions. My mistake was driving one in a 10 minute short test drive on freeway and not really getting a good feeling for the car and the tranny more specifically.

IMHO if you are a kind of guy that like the rawness, excitement and muscle car sensation of AMG, you probably won't be happy with Vantage. Once I decided to dump the DB11, I did a long test drive with Vantage and although it has the same AMG engine, it is a very different car and I knew I had to go back to a GTx. Besides the huge difference in gearbox, I think the exhaust notes on AMG is one of the BEST and there are not too many cars out there that come close including the naturally aspirated ones.

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Old 02-11-2019, 06:14 PM
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@N-4Speed confirming what many of us already know.

Front of the Vantage is so ugly, I would never be able to get over it no matter how good the lease. It's no wonder the lease rates are so attractive on the Vantage, dealers have to give practically give them away.
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Old 02-11-2019, 06:40 PM
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Originally Posted by surfah View Post
@N-4Speed confirming what many of us already know.

Front of the Vantage is so ugly, I would never be able to get over it no matter how good the lease. It's no wonder the lease rates are so attractive on the Vantage, dealers have to give practically give them away.
Surfah, you are dead on. Look what happened to NSX, they can't give them away!

I am not implying that NSX is ugly, I just think from a pricing stand point, Acura completely missed the mark and with Aston, in an attempt to have more distinction between different models, they ended up with an ugly child, AKA Vantage.

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Old 02-11-2019, 06:41 PM
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Originally Posted by ronin amg View Post
Sits like a 4x4 with the ***** house interior dude..
Haaaa I love ******.

Yeah if I was able to consider this I would always do multiple longer test drives. But I am not that excited about it; especially that big fish mouth front end.
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Old 02-11-2019, 06:41 PM
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Similar GT S to DB11 experience - goin' back!

[QUOTE=N-4Speed;7678835]Although I have not owned the new Vantage. I went from a 2016 GTS to a 2017 DB11. I was very happy with my GTS, but when the new Panamericana grille came out I was looking to either replace my GTS with a 2018 GTx model or switch to something more exclusive. Having owned a 2009 Vantage 8 years ago, I thought I would give the DB11 a try. I traded my GTS for a launch edition DB11 June of last year, big and costly mistake.

The ZF 8-speed is a slush box. Unless you leave it in auto and comfort mode, shifts are jerky, twitchy or nervous depending which driving mode you are in. I usually like to put it in S+ and use paddle shifters. It was so disappointing that I just put it in auto and let it do itís thing.]

Our situations are very similar. I bought my DB11 in 2017 and now with lease end in sight (I'll bail early) later this year), I'm looking to go back to a sports car. I started the DB11 lease also owning a 991.1 911 Turbo S and traded to a 991.2 GT3 a year ago. Much like your experience with other sports cars, the DB11 was a trip for awhile, but I, too, shift in manual mode because in auto, Sport+ is jerky. Also, it cannot put power down from a standing start (which Motor Trend observed at the car's launch) and launch control is unavailable. The ZF 8 speed is better in the Vantage but as I mentioned in another post, I'm looking to go back to an AMG GT C or R. I loved my GT S, as well, and if my dealer hadn't ticked us off, I wouldn't have cancelled my GT C Roadster order and I'd be driving that car now instead of the DB11. I was told that the DB11 AMR has a more solid rear suspension than my DB11, which is good because based on my experience on fast transitions on curves with undulating pavement, the car wallows in the back. I admire your courage trying to track the car - even though A-M holds track events for members. My lease is underwater, so I need to wait a few months but then I plan to back to an AMG GT car. All of this said, I enjoyed driving the Vantage and it performs well, the ZF 8-spd in Track mode is aggressive, and it sounds good when pushed, so for some the attractive lease terms might be an opportunity to try it.
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Old 02-11-2019, 09:14 PM
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Originally Posted by surfah View Post
@N-4Speed confirming what many of us already know.

Front of the Vantage is so ugly, I would never be able to get over it no matter how good the lease. It's no wonder the lease rates are so attractive on the Vantage, dealers have to give practically give them away.
To these eyes at least, Aston Martin’s have been beautiful cars for decades. But what awful nightmares were the designers having when they drew the latest models, especially that front end? Yuch! lol



Last edited by thebishman; 02-11-2019 at 09:19 PM.
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Old 02-11-2019, 09:35 PM
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Originally Posted by N-4Speed View Post
I think it is a great idea to drive one before committing and not just a short 10 minutes drive while the salesman is distracting you. I was mesmerized by DB11's gorgeous, voluptuous exterior and beautifully done interior. The 1,000 watt B&O further distracted me. I would test drive it several times on different road conditions. My mistake was driving one in a 10 minute short test drive on freeway and not really getting a good feeling for the car and the tranny more specifically.

IMHO if you are a kind of guy that like the rawness, excitement and muscle car sensation of AMG, you probably won't be happy with Vantage. Once I decided to dump the DB11, I did a long test drive with Vantage and although it has the same AMG engine, it is a very different car and I knew I had to go back to a GTx. Besides the huge difference in gearbox, I think the exhaust notes on AMG is one of the BEST and there are not too many cars out there that come close including the naturally aspirated ones.
Due to bad weather I still haven't been able to take one for a spin (this would be for the weekend, not just a few min.) It's disappointing to hear about the ZF because that transmission is killing it in the M5, but then BMW has always done a great job with the ZF transmission mapping. From the looks the grill looks plain no doubt, but in person the whole car is a very attractive package. I also wouldn't go for a very sporty interior; more traditional GT (full leather, leather headliner, no Alcantara).

A decision between the AMG GT and the Vantage is a no-brainer; but since we plan to to get a AMG roadster to replace the SL, this is not a question.
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Old 02-11-2019, 09:52 PM
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Originally Posted by Vic55 View Post
This one looks good no??? I still need to drive the dang thing.

https://www.ogaracoach.com/vehicle-d...ca-id-26979239
Oy that Grigio Telesto exterior looks like primer!

Originally Posted by N-4Speed View Post
Surfah, you are dead on. Look what happened to NSX, they can't give them away!

I am not implying that NSX is ugly, I just think from a pricing stand point, Acura completely missed the mark and with Aston, in an attempt to have more distinction between different models, they ended up with an ugly child, AKA Vantage.
QFT. $30K rebates on the 2017 NSX and some buyers getting over $50K off MSRP on new, floor models and still monthly sales were anemic.

You want to rock a unicorn sports car go Gen 2 NSX lol.

Originally Posted by thebishman View Post


To these eyes at least, Aston Martinís have been beautiful cars for decades. But what awful nightmares were the designers having when they drew the latest models, especially that front end? Yuch! lol


The writing on the wall came when Andy Palmer took over, DBX SUV to attract female buyers=Fail.

Failure of the DB9 to generate enough profit to fund next generation development created a downward spiral of declning sales/profit.
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Old 02-11-2019, 10:14 PM
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Design failures seem to be common now. Supra, NSX and this cars front end are complete failures.
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Old 02-12-2019, 12:07 AM
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Some dick in a Vantage tailgated me for half a mile on Santa Monica Blvd. in Beverly Hills until I turned onto Beverly Blvd.Friday mid morning. As I turned I saw him and that hideously ugly front end go by. The only front end uglier than that today is on the Lexus LC500. (It looks like Lexus hired some Aston designers and gave them crack cocaine while they worked.)

My revenge against the dick is that he has a car with a hideous front end while I have an AMG GT. I hope he's paying $7.22 a mile for the privilege.
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Old 02-12-2019, 11:16 AM
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Originally Posted by AtTheGlen View Post
It's a good point that engine issues could be addressed by a Mercedes dealer but what I've seen on the DB11 are issues with switches: trunk lid, center console and driver's window (like driving on the freeway holding onto the "up" switch so he window won't drop two inches in a rainstorm, except when I change lanes and need to use the turn signal and the window drops).
Astons are very finicky. I had the same issue with DB11 driver's window. 1st time I took it there, they said weather stripping had to be replaced. When I got the car back, I had loud wind noise coming from the window. Took it back and they said the weather stripping has to be replaced again, which they did. Got it back and sure enough same problem with window dropping. The fix is actually very simple: Roll the window down, keep holding the button down for about five seconds, roll the window up and hold the window switch up for five seconds. Do all of this with the door closed.

My experience with local Aston dealer is that they try to generate revenue by replacing parts that are really not needed. I guess they charge back the factory. That happened with my Vantage and DB11. With both cars under warranty, they replaced parts that I didn't even complain about like the rear dampers & weather stripping in DB11 or leather dash above instrument cluster in the Vantage.
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Old 02-12-2019, 04:00 PM
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Originally Posted by N-4Speed View Post
Astons are very finicky. I had the same issue with DB11 driver's window. 1st time I took it there, they said weather stripping had to be replaced. When I got the car back, I had loud wind noise coming from the window. Took it back and they said the weather stripping has to be replaced again, which they did. Got it back and sure enough same problem with window dropping. The fix is actually very simple: Roll the window down, keep holding the button down for about five seconds, roll the window up and hold the window switch up for five seconds. Do all of this with the door closed.

My experience with local Aston dealer is that they try to generate revenue by replacing parts that are really not needed. I guess they charge back the factory. That happened with my Vantage and DB11. With both cars under warranty, they replaced parts that I didn't even complain about like the rear dampers & weather stripping in DB11 or leather dash above instrument cluster in the Vantage.
Not cool with the Aston dealer, time is money and they are wasting a lot of both. AMG GTS and GT3 have been reliable, no issues outside of regular service.
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Old 02-12-2019, 04:27 PM
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I thought that I had made my last post on this topic, BWTM. I had to have a small screw removed from a tire so while at the dealership, I talked to the sales guys about the Vantage lease programs. The program includes high residuals and "money in the trunk" as an up-front discount. A $180K car/36 mo./2,500 mi/yr is $1,851.13. You'd have drive 6,000 mi/yr to arrive at the 5,000 mi/yr lease payment ($2,186.03). Actually could be more miles. I've driven the Vantage three times and I maintain that, especially in Track Mode, shifts with the ZF8 transmission are fast up/down and the sound is terrific. Power and torque seem greater than spec'd as possibly indicated by the manufacturer's claimed 0-62 3.6 sec which puts 0-60 between 3.4 and 3.5. There are interior choices ranging from sinister to bespoke leather. A-M raves about the polar moment of inertia rotating around the driver and with ex-Lotus guru Matt Becker heading engineering they've done a good job with steering and handling in the car based on my favorite corners, ramps and chicanes on the street. Besides power and handling, when I buy a car I'm interested in motorsports pedigree and the brand's history as a premium mark, therefore I like AMGs, Porsches and Aston Martins. Oh, BTW, I like the back of the Vantage but it does look a bit chopped off from the side. The front's "fishy" design language (DBS Superleggera, etc.) is growing on me, but it didn't stop anyone (with interest and money) from buying the Vulcan. Also, it's very similar to the non-production DB10 in the Spectre Bond movie. So I remain positive about it. Will it be a future garage-mate for my GT3? Maybe - or possibly a GT C GT R or 992 Carrera 2S.
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Old 02-12-2019, 05:16 PM
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Old 02-12-2019, 06:55 PM
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Originally Posted by AtTheGlen View Post
I thought that I had made my last post on this topic, BWTM. I had to have a small screw removed from a tire so while at the dealership, I talked to the sales guys about the Vantage lease programs. The program includes high residuals and "money in the trunk" as an up-front discount. A $180K car/36 mo./2,500 mi/yr is $1,851.13. You'd have drive 6,000 mi/yr to arrive at the 5,000 mi/yr lease payment ($2,186.03). Actually could be more miles. I've driven the Vantage three times and I maintain that, especially in Track Mode, shifts with the ZF8 transmission are fast up/down and the sound is terrific. Power and torque seem greater than spec'd as possibly indicated by the manufacturer's claimed 0-62 3.6 sec which puts 0-60 between 3.4 and 3.5. There are interior choices ranging from sinister to bespoke leather. A-M raves about the polar moment of inertia rotating around the driver and with ex-Lotus guru Matt Becker heading engineering they've done a good job with steering and handling in the car based on my favorite corners, ramps and chicanes on the street. Besides power and handling, when I buy a car I'm interested in motorsports pedigree and the brand's history as a premium mark, therefore I like AMGs, Porsches and Aston Martins. Oh, BTW, I like the back of the Vantage but it does look a bit chopped off from the side. The front's "fishy" design language (DBS Superleggera, etc.) is growing on me, but it didn't stop anyone (with interest and money) from buying the Vulcan. Also, it's very similar to the non-production DB10 in the Spectre Bond movie. So I remain positive about it. Will it be a future garage-mate for my GT3? Maybe - or possibly a GT C GT R or 992 Carrera 2S.
The numbers I have are a bit different but of course everything varies by car. I had posted some of the residual/MF rates previously. Overage on the lease is 60 cents a mile; not as good as the 25 cents on the MB but really low compared to others. Looking at it from a high-level, the Vantage leases about 20% less than a base AMG GT coupe (22,500 miles) with a $50k price difference.
As for the looks, I don't get these comments. Aston Martin have been known to produce some of the most stunning looking coupes. Their weakness was always their tech, reliability and not being very quick. Now the tech has improved and the front grill looks plain but they are still great looking cars; certainly better than many Mercedes models. What gives?
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Old 02-12-2019, 07:08 PM
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Front grill Is certainly a personal taste. I was watching an episode of “ *****in Rides” lol and they were making a custom front grill and that kid who is head of design and he took a 1 inch piece of tape to the bottom and top of the grill and it changed the whole proportion of the front end. The huge grill and the tiny headlights of this Vantage Just don’t work and that’s why nobody’s buying.

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Old 02-12-2019, 07:15 PM
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Originally Posted by AMG 17GT View Post
Front grill Is certainly a personal taste. I was watching an episode of ď *****in RidesĒ lol and they were making a custom front grill and that kid who is head of design and he took a 1 inch piece of tape to the bottom and top of the grill and it changed the whole proportion of the front end. That and the tiny headlights of this Vantage make this car fugly IMO.
Personal taste I get. Fugly I don't. I guess it takes quite a bit for me to call a car fugly. Can't even think of one right now but most of then would be Asian or French cars and many SUV's
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Old 02-12-2019, 07:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Wolfman View Post
The numbers I have are a bit different but of course everything varies by car. I had posted some of the residual/MF rates previously. Overage on the lease is 60 cents a mile; not as good as the 25 cents on the MB but really low compared to others. Looking at it from a high-level, the Vantage leases about 20% less than a base AMG GT coupe (22,500 miles) with a $50k price difference.
As for the looks, I don't get these comments. Aston Martin have been known to produce some of the most stunning looking coupes. Their weakness was always their tech, reliability and not being very quick. Now the tech has improved and the front grill looks plain but they are still great looking cars; certainly better than many Mercedes models. What gives?
If the Vantage is so great, why the fire sale on leases? Honest question.
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Old 02-12-2019, 07:41 PM
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Originally Posted by surfah View Post
If the Vantage is so great, why the fire sale on leases? Honest question.
Don't know, don't care. OP mentioned IPO. This is a tiny niche manufacturer that sells barely 5000 plus cars a year. I am sure they want to move metal and to push up valuation to get enough money to finance their foray into the cash-rich SUV business.
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