Common suspension noises and solutions
 

I'm creating this thread because I see threads created on a weekly basis discussing the same kind of stuff over and over. I have gone through nearly every single noise (squeak or clunk) imaginable that can originate from the suspension. Im hoping this thread can be a collection of all of our best knowledge and become the place members can look for any sort of noise that may occur while owning a w203. Additionally, I am hoping to provide the most (cost) efficient means of pinpointing and resolving unwanted suspension noises.

I highly suggest purchasing a silicone based water resistant lubricant a spray and a grease - all suspension parts will have metal on rubber contact/friction and these types of lubricant last a LONG time and will not corrode your bushings.

Much of this stuff is straight forward to long time members, but hopefully this thread will help out our new members.

Front:

Attachment 382846

Attachment 382847

Attachment 382848

Clunks:

1: Sway bar end links (50). This is the most common cause of clunks on the front suspension. The end link nuts may come loose and need periodic tightening.

2: Front Lower control arms (140). Take a look at the control arms and if they are leaking fluids - the bushings are worn and must be replaced. If you can find a hydraulic press, you can replace just the bushing, but most places will recommend replacing the entire arm because it can be purchased w/ the bushing in place.

3 (Aftermarket) (50): Adjustable sway bar end links. If your car is lowered (alot) and you have adjustable end links, you could potentially have your end links adjusted to be too long. The result is your long end link will knock with one of your lower arms. Not good. Shorten the arm or raise the car.

Squeaks:

1: Sway bar end link bushings (50). Spray with lubricant and go for a test drive. If the sound goes away, then you should replace the sway bar end links.

2: Sway bar bushings (20). Like all other bushings, these can get old and make noises. Apply lubricant liberally. Removing the brackets to get to the bushings is sort of a pain - there are very long bolts holding the brackets in place.

3: Strut bearings (115). This most commonly occurs when people have installed their suspension wrong after installing new parts. It has to be properly positioned in the strut tower otherwise it will make noises when turning and during driving. Additionally, this piece is known to wear down over time and compromise handling. Its a good item to replace and check if your car has noises from the front, but possibly the most difficult to deal with because it requires removing the entire strut/spring assembly.

Rear:

Attachment 382849

Attachment 382850

Attachment 382851

Attachment 382852

Clunks (not many clunk issues from the rear):

1: Sway bar bushing brackets (50/60). Need to be tightened - happens all the time to people installing new hardware.

2: Sway bar end link (70). Needs to be tightened - happens all the time to people installing new hardware.

Squeaks:

1: Sway bar bushings (20). These bushings are pretty well exposed to the elements under the car and can often wear down and need lubricating or replacing.

2: Sway bar end links (70). These endlinks have two ball joints in them when are notorious for failing and causing all sorts of noises and should be replaced. Replacing the arm requires a special 12 sided tool.

3 (aftermarket) Adjustable camber arms (470) - These arms are exposed to the elements and have two metal ball joints. Most arms come w/ a certain amount of lubricant on the arms - I suggest putting on tons. You WILL have to eventually reapply depending on the weather your car sees.

4: Lower control arm bushings (70/80) - These get old and could use replacing. This is the most difficult and time consuming rear suspension squeak to fix. Spraying w/ a lubricant does not work well to test it, so replace these as a last effort to eliminating your rear suspension squeak. If you have a hydraulic press you can replace just the arm, but there is another bushing that attaches to the rear wheel hubs that should also be replaced at this time. Just replace the whole arm for simplicity sake.

5 (not really suspension but too common): Rear lug bolts are too long. When installing new wheels (OR the spare tire), be sure to use the proper length for your lug bolts. Compare the length of your new wheels and lugs with your stock wheels and lugs. They should both come out the back side of the wheels roughly the same length. If you installed bolts that are too long, you will hear lots of noise and probably lose the functionality of your parking brake. You will have to have the parking brake mechanism replaced.

Hope this helps consolidate all of these topics into one giant thread.

Thanks to glyn for providing the images.

:zoom:

of course this needs a sticky! always helpful as usual

I actually had a front end clunk due to worn sway bar bushings (20). They were so worn (after only 60k) that the bar actually rattled within the bushing. I replaced AND lubed and alls well.

Henry

Great job Tru! - If others have other experiences this is the place to post them - Let's keep the whole lot in one place!

Good example - Front sway bushes from Henry.

What if the clunk is only coming from the driver side and only when I turn. I have a c230 ss with cut h&r. Thanks again

Proper lubrication is always a good thing!

++

If you're not getting a clunk while driving, I imagine your issue to be something steering (rack) related. Maybe someone w/ more experience w/ steering can chime in.

If it's non of the issues covered by Tru's comments then check Rack bolts & rack bushes.

Great thread! One of the most useful on this forum!

Thanks Tru.

Just one helpful tidbit:
The front lower control arms are made from aluminum (silverish in color)
The front upper control arms are made from stainless steel (black in color)

Most independent parts suppliers know the difference only by the color, so keep this in mind.

Thank you for the thread!

I had clunk/rattle up front from sway bar end links. I replaced them and problem solved... for a month. haha

My car's lowered on H&R Sport springs and needs shorter sway bar end links, IMHO. Cause it eats stock sway bar end links like candy.

But where do I get shorter sway bar end links?

Thanks!

Rockin' thread John !! Sticky for sure.

Useful info!

If your springs are not cut, I dont believe your H&R sport springs would be so low that your end links need to be shortened. Your tires would need to be tucked for you to bang your sway bar/end links against the lower arms (i know this all too well - its why my car is raised to where i have about a finger's gap between the tire and the top of the fender up front). Your end links are probably just worn down over time.

Also, I havent heard of anyone on H&R springs that has ever had this issue.

BTW - the last time I heard about adjustable front sway bar end links was from Code3Performance. I dunno where they have gone.

Thanks bro!

Something is killing my sway bar end links quickly. It may be the AMG reps too. I think I killed the sway bar end link going over a speed bump while turning... But I don't need them anyway. :)

very very informative ...thankx Tru.....I vote for sticky too.......now when I am down there I will be lubricationg all the bushings for sure.....

Excellent writeup, sir.... Thanks for taking the time on it!

Part Number Please on Upper & Lower Arms.. am thinking of changing out mines :-)
good info tho.. Tru!

Also would the C32 & other W203 Would carry the Same Part number?

thank YOu

I may have a problem with my steering rack. It has a slight play and makes a knocking sound. It also has a loud knock when going over speed bumps (only on the driver side area).
Any idea on how much it would run me to replace this. Thanks!

You can get a re manufactured complete rack for 421.89 - 125 core charge so for like $300 you can get the rack then you just need to install it. That is from rock auto btw. :y

Thanks buddy! I'll post a report here for future reference once I get this done.

Great post.

My car does this stuff, too, and it is not a steering rack problem. Getting new swaybar endlinks and bushings this week to solve the speed bump problem. They're also going to dig deep to diagnose the pop-pop-pop or knock-knock-knock sound but they have said it is not the rack.

Just FYI. I'll post up the results.

Subscribed! Great thread!

Thanks,
Dave

I had this problem. Driver's front side. Fixed at dealer.

I could look into it further for you, but basically I remember them telling me they replaced the "upper portion" of the strut assembly. Whatever that means. It fixed 90% of the problem. I still probably have and endlink issue.

http://www.partsgeek.com/catalog/200...rut_mount.html
i bet this is what they replaced.

Yep, I bet that's it, too. I'm trying to decide right now how much longer to keep the Benz and decide from there just what level of reconditioning I am going to do.

Great post and I'm glad someone posted this. My front suspension is going to **** it seems with the squeaking. Car is always handled with extreme care but the morons at my off-campus apartment thought it's a good idea to put dual metal speed bumps. :X

Hi guys...have a quick suspension question related question for ya.

When I go over a speed bump at a moderately high speed, and when the front wheels "land" after the bump and the cars weight presses the front suspension down, I hear a loud click from the front left wheel area. Its only a single click...

I figured it might be a loose end link, but tightening both ends hasnt resolved the problem. Any suggestions on what to check next?

Can anyone recommend a brand, etc?

Check the front control arms(upper and lower).

Anyone know were squeaks can come from when turning steering wheel? It only happens when temp is low. I just had $1000 worth work done to the front end.It seem like an on going battle with the suspension on these cars.

They were replaced only about 2 months ago...there is no lateral or vertical play in the wheels. That is supposed to be a test of all suspension components...which is why im lost for ideas.

I completely agree...Ive just learnt to live with some minor squeaks, etc for now. Seeking perfection like when the car was new can get very $$

I think as long as everything work,I'm just going to ride it out.

can always buy a can of spray lubrication and spray all the joints and moving parts.

:eek:

My car has always been crawled over speed bumps. My suspension is holding up fine.. I had a very thorough inspection done on it a couple of months ago and they could find no problems even at 98,000 - said even the end links were fine.

I would also suggest going over the speed bumps at a lower speed. I have to do it the lowered car way and at an angle or fine another way around. I do not like hearing the sound of my cf lip scrapping.

My car started to make a noise only when reversing and if im turning the wheel. Sounds like passenger front side of the car. Any ideas what to check first?

Matt, no control arms/bushings/end links ever replaced on your car?

Thats an anomaly! Pretty much everybody local who owns a W203 has had all control arms/bushings/end links replaced at least once. Some up to 3 times within the first 100,000 miles.

Maybe its the driving in the crazy snow with wheels constantly spinning out of control that causes pre-mature failure, or maybe the extreme cold kills rubber bushings faster...

Agreed! I just want to make sure I catch major issues before they become major...but for now this is a non-issue. The only time I go over bumps at anything more than a crawl is when I dont see the bump till the last minute lol.

What kind of noise is it?
If its a rubbing/scraping noise, check the dust cover just inside the wheel.
If its a vibrating kinda noise (which you can also feel), check the inner end of the upper and lower control arm (the spindle joint). The busings are probably worn.

Sounds like a clunk or a knock. like knock ...... knock...... knock dots = a pause lol

It hasn't really bugged me because it only does it when i reverse and have the wheel turned

LOL nice description!

Yeah I dont think suspension noises are worth fixing until it becomes a major issue, because they will never go away fully...from my experience!

I recently had the upper and lower (front L & r) control arms, l & r endlinks and rear bushings replaced. Suspension still knocks and ticks randomly :S

Nothing replaced. The thorough inspection of every single part by my indy mechanic didn't come up with anything that needs to be replaced. Everything is fine. I don't have any noises, vibrations, uneven tire wear, alignment issues etc.

I am now having a problem with my 03 coupe's front suspension. The front left wheel at times feels like it's hopping. When making left turns or applying the brakes. Going straight down the road, it feels fine. My front end has had no problems until this. The car has 134,000 miles. Any thoughts?

Any cupping on the tyre LHS. Could be the damper strut failing.

Speed Bumps
 

There is another good reason to take it easy over speed bumps - to preserve your Cats.

The biggest single cause of premature Cat failure is going over speed bumps fast while the catalyst is incandescent.

why would the strut causing hopping? just curious i am not the best with suspensions that is why my car is at the shop getting the front shocks put on as well as lots of steering parts.

Hi Glyn, The tires look ok. This problem just started in the last 2 weeks and the snow tires I have on there now were put on the first week of December, so that might be why there is no cupping.

I jacked up the car to check the suspension. Everything feels solid. The lower control arm bushing has some minor cracking on the edges but no sign of a leak. You may be onto something with the damper strut.

Inadequate damping of the wheel allowing it to bounce instead of remaining in contact with the road. Do a quick read up on shock absorbers & their function on the internet

Bounce the LHS of the car & see how quickly it settle. It should rise once & immediately settle. Alternatively get it onto a shock absorber tester - usually a free service.

Good to know! People get annoyed with me sometimes in parking lots because I literally crawl my car over speed bumps at <1mph

I had this exact same problem.

The bushings on your upper or lower control arms are probably shot. Grab a pry-bar and see if the control arms move about when you pry the bushing.

Saw this post after posting my reply...

Did you check the outer (spindle) end of the control arms? This is the end near the wheel housing.

If you can move the spindle about or up and down by hand, its shot. It should take much, much more force than your hand can exert to move it.

An easier way to check this is the 12 and 6 o clock and 9 and 3 o clock check.

You have me thinking now. When I was under the car, checking the suspension, I could ever so slightly move both upper and lower control arms by hand. I had to yank at it, but they moved a slight amount.

I did push down on the front left of the car and it rebounded once as it should. The bushings look ok and there is no leaking that I can see, but that doesn't mean they are good. I just might not be able to tell.

Thanks Tru...

got my stut tower bearings replaced this past weekend cuz TWS didn't do a good job installing my h&r's perfectly last year...

so on top of that, i had to replace the bolt that holds the knuckle in place. the bolt apparently came loose this whole time and was actually bent when i pulled it out.

10,000 miles after my install of the h&r's and finally the wear and tear shows. now i have to wait until my springs settle again to the proper height since i took the struts and springs out to replace the towers.

My sway bar end links were replaced and took all the clunk away. I used the DuPont teflon Silicone spray on other bushings but that seems to make the squeeks more pronouncable. Is there a different grease (brand name) I should be using on sway bar bushing, control arm busings, etc??

great thread. thanks.

I have made a stupid mistake of using the wrong lugs on my spare, i experienced loud clunk and now theres a squeaky rattling noise coming from my rear right wheel. I took out my E Brake as i thought that would fix the problem, but its still there and its driving me insane. Any suggestions?!

Hello, not sure if im in the correct thread, but I have a 2004 S430 4-Matic. The car drive pretty smooth but when I go over bumps, like on the expressway or driving over sewers or pronounced cracks in the streets, it feels like the front in rattles and the driver side wheel make a clunking noise (only over bumps) and also its starting to feel like a grinding feeling in the front driver side wheel. The alignment is definitely off. Reading these threads, it sounds like either a control arm, ball joint, or sway bar end link. I'm not a mechanical person so please keep things in lamest terms for me. Its at the dealership now and they are saying that the lower front control arms joints have "a little play" and costs like $2100 to fix parts and labor. They are saying "little play" but its like what does that mean, are they bad or not? :wall: I just want to be sure that they are pinpointing the "correct" cause of the noise so I will not waist $$ and have to take it back. Lower Ball joints were replaced a few months ago. Im in the Chicago area.

I hope you didn't spend $2100 of control arms:eek:

Hello all,

More so in the winter than the summer, I get nasty creaking noises in the rear suspension when going up a curb. Another forum member (I'm sorry that I forgot who it was) had mentioned that it was most likely the rear sway bars. However, when the winter months pass I will be putting in H&R lowering springs, should I be simply replacing the stock rear sway bar or will the lowering springs exaggerate the wear and I should be looking to an aftermarket sway bar?

I'm pretty noob at modding, anything helps.

Cheers!

its not the sway bar itself, its the components holding it like the endlinks and bushing. You just need to order new sway bar bushings and maybe the endlinks. the bushing are made of rubber so due to your cold winters it probably wore them out quicker. bushing are really cheap so you dont have to replace sway bar unless you plan on beefing your your suspension. if your a hard drive and take turns aggressively then I'd suggest getting upgraded sways. but if you're a conservative driver then i wouldnt get it because you wouldnt use its potential. You can also buy some lubrication spray and spray all the moving components of the suspension just to make sure its well lubricated and not having metal on metal contact.

I agree w/ Phister.

Purchase some water resistant silicone lubricant.
Remove your sway bar bushings and liberally apply the lubricant.
If the creaking stops, then replace your sway bar bushings.
If the creaking persists, you likely have another joint making the noise.

In my experience, this noise came from a worn lower control arm bushing. Part #80 on the diagram below, but I replaced the entire arm (part 70).

Attachment 378674

I am now creak free after chasing this creaking noise for a LONG time.

http://www.ksportusa.com/b2c/proddet...E0003-1&cat=14

anybody tried these?

Re-up....

For the past couple weeks, I've been noticing a knocking sound coming from the right rear side towards the wheel area when turning slowly right goin up a parking structure or any kind of incline/decline. When I push down on the right corner of the rear, I hear a squeaky-ish kinda sound. Any ideas, guys?

Thanks.

If you hear squeaking from the rear, try applying some lubricant to your rear sway bar bushings (they are visible from under the car and easy to access). Go for a drive or push on the rear right corner again and listen after grease is applied.

If the squeak goes away, you might need to replace the sway bar bushings OR periodically grease the crap out of those bushings.

If the squeak doesnt go away. You may have bigger issues. In my experience, the bushing on the inside of the lower control arm had to be replaced to remove this sound permanently. Much more expensive, but itll work.

Please describe your knocking sound in greater detail. I am not sure if you're describing it from the front suspension or the rear.

Thanks for your help Tru...the knocking sound can be heard from the rear suspension on the right side when I turn the wheel to the right on an incline or a decline...its most noticeable when i go slow, especially in parking structures.

Also, im lowered on h&r springs and on stock struts...car is around 45k miles too...dunno if it has anything to do with the stuts

Thanks for the great thread!

The only noise I get, is when my trunk is heavy and filled with stuff.
Rear tires will sometimes rubb on the rear fender covers. No noise coming from the coil overs.

A clunk from both sides could suggest that your rear sway bar endlinks are worn, but...

If you have a clunk ONLY from one side, I would get down there and make sure everything is properly tightened especially if your h&r springs were recently installed. Also, dont forge to check and make sure everything is tight inside your trunk on that side also.

:doin' it right: :zoom: :y

Hmmm, I'll use the weekend to see whats going on. I'm pretty certain it has something to do with the suspension itself. But oh, h&r's have been on my car for almost 3 years now.

I hope it's nothing too serious, as I make a 45 mile drive out to work everyday...

This is probably a poor description of the sound but here it is:

Last night, I pushed down the right rear corner, it seemed like the springy/squeaky sound the car is making sounded like air was getting compressed and released on each push..

if youre on H&R and stock struts/shocks they might be going out. since youre cars lowered on springs the OEM strut/shock stays compressed all the time causing faster wear because its not allowed to fully travel. If it sounds like air getting compressed I would check to see if the shock is going out. press down on the corner of the car to see if you get rebound from the shock/strut. when you press it down it should immediately rebound back to its position without any bouncing.

if its not the shock/strut then as Tru said check to see if everything is bolted down nice and tight and lube all the moving parts like the bushings to see if it goes away.

Good information, phister. I'll do some work on it this weekend and let yall know whats up. thanks phister and tru

I was able to grease up all the bushings,but sound hasn't gone away. I can tell that the lower control arm bushings and the other top bushings are starting to strip and wear. Reasoning? Poor installation of my h&r springs. I did a bit of research, and the apparent best way to install aftermarket springs is to install em with the tires hanging, and then loosen and re-tighten the bushings and control arms and all the links to adjust to the new ride height. Obviously when I did this mod 4-5 years back (when all i cared about was looks and nothing more), I had no knowledge of this. I jus slapped those springs on not knowing the lowered height would cause the bushings to uphold more load. Solution now is probably to either go stock height or get coilovers and do it right.

There's no way to install springs with the tires on. Doing all the loosening and retightening isn't going to help the bushing adjust to the ride height. Just tighten everything to spec and it'll be fine. The control arm has bushing which allows it adjust when it's placed back on the ground.

If it was required every shop manual would give this instruction when replacing springs and other suspension components.

Lowering shouldn't put more load on the control arms since most aftermarket springs are stiffer. The more concerning issue is when you install springs with OEM struts/shocks still because those wear out quicker. Just replace bushings.

Yeah i see what you mean, and I agree wit you. I meant to say that after the springs have been installed, put the tires back on and keep the car up with the tires hanging. That itself is a good way for springs to settle in. I mean, i hear different things from different people. Others over at this forum say to drive 500 to 1000 so miles for the springs to settle.

Ive thought about either going back to stock (since i commute 100 miles for work every day), go with a coilover kit setup, or get aftermarket struts and replace the bushings.

I say get koni yellows. It has 5 way dampening adjustment for ride comfort and they're rebuildable.

PLEASE before anyone tries to "fix" any of your noise concerns, bring your car to a mechanic to have it checked out. Checking a suspension noise takes between 30minutes to an hour if its a very difficult noise to find.

That being said, "tightening" ANY balljoint on sway bar links will not help solve a problem unless it was recently changed by an amateur who has no idea what he was doing and didnt tighten it enough.
The FAIL PROOF way to test an sway bar link noise is to REMOVE THE SWAY BAR LINKS! Thats right, just remove them all out. Leave the bar in place, perhaps putting some tape around the end so if it moves it doesnt make any noise. This will help quickly isolate whether you have a suspension ball joint making noise, or if its coming from the swaybar+links assembly. Compression arms will make the EXACT same noise as links, so its usually difficult to tell which is broken.

Also, the suspension setup on these cars is NOT your honda's suspension setup where you can just move the wheel updown and side to side. You NEED a prybar, you NEED channel lock pliers and you NEED EXPERIENCE. Otherwise you will buy useless parts and just throw money out of the window.

Save time, money and headaches, get your car to a good and well known mechanic and have it done right the first time (or maybe second, the suspension on this is honestly horrible as far as reliability and diagnostics)

@JOHNSCT
Most likely for these cars, sounds like your compression arm (aluminum control arm with ball joint at the end) is loose. Happens all the time, this type of suspension is notorious for failing every few years depending on the condition of streets.
Could be the shock as well... but that would surprise me.


===
Bonus: sway bar bushings are not always too worn when the bar is loose within them. Often times, the bar itself has "worn" and has become too thin for the bushing. In this case, you can either buy a new bar ($$$$$) or get your mechanic to fix something up for you with some rubber hose. But obviously start with the bushings, they cost like 20$ each.

I hear you and I agree. I worked in an auto shop for half a year, and when I started hearing rear suspension noise I took it back to the guy who i worked with. Mind that he is a master technician, certified by aaa, is still part of a funny car team, and takes classes on hybrid tech.

Basically he told me about why you gota know what youre doin when it comes to modding. I aint gona lie when I first started modding, I was young and was all about looks and whatnot and didnt giv a rats about reliability, and all that jazz.

So wit my suspension, he told me its important to install the springs then put the wheels on and let them hang on the bay. Because with any suspension mod, the geometry changes. With shorter springs there is gona be more load right. So to keep the joints and bolts in proportion to the new height, wouldnt it make sense to loosen and retighten them as to adjust to the new height? It puts less stress on the bolts, and therefore reduce the chance of bushings tearing. Yall prob think otherwise but jus my two cents.

I think it makes sense because youd want to keep everything in proportion. Change one thing, adjust the other to compensate. I aint tryna be defensive. Jus tryin to share what advice I got from a 40 year experienced mechanic. No hard feelings yall

I believe there is some misunderstanding with the terminology which is making things a bit tough to follow.

In my area we dont usually call any suspension component a "joint" other than a ball joint, and even then we say ball joint lol.
I believe what you mean by joint is actually the bushing! In which case you are right about the re-tightening when lowering or installing a new bushing (particularly the ones where the bolt goes through from side to side, not the ones from top/bottom)

The BEST way to do this is on an alignement lift. After installing your component, move the car to the alignement lift, loosen the nut and retighten.
The reason being is that when the car is on the lift, the wheels are hanging low, but the bushing is tightened for that height. So when you lower it, the bushing will twist, which it is made to do, but not THAT much. It is only made to twist a little bit as the suspension works up and down. So thats why on an alignement lift, with the car at the proper ride height, you re-tighten any bushings that are bolted from side to side (example being the rear toe control arm bushing)

Another way to do this, if you dont have an alignement lift, is to simply mesure the distance from the center of the wheel to the top of the wheel fender arc. Then, when the car is lifted, you jack up the wheel to that mesurement, and tighten the bolt/nut for the bushing that way.

Once again, this applies when installing NEW parts, or when changing the ride height of the car only. If youve done neither of these, this wont help. As a mecanic I really try to help out when I hear people asking about these things, because there are many misconceptions and misunderstandings going around (not talking about this website, mostly about things customers say to me lol)


On a side note, squeeks on lowered cars are a general pain in the ass, and while I have yet to work on a lowered w203, I can imagine this to be a nightmare lol. So yes the lubricant spray will help, but dont forget that if you find your tires are wearing out unevenly even if your alignement seems ok, you may still have torn bushings, and in the end the spray might just "mask" the actual problem.

Pardon my poor choice of words, which i agree to have caused a bit of confusion, but i couldn't have explained it as well as you did. That's basically what i was tryna say, but i guess that sets a enthusiast apart from a mechanic in you. Propz to you!

With that said, how many of us actually do what you said in your last post? I certainly didn't. im pretty sure most of the guys in the forum didn't know. i mean, its happening to me since i drive 100 miles everyday for work, so the wear and tear obviously shows. if i had known to do it proper, i wouldve actually gone with a coilover setup lol...but budget was the biggest issue for me since i was in college. In the end, you get what you paid for. spending 250 to switch out springs is always more attractive than spending over 1k you know what i mean?

Anyway, I can actually see the bushings begin to tear. and even after greasing the bushings yesterday, i can still hear the squeak/creaking sound today. I think ima go back to stock springs and get some new shocks since i'm at 45k miles.

Any good recommendations for stock shocks and/or ss springs? Trying to avoid stealership at all costs...

I have not had to change mine or any customers yet unfortunatly, but I suggest you get the bushings looked at to see if they need changing. They should not be squeaking unless they are bad.
To loosen and retighten is not much of an ordeal, and should only take like a half hour at most to someone who has worked on a merc before (with proper tools)

I believe some online stores like parts.com or http://www.mymercedesparts.com/ sell the actual DEALER parts at ridiculously low prices, something like 60$ per spring. Otherwise, check if you have a local euro parts store (they would usually mostly sell to garages) but if you tell them youre an at-home mechanic they usually will give you a substantial discount.

Otherwise I dont know who manufactures OE shocks, maybe ask around to find out. OEM is always the best, all aftermarket parts are usually junk. When replacing shocks make sure the shock cover/boot is in good condition, otherwise replace that as well.
Shocks are extremely long lasting as long as dirt doesnt get onto the shaft.

what part brand?
 

Your opinion? I have a front end vibration & occasional clunk diagnosed to play in the outer tie rods joint, the upper and lower control arm bushings work OK, but show superficial cracks, so I may just replace the entire arms and save hassles with the bushing replacement and get new ball joint, as well as the Sway Bar end link. In looking for replacement parts I don't really see the benefits of MB parts for this, as they seem to wear early anyway 30K.- 50K. miles on average (front end bushings) mine appear to be original as they still have the round bushing bolt at 82K. miles. The brands I am considering in descending price;
MB'z. OE
Lemfoerder OEM
Karlin (?)
Conseco (bushings)

What brand to use?

I would not change everything in one go unless i diagnosed that everything is actually broken.
If the only play you have is the tie rod, start with that. Superficial cracks on the bushings mean nothing.

I would go with MB or lemfoerder, pretty much the same thing. Always check both because autoparts overcharge their parts just as much as MB does.

http://www.mymercedesparts.com/parts...iagram=5775245

Thats an example of the front end for 2002, check for your car to be sure, but those prices look amazing to me, compared to canadian prices of 300$+ for a control arm.

Also, the links could be the culprit for the noise as well as the stab bar bushings

use original parts
 

Hey guys, I just left my indy mechanics shop and he said purchase original mercedes parts. I had him diagnose an engine vibration, and he told me its motor mounts. When he said that i got mad because I changed them 25000 miles ago. I purchased my parts from a foreign autoparts store and I thought they were OE parts. He said OE is an general term. He said make sure the are made by MB. I just changed the entire front end(Struts/strut mounts/Upper & Lower control arms) and they were made by Corteco. the Upper Lower control arms said "Made in Taiwan" so we will see how soon I will have to change those. Also, changing the struts were a pain. I had a my indy mechanic reassemble them and he had a hard time too. Make sure you know someone who has a wall mount spring compressor. I am taking it in for an alignment tomorrow to the dealer because my guy doesnt do it. good luck..

Thank You, for your feedback and sudgestions. I went ahead and replace the outter tie rods ends with (Lemfoerders) and sway bar end links (Febi, as RMeuropean did not have the Lemforders for 2005 W/O sport suspension), that appear to get reid of the occasional clunking sound and highly reduce the vibration. I order the Cortico upper (211 333 11 14) and lower (203 333 09 14) bushings as well, but could not removed the control arms with my universal separator and a couple BFH blows, so instead of returning the bushings or ordering the upper & lower control arms and the Mercedes or after market separator (or equibalent with the 23mm jaw oppening), I decided to order the bushing removal/instalation tool (ebay KTC-20334).
Hopefuly the ball joint are still OK and after the bushings & control arm bolt kit instalation and a MB dealer alingment it will be Up to Specs!. Thank's again.

slightly worn front wheel bearings will also make a loud clunking sound while going over bumps and is a the same noise as worn ball joints or worn tie rod ends.

Every time I reverse I get a loud squeal and only in reverse. I feel like it's coming from the rear brakes. I did the brakes about 5k miles ago and started after I did them. I figured the sound would go away, but I still have it.

When I turn in either direction I get a squeal that sounds like it's missing lubrication.

What do you think it could be?

UPDATE
 

Hello, Replaced the upper and lower control arm bushings (the bushing removal/instalation tool made this a very easy task, it took less then one hour for all four), re-torque all parts to specs on a pair of ramps and had the alignment perform at the dealer, 2 hrs. wait & a car wash $129.95 -15% disc. = $110.46 Unfortunatly now it wonders to the right if I let go off the steering wheel, front tires with 30PSI, rear 32PSI and regardless of the side I drive on a new flat road. Sorry, I could not get good images to post of the chassis test sheet.

left side caster was 10*33' - target 10*02' +/- 0*30' - corrected 10*11'
right 10*12' - 10*03'
toe unpressed 2*02' - 0*10'
pressed total 2*03' - 0*06' +/- 0*06' - 0*08'
left 0*55' - 0*03' +/- 0*03' - 0*04'
right 1*08' - - 0*04'

I am going to call and try to schedule for a follow up.

I was told my bushings in rear are hard and cracked but they said they didn't need to be replaced yet. Now I'm hearing a sound from the left rear that sounds exactly like a rusty bed spring. I can push on the left fender and reproduce the noise I also hear it when sitting or getting out of drivers seat.
I work at a mfg plant and fine sand gets in and on everything
Could the sand be causing the noise or do I need to replace the bushing
Yes I could go to the dealer and hope the guy knows what he's doing and or doesn't try to up sell me.
I lost my fav mechanic and haven't found one that loves my car like I do in Portland Oregon
Thanks!!

I have to replace the left rear lower control arm bushing at the wheel hub.....sounds like you do too ! Same noise.
I need a DIY for this job if anybody has done it, on the car, I really don't want to remove the carrier....
And the bushing part number. I can't find it anywhere.
Thanks

Thank you TruTaing for starting this thread. I had a clunk in my right rear for 9(!) years - finally took my suspension apart and solved this problem! Suspension now is completely silent. WOW. :zoom:

For me, the problem was where the rear sway bar met the end link. I had tried tightening this particular bolt several times in the past, but only discovered last week that all the rattling/shaking had crushed the threads not soon after the initial install, preventing the nut from being tightened properly. In other words, the nut wouldn't turn any more, but the nut actually wasn't touching the sway bar.

The rattling nut had also chipped off all the paint off the end of the sway bar, but some rust paint solved that problem. $10 at the dealer for a new bolt + nut (Canadian pricing, don't ask) followed by some elbow grease, and I was good to go. Car handles much tighter now too (less understeer) because of the decreased play. I'm running the C32 setup, front and rear.

The sway bar end link bolt is now a 16mm hex, while the original was a E14 external Torx. Same part number.

Bump.

Lately, I've been noticing a knocking/scratchy/rattling sound coming from my front end. When either I let go of the brakes and let the car roll slowly, coming to a stop and braking at an intersection, driving over a bump, or turning on an incline/decline, I've been hearing this knocking/scratchy sound from the front left of the car. I'm suspecting my shocks are shot. What do you guys think?

My current suspension setup is: H&R Sport springs with half coil cut in front, no cuts in the rear. Shocks are OEM and i've put about 56k on the car. Springs have been running for about 50k miles.

If say it is time for some new shocks, what would be a better choice to opt for? (1) Going for Koni/Bilstein shocks ($600-$800) to pair with my existing H&R sport springs, or (2) getting something like H&R coilovers ($1000)?

If say I go with coilovers, can anyone tell if I'd need spacers or not? And say I go with shocks instead, would I need spacers? My current setup is: 19 inch MRR GT-1wheels, 235/35 upfront on falken fk452 and 265/30 in back on hankook v12s. no spacers used for my current setup, but barely clears the brakes.

Thanks for your help.

Roc, lets stick w/ solving your suspension noises and stay w/ the theme of suspension noises, but my quick comment about fitment w/ IF you go to COs is that it is all dependent upon your front offset. Your rears should be fine, but you'll need a 25-28 offset up front to clear the coilovers w/ your current tires while standard strut + spring combos for our fronts can accommodate around ET 35.

Addressing your front sounds: Shocks could likely be dead, but before you go replacing anything, id take a look at your control arms and end links. The endlinks are notorious for loosening or just failing around the joints in general, while the control arm bushings are very well documented to cracking/failing. Both of those can make the noises you're describing.

Also - when you installed the springs, did you install new strut bearings? (the black bushing that sits on top of the springs).

RWD Front Tensile Strut / Aluminum Strut (Thrust)
 

Hi,

I have a torn ball joint in my Tensile Strut. 2005 C230 RWD w/ 75k miles.
(I don't have a noise yet - so I hope this thread is okay to post in! ;) )

EPC States to "ONLY REPLACE IN PAIRS"
Can anyone chime in as to why? I don't have bad bushings at the subframe.

Looking to replace my OEM strut with A204-330-43-11. Is that a LOADED strut - or do I need to buy a bearing and press that in? I know I will need a ball joint / ball stud nut - MB# N 000 000 00 3281.

Thanks!

Torn ball joint? Or ball joint boot?

I haven't seen the boots available anywhere ... or the ball joint for that matter. I assumed you would have to purchase the entire arm.

You can buy the Lemfoerder arms for around $100 ... the one you are referring to should be the left upper control arm, also known as a torque strut. (sorry, never heard it called a tensile strut). And these include the bushings.

I think they recommend replacement in pairs because the rubber bushing relaxes over time, and you don't want uneven stiffness in your front suspension bushings ... could potentially cause stability issues during braking.

However if your problem is just the boot, you could (a) leave it as-is and check it periodically for ball joint wear, or (b) find an aftermarket boot that will approximately fit this ball joint and fit it on.

The reputation of these control arms is that the bushings wear out within a few years or so, but the ball joints last much, much longer. So if your ball joint itself is damaged and the car is 8 years old, I would replace the control arms.

Thanks for the reply - it matches my logic and corresponds with “Spring Replacement Logic.”

Tensile comes right out of MB service books / WIS / etc. These arms have a lot of names.

Yes the boot tore and the ball joint has corroded and is shot. It moves freely with my hands on the tire (lifted of course) both at 3 and 9 and 12 and 6. All other joints are a-okay.

Time to-
1.) Lower sway bar from mounts – leave end links attached.
2.) Disconnect the steering knuckle from the suspension McPherson strut (strut is fully extended at rest – no concern of over extension)
3.) Pull ball stud / joint
4.) Remove sub frame bolt (turning nut)

Reinstall –
ONLY TURN BOLT IF ON CENTER / DO NOT TURN IF IN ECCENTRIC DETENTS WITH GROOVED BOLT.

(Right Arm at time of this posting is A204 330 44 11
Nuts are N 000 000 00 3281
Sway bar bolts are N 910 105 0080 37)

The upper arms I believe are aluminum, so I would guess that the ball joint isn't replaceable by itself. You referenced the removal steps for the upper arm. The aftermarket Lemfoerder arms come with a nut so you don't have to buy it separately.

You might consider buying a mounting hardware replacement set for the struts though .. Those bolts are put on pretty tight and you don't want them to snap. Which cascades into --why not just replace the struts now as we'll? And if you replace the struts, also replace the upper strut mount. Sorry .. The fact that you have to unbolt the bottom of the strut kind of forces the issue ... I replaced these all together when I did my car at ~90k.

Thanks for the help Tru. I'll have to bring it in to a shop and take out the wheels off and then go from there. I'll make note of the control arms, end links, and bushings/joints that you mentioned. I already know my bushings have been showing signs of wear for quite some time now, so hopefully it's just that for now. I don't believe I installed new strut bearings when I got the new springs, but I honestly don't remember all that much since it's been so long.

Hi, I have this noise coming from the front right end. It sounds like a rubbing/crunching noise. Does anyone have any idea what it could be? Thanks in advance.

Squirrels eating Cheetos ...?




That's the first thing that came to mind ;) ... but seriously can you give us more info?

e.g. ... From engine bay? speed dependent? Over bumps? Only when turning?

Lol!! It happens when I go over a bump or turn right, it sounds like its coming from the suspension area... And it's an on and off kinda issue, one day it'll act up and the next day it's completely fine.

Is it EITHER when going over a bump, or turning? Or do you have to be doing both at the same time?

Any difference if you do this while applying some braking?

Any difference if you are moving in reverse instead of forward?

And it does not happen when you turn left?

However about when turning the wheel and not moving?

Have you tried bouncing the front of the car up and down when it is in park? Try it both with the engine on and off to see if that makes a difference.

If you have access to a floor jack, jack up the front of the car so the wheels are hanging, then with the engine off but the steering unlocked, turn the steering wheel from side to side to see if you hear it then. If so, then have a friend turn it while you listen and look underneath for the source of the noise, and anything that is moving that shouldn't, or anything that looks out of place.

Also while the car is jacked up, rotate the front wheels. Smooth?

I can think of several possibilities ... and this is not a complete list:
- broken spring (at bottom)
- torn or hardened top strut mount
- worn strut bearing (at top, hidden in between mount plate and top mount)
- play in control arm ball joints
- worn control arm bushings
- sway bar links
- sway bar bushings
- wheel bearings
- power steering pump / serpentine belt
- foreign material (plastic bag?) wrapped up in suspension

Fyi, I have a slight creaking noise from my right top strut mount, which I replaced several months ago but did not grease well enough. The strut orientation/angle changes slightly with steering, and it twists the mount very slightly, but enough to cause rubber to rub against the cup that it sits in if it's not greased. Supposedly a common problem with these cars.

Anxious to hear your further troubleshooting diagnosis ...

First of all thanks for all the information.

As for the noise it's either, usually starts when I suddenly accelerate or brake, doesn't happend when I'm reversing or turning left.....

I was doing some more research and I ran into this old thread..

https://mbworld.org/forums/c-class-w203/244666-front-end-rubber-cruching-noise-over-bumps.html

What do you think?

You car is eleven years old, which means if the rubber sway bar bushings or strut mounts are still the originals, they are likely hardened and susceptible to creaking.

When braking, your upper control arm (also castor arm or torque strut) bushing takes a load. But I don't know these to creak ... I thought they just knock.

The strut upper mount would also take some load on braking. It can creak. Let us know if you have a floor jack to lift up the front end. You can inspect the top strut mounts as well when the car is lifted.

For both acceleration and braking though? Since it's rear wheel drive, the front suspension components shouldn't take any sort of load on acceleration. The front of the car will lift on acceleration and dive on braking, however, which points to the sway bar bushings. Have you tried going over a speed bump around 5 mph so the front of the car oscillates significantly up and down? Do you hear the noise then?

If the upper strut mount were creaking I would expect to hear it creak when turning sharply in either direction, not just one way. And this would also be most noticable at slow speeds, such as getting in and out of a parking space.

A wheel bearing can make noise when turning in one direction at speed. Since there are two bearings, one on the inside and one on the outside of the wheel hub, the bearing undergoing pressure from the turn would make noise if it were going bad.

Is it really a crunching sound ... or a heavy creaking? Is it possible to post a recording?

I suspect I have sway bar bushing squeak, but when I was under the car with it on the hoist, I could feel vibration in the spring itself when it squeaked, so I was wondering about the connect between spring and its seat.

Also I THOUGHT I had seen somewhere a post about an anti-noise pad under the spring at the bottom, and someone saying that they do wear out and its best to get some of a particular material that lasts and doesn't squeak. But on re-looking in history and researching I cannot find such a post and think I may be confusing things?

Anyone know what the actual interface between spring is at the bottom, does it sit metal to metal of what? Cannot get a finger in to feel it even. May be able to get wifes makeup mirror for a look I guess.
Greg

My struts have a metal seat for the bottom of the spring to slide into. The metal seat is 2-3" long ... then the spring is on it's own until the other side of the turn where there is a rubber seat.

Rear suqeak
 

Hi, sorry I just noticed I've missed out crucial fact that it is rear left that squeaks, not front. Was your comment for rear or front?

My comment was for front springs ... sorry!

For the rear there is a different set of issues ... I recall a thread going though them all.

The rear springs should have a spring pad on the bottom...these come in 4 different thicknesses. If you can get it to squeek when it is in the air, try spraying some water in that area and see if the squeek goes away. If it does go away, you know what the problem is.

Noise from sway bar bushes
 

I had the dreaded noise, mainly on hot days? I replaced the factory rubber bushes with non-squeak polyurethane bushes that last much longer.

Just recently had a shop install Teins sport springs and am now experiencing rattling/clunks from both driver and passenger fronts when rolling over bumps/cracks/manhole covers etc. From Tru's diagrams it sounds like it may be #3 with the end links. I don't think i have adjustable end links or am i wrong? Or is it something else?

I could say i've done a lot of research and looking into prior to finally lowering vehicle and replacing oem wheels and I haven't read of anything to needing this end link to be replaced when lowering the vehicle. I'm starting to think the shop i chose to install the springs did not have enough knowledge on the installation because they are now just starting to name off all parts that supposedly might need to be replaced.

Anyways was hoping on feedback from fellow members while I try and get vehicle in my mechanic. Thanks in advance all..

If you lowered your suspension, there are shorter sway bar links that go with the sport suspension. Check under the car and see what clearance the sway bar has now

Greetings all. Been lurking for a while and used a lot of information here for my dad's W203 coupe and since I just picked up a 2001 W203 sedan with 100k miles, I'm tackling some suspension updates. I figured at 13 years old most of the bushings are hammered.

I replaced the front upper and lower control arms (silver and black arms) and a world of difference as expected. The silver arms had bushings that were hammered...

Onto the rear. With so many arms and bushings, which ones are best replaced as a whole vs. pressing in bushings. I'm about to pick up a hydraulic press since it seems worthwhile with the amount of older cars I have now. I don't have any squeaks but a faint hollow popping sound from the rear over bumps. Not enough to be annoying but probably warrants a lot of bushing replacement anyway.

From some searches, it looks like the rear wheel carrier bushing is definitely one to just press out with a home made tool. RE: https://mbworld.org/forums/5630155-post7.html

I believe the rear control arm (the one that supports the bottom of the spring) can just have a bushing pressed in too.

Now for the other 4 arms in the multilink suspension... What are your guys' thoughts on replacing bushings vs. arms? Has anyone done all the arms or all the bushings? I'm having a bit of a harder time finding bushing part numbers but I believe I've located all of the suspension arms as a whole.

The end goal for the car is somewhat comfortable commuter. No track / autoX as I already have another vehicle for all that. It'll probably get a set of coilovers and wheels but I wanted to get the worn parts replaced first before diving into suspension upgrades. Any input appreciated. Thanks!

Thank you JK.... somehow my Teins did not come with the links? But on the other hand the situation has been resolved mechanic claims it just needed to be tightened a little more. :)

This most likely has something to do with your Constant Velocity Joint or CV joint. About a $250 -$300 fix at a repair shop.

I have just replaced my cross struts (lower control arms) and wonder if I may have done this wrong. What kind of noise should I look out for to know if I've done it wrong?

The bearings in question are for the front struts (i.e. shock+spring assemblies), so you should be fine since you replaced just the control arms.

I would like to add that I had similar problem: a loud knocking or rattle coming from the front driver's side of my 2004 CR320 4MATIC wagon each time I would drive over the slightest bump. It sounded as if my car was going to fall to pieces at any moment! My mechanic diagnosed the problem as faulty sway/stabilizer bar end links. Once these were replaced my car was whisper-quiet again! The job cost $486.60 for both front left and right sway bar end links (front). That's in Upstate NY at a trusted independent shop.

puller sizes
 

Hi,

Does anyone know the size of the puller used to remove the lower control arm? The mercedes part number of the puller is: 203 589 00 33 00.
On the internet I found that the size of the upper control arm puller(171 589 00 33 00) is 28mm, please correct me if I'm wrong.

Almost $500 for some end link replacement? u can get some really good end links for under $100 and it doesnt take much longer than a half hour to replace them.. IMO your trusted shop robbed you

I ended up buying both the cup type puller http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Ball-Joint-Separator-Tool-19mm-Benz-VW-BMW-etc-/251638798955?pt=Motors_Automotive_Tools&hash=item3a96d75a6b and scissor type puller http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Mercedes-BMW-Ball-Joint-Tie-Rod-End-Separator-Remover-/151403731562?pt=Motors_Automotive_Tools&hash=item23405d9a6a off of eBay ... I think I paid $20-25 each for them. For the upper arm ball joint I think you need the scissor type since the other ball joint is directly below it.


Ouch! My Lemfoerder links cost $31 each and those were for the sport model ... I think the non-sport was under $25 each. (I just checked Partsgeek and the prices are $37 sport and $22 non-sport). You should have been charged about an hour for labor, since in reality it should take them only a half hour to change them both. A "trusted NY shop"? Well, I "trust" they charged you full price for what they could get away with legally ...

Don't worry .. I've had to pay ridiculous prices in the past as well. Everyone has to make a living, including the auto mechanics ... I would just prefer it be off of people other than me!

At least make sure they put in a reputable brand of part. If they used Mercedes OEM parts then likely the parts cost was 2-3x what I just quoted.

Fyi it's not just Mercedes either -- for our Toyota Matrix the OEM front sway bar links (that look just like the Mercedes) are $100 each!

i changed my own so they cost me about $60 and an hour.. hopefully MissyKins did get some Mercedes OEM from the dealership so the price matches the parts and labor.. and as if the MAtrix has $100 plus for a single end link.. thats ridiculous .. i think i should get in the game of selling end links

Most of the Toyota parts are reasonable ... and then there are a handful that are really expensive. Maybe having to do with whether the part was manufactured in the US or abroad?

Interestingly, Lemfoerder has sway bar links for the Matrix as well ... $37 each at RockAuto ... I'll get those in a heartbeat before spending more than double for OEM.

[QUOTE=jkowtko;6176350]I ended up buying both the cup type puller http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Ball-Joint-Separator-Tool-19mm-Benz-VW-BMW-etc-/251638798955?pt=Motors_Automotive_Tools&hash=item3a96d75a6b and scissor type puller http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Mercedes-BMW-Ball-Joint-Tie-Rod-End-Separator-Remover-/151403731562?pt=Motors_Automotive_Tools&hash=item23405d9a6a off of eBay ... I think I paid $20-25 each for them. For the upper arm ball joint I think you need the scissor type since the other ball joint is directly below it.


thank you jkowtko,

I wasn't sure about the size of the scissor type puller. I'll get both pullers to be sure. I don't wanna end up hammering the crap out of the front axle to get the ball joints out.

They are saying on the listing it "for Mercedes". I just measure mine -- the "hole" is 19mm diameter. On the scissor type the gap tapers out to 22mm.

Steering column play not suspension
 

I noticed a hollow rattling noise which can be felt through the steering wheel. I replaced pretty much every suspension component and had it checked over by 3 different shops. Feels a lot like a tie rod on the drivers side and is most noticeable going over multiple small sharp bumps in the road. Does not matter if I hit them straight or while turning.

I noticed though that I can force a similar sound but moving the steering wheel rapidly side to side about an inch while stationary. The hollow rattle seems to be coming through the steering column.

I've been told it's not entirely uncommon for the collapsible column to develop some play internally. I'm annoyed because I've spent so much on getting the suspension perfect and this just ruins it. My suspension place told me that they had an s class with similar noise (but also had free play) which they fixed by tightening some bolt in the steering column.

Anyone experienced this and have a fix?

If you haven't replaced the steering rack bushings, you should. It's pretty easy ... I created a DIY thread for this ... https://mbworld.org/forums/c-class-w...iy-w-pics.html

Thanks mate I'll look into it. Hopefully that solves it because I hear the steering column replacement is not a cheap fix.

Sounds like what I have too.
Did you listen with an open window - mine makes a metallic clanking sound as well as the hollow sound in the steering column.
Also when I rock the driver's side wheel side-to-side there is some noise in the brake booster area. So it might be the steering column u-joint coming loose(see your shop's comment on tightening some bolt).
I haven't replaced the rack mounts yet, and haven't had an indy look into the noise, but the tie rods look solid to me...

My tie rods are practically new as are my mounts, caster bushes, shocks, springs etc. I don't think they did anything with the rack. I'll get my Indy to check the rack and u-joint next week when he diagnoses the miss that developed after I installed the new spark plugs, sc pulley and psk.

I haven't noticed any metallic sounds. My noise comes up even with the steering wheel dead straight over a rough surface.

https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...9f0cc89f89.jpg


I think it's 25a and 25b which my suspension guy is talking about. You can also see the u-joint here which would require the entire coupler to be replaced.

Yep, that's it.
And those joints are like $250 used... I've been thinking about it for some time.

Funny thing is my 05 c200k has the same loose steering column as the c32 buy no unusual noise going over bumps like the c32. It's nice and quite and hasn't had any suspension work done.

My c200k has the sports pack which looks like a similar brake and suspension setup to the c32 so I'm no longer sure the noise in the c32 is in fact the steering column. Only difference between the two is the c32 is running 18" wheels. I suspect something else is loose which is manifesting up the steering column and causing the vibration.

I would still check the rack mount bushings ... Noises come from the strangest places.

Take off the front engine cover, have someone wiggle the steering wheel back and forth with the steering wheel lock off, and look at the rack where it mounts to the frame to see if there is any give as the rack takes a load. The bushings should be very tight so if you notice any movement in there at all then chances are the bushings are bad.

Suspension guys are replacing the sway bar bushings ... They found movement while it was up on the hoist. Worse on the driver's side which is where most of the noise seems to be coming from. I'll report back with the results once they get installed on Thursday

My sway bar bushings are new (molded into the bar), still have the sound. So replacing may or may not help...

Same here. Replacing the sway bar definitely fixed the speed bump "creak" ... but that was all ...

Yep, I mentioned this on post #3.

Good luck and hope that takes care of it.

Sad to report that the knock is still there. The seat bar bushes do seem to have stabilized the drive somewhat but I'm still getting knocking noises over bumps... Normally when turning/low speed maneuvers across bumps... Like pulling into a driveway. I'm going to swap out the sway bar links next, even though the suspension guys reckon they are still good.

... and then the steering rack bushings :) At least do the check to see if there is any movement at the mount point.

crembz,
I would almost bet it's not end links:) My sway bushings and end links are new and I get this knock. Although the links are cheap and it may be nice to refresh them anyway.

Benz here want $190 for each end link ... Crooks!

I'm gonna pull the trigger on the two rack bushes ... And may do the end links just to make sure. They're the only two rubber bits left to change.

Other than that I'm thinking the 18" wheels might be the culprit... Transferring additional noise through to the cabin.

There are four rack bushings -- two each side, a top and bottom one :) I bought Corteco for ~$13 each.

Fingers crossed ...!

(Fyi, Lemfoerder sway bar links at Partsgeek ... ~$25 each for non-sport, ~37 sport)

Please do some testing after the 4 rack bushes before you replace the end links ;)

Thought I'd report back. Ever since doing the sway bar bushings the clunk noises have intensified and gotten more frequent. I'm now getting popping whenever the suspension unloads... Occasionally even when accelerating and only ever on the right. Not sure whether the bushings have been put in wrong or have come loose. I checked the end links and they're tight enough. I'd suspect shock absorbers/springs but they're only 4 months old. I'll take it back this week and see what they say but was hoping you guys could maybe suggest what they should be checking.

The brackets holding those bushings on are pretty basic ... nothing really in the way of them. I do know that there are many diameters of sway bars for our cars, so I would make sure they got the right ones.

If your car does not have replaceable bushings, i.e. they are molded onto the bar, then you have to replace the whole bar. An attempt to find bushings that fit might end up with a problem.

If your car does have replaceable bushings, then also pay attention to the rib along the middle of the bushing where it seats into the bracket. Some cars have "innies" and some have "outies".

I visually inspected the bushings and it seems that the split ends of the bushings do not meet up at the rear of the sway bar. There is probably about 3-4 mm gap back there. I didn't get a look at the original ones. Is this normal?

Also moving the sway bar up and down by hand induces a noise at the strutt end of the end link. I'm guessing it is loose but didn't have the tools at hand to tighten.

Offhand it sounds like the bushings they installed are for a smaller diameter bar. As for the rattle in the strut area, not sure where that is coming from ... You don't have to remove the sway bar links, or touch anything else on the suspension, in order to replace the bushings. But maybe they did? Don't assume your auto mechanic did everything correctly.

Can you take a picture of the bushing? Can you also confirm the model and year of your car?

Finally, to measure the diameter of your sway bar, cut a notch out of a piece of cardboard or card stock that fits over the bar exactly, then measure the size of the notch. It should be in the 20-23mm range for the front sway bar.

I'll take a pic next time I'm under there. The Benz dealer said that there are 20mm and 23mm bushings available for the car. It's a c32, and visually pretty sure it's a 23mm bar. I have new rack bushings going in tomorrow. I'll ask the guys to re-torque everything... Control arm bushings, strut tops, end links and the new sway bar bushings. At the moment I'm actually jealous of the c200k the Mrs has because of how smooth the ride is ... Make me desperately want a smooth ride again!

So you're talking about the C32 then? I thought that sway bar (like mine, C230 Sport) comes with molded bushings now and there are no separate bushings available.

I would suggest you contact your local Mercedes dealership to confirm whether this is the case or not. if it is, then the sway bar with moded bushings is reasonably priced from Mercedes. I bought mine from the local dealership (in the silicon valley, not cheap around here) for under $100.

-- John

Thanks John. Funnily enough when I called Mercedes they didn't mention needing a new bar, they just said check what size bar you have because 2 sizes come up for my chassis number, 20 and 23mm.

Come on John:)
He says dealer wanted 190 for each end link, how much do you think they will ask for the sway bar? $300 maybe?

If you changed out the sway bar bushings and it got worse, then the noise is likely associated with that part of the suspension. Sounds like you got the wrong size bushings. You can put the old ones back in and see if the noise is less...like before. Or, better yet, just disconnect the swaybar and go over some bumps and see if you still have the noise...if not, then you know what part of the suspension you need to look at.

I have a couple of posts in this thread:

https://mbworld.org/forums/c-class-w...ml#post5616937

https://mbworld.org/forums/c-class-w...ml#post5618957

A lot of confusion around the sway bars ... evidently lots of changeups over time.

If you want a second dealership opinion, try calling the parts counter at Autobahn Motors in Belmont Shores, CA 94002 http://www.autobahnmotors.com/index.htm

Yeah dealers here in AUS are criminals. Here are some prices I've had off them in the past:

Steering rack bushings $70 each
Water pump $950
Supercharger clutch $5600
Intercooler pump $900
End links $190
TCC solenoid $430

I'd be shocked if a new sway bar came in less than $800

Thanks mate, the suspension guys said the bushes they took off were not molded. The bracket looks like an "outie". They're putting it on a jig today and checking it out again. They agreed and said it sounds like the sway bar but seemed confused since the bushes are new and lined up correctly with plenty of lube. Getting the rack bushes done today also.

LOL!

Sorry, I didn't see you were in Australia. It's a crime how much some countries/regions are overcharged for car parts.

For the sway bar specifically I was initially surprised at the low price (I believe it's $80 retail here) ... but then realized that since you can't buy the bushings separately and are stuck with a complete bar just to fix two $10 rubber parts, they much have priced it lower to compensate.

Too bad you can't call a US dealership and have them ship it over there ...

If it's really that large of a price gap, let me know what you need next time, I'll bake them into some chocolate chip cookies and send you over a care package ;)

Don't get me started on the price of tyres! Lol. Thanks for the offer mate ... Your gonna need a production line for all the cookies you're gonna be baking ;)

Anyways the guys recon the new sway bar bushings are causing the noise. They're gonna fit some original mb bushings instead of the bilstein bushings they fitted. On the up side the steering rack mounts have improved the steering feel over bumps. The bar is 23mm with removable bushings. Hopefully that solves the popping noise once and for all. Got the behr and water pump going in this week and hopefully that closes out the restoration and my wallet can relax for a little andi can start enjoying the car more consistently. On the down side I scraped one of my wheels on the way home ... Seriously considering going back to the stock 17s.

Any updates, crembz? I guess the noise is gone now?:y

Hey mate, yeah the bushes were replaced with mb bushes and all the creaking is gone. Still have the loose steering column rattle though, I think I'll get onto that and replace the coupler straight after the quaife goes in :D
Also need to replace the brake pads with something that doesn't sound like a dying pig in low speed braking!

My noise is mainly from the front. From the back I get a rattle, which I'm sure is the sway bar shaking around. I will get to that in the coming days.

But in the front, it sounds like my car has something loose. I can't even drive into a shopping plaza or parking lot that has a slight bump without slowing down, otherwise it sounds like my car is gonna fall apart. It sounds like a big part (maybe shocks?) are lose and banging up and down on the chassis. Not only that, the car is bouncy and unstable hitting even a CRACK on the road. Yes, a small crack.

Anyone have a good idea what I should look at? I'm sure the car needs some new suspension, but I'm trying to tackle this noise first, and come summer I will do a complete swap.

The first thing I would check is strut mounts.

Open the hood and look at the two mount points on the sides of the engine bay where the top of each struct sticks through. Fastened to the top of each strut post is a small straight (1" x 4") metal bracket that should be floating above the chassis metal maybe 1/4". The nut itself it probably covered by a black plastic cap.

Bounce the car up and down. You should see the bracket flex only every so slightly up and down relative to the body of the car. It should flex less than a millimeter. If you see it moving a lot, then the top rubber mount is likely torn.

It that is the culprit, then you are looking at having to remove the struts assembly in order to get to the strut mount (it is part of the strut assembly complete with compressed spring). And in order to take out the strut, you have to remove the ball joint of the upper control arm from the steering knuckle. So if your car has not had front suspension work done lately (or since 2001), then you should consider replacing at this time:

* struts
* top strut mounts
* upper control arms

Additionally, to remove the bushing side of the upper control arm you have to remove the sway bar bushing brackets, so also consider replacing at this time:

* sway bar bushings.

The following additional items may also need to be replaced, but they can all be replaced independently without requiring removal of any of the above or each other:

* lower control arms
* sway bar links
* sway bar bushings.

If you do the bounce test and that top bracket does not appear to flex excessively but you still feel poor control and/or get lots of noise, then your struts just might be shot. Unfortunately that's about the same list as above for the top strut mounts ... I would suggest replacing the strut mounts whenever you replace the struts, since you have to disassemble so much to get to either part.

There is one other possibility that I've heard of, which is a broken spring. You should be able to check the spring by visual inspection if you jack up the car and remove the tire. The entire spring is in plain sight.

Let us know what you find!

Thanks. John

Hey folks, there is this knocking sound coming from the front passenger side feels like some metal rubbing on each other when turning full right lock, at first it was the struts nut loose so the spring was snapping from its upper mount plate but we fixed it and its fine now but the sound is still coming im wondering if its the sway bar now need to be replaced , does it create that noise?!

The first things to look at are the castor/thrust arm bushings for cracks & damage. Common issue. Then check the sway bar drop arms.

Well glad you mentioned it, i went under the car a hour ago and i recall the thrust arm bushings had cracks in them on both front sides but more noticeable on the passenger side, all this time i thought the problem was in the strut area but that doesnt seem to be it.Ill change em bushings tomorrow.

Benz had a bulletin out on this issue. Bushes were improved. Changed very early under warranty on my old C240 & never another issue.

Nice, well mine is on 110k miles atm and i never changed any suspention parts yet except for struts.Heres 2 pics i took under my car


https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...6ca9f4e61f.jpg


Left thrust arm bushing.


https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...6991efbfc5.jpg


Right thrust arm bushing

Those are the camber arm bushes. Look at the castor arm bushes.


https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...abc9f42fe5.jpg


https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...fcb1b799aa.jpg


https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...a1729ee8e3.jpg

oh my bad then, well i recall those one had some oil on em well at least on the passenger side..similar to the first pic you posted but with less oil plus it had cracks in em too , all 4 arms (Camber/Castor) in the car.Do you have any idea how much per piece?

The castor bushes are silicone fluid filled & leak when they crack.

They used to be about US$20 each.

Here is the bulletin. Ignore VIN numbers. It was a general problem.

https://mbworld.org/forums/attachmen...h-bulletin.pdf

ok cool, ill get em changed by tomorrow hopefully, thank you glyn,appreciate it.

So it finally got nice enough and I went out and popped the hood open and checked the mounts. I bounced the car up and down on both sides of the front and I heard a "squishy" sound when it would bounce back. Like either fluid was being squirted, or air was pushing out. There was no movement in the mounts themselves. Does that mean my shocks are shot? It sure feels like it, it bounces like a stripper twerking!

If the top mount rubber isn't flexing excessively and the car bounces a few times, then it sounds like the struts. You could look for a second opinion, but if your car has 100k miles on it and the shocks/struts have never been changed, then it is likely they are shot.

I would replace the fronts and rears all together. I suggest you also consider replacing the top strut mounts -- an extra cost, but you don't want to have to go back in there in a few years to replace them.

Not necessarily, I changed my bushings believing they were causing the creaking/squeaking in the front and the new OEM ones only made it worse. They were a good fit and the techs at the dealer said they didn't use any lube so I was bit puzzled, the only other thing I touched during replacement of the bushings were the sway bar links and I went and replaced those, noise went away.

Hey folks, are the front camber adjustable?!

Yes. You use fluted bolts that allow the mount points of the upper and lower control arm bushings to be moved a few mm in each direction. See this thread:

https://mbworld.org/forums/c-class-w...-question.html

okay folks, i have a weird problem happening here.I hear a clunk noise when the car is idle and i turn the wheel to the right side , it happened a month ago when i heard it , all i did was i lowered the rear even more and the noise was gone but now its back .

PS: i have changed every single bush needed in the front suspension.Maybe if i go more low at rear , itll fix the issue again lol .

May be wrong here, but might be a control arm. Mine did the same early on when I had it, once I replaced the control arms, it went away.

You are right, i just check mine today and the whole needs to be replaced.Thanks man.

So it looks like I have a failed front L lower arm ball joint (155k km). Would you guys recommend a) replacing just that arm, b) replacing both front lower arms, c) replacing all 4 arms in the front, or d) something not listed here? All 4 bushings are cracked, but as we all know, MB sells these bushings separately. Both tie rods were replaced at 100k.

Also, has anyone tried using an odd number of fluted bolts? Doing a quick calculation based on my current camber/caster settings, it looks like I may only need 3 sets instead of 4 to bring the car within spec. Wondering if this is a good idea.

Thanks in advance.

Unless is due to a accidental mishaps when new or near new, this are parts that should be changed in pairs for both sides. I only change the bushings in both lower and upper control arms, it was not that difficult or time consuming (+/_ 1 Hr.) using the bushing removal tool with the control arm still on the car. Now, the outer tie-rod ends was a PITA to separate. I don't understand why you would only need 3 out of four flouted bolts, even if one connection is or will be with in specs after an alignment, I would think is better to have all 4.


I installed the 4 fluted bolts and to this day and four alignments in the last 13.5K. miles, 2 at the MB dealers my car still pulls to the right. I can not get this "A__ H___S" to follow what Mr. Ruke's posted MB bulletins say. They have given me at least 4 sets of run of the mill excuses, to do but the minimum with different with-in factory tolerances final specs and the same slight pull to the right results.

^ This is exactly why I'm wondering about using 3 fluted bolts instead of 4. That's the only way I know of for increasing the caster on the passenger side but not the driver's side, to get rid of that pull to the R. Also, for some reason, if I use 2 fluted bolts on the front R wheel, the camber goes out of spec. Remember, my car is lowered, so the current wheel values are all going to be slightly wonky.

Anyone know how long the ball joints are supposed to last? This is why I'm considering replacing the entire arms and not just the bushings. As mentioned above, one of my tie rod ball ball joints failed at 100k km, and now one of the control arm ball joints failed at 155k. Wondering if the 3 remaining original ones are also about to go. Car suspension has not been damaged in accidents.

100k mi is long enough for these ball joint to last ... I suggest replacing the entire control arm as these are integral components of a very beefy suspension and you will have to replace them only once every several years.

Regarding the fluted bolts, buy all four. You can still set them in the center position, but it's good to have the ability to make adjustments whenever needed.

Regarding pulling to the right, that continued off and on in my car until I replaced the steering rack bushings. The worn bushings were allowing the rack to move a bit left-to-right, so when I drove on a crowned road the steering would "lean" from the crown and as a result the car would pull. Check out the other threads on this forum regarding steering rack bushings ... I suggest you replace them as it is fairly easy to do.

“4 Sets of excuses” – simple fact is FULL/PRECISE FRONT AND REAR WHEEL ALIGNMENT IS NO MORE!!


Since the mid ’90 model’s, with the ever increasing speed of assembly lines there has been no front or rear Camber (or front caster) adjustment facility fitted OEM.


We saw the need therefore “to fix it right the first time” by designing, developing, patenting (and re-instating from the 1990’s) fully adjustable front (and rear) suspension for virtually all models.



The current K-MAC kits have up to 4 times the adjustment of the one only position offset bolts (both positive or negative). And unlike these one only position bolts that require labour intensive jacking and disassembly each time to alter, K-MAC kits only require use of a single wrench to adjust on car (under load) direct on alignment rack.


Providing “ongoing” full, precise adjustment of both Camber and Caster settings to resolve costly premature inner edge tire wear, improve traction and resolve steering pull.


Essential to return vehicle to factory specs after curb knock damage, altering height, load carrying or fitting wider profile tires/wheels.


With the front Caster adjustable “2 axis” bushes also allowing improved hi-speed directional control, better traction/braking and steering response. Along with reduced dive/lift on brake and acceleration.



The rear Camber adjustable bushes also include extra Toe adjustment to compensate for the new Camber facility.
https://mbworld.org/forums/attachmen...-suggest-4.jpghttps://mbworld.org/forums/attachmen...ari-grey-5.jpg

The hassle and alignments cost are adding up!
I have conceder the K-mac's well regarded solution. However my main issue at this point, is that the alignment tech's are not following the correct fluted bolts installation alignment procedure.

That's because it's a non-trivial procedure. Most alignments involve loosening a bolt and turning it, or inserting/removing shims. In the case of the W203/W204 chassis, you have to remove the bolts, and for the uppers you also have to remove the sway bar brackets in order to remove the bolts. You're in a sense disassembling part of the suspension in order to do the alignment.

I wouldn't expect the traditional alignment shop to touch caster/camber on our cars. Nor would I trust them to tighten it up correctly either. (you must tighten the bushing bolts with the suspension resting at normal height, otherwise you will ruin the bushings.)

I know that, I install all the parts. Is not dark Science or Art, The alignment can be tedious but is just a mechanical procedure that involves a alignment machine... just nuts and bolts.

... and you have to lift the car off the front wheels ... do alignment machines do that nowadays?

Thank You, That goes with out say, for this or most cars. They were told to correct the steering problem. I anticipated having to pay for additional labor... check tire pressure, ad 75 Kilos on the driver seat, removal of the sway bar clamps to gain access to 2 of the control arms bolts, removal and adjustment to the other 2 control arm bolts, torque everything with the car bearing its weight (as I did) and reseating the car on the alignment machines as needed. The problem is that Mercedes as well as the indy appear to simply adjust the toe with out regard for the caster and camber adjustment.

“....ALIGNMENT TECHS ARE NOT FOLLOWING THE CORRECT FLUTED BOLTS INSTALLATION ALIGNMENT PROCEDURE”.


Go easy on them!!


It’s no wonder - when after all they only have a one offset position bolt to work with. No precise adjustment and then only a minimal 1/8 of an inch change can be achieved.


Simply no comparison to the K-MAC front Camber and Caster accurate/precise adjustment system – which also offers up to 4 times the adjustment range.


With no labour intensive disassembly required to change settings.


The unique patented design allows ongoing adjustment on car to easily return to factory settings by use of a “single wrench” to precisely adjust (accurately under load direct on alignment rack) to achieve (the first time) precise settings.


A similar system also manufactured for the rear – Camber with extra Toe adjustment.


Finally (and only with K-MAC) the statement “Full Front or Rear Alignment” is once more!!
https://mbworld.org/forums/attachmen...-suggest-4.jpghttps://mbworld.org/forums/attachmen...ari-grey-5.jpg

https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...deed430287.jpg

The rear in my W140 has been getting worse and worse... Now its a constant creaking.. really noticeable getting in and out of her.

We had her on the hoist recently and the stethoscope showed the creak was coming from the lower suspension arm, where the spring is inserted.. (highlighted in red) So, during servicing today the springs were compressed to check the rubbers... and they were fine.
Shock absorbers were dry and dusty.

Any ideas?

Ben

Had the same problem this year. It was hard to identify where the noise was coming from unless you have the vehicle raised and the rear wheels loaded while rocking the vehicle. It is most likely the outer rear wheel carrier bushing (part 20) in the diagram. Parts are readily available online and it can be replaced yourself. I was going to do the inners as well and press new ones in, but even in a press I couldn't get them to move and didn't have the time to burn them out. If you do that I would recommend buying the complete arm.
The spring does not need a compressor. If you have a jack under the arm while you are unhooking the shock and removing bolt 90 you can then just let the arm swing down and remove the spring. I used a busing installer for another application and with some maneuvering with various size sockets push it out and re install. Remember to load the wheels before tightening the bushings in place. While you are under there you may want to replace the stabilizer bushings as well.

Hi folks,
Need some advice as my 2005 C230 Sport is starting to drive me a little crazy....When I drive over imperfections or bumps in the road the car will wobble pretty badly. The car almost shudders from side to side. It does this at all speeds and can be quite unnerving at times. I've had the suspension checked, alignment checked, and tires balanced...nothing seems to fix the problem. The mechanics I've spoken to just tell me it's how the C Class rides but I cannot imagine for the life of me that this is how the vehicle should behave. Any advice greatly appreciated!!
Chris

Sedan or coupe?

Sorry, this is not "just how the C class rides". These cars have great suspensions. I have the sedan, and it's pretty tight. I put Bilstein TCs on it and that also really tightened up the rear end. But I've never had sideways wobbling.

What brand/model tires do you have? It seems like an overwhelming number of "suspension issues" are really due to bad or worn tires.

When you push down on the rear of the car (either fender), does it go down much? Mine does not -- it's pretty stiff.

Does the problem affect the steering? Jerk the wheel one way or another?

have you had someone watch the car from outsdie while you drove over a sharp bump in the road, to make sure the tire isn't bouncing abnormally over the bump? (bad shocks).

It's a sedan. I have Michelin Primacy's all round. When I push down the rear of the car it's pretty stiff..doesn't seem abnormal. The steering is not affected at all which makes me think it could be an issue in the rear?? Shocks seem ok...90K miles on the vehicle.

I replaced my shocks at ~95k ... but I would say they were bad by 70-80k. You might still want to hvae someone watch thecar as it drives by over a sharp bump.

Fyi, my son's 96 Accord has a "buck-o-bolts" rattling problem in the rear when I go over sharp bumps. I've completely removed the interior lining and have the rear seat folded down so I have clear view of the trunk. Unfortunately I haven't been able to get someone to drive the car over enough bumps while I'm lying back there, to isolate the problem. I'm thinking that the rear shocks are bad. I ordered a new budget set of shocks that I'm going to swap out and see if that's the problem.

i wish I had a better answer for you, but I am struggling with the same issue myself on the Honda. Fyi here's my Honda video:


Any chance you can post a similar video of your car?

Thanks. John

Hi guys!
This is a looong topic, but realy helpfull, thanks to you all.

My 2002 coupe (I just adopted it in poor condition) has now all new arms, sway bushings and sway links on the front : that's wonderfull!
Now I'm willing to work on the rear: my coupe makes squeeky sounds on any move. When I get into a curve, on any bump... sounds like and old ****!
Sway bushings?

After reading this topic I have questions:
- what do you lub the bushings with? (I did not put anything on the front ones, should I?)
- what special tool d'you need for rear sway links replace?

Many thanks

Hey folks, how to spot a bad upper front strut mount on a c230 sedan kompressor?!i have a sound coming from the driver side when turning left, can see the mount left and right but sure the sound is coming from that thing, im confused if its a bad strut mount or a spring.

You should lube rubber parts with silicone grease. It's not petroleum based like regular axle grease so it won't deteriorate the rubber. You can find it at your local hardware store in the kitchen faucet aisle ... it looks like vaseline, clear/white in color, but with a stronger smell.

Sorry, I don't know what bolts are holding on the rear sway bar bushings. In the front it's torx bolts, for which you can use a 12 point regular socket, or purchase some inverted torx sockets relatively cheaply on eBay. If you plan on working on your car regularly, a torx socket set is a must :)

What kind of sound? the creaking of rubber? sandy grit sound? If you jack up the front of the car and have the engine turned off, do you still hear it? Can you send us an audio or video clip of the sound?

You can check the strut top mount rubber for cracks simply by lifting up the front of the car so the suspension hangs. then peek under that crossbar that sits on top of the strut post in the engine compartment. If you can see any cracks in the rubber below, then the mounts are on their way out.

There is also a bearing in there, a flat donut-shaped slider bearing around 4" in diameter, that sits in between the two pieces of that top mount.

The top of the bearing is under the rubber "hat" that you see when you peek in from the engine bay.

The bearing then sits on top of the "brim" of the hat, that sits on the top of the spring.

When you turn the wheel, the entire wheel/knucle/spring/brim assembly turns, while the "hat" stays stationary, except for some pitch and roll orientation change due to the geometry of the overall linkage.

If you are hearing a noise in there, either it's the "hat" rubbing against the inner body well where it pushes up to hold up the car, or the bearing is going bad and is grinding when it turns.

Less likely but also a possibility, is the rubber flange around the "brim" that closes up the wheel well hole at the top to protect against dirt and debris, and that rubber could be rubbing noisily against the metal.

And also an unlikely possibility is the control arm ball joints that are attached to the steering knuckle, or something in the steering linkage or rack.

If you can clearly hear the noise when you do all this, but still can't pinpoint where it's coming from, do either the touch test (feel with your fingers for vibrations) or buy a mechanics stethescope for under $10 to figure out where it's loudest.

Good luck, and let us know what you find out!

-- John

Yes , i saw some cracks but not that serious , i was told to check the bearing aswell but that i have to take out the whole strut.I have replaced both control arms a month ago .Everything seems to be normal when turning left while cars jacked , the noise comes when the car is sitting on the ground and you turn the wheel to the left , you could hear a grinding sound and its like something metal snapping from its place then going back and there is a sound just like when something hits under the car when on freeway, i looked at the mount and turned the wheel , it acted weird like something is keepin it from rotating so it just rotate to the left then snaps i dont know its just too noisy and the car doesnt seem to run normal,the passenger side is running normal. i will take a video tomorrow and post it here.

Your description of the noise when turning sounds like bearing, but on the freeway when you are not turning? I would normally think of control arm ball joints, but you said you just replaced those.

Can you get under the car while someone turns the wheel? If you don't trust ramps, then drive the one tire onto a tall a curb to create some room underneath.

car runs fine on free way , i went to an indy today and he said its the steering rack but as far as i know the rack doesnt go bad on one side only , correct me if im wrong please.I will have to go underneath it just like you said before starting taking the whole suspension down.

Okay I see -- you said the noise is equivalent to if something kicks up under the car on the freeway. I can envision a bunch of different noises ... a video clip woul really help here :)

Fyi, the rack bushings do wear. I replaced mine last year -- actually a pretty easy job -- I posted my DIY in another thread.

In my case there was side-to-side slop in the steering, i.e. it would drift heavily in whatever direction the crown of the road was sloped. Others have reporting their rack bushings worn so badly that they got metal-on-metal clunk from the bushing core hitting the mounting tab of the rack. Definitely worth checking this out and replacing them if you see any play in the rack mounts.

, maybe this will help :p

Boy that engine is loud! Are you inside a metal storage locker? ;)

It's really hard to hear the noise ... I think I could barely make it out but it's being drowned out pretty well by the engine noise.

Can you hear this noise from inside the car with the door closed?

Any way you can get a louder recording of the sound? Hold your camera right on the mount -- no need for a clear photo ... just need to get your microphone right up to it so the strut noise will come in louder than the engine noise.

Also if you have any large shop towels or blankets, use them to blanket the sound around the shock mount ... believe it or not it will help (I'm a sound guy on the side).

Thanks. John

I couldnt take a better shot without turning the car on , ill take a new video tomorrow with the tips you gave me, weell i can hear the tick tack sound inside the car and i havr no idea wheres that coming from and somehow the engine aswell but itd be pretty low, them I4 engines are pretty loud, one the negative sides about this car I guess my phone has a pretty loud mic too idk lol

HEY GUYS; HAPPY EASTER.
I HAVE A 2006 C280 4MATIC AND AM WONDERING IF THE FRONT SWAYBAR BUSHINGS ARE ATTACHED TO THE BAR OR NOT. IM GETTING AN INTERMITTENT CLUNK IN THE FRONT AND HAVE CHANGED THE END LINKS TO NO AVAIL. I BELIEVE THE BAR IS SWIMMING AROUND THE BUSHINGS AND WANT TO CHANGE THEM.
~88K MILES. THANK YOU!!!!!!

I have a very irritating problem and would love if any1 knew how to fix it.
I have a c200k w203, that has gone 148k km.i bought it about 3 weeks ago. Just switched to summer tyres and now that i can hear almost every sound the car makes (and its not many) i notice that one of my wheels are doing e very weird thing. Before i start explaining i can will just say that while on winter tyres there was a lot of sound around 120km/h (the wobwobwobwob sound) I thiught i just had to adjust the wheels at a workshop, but now i think it might be the suspension.

The problem i have is kinda hard to explain, but its very noticable in a 25 degree turn (to the left and only to the left) at 80-120 km/h. When i turn a little bit the right, the front wheel starts vibrating, if i turn harder it stops vibrating (and it does not vibrate if i drive straight unless at speeds around 140-160 km/h)

If you can post your VIN it will help to look it up on EPC-net.

I thought that wheel noises that are turning dependent were generally wheel bearings?

The weird thing is that the sound is not there if i turn hard, only if its light turning. i dont get it...

Also i could mention that the breakes are uneven on the front right wheel. if i take the wheel off and try to spin the axle around it only goes halfway before i have to use force to turn it more.

Normally that is a sign of warped rotors.

Does the left wheel not do this at all?

Does the wheel pulse at all while braking lightly at highway speeds?

If this is an audible noise, can you post and audio clip for us to listen to?

Thanks. John

The wheel vibrates when i break hard, and the steering feels kinda floaty. I dont feel like i can steer accuartly.

'06 C280 4M SWAY BAR BUSHINGS
 

MY VIN IS WDBRF92H26F786272.

-THANKS FOR YOUR TIME:)

i have only heard noices on the right side, sorry for double posting im very tired.:nix:

It sounds like you have at least a rotor problem. Pads and rotors are easy to replace on these cars, so I suggest you do that first.

When you do the brake job you should also check the calipers carefully to make sure the piston moves fluidly and the dust boot rubber is still intact. You should be able to confirm this when you push the pistons back into the caliper housing to reset for the new pads.

Possibly your control arm bushings are shot as well -- when you brake to a stop sign do you hear some knocking around in the front suspension, and the steering gets a bit squeamish? Thats usually the control arm bushings.

i feel like the steering angle changes a bit when i break (even though the steering wheel is at the same place). I will try to fix the rotor at work, as i work in a milling machine. All i need to do is to make the surface even without ruining the threads right?

I would think you need a lathe more than a milling machine.

The issue may not be whether the thickness of the rotor varies, but that the entire platter is warped, in which case it's going to be a lot hard to true everything up. Spinning it on a lathe should tell you that pretty quickly.

If it turns out that you can cut it enough with a lathe to straighten it out, maybe it will work. Keep in mind there are minimum thicknesses you should comply with ... you don't want this thing to crack under hard braking.

Please post pics of the lathe if you do this.

VIBRATION WHILE BREAKING
 

HELLO JOHN.
I BELIEVE THAT, AFTER A SERIES OF RESEARCH ARTICLES, I CAME TO THE CONCLUSION THAT W203 BRAKE ROTORS AND PADS DO ACT UP PREMATURELY. THAT INFO (I FORGET WHERE I FOUND IT) PROMPTED ME TO CHANGE OUT BOTH MY ROTORS AND PADS TO A HIGHER QUALITY. THE BRAKE FLUID IS ALSO FINNICKY AND NEEDS TO BE CHANGED EVERY TWO YEARS.

It looks like the bushing isn't sold separately, and the torsion bar description says "with rubber mount".

Unfortunate that it will cost more, but on the flip side the noise problem is better handled by the molded on bushings. And, for what it's worth, you get a brand new torsion bar.

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...f70eb12e50.jpg

When I did my brakes three years ago, from what i could tell the OEM rotors were Balo, which were fairly cheap online. I ended up getting Zimmerman coated and (rear also) drilled for a bit more, but they have held up very well.

I haven't touched the brake fluid since I did the brakes, but I did flush the fluid at that time.

W203 BRAKE FLUID CHANGE INTERVAL
 

OK;
CHANGING THAT FLUID IS REGULARLY STATED IN THE FORUM. I'LL TRY TO CHANGE MINE EVERY COUPLE YEARS OR SO. I'VE EVEN MADE THE PRESSURE TOOL TO EASE THE PROCESS.
BE WELL SIR

I am certainly not against changing these fluids at frequent intervals. I have changed the tranny and PS fluid on all of our cars, and at ~100k miles each they run as if they were new.

Keeping fluids in the car fresher and cleaner than the stated maintenance intervals require will certainly not hurt your engine, PS or braking system ... and in my opinion they will help marginally at a minimum.

-THANK YOU SIR.
I WASN'T SHURE.
BE WELL

Thanks Glynn for the post. very Helpful

I have noises and on top of that, the car tends to sway from side to side depending on which side the road is leaning to.
one of the noises stops when i apply brakes. I take it that has something to do with the Brake sleeve bushes.

The plan was to replace the control arms , but from this post, it looks like it might be the strut bearings. is this correct or could it be something else?

is there a way of checking the shocks myself. Ive done what i would normally do on other (older cars) but i the seem fine to me .

this is awesome :), thank you.

I'm having a clunk nosie coming from the driver side fron wheel(i think). It's only when i driver between 15-25 MPH, anything slower or faster it doenst make that noise. Usually only happens when I go into a parking lot. Any ideas?

Thank you.

This sounds like steering rack bushings to me. drive the car up on ramps, and have someone wiggle the steering wheel back and forth (not locked) while you look closely at the rack under the car with a flashlight. If you see the rack move at all in the mounts, then you should probably replace the bushings.

There could also be play in the tie rods ...


I find it hard on the sport suspension to do the bounce test because the springs are so stiff and have a lot of damping in them already. I had to pay attention while driving through dips in the road at moderate to freeway speeds.

sway bar end link? Try driving over small but sharp changes in road height where only one wheel changes height, so it creates a twist on the sway bar. Like when you enter a driveway and the ramp has a small lip on it above the road height. That's when you should hear the clunk of a worn sway bar link.

Thanks for the quick reply :)

I think I picked the wrong sound effect, lol. it's more of a wobbling noise i guess. It sounds like something is loose. Only on driver side and at low speeds. Hopefully by next I can take the car to the dealership but any idea what it could be? :confused:

There is a brake anti-rattle clip that could be missing, bent, or not installed properly. if the noise stops whenever you brake firmly, then that's a good indication.

The noise does go away when I brake. only starts when im driving from low to high speed or slowing down from high speed to low speed. (usually between 20-30 mph).

anything else it could be?

Thank you for helping out. Taking my car on Wed to the dealership and I want to avoid being surprised.

rear suspension
 

has anybody ever replaced all 4 of the rear suspension arms on the w203 as im going to be doing this tomorrow ive had a look but i cant see how the front top one will come off (as the bolt must have been fitted before the subframe was bolted in place ) their isnt enough room for the bolt to come out as it will hit the body ......ive changed the springs , shocks an now the link arms as i have got a lot of floating, swaying , snaking while im driving....it all started after i had a blow out on drivers side which i had to drive on for about 4 miles to a safe place to stop
many thanks guys

Clunk when hitting the brakes; tremor on highway.
 

Hey guys,

2003 C200K here.
Got a huge 'clunk' sound when I hit the brakes all of a sudden (like when someone cuts in front of you and you hit the brakes) -- very noticeable at 5-10kmph. It is as if something metal is hitting something else metal.
(sorry for the strange explanation; I hope it is clear)

It all started a few months ago, when I started noticing this 'tremor' at about 140kmph. Had all wheels properly balanced, even switched them with a different set (got an extra winter set), but tremor is still there.

Took the car to a shop, the mechanic replaced items 90 and 140 in the diagram below, and that is when I started noticing the clunking noise as well.

I am attaching this slo-mo video that I just took (put the phone under the car, started filming, and tried to reproduce the problem -- I know, I'm that desperate). I believe the part in focus is #140 from the diagram. Is it normal for this arm to move that much when braking?

As for the tremor, no idea what might be causing it. It definitely got better after replacing these parts, but it is still there.

Any help/ideas would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you.

Attachment 373098

So my first question -- how did you take that video? Where did you put the phone and how did you move it around?

Regarding the clunk, it sounds like it could be the control arms, but if you just had them replaced and had good quality arms put in (Lemfoerder or MB brand) you should be fine.

Did the auto shop tighten the bushing bolts AFTER the car suspension was set at rest height and not hanging? If not, then your bushings are twisted and will tear prematurely.

When braking consistently is it only a single knock, or a bunch of knocks. Multi knock is what it sounded like for me before I replaced my control arms.

Check sway bar links. Do you hear the clunk when going over small bumps with one wheel at low speeds, such as turning into a driveway or going over a speed bump at an angle.

Check the sway bar bushings. This you will just have to do by inspection for the time begin. See if the rubber looks worn at all, and shake them up and down at the bushing, or use a pry bar to gently press up/down to see if there is movement.

Steering rack bushings ... does the steering have any slop in it? When driving on a road crowned to the left vs right ... any excessive drift with the slope of the road? Get under the car and try moving the rack around a bit ... it shouldn't budge more than a fraction of a mm.

Park the car, open the hood, and bound the front suspension up and down and look at the top of the strut mounts. The top brackets should not be touching the car body, and should move ever so slightly (1mm?) as you bound the car up and down. There should be no excess movement.

Sounds like a failed ball joint. There are actually 3 ball joints for each front wheel - upper control arm (90), lower control arm (140), and the outer tie rod (it's shown in the steering system diagram, not the one you posted). Not sure if your mechanic replaced 2 or 4 (did he or she do both front wheels?) of the arms, but I would look into the other joints that weren't replaced.

Finding a failed joint is quite easy to DIY. Just jack the car up, and take a long metal rod (a large screwdriver works) and jiggle/pry each ball joint. Any joint with play is bad and needs to be replaced. Remember to change parts out in pairs, as the other side is probably going to go soon if you find a clunk.

Front Driver Side Suspension Noise
 

Hi Guys. Im having an issue with a noise coming from the front drivers side on my c230 w203, when i pull in and out of the driveway and have my steering turned. I've replaced front shocks, shock mountings, lower control arm bushes, stabalizer links (i think its also called sway bar links) and tie rod ends. After replacing all of that, i still have the same problem. Could it be the stabalizer bar rubbers or bushes (Sway bar rubbers or bushes)? Please Help

I take it you are hearing a clunk, vs rattle or creak.

* If clunk
- it sounds like you did not replace the entire control arms ... worn ball joint?
- sway bar bushings very worn
- inner or outer tie rod end ball joint
- steering rack bushings

* If creak
- top strut mount moving in body cavity ... needs greasing
- sway bar bushings losing their springiness

Either way, your car is old enough that it will probably help if you replace anything that hasn't been replaced yet. I've done all of the above except for the inner/outer tie rod ends, and I've still got a clunk when backing out of my driveway -- so I still have a bit of work to do.

-- John

Thanks John

Its more of a creak,when pulling in and out,and also slightly when going over a bump.

I will try replacing the sway bar bushings and let you know.

Excuse my not knowing,but the sway bar bushings is located on the ends of the sway bar or in the centre? My mechanic removed what he called 'rubbers' from the centre of the sway bar,and says that could be the issue?

Thanks so much for the assistance,highly appreciated.

They're in the center, maybe 18-24" apart?

Depending on which sway bar you have, the bushings could be molded onto the bar. Mine had the molded on bushings so I had to replace the entire sway bar. The MB price was surprinsgly cheap for the entire bar ($80 vs ~$20 for two bushings) and no more creaking for me :)

jkowtko,

I'm gathering parts to take care of both the Bushings and End-Links. When it got colder outside, they started creaking like an old bed. Sprayed both Bushings and Links = Silenced. My question to you is, you state yours were molded to the bar. Well, it looks like we have the same ride (05' C230K SS/Sport Suspension) and judging by my photos, does this look like yours? Molded? Additionally, when doing both bushings and links, what did you start with first?

Passenger Side Bushing:

https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...69219016a0.jpg


Driver Side Bushing:

https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...d5f5348bc0.jpg

Those do look like separate bushings. But check the diameter of the bar -- you may not be able to buy separate bushings anymore. I may have had my sway bar replaced early on under warranty (I might have complained about creaking, I don't quite remember) and if so, then they would have swapped in the molded bar at that time.

As for which to replace first ... I think either one would work fine ... just replace both bushings and/or both sway bar links at the same time.

These are the one's I bought. 21mm Meyle 203-323-21-85 https://www.ecstuning.com/Mercedes_B...1.8L/ES253032/

Let me know your thoughts. Thanks again!

Ps - My Bushings sure look shot, don't they?

I thought we had 22mm bars, in which case the bushings you bought could end up squeaking. If you are changing these yourself then there is little risk other than scrapping the new bushings .. However keep the old ones so you can put them back on if needed.

It appears you're right, they are 22mm. Weird.

Even the Genuine MB Bushings state they're 21mm, when the Genuine MB Torsion Bar is 22mm..

Bushings: https://www.ecstuning.com/Mercedes_B....8L/ES1727683/

Torsion Bar (Code 486): https://www.ecstuning.com/Mercedes_B....8L/ES1727693/


Maybe for a tighter fit? Idk. This stuff is taxing... Good god.

I went through this ordeal of confusion and discovery when I replaced my sway bar. For whatever reason the sport suspension had the 22mm and that size alone had enough of an issue that MB just replaced it with a bar with molded on bushings. I don't have the full scoop on this ... but I do have the bar with the molded on bushings.

Also note whether your bushings have the "innie" or "outie" rib on them. The molded bar appears to have the innies, yet bushings for the other models have the outies. And it looks like the Meyle bushings you just bought are outies as well. I will venture to guess that the bushings on your car are innies, which will match the molded bar. But if for some reason you are switching between the two, then you will need to get new bushing brackets as well.

Are you having fun yet? !!

Front Lower control arms (140) - thanks for the thread
 

https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...4dd8139afa.jpg

Thanks for the sticky. My left FLCA bushing is leaking. This thread informed me I need to replace the bushing or control arm (with pressed bushing).

Forgot to add the leaking substance etched my garage floor epoxy coating. WD40 only picked up the residual. I had to use some Comet but some etching remains. Nasty stuff....

Well, just to keep you updated and help anyone else with this conundrum. You were correct. The W203 2005 Mercedes C230 Kompressor Sport Sedan DOES have a 22mm sway bar WITH the bushings molded to the bar. So, consequently, I had to buy the bar at the stealer (along w/ trans mount). They asked for $181+tax at first, then I talked them down to $129. All of these reputable auto part websites don't elaborate on this. You can buy the sport suspension bushings (Code: 486), but unfortunately they will not fit the bars' 22mm circumference, or fit the stock brackets.

Takeaways...

1. If you have this model car, save yourself the time and buy a whole new bar with bushings molded. It's the 22mm AMG bar. No way around it, if you want to do it right. Sway Bar Part# 203-323-44-65. The rear sway bar is a different story, bushings can be replace separately.

2. If the price seems high at the dealer (which it always is) try to haggle with them, it never hurts.

3. Replacing end-links and sway bar WILL help eliminate creaks, squeaks, and minor clunks for the most part. I'm pleased with the results as it has brought new life to the suspension.


https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...7275db0fd.jpeg



https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...f9f4ef7c2.jpeg

Is there a diagram of how the rear sway bar bolts from the bracket to the cars body on drivers side rear? Mine is a 2004 C320 wagon. Initially appears the bolt securing it to the body upwards, is missing or broken or rusted away. Not clear if there is a nut to go over the top or what yet. I was trying to research it on this forum. I will have to crawl under and stick a tool inside body to know for sure.

I was able to get under the car and probed where bracket bolt held end of sway bar to car. The bolt seams to be broken off or rusted off inside the hole. Looks to be know clearance to push out the top. Im guessing the whole frame assembly will have to be dropped to remove bolt from top. Has anyone had this happen? I'm thinking more bolts will break disassembling.

I have this creaking noise and wondering if this is the case of stabilizer bar bushings going bad. I only get this noise when I go over bumps and braking or going downhill coming to a stop. I have already replaced the struts and the mounts. If I go over bumps and not brake at the same time I do not hear any noise at all. This noise can happen both going forward or reverse. All the parts "looks" good under the car, no cracked or leaking rubber parts., no play in the ball joints with the joints unloaded.

try a speed bump at only a few mph so the car heaves up and down ... do you hear it then? If not, how about if you entry an uneven surface while turning so that only one of the front wheels is elevated?

Nope, only when I'm going straight, going over a speed bump and touch the brakes at the same time. I can go ver the bumps fast or slow, if I don't touch the brakes I don't hear anything. Thank you for replying...

Does the speed matter?

Does it happen anytime you brake? From any speed? Or do you have to brake with a minimum amount of effort in order to feel it? Is it when the body of the car pitches downward when you brake hard enough?

If I go fast I'm sure I can't hear it due to road noise but if I go slow, every time the car pitch if I brake moderately I can hear it creak once when the nose pitches down and once up.

In my experience:

* If it's a creak, then look at the front or rear sway bar bushings.

* If it's a clunk or clatter when driving over a pothole, bumps or irregularities in the road, look at the sway bar end links

* If it's one or more distant "knocks" when braking hard, look at the control arm bushings.

* If it's a creaking only while turning the steering wheel, look at the top strut mount

* If the car steering "slops" to one side or the other depending on the crown of the road, look at the steering rack bushings.

* If it's a knocking or loose joint sound when you back out of a driveway or hit small bumps at low speeds, look at the inner or outer tie rods, or play within the steering rack (this is what I am still chasing down).

You have the same car I do (2005 c230 w/ sport suspension), so your front sway bar bushings are likely shot if you haven't replaced them yet. The replacement is a new sway bar with molded on bushings ... evidently they had so much of a problem with noise from these bushings that they molded them onto the bar. I haven't replaced anything in the rear of the car yet.

Thanks, JK, much appreciated. I dreaded you might say it was the sway bar bushings! The car has really been pretty good to me up till now. I've replaced a fuel pump (which died on me on the highway fast lane!!), strut and mounts, 2 trans pilot bushings (auto), 2 sets of rotors, 1 voltage regulator and an alternator pulley, that's about it. And the reason I had to replace 2 sets of front rotors was that the first set I had was cheap and warp when it got hot, they were Balo or Baro and were like 34 bucks each.
I'll probably just lube them so the noise goes away then turn the car in in the Summer for something else.

JK, One thing I found puzzling is that if I don't step on the brake while going over bumps, I do not hear the creaking. I can also hear the creaking if I go backwards and step on the brakes even without going over bumps.
Have you discovered what your noise come from yet? The knocking noise while backing out of the driveway. From my experience the tiers or steering rack bushing doesn't make a knocking noise. What you can do is have someone turn the steering wheel back and forth and you can see if the steering have any play in it, if not then it is neither the tired nor the rack bushing...

Had a mechanic take a serious look at mine.
The bushes at the BASE of the shock are worn out and need replacing.

However, replacing them means new shocks as the bushes cant be replaced.

As my car is not fitted with the self levelling system, it should be about $400 for parts.

Rear shocks on a 2005 c230, $75-90 each for Bilstein TC, $100 each for OEM Sachs.

Wow they're just as expensive as the struts!! Actually I got mine (struts) for $114 for the pair here in Laguna Beach (they're in Fountain Valley). They charged me $20 for shipping although I could have gone to pick them up as they are only about 15 miles from my house but they won't let me.
How long have you had your car for, John?
Ben, these must be for the rear, yes?

I bought my car new in Feb 2005. The shocks started really getting weak around 2011, and in 2012 I replaced them. So far the TCs have been holding up admirably, and as I understand it they are lifetime warranty, so if I feel they ever are loosening up or if the rubber starts creaking, I should be able to swap them out with a new pair at no charge (maybe shipping cost for the return set if they actually want them back).

Fyi,

* the rears are monotube, and the same shock is used for both sport and non-sport suspensions.

* The fronts are twin-tube, and I didn't know it but there are different struts for sport vs non-sport -- strut length is 3/4" less for sport, plus the sway bar link hole is M12 vs M10, plus the sport damping is slightly less (yes less) than for non-sport. Since i could only find one type of strut I ended up getting the one for non-sport, drilling out the sway bar link hole, and I live with extra 3/4" suspension travel whenever I jack up the car. The car handles very well, and I don't know if I would be able to tell the difference between the sport and non-sport damping rates (presumably the lower damping rate on the sport might reduce resonance on wavering roads at certain driving speeds ... who knows.)

But the car does feel sportier than it did with the stock suspension.

For me the specs indicated that it would fit my car and I didn't even check the link bolt hole till I had one installed so I had to drill the hole with the strut installed. I drilled the hole for the other side before I installed it though. Yes you are correct, it is longer (though I didn't measure it) which made using the spring compressor a little easier! For me I really didn't notice much difference in the ride but I don't go racing with it or anything so it works out fine for me, and the cost is quite a lot less, I use Stagg struts. I haven't changed the shocks yet.
I really don't feel like changing the sway bar, I think it's about the time and mileage when a lot of parts will need changing (i'm still on original water pump and starter). I'm seriously considering the 2017 E-class when it comes out but until then I'm going to need to keep this car on the road as it's fantastic on gas and nimble to drive.

Just replaced a few things myself yesterday and still have yet to identify the culprit of the thrumming sound coming from my front suspension

Replaced in the front:
Sway bar
Sway bar bushings
Sway bar end links
Balanced all tires.

How many miles are on your front struts? have you replaced the strut bearings?

Could you describe how you reproduce the sound?

No idea how many miles are on the strut bearing as I'm not the original owner. I'm going to say it's safe to assume they have never been changed.

Driving straight and at all different speeds it's audible. No vibration in the wheel, just a constant wawawawa type of sound, all brakes and rotors have been replaced as well.

Front bearings possibly?

When you're driving straight, if you turn the wheel slightly left or right, does the noise change? if no then it's not the wheel bearing. You can try put your spare on one of the front wheel and see if the noise change, this could indicate tire noise. This is due to cupping in the tires which could be caused by bad alignment or bad shocks or struts (tire bounce while driving).

I hate to say it, but sometimes tires can make a lot of misleading noises.

I had General UHP Exclaim tires on my car during it's middle years, and at one point I thought I needed a new front suspension, transmission, and differential, there were so many whining, grinding and vibrating sounds. I decided to replace the tires first, and it pretty much all cleared up :)

That is definitely true John. I used to work for Goodyear and MIchelin in my past life for over 25 years. Even tires that has wide vertical spacings on the sidewall (Technical term, if my memory is correct is called sipes) can create noise much like the old Willy jeeps did.
In the old days if you have front wheel drive cars and don't rotate the tires the rear will cup really bad and make noise just like a bad wheel bearing.
BTW all my front end noise is gone now, what I did was loosen the sway bar and greased all around the rubber bushing where it contact the frame and the bracket.

Well, after all the rain that we had stopped, my creaking while going over speed bumps and brake at the same time is back. I'm 100% sure it isn't my sway bar. The reason being I took the sway bar completely out of the car and go over the speed bumps and brake again and I still get that exact same creaking. The rain apparently lubricate whatever was creaking (driver's side). If I turn and brake I still get that creaking if the left front end dip from braking. I'm totally stumped. Could the thrust arm bushing be the cause? I can hear it really close to my footwell though. Whatever it is I have to apply moderate brake for it to creak.

Reply to jcnash post#9, I think you might have the material backwards.


https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...e29da5ae47.png

Had both Front-Upper and Front-Lower control arm bushings pressed out yesterday and replaced all with OEM Lemforder. According to my Indy, the balljoints were in solid shape at 102k miles. I know it's a bit of a gamble doing ONLY the bushings, but for $340 parts/labor, I found it hard not go ahead with it.

I must say, after replacing, the car is significantly smoother over bumpy driving conditions. As you can see below, the Front-Upper bushings were shot!


https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...c8073fc910.jpg

Nice pics of those old bushings :)

If you haven't replaced the engine/tranny mounts yet and you can hear any engine noise/vibration, time to do the mounts. This will result in another noticable improvement in ride noise/quality.

-- John

Haha, no prob! :y I prob need to reduce the size of this images a little bit..

I replaced the tranny mount last winter, so that's checked off the list. I'll need to do the engine mounts after winter; remarkably they're holding up well for 12 years, no issues. Yet...

My engine mounts looked new when I removed them ... however they had "settled" about 3/8", which was effectively bottomed out, and the vibration passed through to the frame of the car. Replacing them removed that vibration and noise.

Good to know, thanks for the heads-up! Haha, it's quite the task getting to all these rubber bushings/mounts on our W203's. I'll keep you posted if and when I replace the mounts :y

-Christian

My 2007 C230 Sport w/86,000 miles has developed a ka-thunk kind of noise when going over even slight road imperfections (such as transitions between concrete and asphalt). Sounds as though the spare tire is loose and bouncing up and down in the spare well (not the case).
A friend who's owned about 20 Benz's over the years thinks it's probably the rear shocks.
Any thoughts/opinions? If I do replace the rear shocks, I'm inclined to go with upgraded Bilstein's, unless someone has a better recommendation?
Thank you in advance for any input!

86k doesn't sound like many miles, I have 130k and haven't replaced them yet. I would lift up the rear and visually check the shock bushings to make sure. Also do a bounce test, if it bounces more than 2-3 times it's bad. It's not hard to check if they're good or not so I wouldn't guess as if it's not, although you have new shocks you haven't solved the problem....

Your car is a bit younger than mine when I replaced the shocks, but mine probably needed replacement about the same time and mileage you are now noticing.

I replaced the stock units with Bilstein TC ... love them. Noticeably firmer than stock but not "hard". It will be hard to change to Bilstein in the back while leaving stock in the front though ... the car may feel a bit odd. So I f you are going to do two I would recommendall four.

-- John

Hi, this is my first post here.

I have a 10-year long problem with rear noises on my W202 from 1996.

These are really strong clunks only when the car is driving and only when the surface is not regular. It doesn't happen for instance on a regular bump on an elevated sidewalk.

However you shake the car when parked (and I mean shaking it for real with machines) no clunk is produced.

The struts have been replaced with no effect. Same for sway bar rubbers, strut bearings and silent blocks brushes (not sure this is a correct term).

No loosening are noticed with any suspension part checked so far.

Nothing else is loose, like the spare tyre and so on.

Can anyone be of help with this?. Thanks very much.

Follow up to my earlier post about the "ka-thunk" noise coming from the right rear of my 2007 C230 over even the slightest road bumps. I took the car into my local German car specialist to have the transmission fluid and filter replaced, along with the brake fluid. I bought the car a little over a month ago and noted from the maintenance history the trans and brake fluid were overdue for change.
I also asked them to investigate the rear suspension noise. Turns out the rear shocks were replaced at 80,000 miles with new OEM, but not by a dealer or qualified garage...instead by a more or less "Happy Harry's Auto Repair" kind of garage. They managed to over torque and strip the fasteners at the lower right rear shock...not so good. New bolts and nuts installed both sides to factory torque and the ka-thunk is long gone!
They also replaced the front lower control arm bushings and the ride is now as solid and quiet as brand new, although I can't wait to wear out the piece of crap noisy Hankook tires and install a set of quiet Michelin's.

My 2013 ML350 makes a loose rattle sound over minor bumps .Only 18K on it.
Anyone have this problem with W166 ? I'm 2 hours from nearest dealer over mountain roads . Safe to drive it that far?

That looks good, however I had the struts replaced without any help, so I discard torque (actually, mine are hydraulic and I tried normal ones without any difference in noise, so I reinstalled mine again).

Front lower control bushes are replaced, too.

The parking brake might also be the culprit, but I drove the car with it half pressed without any difference, so I don't think this is the problem.

I think it must be something that is under stress when driving only and acts only on asymmetrical moves of the rear wheels.

The car is almost 400K now. This noise is its only major problem. Everything else is fine and it carries only genuine parts.

I use only Michelin, too, as these are the safest tires.

Thanks for contribution. Hope other contributions will show up. Non-standard hypothesis are needed at this time...

Rear camber
 

I have a 2005 c230 and just noticed having more negative rear camber on the right side versus the left.I have stock suspension components. What would possibly broken or worn down to have more negativr camber on the rear?

Troubles suspension
 

Hi, everybody.
my troubles is with my left rear wheel have an inclination too much that of the normal.
the paw of my tire are not complete and look the images.
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...91a58107a5.jpgLook the difference between rear to front
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...8711dea69d.jpgPaw not complete contact with the road
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...3b89f50bd9.jpgRight rear tire complete paw on the road

it's a bit hard for me to tell from your pics. Can you show a clean pic of the entire side of the car, from each side, so we can see that the tire is cambered in more on the right? The pics should also show the suspension height on each side so we can confirm that one side isn't lower than the other (which would affect camber).

These cars I believe do not have adjustable camber or caster on the rear. So if it is significantly off, I would first check for damaged control arms/links or worn bushings on those links.

However if you know your car was hit on that side in the past, that could be a more serious issue of the control arm mount points being bent or moved out of the correct position.

Fyi here is a thread on the rear suspension links:

https://mbworld.org/forums/c-class-w...ml#post4568245

Let me check that
 

Thanks a lot let me check the pieces and later I will put the situation of my rear wheel.

I had made a new thread bc I did not see my issue already posted and then found this about noises and see you want stuff like that under 1 thread so here's my post below:

Hi I have a 2004 c240 4matic. 2 Sundays ago as I was driving under 30 pulling up to a light the car gave me a jerk. Kinda like when you're running and someone grabs you and pulls you back kind of Jerk and then it makes a noise that sounds like when you go over those ridges on the highway when you go over the side line. It only happens when I am doing under 30 miles and not braking or accelerating, just driving . At 40 and above it is fine but if I am going to stop without really slowing down I can feel the brakes skip. For a while i only heard the noise and felt the vibration but just thoight i was drivin over ridges or a rough street but now once i hear the vibrating it always follows with the car jerking back. I sent it to mechanic who had it for a week and he swore it was my coils bc the car did shake when idle and he changed all of them. Even though they did need to change, i told him it wasn't the coils bc it was a diff type of vibration. One does not happen without the other. It is either I get the pulling back first and then the noise/vibration or vice versa. I am at my wits end and cannot continue to bring my car to the mechanic. It is affecting work and I just need help with what it could be. We have changed the back brakes and rotors but not front which I told them to do. I DO KNOW I need tires, badly and working on finding a reputable place. Can anyone help me?

P.s. I have no check engine light, I do not smell anything rubbing or burning.

THANKS so much
 

NISHA238

Amazing Post thanks to TruTaing too :bow:.

Incredible very useful.

Thanks to you guys.
ONE for WROTE the post and THE OTHER for QUOTE :bow:

Thunk sound in rear.
 

2005 C240 4 matic with 151k miles. There is a thumping nose from the rear, sounds and feels like a kick in the caboose, happens only when a) putting it in reverse and slowly backing up, b) coming to a stop at stoplight after stopping, c) slowly accellerating. Doesn't seem to do it until the car is warmed up some. Doesn't do it when shifting (tranny seems smooth) or going over bumps or when turning. Mechanic can't find anything wrong. New tires and alignment had no effect. Pushing up and down on the trunk produces no noise. Anyone. PS -thanks for this thread. Took a while to go through but didn't see anything matching.

Hi Devereux.

You need to check the Flex Disks in the drive line shaft. maybe is there the problem.
go to youtube and find mercedes flex disk, and you can see many videos.
If this is not the problem maybe you need check your differential fluid.

I'm wait that this options can help you.

Hi, Nisha238.

maybe you need check your Bearing wheels. for the sound that you mentioned, like a concrete road.

I'm waiting that this was the solution for you

Thanks for your input. I checked out the videos on the flex disks and went into the dealership with some extra knowledge. They put it up on the lift and poiked and prodded and couldn't find the problem but when it came down the noise was gone. They said the flex disks were good and their service records said the car was well maintained and was "a solid car". Mechanic even drove it home that night to make sure the problem wouldn't recreate itself. Drove away from the dealership very happy.

W203 strut mount/bearing noise after replacement
 

So recently ive changed entire front suspensio on c220 i own. However i keep getting noise from front strut mounts whenever i turn my steering wheel. Im pretty sure everything was put together spot on.(since ive reasembled whole thing 2 times) mounts do sit right in place where they should and how they should. However the bit where you put top strut nut seems to be sitting much higher than before.(thats if before strut nut with washer and a plate sat on the cars body(right above strut bearing) now it sits in the air.right above the rubber bit where its ment to sit. At this point im not sure what else i could do to get rid of them noises. The only thing which was not done after replacemeny is camber alligment since most of the shops dont have them special pins to do it. Not sure can this make such an impact on suspension. Any advice more than welcome since im sure there are lots of experts :)

I am planning to replace the lower/upper front control arms as well as they sway bar end links. Still running on the original components after 180,000 miles. Everything appears tight but the noises are getting louder, especially on uneven road surfaces and right turns. I will attempt to do this myself based on all the helpful information from this thread. Does anyone have the part numbers for a 2003 C230 sedan with the factory sport suspension? I would like to stick with the OEM parts from either MB or the original supplier (Lemforder?) My VIN number is WDBRF40J33F379100 if that helps. Thank-you!

If you want MB labelled parts, try parts.com ... that site is serviced by dealers around the country. For my last few purchases from them it has been Lokey Motors in FL fulfilling the orders for MB.

If you are okay with aftermarket suppliers like Lemfoerder or Corteco, you can try some popular online houses like PartsGeek and RockAuto.

RMEuropean carries both MB label and aftermarket.

You don't necessarily need to know the exact parts numbers (although Parts.com will generally list them) ... just make sure the site you order from gives you a place to enter your VIN so they can confirm the parts are correct for your car's suspension.

-- John

Late reply, but since there were no other replies --

The top portion of the top strut mount looks like a bundt cake made out of rubber, which fits inside a pocket on the underside of the fender well. When you turn your wheels the geometry of the front suspension causes the strut to pitch and roll ... this movement may cause that rubber bundt to creak inside the fender well.

I had this problem early on when my car was under warranty, and the dealership lubed inside that pocket. When I changed my strut mounts back in 2012 I also lubed the new mounts, but didn't get it just right so it still creaks a bit when I turn the wheels sharply at a slow speed.

If this is your problem, you can lube that area by removing the top retaining bracket off the top of the strut in the engine bay, jack up the car by the body, let the suspension dangle, and then push the top of the strut down another half inch or so ... then you should have a bit of room to get in through the hole at the top of the fender well to rub some (rubber-friendly) grease in there.

-- John

Hi Bagdo,

Did your problem get resolved?

Thanks, John. I went ahead and ordered a complete set of Lemforder control arms. They do come with the self-locking nuts since these are not supposed to be reused. Should the control arm bolts be replaced as well or can I just reuse the original ones? What about the strut to steering knuckle and the brake caliper mounting bolts which have to be removed to provide clearance for the torque strut disassembly? I also understand MB fasteners come pretreated with locking compound. Do I need to reapply some blue Loctite threadlocker if reusing is an option?

As I remember I reused the control arm bolts, I don't remember if I had replacement lock nuts for them or just used loctite on the existing nuts.

For the strut mount there is a bolt kit that replaces those, and I think it was recommended to replace those and not reuse them. When I bought the struts I got those bolt kits for $25 per side.

When I started doing DIYs on my car I bought blue Loctite right away and have been using it on all bolts that don't appear to have some already on them ... it may not be critical but it's a small price to pay for an additional piece of mind.

My Lemfoerder control arms actually didn't have the multi-position bolt hole in the bushings ... they just had a simple round hole that would allow for no adjustment. Not sure why -- they just came that way. On the uppers I left the bolt in the center. I aligned the toe-in and steering wheel centering myself using a tape measure across the tire treads front and back, and did a handful of iterations of test drive and toe-in adjust for feel and steering wheel centering. After 6 years my alignment still feels perfect and my tires have always worn perfectly evenly. So I would suggest that these cars aren't hard to DIY align.

From what I've heard few alignment shops will touch those eccentric bolts, so the $$ you pay for alignment service will likely be toe-in only.

-- John

Installed all 4 control arms and new sway bar bushings/end-links on Monday. The bushings and ball joints were definitely shot. I did find a fluted bolt in one of the torque arms, but just replaced it with the standard one. Car handles like new again, squeaking noises are gone, and it no longer shakes/bounces on uneven surfaces. It even still drives straight without having taken it in for an alignment! My only remaining concern with the suspension is that the wheel to fender clearance in the rear is about 2 inches lower than at the front. I did torque the arms at ride height, and the front clearance has not changed before/after. Should I go ahead and replace the rear springs?

What's your clearance look like?

On my car (c230 Sport) it's about 6" from the ground to the bottom face of the jack pads, both front and rear. I also measured the vertical gap from the top of the tire to the fender opening ... 1" rear, 1 5/8" front. If you have the non-sport model your stock height could be 3/4" more.

-- John

My center hub to fender clearances are 13 1/4" rear and 14" front. It sounds like you don't have the sport suspension ...? Fyi here is a profile pic of my car so you can see the ride height ...
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...341c0018ee.jpg

2005 c230 Sport

Squeaking rear suspension
 

Is it speed dependent, like a wheel bearing? Or does it change when applying the brakes?

With a C270 I am assuming you are not in the US ... If I thought it was a wheel bearing I would drive pretty carefully so as not to seize up the hub (I did this on an old VM Beetle, not pretty), and I would try to get roadside service to pick up the car once I get closer to home. Others can comment on how long you can run with a bad wheel bearing ...

John, I did confirm through the original window sticker that I do have the sport suspension (code 486), although mine is a pre-face lift 2003 model with the standard sway bar links etc. I can understand how the rear springs might settle after a couple of years, but find it strange that the front clearance is more than an inch higher than yours... Here are some before (about 4 years ago) and after (last week after I changed the control arms) pictures for comparison.

https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...deadaa83cc.jpg

Picture from about 4 years ago, front and rear looks pretty close to level.
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...44727c6620.jpg

Picture from this week. The front clearance looks quite higher than the rear.

Your car in general just seems higher. Here, I drew some trace lines across the bottom door seam to see where it hits the hubs ...

https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...008781df06.png

I didn't get them exactly on line, but it looks like your before and after pics are about the same, possibly slightly higher. And both your pics show your car noticably higher than mine.

Fyi, I've attached a pic from the original 2005 brochure when I bought the car ... you can see the line hits low on the hub here as well ...

How did you torque your bolts under suspension load? I drove my car up on ramps, then loosened and retighted the bolts, which pretty much ensured it was at ride height.

You may be right, there is not much difference between the 2 pictures. I will probably leave it alone and change the springs/shocks further down the road as needed. I used a screw jack to raise-up the steering knuckle instead of a ramp. I was about half-an inch off on the front wheels clearance for the final control arms torque. Close enough?

I don't remember the exact geometry --- but if the control arms are 12" long and the total vertical wheel travel of the front suspension is around 4", that's 1/3 ... sin(1/3) = ~20 degrees. So if you tighten your bolts while the suspension is fully hanging you are potentially twisting those bushings by 20 degrees ... probably not a good idea to subject the rubber to that level of twisting long term. (Keeping in mind when you raise the car on a lift, that's what happens, but not permanently.)

However if you are only 1/2" off when you tighten, that's sin(1/24) = ~3 degrees ... I don't think the rubber will notice or put up any resistance for that little of a twist.

Short answer -- yes IMHO it seems close enough to not worry about it.

Has anyone replaced all the REAR suspension links, and if so at what mileage? Mine has about 180,000 miles on it. I have some noise most likely coming from the lower spring arm, which I am planning on replacing next week. From the other posts on this thread, this link seems to be a weak point. I am debating whether to replace the other links (thrust/camber/track) at the same time. All except for the radius rod which would require lowering the subframe /drivertrain, which is well beyond my patience and abilities... Thank-you.

I can't answer to the longevity of the specific bushings, but my two cents is to replace everything back there if you plan to keep the car for a while longer ... I think it's worth an extra few hundred dollars worth of parts for a service that you will do once every 10+ years.

Ok so I had annoying squeek from my rear suspension I jacked up car removed tire and disconnected rear control arm at both ends and found worn bushing at the knuckle where arm attached to. all other bushing were good, but that one was a pain to replace ( used threaded rod and some sockets, washers and a lotsa elbow grease ) I think this one takes most of the load of car. You can get it online for around 25$ + or dealer .My mileage was around 150K. I got a youtube link but it's in russian but you'll get the idea. Good luck.
https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...e4285d3197.jpg

I agree with everything on the video except for the oiling of the threads. The blue color on the threads is Loctite and it should be used. This will make sure that the nut does not loosen up over time, oiling it is the last thing you should do. There are 2 kinds of Loctite, red and blue. Use the blue one as the red is used for a more "permanent" lock, unless you're not ever going to loosen that nut again for any reason then by all means use the red one.
Alan.

Ended up replacing the entire spring arms for simplicity. The MB parts cost only $61 each, with the bushing already mounted. Did not replace any other arms in the rear (other than the stabilizer bar bushings and links). And the suspension is finally completely silent again :)

My 2005 C230 Sport Sedan has about 129,000 miles on it. I bought it used and didn't receive any maintenance records, but I was able to find a few on CarFax. Many of the CarFax records simply state that the car was serviced, so I don't know whether any suspension work was done other than a vague reference to work done at 80,664 miles stating, "Steering/suspension checked."

I recently had the opportunity to put the car on a lift in order to change the transmission and differential lubricants. (That made the job much easier and also allowed me to have the car level while training the old fluids. It felt like a luxury compared to my usual practice of crawling under a car suspended on ramps.)

While I was waiting for the fluids to drain, I took the opportunity to look at the suspension components. Most of the bushings appeared to be pretty well worn. I'm no expert on this subject and I'm basing my assessment on what I've seen on auto repair shows such as Wheeler Dealers. I think that if Ed China looked at my bushings he would say they were "perished." I don't know how the car felt when it was new, but it does seem to vibrate quite a bit on irregular road surfaces and it is not well damped on big bumps.

I've been researching suspension issues on this and other forums and looking at videos on YouTube. I would like some feedback on the following questions so that I can develop a strategy for addressing suspension problems.

1. I have the opportunity to buy a set of OEM struts, shocks and springs that were removed from another care for a suspension upgrade at 37,000 miles. Will these items have a good service life? My goal is to keep the car for at least another 70,000 miles.

2. If I replace shocks and struts, do I need to replace the springs? For example, if I bought new Bilstein shocks and struts instead of the used OEM components, would I need a set of springs too?

3. If I take the car to a shop, am I correct to assume they will have the equipment to replace bushings rather than entire components such as control arms? If I can replace just the bushings is there a trade off for the cost savings in terms of performance or durability?

4. If I take the car to a suspension shop and ask them what I need done, I'm concerned that it would be like asking a barber whether I need a haircut. Can anyone suggest a strategy for keeping costs down if I decide to use a shop? One of the shops I'm considering previously allowed me to supply my own parts, so I could shop for good prices.

5. I've replaced shocks in the past, but that was on an old Toyota and I have not used spring compressors. Is this a good learning opportunity? I have access to a lift, but I am a very slow worker and the lift rental cost is $12 per hour. There are videos on YouTube that show how to do the work, but they don't show the problems that may crop up such as corroded bolts and unexpectedly broken components.

6. Are there efficiencies or economies from doing all the work at once, i.e. replace shocks, struts and bushings in one session?

7. Any other suggestions or issues I need to consider?

Thanks in advance.

I have the same model and year as you, 135k on my car now, at ~100k I replaced the shocks/struts all around (with Bilstein TC/B4) and all front control arms (Lemfoerder) and upper strut mounts (Corteco). I have not replaced tie rod ends yet, or any control arms or bushings in the rear.

From what I understand the front rubber takes the biggest beating and goes out much earlier than the rears ... and if you haven't replacing anything yet then I recommend you start with what I did (shocks/struts and front control arms) ... just make sure when you replace the upper strut mounts that you get the mount assembly with the bearings in them.

-- John

I agree with John's comments. I would first change the front control arms. At your mileage, I would replace the entire arms (Lemforder or MB) and not just the bushings. The ball joint end is probably going to be very loose and these cannot be refurbished. It took me about 6 hours on a lift with zero prior experience. I purchased a ball joint removal tool which made removing the control arms very easy. If you do decide to replace the struts/springs, make sure you get the exact fit for your VIN number. MB has 3 different types of springs for this model depending on what options your car is loaded with (such as sunroof, amplifier etc.)

HI I HAVE A C230 W203 WIYH A M272 ENGINE ,AND I DONT FELL THE COMFORT WHEN DRIVING ITS GOT 17INCH RIMS WHAT CAN I DO PLZ HELP

I have the same problem in my 2014 e350
 

I have a 2014 e350 red and have the same problems on both sides of my front suspension. Lmk if u find the fix.

W208 CLK here. Perplexed about getting conflicting information from two repair shops. Hoping to clarify things a bit.

Problem: fairly loud squeak from rear suspension, seemed to start almost overnight. Any speed, any bump, even getting in and out of car, "SQUEAK!"

Repair shop #1: Tech states "rear bushings [both sides] on the wheel knuckle is blown and noisy. These bushings actually the support joint for the wheels. Recommend replace both bushings and align the vehicle when completed." The Service Manager says this is an 8-hour job plus alignment, and $285 in parts. Well over $1500.Repair shop #2: It rained the next few days and the squeak largely went away (like 70%-80% better). Then I took the car to Shop #2. He said he couldn't find problems with any bushings. He performed an alignment and I haven't heard a single squeak since.

My question to this forum: Normally I'd be happy that the squeak is gone and I wouldn't waste your time. However, shop #1 said that if I don't repair the bushings, eventually they'll fail completely and the wheel could come off. This sounds a bit drastic, if not fishy. How much of a safety issue are we talking about here, potentially, and how do I figure out which shop was correct about my suspension? (Note: suspensions are my weakest area of car knowledge, otherwise I'd look into it myself).

When I replaced my front sway bar (with molded on bushings) it was because those rubber bushings had become very noisy twisting in their holding brackets. They were not loose ... just hardened enough with age that they didn't flex as well as new ones. They would creak over speed bumps in the shopping center parking lot at 5mph ... how embarrassing ...! Replacing them eliminated the squeak completely. Absolutely no change in driving, handling, etc ... it was only the noise.

It's possible you are in the same situation, with a hardening rear bushing that isn't going to go out, but will squeak when dry. If the repair shop said they tested okay, that usually means no play in the joints, so my suggestion is that you try to figure out which one is squeaking and then keep it lubricated with something that won't dry out immediately, figure on doing it periodically (monthly?) like you used to have to grease the bushings in older cars.

Anyway that's my two cents :)

jkowtko, much appreciated!