New Ride Possibly
 

Hey Guys,

Sorry I haven't been on much lately on the forums. I honestly do miss posting on here and I hope my old threads have helped some of the newbies out with modding, parts..etc Anyways, I'm looking to to trade in my C for something new this month. I definitely am looking for more power! Even more than the 350. So lately I've been testing out and researching into a few options:

-2010 Audi S4
-2011 BMW 335xi
-2008 Lexus ISF

What do you guys think? Please post your thoughts and opinions on which you would choose.

P.s. I don't want a C63 because its so similar to my car in styling, that when I buy a new car, I need a considerable change in styling lol.

Thanks!

If you want HP don't bother with those 3 so called prissy prestige cars . Why not a muscle car with real balls. Try a Dodge Viper or similar. Something with over 500 HP.http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13qIe8Sy1aw
:X

Of the three, I'd probably go for the S4. It's quite nice, has a wonderful gearbox, interior has been revamped since the B7 generation. On the downside however, it compares only to the 335i in terms of performance. Also, the tail lights were never really attractive to me. If you were to get the 335i with a manual gearbox, I'm sure you'd definitely get the performance/fun you're looking for, but in terms of options, the 335i, as well as the 335xi lacks most common options that come with cars these days (ie. some sort of multimedia interface, heated seats) and costs an arm and a leg to get those options installed. Also the 335's N54 engine is still on and off with the HPFP problem.


I assume you'd want AWD since you're in Canada for the winter, so the S4 and Bimmer definitely seem to be the two you might want to get. The ISF is a great car. Comfy/soft (although kinda stretchy leather) seats, great touch navi, pretty good stereo, etc, but has a rather cramped backseat/trunk space, and is honestly only a hint better in a straight line than the IS350, and not as much of a potential daily driver as the other two are. When I test drove an IS350, (interior is still the same in size!) I adjusted the driver's seat to my liking and then sat down in the backseat. My legs were definitely cramped. So if you have kids, expect em to be fidgety, and for them to scratch the leather quite a bit getting in and out. ALSO. I found Lexuses, err, Lexi to be somewhat numb in the handling and roadfeel department. If that's something you want (especially since you're looking for performance) that's something I'd take into consideration. But hey, the ISF has the fastest shifting automatic (excluding dual-clutch) transmission on the market. Or so says the MyIs/ClubLexus folk.

So for me, I'd go from S4>335xi>ISF.

if it's entirely limited to those 3 choices then i'd have to go with the 335xi. the s4 is a great car but IMO it's way too plain from the outside and barely looks any different from a normal A4. the only "sports sedan" i'd ever consider getting is the C63. the ISF is also a decent car but are you really going to move onto a glorified toyota from a mercedes? and again, it's just not visually striking.

the 335xi is the only option. great performance, handling, and looks the best out of all three cars. but if you'd ask me, i'd go with an S5 myself because 3 series are just sooo overdone...

it's just my opinion of course. as you can see i value the styling of the car quite a bit. if you're a more subtle and practical kinda guy then the S4 and ISF makes sense. in such a case i'd definitely pick the S4!

s4 would be my 1st pic.. 335 is good also if you plan on modding it bc the choices are endless.. not considering a c63?

Of those three, I think the choice is between the Bimmer and Lexus, and I would take the BMW driving experience over anything Lexus has to offer. My bias is to be much more interested in which one will keep me out of the service department and Audi is the clear loser historically, and in recent data as well. Yes, some will report their's was fine, but I am looking at the overall data. On a personal note, I had one once, and that turned out to be one too many, and dealer and corporate support were poor.

Good luck with your choice!

Although I like the Audi's basic design, I find the execution and reliability a bit lacking. Of course with a hundred or so more HP under the hood, things would have to be better.
The 3 Series is an amazing driving car on a nice smooth, twisty road but I don't like the ride, the interior, the attitude or every BMW salesman I have ever met, the reliability or the fact I would see my car coming at me 50 times a day.
The Lexus looks a little wierd on the outside, really nice but very small on the inside and just doesn't get me juices flowing at all.
Although it is the same basic running gear, how about the E Coupe? Cadillac CTS 3.6? Give it a few months and maybe you could try a Buick Regal GS...I just had to throw that in there as I find it intriguing that they are at least out there trying!

Actually a great point....a rebadged Opel Insignia, with all the performance content, built in Germany and shipped here...don't be fooled by the Buick name...this car is getting great reviews, but be sure it's the GS.....for another surprise, also check out:

http://www.leftlanenews.com/volvo-s60.html

The new E Class is winning tons of awards for design and performance. I can't believe you're not even considering it. If you want different try a Coupe instead of your old sedan.

Audi no question..but I'd go with the S5. The new CTS coupe is sick as well.

^^ i was actually thinking the same thing. i really wanted an S5. but my choices were a C63, M3, or S5. as they are all in the same price range.. their all beautiful cars. in my opinion the S5 is definitely the most drop dead gorgeous car out of all of them BUT it lacks so much in power with 3something HP. this was last year idk what kind of upgrades they have now. BUT back to OP. i would say Audi or Bimmer. and of course maybe another benz? if you dont want a C63 but you want power try a different AMG class? E63 is pretty nice, and so is the CL =x im definitely in love with a CL =x sigh. i want one now =[

No to bimmer, its not that fast and they are about the change the styiling. Not to the ISF, over priced P.O.S. imo. And I like the Audi, but the S4/A4 is not my personal cup of tea. I am more into the A5/S5.

Like someone else recommended, why not get a Camaro SS or a Challenger or the new Stang (least favorite of the three).

I love the new chevy's and I was very surprised with the quality and reliability rating improvements.

Your not into any Infinti's? I had a g37 coupe and I LOVED it!

F that noise, choose this.

Not enough.

http://www.lingenfelter.com/engine-p...s-ls3-l99-sale

Did you just compare a camaro to an E class convertible?

I guess I should have raised the "dry wit" flag in offering a way to more power. Why not 800hp?


P.S. It also comes as a "Firebird".

Im also a fan of Lexus and participate in their car forums. So I have to say I am biased towards the ISF. I understand that the backseat is cramped, etc, but its not like the C isnt cramped either. These are entry level vehicles so if you are looking at cars in this class, then I dont think legroom is a relevant condition.

I would love to play with the sound that the ISF makes at WOT.

Have you ever looked into an E60 BMW M5? Circa 07 go for about 45k, 06's go for even less. Extended warranties through Easycare, etc is very necessary however, you get pretty much bumper to bumper coverage.

Just curious..what makes one a fan of Lexus? I hate that company with a passion. They're no longer a better value than their superior German competition and the people that drive them are massive d-bags..at least in my experience.

Also..the IS-F is more expensive than the M3. You'd think Lexus wouldve priced their inferior BMW ripoff below the car they were targeting.

HAHA, they compared the Camaro with the E63 on Topgear this week.. ahah

335i would to be the one to go with outta the bunch. The rest are slow! The S500 spanks the Lexus. I've ran a few of those.

I would pick the 335xi, especially if you can get one with the M body package.

Im going to assume that your question was of genuine curiosity so I wont go on the defensive...yet :rolf:

My family has owned a few, and to be honest, a large part of it is the service. I know everyone says this, but honestly, I look forward to go service our vehicles at the dealership, from the free snacks and drinks, to a loaner car without even having to ask (even for a quick oil change). Then there is the true to god honest SA. I am disapointed at the MB dealership when I go because there isnt any of this.

We have owned the first generation RX300, right now we have an RX330, and are soon to receive the RX450h. I understand many people hate Lexus and the RX might be the epitome of that hate, but it is a truly outstanding vehicle for our family, and it meets our needs. You probably see tons of RXs on the road because the car is perfect for families of today. We also have an IS300, and in a world filled with bmw 3 series, it is a great alternative sporty vehicle.

I also continue to think they are good value. Just because I am a lexus fan doesnt mean that I cannot appreciate other vehicles as well (like MB) and I hope you can see where I might be coming from.

As for the D bags, I think most are BMW drivers. :naughty:

Sorry for being an ass..I didn't mean for that post to come off like that..I actually was just curious. I appreciate that you actually responded..and I can agree that the RX is a great family vehicle.

I think the whole Lexus love/hate thing comes from them being so isolated and smooth. For people that want a little road feel and maybe even "character" in a car, Lexus comes across as being soulless and easy to hate.

Character = little issues that would bug you if you didn't otherwise have passion for the car...

joshg1001 and C300Sport both have it right. For a carefree and most pleasant car ownership experience, one cannot beat Lexus. They take care of just about everything, and until recently, had a great quality record with the Toyota parent. They just have a very different view of what makes a great car, but which is perfectly consistent with the Japanese culture. Everything is smooth, isolated, intended to be the most non-disruptive experience possible. "Fun" has nothing to do with it. It's what our grandparents wanted from a Lincoln/Cadillac...."you don't feel the road". The goal is to get you where you want to go, and make the actual process as much of a non-event as possible. Never shock the body!! Ride the Shinkanzen train, a building elevator, or even touch and listen to automatic opening doors in Japan and compare to anything else in the world....silent, smooth, as little feedback as possible....nothing floats like a Japanese form of transportation. (Before the replies come....Honda/Mazda, etc. have make a conscious effort to differentiate themselves by targeting younger American tastes, while Toyota has offered the truest Japanese experience to America.)

If you actually like, or love, driving, want to be involved in the experience, and the destination is not always the most important reason for the trip, Lexus (or Toyota, for that matter) is just a mis-match for you. If you like, or love, riding comfortably, think cars should just be a safe, reliable, and comfortable "background" part of your daily routine, and no car is worth any more attention than absolutely necessary, there's never a reason to leave Lexus.

I get all that from my Mercedes dealer, although I don't really look forward to going there because they always charge me for the service. How dare they! :D

When I see an RX on the road, family isn't what comes to mind. To me the RX screams "I'm a Realtor! Call me today and I'll sell your house for top dollar!" Maybe that's just me. :nix:

my brother has a 335, they're sweet cars, but i' d get something different.

did you consider the new e550 coupe? its quick as hell and looks great!

but from your choices, i'd go for the 2010 s4!

I'd probably have to go with what was my second runner up when I choose the new C350 in late 2007, and that's the 335xi. Coupe is def my fav but the sedan isn't bad either. They are a dime-a-dozen on the road, but there's a reason for that. The S4 would be a close second. And I'd have to consider other cars over an ISF, like maybe the new E. I really think AMG should make an E coupe. :naughty:


+1 on the Realtor thing! There's an Edina Reality building next to ours and there are more than a few Lexus RX over there. Actually a lot of MB and BMW too :D And my MB dealer has all the perks as well, sounds like Josh's dealer needs to wake up...

i would pick the S4 because i dont see it often. thats one reason i was absolutely in love with my car when i first got it. NEVER saw it on the road

They're in the service department.

:eek: :rolf:

Or is it because you can barely tell them apart from a regular A4?

So, so cold but unfortunately pretty true from my experience

So true. The new S4 is a great car but with the major sleeper styling compared to the stock 2.0T and the non-rumbling V6, it just doesn't seem to have the bad ass look and feel of the past S4s.

my vote: IS-F

good mpg, raw power, Toyota/Lexus reliability, cheaper to mod, etc.

anyone that says the IS or IS-F is boring they need to test drive an IS with F-sport mods and an IS-F.

Thanks for all the replies and input guys. Its a hard decision. I've actually just test drove a new S4 earlier today and honestly I love it. Its faster than the 335 and definitely has a nicer interior. The exterior looks a little like an A4 but there are a lot of differences. I dunno, I think I fell in love with it. It handled amazing, the supercharger had a nice sound to it, it was fast as hell haha And honestly the quality and fit and finish was top of the line. I'm going to think it over of course, the good thing about it is that its very rare. I honestly have never seen another S4 around in the past couple years. Thanks again guys! :bow::zoom:

Rarity can mean expensive insurance & hard to find & expensive parts.

Obviously you need a prestige car & don't mind paying the price. But just remember to look after your old age pension !! Cars are a poor investment.

Good luck & enjoy.

Inside sources indicate that Audi has become the brand of choice for douchebags.

^^ It could actually be any luxury entry level model, whether C class, 3 series, A4 or IS. Most of these drivers are young and they tend to like to show off.

bmw 335 coupe over and S4 however both have major issues all my friends have fuel pump issues with the 335 when i say all i mean all 3 of them and even more issues on the s4 but the b7 gen

The S4 is a tempting choice because it's more exclusive than the 335xi. Being Canadian, I'd prefer to stick with an AWD sports sedan, but maybe less so on the left coast. Good luck with your choice.

It depends what you want.. the 3 vehicles you chose are very similar. I liked the S4 until I drove it. The ISF is a powerful machine, my friend has one, but I'm not a fan of the power band as it comes stock.. so by default 335.

All these platforms are not very far off, once you've driven all 3 you'll find the one that suits you best. You're still in 4-door sedan territory, it's a lot of the same in this class. Sure you have different engines and aesthetics but how these vehicles handle on the asphalt isn't terribly different from vehicle to vehicle. It will come down to which one you find pleasing to eye, and which one hugs your hips in a way the others don't lol. My advice.. don't spend too much time talking about this or reading reviews, go sit in them - you'll know instantly.

My friend Has a 335i coupe. It's fast, but it lacks some visceral element. I like the Sedan more. The front end on both new 3s just look odd to me. I love German cars, but I'd struggle between choosing the IS-F and the S4. The IS-F has the nice touch-screen nav as previously noted. Not sure why the others do not. It looks and sounds great. I was actually considering a used one in March because I found a great deal. The Audi has heritage, Quattro and forced induction (as the BMW). I have had Audis. For me, they fit every time I sit in one. The W204 is the only car that has ever come close to giving me that same feeling. In my experience, S4s hold their value like mad. I also like the huge selection of aftermarket products for Audi.

Anyway, I am with BenTrovato. The only way to know is to drive each one for a while then go with your gut.

I couldn't agree more. The only way to tell which I personally like best is by driving them. So far I've driven the S4 and 335i sedan. I got a really good offer on a S4 with nav from a dealer that is hard to pass up. I think this weekend I'll take out the ISF for a spin and actually make a decision. :)

theres no upgrade if u change to anyone of the 3, i would maintain, or just buy another pure sportscar for sports driving pleasure if the C does not satisfy u in that way.
if change, get c63, M3, R35 GTR or something along the line, 335i, A4 or other similar thing is just pointless to go from a C300, just a change in style or downgrade even :0

Really?... 333hp is not an upgrade from 228hp? :smash: Plus keep in mind, not everyone can afford a GTR or M3. That's why they make less powerful cars lol

IMO

- W204 is great value - looks the best in and out
- S4: can get a very nice slightly used Porsche for that $
- ISF looks good and not many around. Service experience will be a dream compared to others.
- BMW 3: dime a dozen, looks getting bland

I'd just get a low mileage 997 S4

IMHO.. no not really, they r still in the sporty sedan class, if HP is all that is to you, 100HP increase in factory claimed power, will still get you raped by sportscars, and if u want fast, y not just get true sports car?
the reason y i wouldn't opt for ISF is, it is 2008, I wouldn't want something same or older than my current car for a swap, plus, u r giving up a benz for a toyota ...
if you think 333HP is everything why you should do it, then it's your preference, keep in mind theres still 4 doors evo and sti that can eat ISF anyday, hell ... my s15 can eat ISF too ...
my point is, to me, if i cant afford to upgrade, switching to similar class is. well to me i am not the type would do it until i save enough to do real upgrades
but at the end of the day the choice is entirely yours to make, just giving my 2c:smash:

Umm sure. Always wanted to mention the fact that I think the S4 has a luxurious interior and looks amazing. So yeah, no I'm not making decisions on ONLY power. Otherwise I wouldn't buy brand new, I'd get used. But yeah anyways, looks like I'm going with the S4 guys. I'm going in this weekend to put an order through. Will post with an update, let you know when its suppose to arrive and if I'll sell any mods I did on my C300 :D

If that is your final decision and you have a choice between dealers, hang out around the write up areas in service one morning and see how customers are handled. I know we kidded about Audi quality earlier, but if you are determined to take the chance with the lower reliability choice, you may improve your overall odds by finding the more customer oriented dealership. Good luck!

I honestly don't believe that current Audi reliability is drastically different than MB.

Micropower..excellent choice. Still would've gone with the S5 but im guessing you need the 4 doors for practical reasons.

Like I said before I despise Lexus and the 3 series is as bland as a Civic, so I think you made the right choice.

Thanks man. Yeah I totally agree. I was definately looking at the S5 but I needed the 4 doors as I use the back seats quite often. :zoom:

Good idea. Thanks for the advice!

s5 is overpriced POS....take the s4 or isf. or if your not worried about warranty 335 and mod it

How is the S5 a pos when it's basically identical to the S4? The only difference being the S5 uses the old V8 and the S4 has the new supercharged 6 (and I assume the S5 will be getting the new engine for 2011).

s5 fully loaded is the same price as my c63 was fully loaded for half the car...that's why its an overpriced POS. For 8-10k less might be worth it.

ISF is garbage, C63 can totally kill it. Even the new S4 can almost keep up with it given the fact it has a huge motor and a big price tag.

the S5 is around $65k loaded while the C63 pushes $72-73k msrp. it's almost a $10k difference. totally different purpose of a car tho.

i'm not quite understanding what you are saying. even phil/nlpamg who has an M5 was impressed with the IS-F performance, but he said he like the C63 more only for the fact that it sounds insane. IS-F right now is pretty cheap btw last I checked they were around $54k OTD it's around the same price as the S4.

in 2009 fully loaded was 68.5k about and s5 was 62-65k as you said, most of us got cash off msrp (2k personally) off our C63s, regardless they were only a few k difference, not 10. Plus the audi dealerships in LA think they have the best european car on the market and wouldn't let me test drive without talking numbers first. Far from the truth, they are still in BMW and MB's shadow. They don't give deals on them at least here and to top it off they are overpriced - 62-65k is about 8k too much. The difference in purpose of these two cars is not as great as you make it sound. They're both performance oriented cars and model competitors considering audi has nothing else, well only 1 is really.

if comparing the car by cash off msrp then there are a lot of cars that will make any car seems like a overpriced POS. There is a $15k off msrp on the C63 at one of the socal dealership btw. price also reflects on market demand...and this pretty much tells you which one the general public like/want more. I think you can get discount on the S5 too, but haven't look into how much. There's always certain dealership that's willing to give bargain.

the service difference between dealership is negligible since there are always bad dealerships out there just depends on where you go. I've been treated badly by all three at different locations.

I just don't think they're overpriced since for MB, BMW, Audi, the coupe version of something has always demanded a higher price. for comparison, E550 coupe is about the same price as the S5 and that is really the real comparison for the S5. I really don't think people that are considering about the S5 would care to shop the C63 vise versa, unless you did it. I'd only look at C63/M3/ISF/CTS-V if it's me. If i'm considering a coupe then it would be between S5 and the e92 M3 for a performance coupe that is. lol

too bad the RS5 is not available in the US otherwise it would've give the C63/M3/ISF a run for the money.

Well it may be overpriced but I didn't question that..I asked why it's a pos.

I am not debating my belief versus yours.....this is large sample data, reported by owners, and which trumps any individual personal opinions.

http://www.jdpower.com/autos/ratings...remium-vehicle

http://www.jdpower.com/autos/ratings...ry-premium-car

Weak v8, sub par performance in its category, horrible handling and 8k too expensive.

Does it handle worse than an S4? I've driven an S4, never an S5..I just assumed they were basically the same car.

never been in one, but should be the same.

as far as the "sub par performance in it's category"...like i've said before...Audi didn't market it as a C63/M3 competitor but rather a CLK550/E550 and some what a e92 335 competitor.

You know, I didn't even think to post the car that came in #2 in my car buying dilema.. the Jaguar XJ Supercharged.

This sticker price is marked at like $76k but when I walked into the dealership for the first time, they offered to order one from the factory for $54k, so the markdown is impressive.

Apparently, there's been a dramatic shift in pricing between the '09 and '11 model. The XJ Supersport, which has the 510 hp engine I was looking at, is base priced at $110k. I wonder if there's still such insane price flexibility or if they've adjusted their production and tightened their inventory. The nice thing about the jag was that there's no need to put in a bunch of options, it's base model has pretty much everything you need.

I find it interesting that the domestic cars (Cadillac CTS, Lincoln MKZ, and arguably the Saab 9-3) did so well in the dependability study. Most people here are quick to write them off as crap.

Sad thing is you only see those kind of discounts and markdowns in the states. :(

Exactly!! That is why, while everyone has an opinion, data has meaning. Factors such as perceived status, social pressure, defending one's own decision, and reaching the "POS" conclusion on other factors than reliability, such as 0-60 times, etc. are involved. Some can't let go of historic opinions on imports vs. domestics, even as the world continues to evolve. In this thread, some condemn a car, and then justify their position because another car is faster.

An Audi purchase could be based on the personal importance of TGR (Things Gone Right) being more important than TGW (Things Gone Wrong). These are metrics which assess how delighted one may be with a car, versus actual quality failures. If you are sufficiently delighted with a car, history shows you will be more willing to put up with its problems. For others, where the importance of avoiding TGW is more important than TGR, some in the extreme just buy Toyotas. For most of us, there is a balance we each need to find. We just should have the best info available to make that choice.

one thing i don't like about jdpower is that their survey are pretty vague which can be skewed somewhat.

for example, one mechanical inclined and the other is not. both owns the same car. the former would most likely put off a few things that he knows how it works and how it broke or not working as it should until he can get it to a dealership. however for the not so inclined he would complaint about it until dealership fixes it. the inclined guy would probably say the car is great except few minor thing that's not that big of a deal, but the not so inclined guy he would probably say the car is a POS that has issues. AND those that are taking these surveys 90% of the time are those that are not.

Making a car is that does not break down doesn't make it not crap. It's about the feel of the car, stuff like how the doors close, where they use sound deadening material, the craftsmanship of little thing like interior buttons.

For example, I can't imagine sitting in this car and not throwing up. I don't care if it's all made from white gold and baby seal hides, it's simultaneously hideous, oppressive, and boring.

Two points:

Response bias is distributed across segments, and within segments with similar psychographic profiles, would especially be a "wash". Quota sampling ensures a proper distribution in the respondent population.

A lot of this conversation is evolving into what constitutes "crap". The answer varies widely among different groups of people. The first issue is "does it work", and the second is "do I like it" which includes all those intangibles of how does it feel? Only you can decide how to balance the importance of those two. No surprises that "do I like it", or as I wrote above, TGR, is supremely important on an enthusiast forum. As Peabody indicates, no amount of perfection would let him sit in the car he showed as an example. That might make that car subjectively "crap" to him. So, how much Audi-love is going on to offset the demonstrably higher likelihood of visiting the service department?

I was referring to people commenting that the domestic cars were crap specifically because theyre unreliable.

And Peabody that's not the current MKZ interior, that's an old pic. Still, I agree the car sucks.

I finally made the choice. I traded in my C for a 2011 Audi S4! Thanks for all the tips and comments guys I really appreciate it. I'm picking up the new car on Wednesday so I'll definitely post pics then. In the meantime, I won't be parting out of the mods EXCEPT (lol) for my MBArts Strut bar. I would prefer to sell it locally but if I have to ship so let it be. Make me an offer. PM me or reply in this thread. I will sell it cheaper to a local if I can find a buyer.

Thanks again guys!

I don't think too many people care for Lincoln's interiors these days. Have you driven a new Buick or Cadillac? Very, very nicely done with good materials and a solid feel. It really comes down to each and every car these days and you can't completely write off most any brand as most have a least one or two really nice models.

congratz on the new car

I just got it yesterday! :D

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Black on Black with 19" rims. So far its amazing. I will do a former review in a few days once I get a little more comfortable with the car. Felt bad to get rid of my C but my happiness outweighed it. :zoom: Cheers guys, thanks for all the great times. :bow:

Congratulations! Very nice.
The Vancouver 2010 plates are a nice touch. Did you have to pay extra for those?

Nice ride and Congratulations! Luv those wheels !

Congrats on your new ride. The rims are sexy!

Congrats that would have been my choice too.

Very Nice, that is one gorgeous car. I hope she treats you well over the years...our 2.0T has been pretty good though not as solid as the C. I'm sure another year and a half has given Audi time to sort a few small annoying things.