Interesting comments on the C230K . . .
Thread Starter
Member
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 153
Likes: 0
Interesting comments on the C230K . . .
. . . just arrived today in my monthly issue of Travel Holiday. Fairly reasonable. Do not take the comments too personally manual transmission types. Overall, I think what is said is basically why I bought the car. Refreshing compared to some of the car publications.
Best regards,
CP
Click below:
http://home.indy.rr.com/chrono/Pict0020.JPG
Best regards,
CP
Click below:
http://home.indy.rr.com/chrono/Pict0020.JPG
Last edited by chronopassion; Mar 28, 2002 at 09:50 PM.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 1,377
Likes: 1
From: Vancouver Island, B.C. Canada
2005 smart cabrio; 2008 Mercedes-Benz B 200
shift quality
Really, I wonder about the media slagging of the gearshift quality. I've noticed it in the German press too ("schaltung hakkelig").
The only one I've driven had a perfectly fine shifter quality - not rough or clunky. In fact the contrary was true.
I wonder if there are highly variable shifter qualities among the cars that come down the assembly line and the one I drove was a good one, or if these journalists are pandering to the "Mercedes can't make a manual gearbox" myth.
We will see, I suppose, when "our" C 230 K arrives in 2 months...
The only one I've driven had a perfectly fine shifter quality - not rough or clunky. In fact the contrary was true.
I wonder if there are highly variable shifter qualities among the cars that come down the assembly line and the one I drove was a good one, or if these journalists are pandering to the "Mercedes can't make a manual gearbox" myth.
We will see, I suppose, when "our" C 230 K arrives in 2 months...
Last edited by Mike T.; Mar 28, 2002 at 11:33 PM.
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 461
Likes: 0
From: Atlanta, GA
C230 coupe 6sp
I have a 6sp, and it is terrible on the 1st to 2nd shift. It clunks loudly, and sometimes feels like the syncro is bad. The Mercedes rep drove it and said it was "normal" but the service writer told me he has had complaints from other owners too. They are supposed to put a new 2nd gear syncro in whenever I can get it down there for a few days. The car I test drove before I ordered this one didn't seem to have this problem. Maybe it is a random thing, but enough people complain about it (press and owners) that it is not totally random. Make sure you test drive your new car extensively before accepting it to make sure it is what you want, and can live with it.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 3,744
Likes: 1
Originally posted by speedfrk
I have a 6sp, and it is terrible on the 1st to 2nd shift. It clunks loudly, and sometimes feels like the syncro is bad. The Mercedes rep drove it and said it was "normal" but the service writer told me he has had complaints from other owners too. They are supposed to put a new 2nd gear syncro in whenever I can get it down there for a few days. The car I test drove before I ordered this one didn't seem to have this problem. Maybe it is a random thing, but enough people complain about it (press and owners) that it is not totally random. Make sure you test drive your new car extensively before accepting it to make sure it is what you want, and can live with it.
I have a 6sp, and it is terrible on the 1st to 2nd shift. It clunks loudly, and sometimes feels like the syncro is bad. The Mercedes rep drove it and said it was "normal" but the service writer told me he has had complaints from other owners too. They are supposed to put a new 2nd gear syncro in whenever I can get it down there for a few days. The car I test drove before I ordered this one didn't seem to have this problem. Maybe it is a random thing, but enough people complain about it (press and owners) that it is not totally random. Make sure you test drive your new car extensively before accepting it to make sure it is what you want, and can live with it.
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 461
Likes: 0
From: Atlanta, GA
C230 coupe 6sp
My car has about 2300 miles on it now. I will drive it til about 3000 miles and see if it gets better. Someone else said that they get better with miles, but I've never heard of a break-in period with manual transmissions. It is a strange transmission no matter how you look at it. It will not shift into 1st coming to a stop until you are at a complete stop. Kleeman said his 1st gear is like that too, but he doesn't have the 1st to 2nd problem. The factory rep made a point of telling me I had to be completely stopped to shift into 1st, so it is something they know about. Strange for a syncro gearbox.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 1,265
Likes: 1
From: Nashua, NH
2008 VW GTI
I have to stop completely to shift into 1st too. I get a bit of a "clunk" going into 2nd but it doesn't strike me as a problem. It's definitely not bad enough to constitute a tranny rebuild.
I prefer the positive mechanical feel of the MB stick to my wife's Honda. The Honda's stick moves almost too easily giving it feeling like it's worn out and loose. Maybe I've just gotten used to my MB....
I prefer the positive mechanical feel of the MB stick to my wife's Honda. The Honda's stick moves almost too easily giving it feeling like it's worn out and loose. Maybe I've just gotten used to my MB....
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 2,498
Likes: 3
From: Ashburn, VA
'19 GLC 300, '19 TM3SR+
Originally posted by avlis
I have to stop completely to shift into 1st too. I get a bit of a "clunk" going into 2nd but it doesn't strike me as a problem. It's definitely not bad enough to constitute a tranny rebuild.
I have to stop completely to shift into 1st too. I get a bit of a "clunk" going into 2nd but it doesn't strike me as a problem. It's definitely not bad enough to constitute a tranny rebuild.
All in all, I do like the coupe's MT. Neither clunky, nor notchy - just right.
Last edited by vadim; Mar 29, 2002 at 08:10 AM.
Trending Topics
Almost a Member!
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 62
Likes: 0
From: NY
C230K
Despite what some say, manual trannies, more specfically the synchros, do require a certain degree of break in, even "easy trannies like a VW. While a new VW shifts very easily for example, wait until around 5K miles or so, and you feel that you never need the clutch after the 1-2 gear change.
I think the c230 shifter isn't terrible, but I've found you really have to hold it "left" during the 1-2 gear change, or it tends to want to either bump the gate or go into 4th. Also, I think there's a lot of overlap on the first three gears for such a torquey engine. You essentially have to short shift 1st or 2nd, or skip 2nd or 3rd entirely. If gear ratios are not well matched to an engine, it tends to make the shifting process feel "klunky" until you get a better feel for it.
I think the c230 shifter isn't terrible, but I've found you really have to hold it "left" during the 1-2 gear change, or it tends to want to either bump the gate or go into 4th. Also, I think there's a lot of overlap on the first three gears for such a torquey engine. You essentially have to short shift 1st or 2nd, or skip 2nd or 3rd entirely. If gear ratios are not well matched to an engine, it tends to make the shifting process feel "klunky" until you get a better feel for it.
MB World Stories
The Best of Mercedes & AMG
6 Mercedes Models That Did NOT Age Well (But Are Somehow Still Cool)
Verdad Gallardo
Manual Mercedes? 6 Times Sindelfingen Let Drivers Have All The Fun
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes SLR McLaren 722 S Is Extremely Rare Example Modified by McLaren
Verdad Gallardo
8 Classic Boxy Mercedes Designs That Have Aged Like Fine Wine
Verdad Gallardo
Flawlessly Restored Mercedes 190E Evo II Heads to Auction
Verdad Gallardo
Electric Mercedes C-Class Unveiled: 11 Things You Need to Know
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes EQS Gets A Major Update: Everything You Need to Know
Verdad Gallardo
5 Underrated Mercedes-Benz Models That Don't Get the Love They Deserve
Verdad Gallardo
Mercedes 300D Has Pushed Well Past 1 Million Miles and It Ain't Stopping
Verdad Gallardo
Member
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 81
Likes: 0
From: Kalamazoo, MI
My shifter also kinda klunks when moving it from 1 to 2. Also, when I am shifting from 1 to 2, the car usually kinda 'lurches' when i release the clutch pedal. Now I am a fairly new driver with a stick, so it is probably a technique thing, but it doesnt happen with nearly the same frequency on the other shifts. Any tips on making the gear transition as smooth as possible for other passengers? 
Also, is there a certain RPM that it is ideal to shift at, and why?
Thanks for any advice
Also, is there a certain RPM that it is ideal to shift at, and why?Thanks for any advice
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 1,480
Likes: 1
From: Central NJ
C230K Coupe/Orion/C4/C5/CD/AMG Spoiler/V60/TeleAid, 2 MGB's
My shifter smoothed out around 2500 miles...and I noticed it immediately when it changed. I let my girlfriend drive the car once, and compared to her PT she said it's much better.
My only issue with the manual trans is that they could have made first gear a little taller...as it is now, it spins the motor up to redline long before you really get moving.(another comparison - my Talon TSi used to hit 60 in second gear)
My only issue with the manual trans is that they could have made first gear a little taller...as it is now, it spins the motor up to redline long before you really get moving.(another comparison - my Talon TSi used to hit 60 in second gear)
Out Of Control!!
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 10,067
Likes: 11
From: Westwood, NJ
2004 Civic Si. FWD for the Win!
This is why people should list exactly what they have in their sigs. I'm wondering - out of the people with problems, how many have the C7 pkg? I wonder if it makes a difference???? 
Almost a Member!
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 62
Likes: 0
From: NY
C230K
Consider this: You are driving a hydraulic clutch, with electronic differential, and what I think are overlapping gear ratios. "Feel" is vague at best, when it comes to relative gas/clutch technique
Also, driving is a skill, which, when you change equipment, can require a change of technique. If all cars were designed for how the majority of drivers drive, we'd all be driving Accords or Buicks or the like. Thank you, but no.
Try approaching it a little more scientifically. play with combos of shifting, later than you're used to, earlier, etc. also, consider double clutching the 1-2 shift. When you find what works for you, make it habit, and the "problem" goes away.
Also, driving is a skill, which, when you change equipment, can require a change of technique. If all cars were designed for how the majority of drivers drive, we'd all be driving Accords or Buicks or the like. Thank you, but no.
Try approaching it a little more scientifically. play with combos of shifting, later than you're used to, earlier, etc. also, consider double clutching the 1-2 shift. When you find what works for you, make it habit, and the "problem" goes away.
Almost a Member!
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 50
Likes: 0
From: north Philadelphia suburbs
2002 C230 coupe
I have a 6 sp w/ C7. I find that I can't shift into first until almost at a stop. It will finally slide into 1st while rolling very slowly. Shifting from first to second presents more resistance than any of the other shifts and a slight "clunk" to the feel and sound. Sometimes the clunk is more prominent than others. (Only at that point would I classify the clunk as undesirable.) I now have 2300 miles on the car and I can't say that I notice any change from mile one. (I'm still hoping that there may yet be some slight improvement.) I think that all of the other shifts, both up and down, feel really nice. The only issue I have is that 1st to 2nd isn't as nice as all of the other shifts and the fact that I didn't notice a difference in the 1-2 shift during test drives. I may have just overlooked this during the test drive (they're always too short) but I did drive 5 different test vehicles and don't remember feeling or hearing a clunk on any of them. I do not know how many miles were on any of those cars. I still have my 5sp Honda Accord which I have always enjoyed driving. However, when I drive it now the shifter feels "mushy" and not as enjoyable to operate as my C230 shifter.
Almost a Member!
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 62
Likes: 0
From: NY
C230K
If you want to get it into first while rolling (say, coming to a stoplight), simply take the car out of 2nd, put it in neutral, let out the clutch, give a rev to bring the mainshaft of the tranny up to speed, and then clutch, putting it into 1st. . .it works. . .if it doesn't , the gears have a nasty way of letting you know. Many folk (kids and beginners) think revving the engine while the clutch is depressed will help. . .it won't). You have to rev with the car in neutral to get the tranny matched right.
Do this procedure right, and the clutch is almost superfluous.
Do this procedure right, and the clutch is almost superfluous.
Super Member
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 875
Likes: 1
From: Los Angeles
2002 c230k
Mike E,
Mine is the same too. That 1st to 2nd clunk drives me nuts. I am a very experienced driver with lots of track time and unless I double clutch, wasting time, I dont get a smooth 1-2 shift. On the other hand, speed shifting (matching rpms to gears) without the clutch is as smooth as silk. The stick just sucks in to the gear with little pressure on the stick. How long should we wait before we take the cars in a complain?
Mine is the same too. That 1st to 2nd clunk drives me nuts. I am a very experienced driver with lots of track time and unless I double clutch, wasting time, I dont get a smooth 1-2 shift. On the other hand, speed shifting (matching rpms to gears) without the clutch is as smooth as silk. The stick just sucks in to the gear with little pressure on the stick. How long should we wait before we take the cars in a complain?
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2002
Posts: 461
Likes: 0
From: Atlanta, GA
C230 coupe 6sp
There is a service bulletin that calls for reducing the trans oil level by 10mm on these cars. It makes it shift easier, especially when cold. It helped some in my car, but the 1st to 2nd shift is still about the same. I've had more cars than I can even count, everything from Austin Healy sprites to Ferrari 308s, and they do all shift different, and require a little different style, but this is the strangest transmission I have ever felt. 3rd-6th shift absolutely perfect, but 1st to 2nd feels like it is a totally different transmission! If you double clutch it, the shift is also much better, but you shouldn't need to do that on a new car. Shifting slower from 1st to 2nd also helps smooth the shift out, but in my car if you go too slow, you can actually feel the gears catch in a way that doesn't seem right. There is a sweet spot on mine in terms of engine rpm, and how fast you shift it from 1st to 2nd, but that isn't always possible due to traffic, etc. It is a little comforting to know that other people have the same experience as I do, so maybe it is "normal" as the Mercedes rep told me, and it will get better with more miles. My car is a non C7 car, but I have heard from several places that all US cars have the same mechanical specs, and the C7 package is just the cosmetics. MBUSA does not mention any different specs for the C7 except the cosmetics. I'm still trying to get my dealer to tell me if there is a different part # for the shifters on C7/non-C7 cars.
MBWorld Fanatic!
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 2,465
Likes: 0
From: SF Bay Area
2002 C230 K
Two points:
1. downshifting to first - never noticed it balking, but then I almost always double-clutch out of habit
2. gear-box ratios: does the C230 have the exact same ratios as the C240? Maybe the gearbox is more to keep the V6 in it's power band rather than the more torquey 230 motor.
BT
1. downshifting to first - never noticed it balking, but then I almost always double-clutch out of habit
2. gear-box ratios: does the C230 have the exact same ratios as the C240? Maybe the gearbox is more to keep the V6 in it's power band rather than the more torquey 230 motor.
BT
Almost a Member!
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 50
Likes: 0
From: north Philadelphia suburbs
2002 C230 coupe
mdp,
I can't honestly say that what I am experiencing with my car on the 1-2 shift warrants a complaint. Since I haven't met anyone from service at my dealership as of yet (I wasn't provided the initial introduction that I was apparently supposed to get) I may stop over there to get mud flaps and introduce myself and at that time I'll mention it and see what kind of response I get.
I can't honestly say that what I am experiencing with my car on the 1-2 shift warrants a complaint. Since I haven't met anyone from service at my dealership as of yet (I wasn't provided the initial introduction that I was apparently supposed to get) I may stop over there to get mud flaps and introduce myself and at that time I'll mention it and see what kind of response I get.
