j4kethedog

Hello all!

Coming from a C7 Z06, so bear with me here xD

I recently purchased a beautiful, low mile 2016 AMG GT S in Solarbeam Yellow. I will post pics on here in a few days... but I have a question that I have honestly not found a concrete answer to, even when using the search function in the forums. My warranty runs out in 5 months. When that happens, I want to either lightly mod the car (ecu+exhaust) OR buy an extended warranty because though I understand "pay to play" I do not think I could stomach the costs of replacing the $30,000+ engine. My question:

Have there really been no documented blown engines?

I saw the ONE post on here with several pages of responses which never showed proof of the supposed failure-car and eventually devolved into another "just get a Porsche" thread.
Again, I understand the inherent costs in this car. What I can't find are figures of those actual costs, and the likelihood of having them (which seems optimistically low given the lack of info!) For example, in many cases an engine failure will simply require a new block or maybe just a new set of rods+labor, etc. Is this the case with the m178? Or is it too complex to work on, in most cases? I'm not looking for someone to say "go ahead and mod it and never worry!" but I want to know more so I can make an educated decision on how best to play my cards.

So, people with tunes and/or exhaust mods: Have you had any problems, whatsoever? How many miles have you got with the tune? This is a big factor, as many people in other sports cars I've had will be fine for awhile and then it will "go."
And if possible, does anyone know of any situations where people HAVE had failures? Did they have to replace the whole mill, or did they get out at "just" a fraction of the cost, with say just new pistons, etc.?

I am absolutely in love with this car. I'm also aware of how robust the engine is, really a marvel! But I look forward to hearing input on this specific question. Again, sorry if it's been beaten to death already. I could not find any real solid info via the search function or even Google.

Thanks!

PS - I understand also that all tunes are different. I'd likely be going with Weistec or Renntech.

emericr

send you a PM.

texasmade

I think you can register with the AMG Private Lounge with your car's VIN. I know there's a dedicated thread there about GTS problems.

j4kethedog

Is that on here on or on another site? I didn't see it on here..

Thanks

texasmade

http://www.mercedes-amg.com/privatelounge/

Different website run by Mercedes AMG.

kumizi

I've had Eurocharged downpipes and tune for 39 months and 25,000 miles. I believe I did it around the 500 mile mark. Not a single problem. The only reason I haven't done bigger turbos yet is because I sit in awful traffic almost everyday and dont get to open it much into the triple digits. Not really worried about the engine.

I've owned 5 Z06s in the past (all with cam or heads/cam) and blew the motor in two of them.

j4kethedog

Amazing, the amount of positive feedback people have on this engine. It's unlike any other engine I've been around/worked on/researched. From the LS7, to the LT4, to the EJ series Subaru engines, and even the Mezger and later Porsche engines, they all have common flaws to correct/watch out for. My 2014 wrx sti actually blew the factory motor on the stock tune

You guys are definitely inspiring me to go ahead and do a nice stage 1/DP setup!

So far I've heard big ++ for Eurocharge and Renntech. More responses would be great. Thanks guys.

Alexfor8

It's bullet proof, hands down the absolute best V8 currently on the market.

Case1906

After head-bolt issues with some of the M156 motors, Merc had to get it right-- and they did.

j4kethedog

Good stuff. I'll be going with dps/tune and calling it a day. Right now looking like eurocharged is top of the list. This car has the perfect amount of power as is, so it will be nice to just get it slightly into "excessive" territory.

Jim Brady

AMG in Affalterbach operates 5 dyno cells for testing and run the entire facility on the power the engines develop and sell the excess power to the city. On a tour in 2016I I was watching a M177/178 on the dyno running at full redline. I asked if they destructively test, and the tech told me yes. They gain use full information and they abuse the motors to determine what may cause failures. I asked the question how long can you run at red line. His answer blew me away. We've run them as long as 5 months! We couldn't blow it up.

thebishman

That is amazing, Jim. WOT for 5 months! Can you imagine the fuel bill? lol

I came from a ‘15 Z06 and that’s a fine engine, but it’s not the same calibre as this TT-V8 in the GT cars.

Bish

Jim Brady

Thanks Bish,
The AMG bullets are the best! Even the M156 which was somewhat maligned for head bolt issues primarily due to the internet hysteria was a killer motor. We ran it in the Pirelli Challenge in a CLK63 Black series with no issues. In fact when we asked AMG for a spare engine they said why! No one has blown one up yet on the track.
So we ran our test engine out of an ML63 which had better oil baffling due to the oil pan configuration. That pulled 580HP with air restrictor restrictors. Never had to use our new motor.
FWIW, Porsche rebuilds their GT3 race motors every 25 hours, Mercedes, maybe a refresh at the end of the season.
Why do you thing Aston Martin chose AMG motors. Bullet Proof reliability means no warranty issues.

j4kethedog

My jaw dropped when I read the post about running at redline for 5 months! What started as a thread to learn about the m178's weaknesses has turned me full on fan boy. While I'm learning from you guys, could anyone comment on the fact that the engine and trans both seem to run a little hot? Is this okay? It does seem like it cools better the harder I run it, with slow city driving being the worst, but how about a hot FL track day? Does it have heat soak issues (especially with a tune) or does the active cooling setup do the job under continuous flogging? For reference, I have seen oil temps jump into the 220s just from a 10~ second WOT pull. If this is normal/healthy then I'll just accept it for what it is.

PS - Bish I thought your name looked familiar! Pretty sure I have seen you around the Vette forums.

Alexfor8

That sounds a bit hot. I would run in the 190's and maybe break 200 after a long spirited drive. The F12 is consistently in the 160's

thebishman

j4kethedog:

Try and PM ‘Decartesfool’ here as he has extensive experience running his GT S on track. He should be able to give you tons of info on temps; alignment settings, etc.

I have a GT R which has excellent OEM alignment that I checked but haven’t changed, and it runs super cool on track, unlike my A8 Z06. But as it’s a different version of the GT it’s a bit of an Apples to Orange comparison.

Glad to see you over here from the Corvetteforum!!

Bish

Jim Brady

Some people reported elevated temps while tracking other didn't. The elevated temps in the transaxle is in part caused by the exhaust tubes being located next to the gearbox. I installed Thermo Tec stainless steel pipe sleeves which wrap around the exhaust. Summit Racing has them for $99. part number THE-11675. Dropped gear box temps to 190 on 89 degrees track day.
The second reason that can cause elevated running temps is that the turbo intercooler also cools the transaxle..
The Amg race cars ran an extra cooler for the rear dif. Don't know if the GT-R has one pretty sure it does.

j4kethedog

These responses caused me to check my coolant level, and though the wording in the manual is a little vague, I guess that black tab is the "indicator" and my coolant is low. What gives? Car has 17,000 miles on it and a great service history. I am going to MB to get a jug tomorrow, and going to change the oil while I'm at it since this has made me a little paranoid now.

Any decent reason why the coolant would be low? Tempted to have the engine checked, but I reeeally don't like service techs touching my cars...

Sorry for the endless questions. Buying this car used from a non MB dealer has left me with the carfax and the googles to find answers, and the latter hasn't been as helpful as usual -- though you all definitely have!

thebishman

If the coolant is the original, and it probably is, I'd have it flushed and exchanged during the oil/filter change. I wouldn't be worried at all with a slight drop in coolant level after about 2-3 years.

Bish

P Rock

There are quite a few M177 and M177 cars running 700-800 wheel HP for many miles without major issues on the motor. I know some of the owners.
I myself wouldn't want that much power but I'm stating this to reinforce what people are saying about the engine's strength.
Many C63's and GTS's running 10's with stock internals and pretty mild upgrades and others with turbo upgrades haven't reported issues either. The major tuners like Renntech and Weistec are offering turbo upgrades designed to work with the stock engine. I'd assume they did their research before offering.

Tony A.

Got RENNtech tune for it, ran great for 12k miles, then engine started misfiring, I removed the tune same thing, so I don’t know too much about engines so from what service advisor told me, cylinder 2 was the misfire, and then the spark started leaking, into a piston, so the piston bent, I believe and cracked the head… now I need a new head and no where has it, not Germany or America……. This is my 3rd week waiting, I bought the car cpo, in 3 years it had only 5k miles when I got it within 6 month I put 12k hard miles. But that car with a tune and wider tires is a different animal, I even raced Amg gtr , beat it couple times, smoked 911 turbos. Rolled raced a huracan at 60 I passed him at 140….so I don’t know if it’s the engine or my driving…. But I need a complete new head now

Stenzel-Germany

Hi Tony,

Check MB used Parts:

approx. 1550.- USD. & Shiping Fees.

Like new, only 6 (six) miles. WITH Cams.

MB GTC B2C Shop | Zylinderkopf | online kaufen

MB GTC B2C Shop | Zylinderkopf | online kaufen


Regards

Stenzel

Tony A.

thanks for the links, but the dealer is looking for a brand new one, and I believe they want it straight Mercedes, because warranty is covering the cost of parts and labor.

AMG 17GT

Did dealer do any diagnostic on ecm or the canbus? Or did the dealer ask you wink wink? Just curious if it came up.