dude...no offense, but STFU. you bought a USED 2001 C320 in 06 or something and has over 80k miles NOW. BUY a 2001 330i and come back and tell us it doesn't have any problems. If you had owned the car since new fine, but STFU. IF you had done your "homework" you wouldn't have bought a 2001 C320. A first year of a new generation C-class.

 

i think the guys just frustrated. If i wasn't a diy'er and took all my repairs to the dealership where they like to while your bent over without lupe. Then I would probably feel the same way.

jhartmac, if you want a car with no problems just buy a honda new. When i had my civic new the only thing i ever changed on that car was oil and brakes for 80k. If you luxury and reliability with similar mercedes comfort levels just buy a lexus.

Now a days, you can probably get a pretty good deal on new cars. I know frank got a pretty smoking deal on his mom's new c300.

As for BMW's, there not that much better then mercedes. My friend bought a 04 bmw 330ci brand new after the mid cycle refresh where there suppose to get rid of most of the bugs. The first 12k on the car, he had bad coils, bad starter and his window regulator broke. The window regular broke three more times after it was replaced.

To give you a contrast, my starter on my acura lasted 14yrs 178k miles before i rebuilt it for $25. It only needed to be rebuilt because the copper contacts corroded over time, the selonids were still good after 14yrs of use. The starter was made by Nippon Denso, so thats another reason i'm impressed with the quality of denso and honda.

 

haha yuppp

 

Oh! No - not again - The idea of a forum is for a usefull exchange of information regarding a common subject :confuse d:: rant:

 

I'm with you on Honda - As I've stated before on this forum. Japanese produced Honda's are the best screwed together cars on the planet.

Regarding previous owners of Jag & Aston I'm not going to endeavour to protect them other than to say that they had no money or scale & whether their management was hopeless or helpless is subject to debate.

Regarding Ford, your perspective is Americentric & factually distorted. Ford and other American Corporations frequently achieve short term but unsustainable turnaround in company profits in the short sighted interests of satisfying Wall Street. I've just retired from one such Corporation after being with them for 37 years. They first bring in American Management that have never left the state that they were born in much less had a passport and these guys think the rest of the world is "just like America" - mistake number one. These guys blunder around with clumsy naivety not understanding markets, cultures, labour practice, etc. etc. ad nauseum. Oh! I did this in Louisville, Kentucky - it must work in Bangkok, Thailand or Sao Paulo, Brasil. They then bring in some consultants to pick the brains of the locals and then ignore all the good advice they were given. Mostly young MBAs with no real experience - these youngsters can quote what Sam Walton did at Walmart & Jack Welch did at GE and think that these models translate outside the USA - they don't and they endlessly fail. There is a short term pick up in profitability and then they head South because the suggested strategies were unsustainable & market inappropriate. Many American Corporations are dinosaurs and will go the way of the dinosaurs - I've just been called back to consult because of this very situation & have seen it time and time again in the global job I had.

Back to Jaguar - I want to quote from our most influential local car magazine because they have it factually right, I could not say it better myself and they have no axe to grind or centricity in this debate and are most impressed with what Ian Callum & his team - including Wayne Burgess (DB9) have achieved with the XF (this article was written a week before the buyout was confirmed)

Quote "Let us explain why the Tata buy-out is increasingly seen as exactly what Jaguar needs. Tata has money. Ford doesn't, and hasn't for a while. To develop new cars and expand product lines costs money, which has been a severe handicap for Jaguar for many years. Secondly for Jaguar to flourish, it needs an owner with not only money, but also business savvy. And this Tata also has - look at it's success with British Steel (now Corus), for proof. The hugely successful Tata will not take a special brand such as Jaguar and meddle too much with a company that is, on the evidence of the superb XF - certainly capable of producing the goods. The only remaining worry for us is whether Tata will keep Jaguar once it has bought it. You see, Ford insists on selling Jaguar & Land Rover as a unit. There have been rumours that this unit sale is because profit-making Land Rover is seen as the deal-sweetner to get rid of loss making Jaguar. And while Ford may very well find a willing buyer in Tata, it is theoretically possible for the two brands to be separated after the sale. Tata to keep Land Rover, and put Jaguar up for sale, again. But we doubt it. We think Tata is clever enough to realise it is getting a bargain...." Unquote.

Well we now know that Tata got it's bargain - is keeping Jaguar and investing in it. You will forgive me if I remain unconvinced about Ford really doing Jaguar any good or they would have kept it. The S Type is just as much of a dog as it has always been - rated worst on customer satisfaction in this market last year as a direct import, while under Ford control.

A few years back the American Auto makers and their beloved consultants were all shouting that the Merger of many brands was the ONLY answer to long term viability. GM with Daewoo, Fiat etc. Well once again they got it wrong! Toyota & Honda said no way! we are going it alone and as they say the rest is history. (and Toyota is already backing off from the US outsource model for the reasons you quote - outsource and loose control - another US business model that fails endlessly especially outside the US)

 

Your opinion on american corporate leadership sounds very sterotypical and your basing your entire opinion on one experience with an American corporation you worked with.

There are some that fit in the sterotype that you have described, but usually those are people who haven't really lived in a diversed environment and only have seen one type of culture or way of thinking.

I agree that american auto makers are not the best example of american corporate leadership, but its arrogant to assume all american companies are like that.

I will agree to disagree with you on ford.

As for mergers, lot of the mergers were to obtain economics of scale. Thats one of the main reasons mercedes wanted to merge with chrylser in the first place. They knew the reason lexus can offer similar features at a lot lower price is because of the buying power and economics of scale Toyota had.

Unfortuantely with Daimler they we're not able to successfully integrate mercedes and chrylser parts together, with maybe the exception of the c300.

On the global scale, mercedes, bmw are all relatively small auto makers compared to toyota, gm,honda, ford and now even hyundai.

Why do think you even hyundai can offer all the features of a 7 series for $30k-40k in there genesis?

Or Nissan can sell a GTR for $70k and have the performance of cars double its price and still make money on it. Yes, nissan does make money on the GTR and it not a loss leader.

They have the volume to leverage suppliers for higher quality parts at a cheaper price, and spread the cost across multiple high volume models.

You see this now with the Fiat group and the VW group, of course integrating multiple brands isn't as easy as just starting your subsidary luxury brand.

The price of cars are one of the few things thats actually gone down in price when adjusted for inflation. When your margins go down, you have to make it up in volume or mergers or forming alliances that can help you be competitive. Just some were successful and others were not.

 

Let's not debate further on line because we are so way off topic others are going to get pissed with us.

- I'm not basing what I say on the one multinational corporation I have worked for but on what I've experienced in the global marketplace & most markedly in Asia. I have also worked in a number of cross organisational teams over the years. I have great respect generally for the Corp I worked for or would not have stayed 37 years or be prepared to go back & consult.
- I was mainly addressing the American Auto Makers
- American Corporate leadership is regettably stereotypical in the way they behave - they are all taught the same things - I can quote you the %age of Americans that never leave the town or state they were born in but let's not go down that road.
- I'm certainly not saying all American Corps - that would be ridiculous, I used the comment "many" - but the number is high as is their arrogance when operating in a country where they are guests & this is alarming. It plays directly into the Chinese' hands & to their benefit. I have great respect for the Chinese
- I fully understand scale which makes Honda's achievement all the more impressive as they lack it. Also remember that Toyota started as a baby vs the US Auto Makers
- We will agree to differ on Ford - they may not be around without a Goverment bail-out - The last time I was in their Cleveland engine plant I had to shake my head
- Agree on Hyundai - they are likely the next Toyota although it's going to be interesting to see if Porche achieve their goals with VW - The way VW/Audi is going in China is impressive to say the least
- Agree Benz cars are tiny in the overall scheme of things. Trucks & buses are where they really make their money which is why the Schrempp, FAW merger would have been important. It would have taken them from number 1 to unsurpassable.

Nice debating with you - go well - we have hugely differing perspectives on things and that's healthy. I will forever be indebted to the American Corp I worked for, for exposing me to the global environment for such a long time - but then I made them a bucket of money

 

agreed

its going to be interesting to see how the auto industry is going to shape up in the next few years.

 

/agree.

 

+ 1

 

Killer stuff,Glyn & Temjin! Anyone who'd get upset that you all got "off topic" has to be pretty clueless to not apprecitate HIGHLY EDUCATED,INFORMED members kick around issues more substantive than the colors of sidemarkers! Thanks guys for the OUTSTANDING debate! Truly informative!

 

Thanks Ken & thanks for the scan - I owe you!

 

ArsnlKen

WOO HOO another ARSENAL fan

new season starts this week...........

 

wow, good stuff mike and glyn. i really enjoyed reading what yall have wrote!

 

A healthy debate, always keeps the mind on its toes.

 

Thank you - I'm humbled - agree with Mike that a good debate exercises the mind

 

Shivi!!! CANT WAIT!!!

 

I just read this thread and got nothing of any substance from it at all. All this debating and educated crap is the rambling of parrots standing on the shoulders of mainstream media repeating last weeks Autoweek and New York Times. I know the stereotypical American businessman and am myself discusted by the behavior I have witnessed globally. That is not the norm however, and doing business with America has had many benefits globally. The virtues of America is not found in it's auto industry. We do not develop autos for the world to admire nor care if snotty asians or Europeans make cultural presumptions based on that. I regret that some people here and abroad feel victomized by America.
America is the greatest country on Earth.
I do however encourage dialogue and debate in proper forum-iron sharpens iron. With that being said:
K&N offer no improvement over stock. Even a stock filter can loose half of its flow and still supply the motor more than it needs. They are used in race applications for there durability, not flow.

 

Thats the kind of thinking that makes people hate Americans. Its arrogrant to think America is the greatest country in the world just because the US is currently the economic and military dominant force or the American way of life is the way everyone should live.

Thats same kind of thinking the British and other European nations used to justify there imperial and colonial polices during the 19th century.

Why do think Europe is dumping so much money to try to save troubled africian nations? Its because they there policies from 100yrs ago caused a lot of the problems those nations have today.

I dont claim to know everything about the auto industry because i only read about on a recreational level, its good to get other peoples opinions on things and see different view points.

The auto industry isn't as important as it use to be as a whole in the US economy, but its a symbol of a countries Industrial prowless. Thats why its sad to see the domestics be successful in Europe and Asia, but struggle on there home turff.

Think about it? Didn't you think korea and japan were third world countries until they started making computers, cell phones, cars and lcd tvs?

 

+1 Mike..... an intellectual wasteland - mental paraplegic - whatever!
Glyn - Saudi Arabia

 

So I am an arrogant intellectual wasteland. You are full of ****. I get sick every time America bails out the rest of the world and gets little or no appreciation. The sence of entitlement other countrys have toward the US is shameful and you should be ashamed as well. Its ok when other people talk about their country with pride. I get called arrogant because I am patriotic and value God and Country above all else. My intellect is unknown to any of you. When you resort to personal attack, you have clearly run out of anything intellectual to say.
I am proud to be American and will gladly clean up the rest of the worlds cultural, egocentric, self rightious atrocities as we Americans have always done.
I will not tell you how great your country is. Is that what you want? Am I put-off by your own nationalistic views? Do I need to be some kind of appolagist for America so your sensetivities preserved.
I embrace quiet pride.

 

Okay guys, while I can appreciate good debates on patriotism and whatnot, could we please keep this thread on topic of K&N.

If you guys want to start a new thread in off topic forums, that's fine by me, but I think for the sake of those that want to discuss/debate the K&N filters in further detail, it would be much appreciated if we could stay on that subject matter.

Thx,
Drex

 

Absolutely & understood

 

Sorry I took a bit of offence to what I considered a disparaging position toward my native country. I digress as we are all anonymous here for the most part and I refuse to make personal presumptions about anyone who posts here and I ask for the same respect. I don't think I have articulated my thoughts very well in this forum and will reconsider any post I make as being constructive. I value and respect all who come here to contribute and will "thicken my skin" a bit against those that do not.

 

Some forums argue about serious mods..... this forum is stuck on arguing about air filters. :P
Sheesh...... what's next.... the K&N sticker? will I gain another hp if I put it on my car?