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BMW e89 Z4 sDrive 35i & MB S205 C200 AMG Premium Plus
Originally Posted by DerekACS
IMO, MoneyVSOP has stated some valid points about the W205. I too still prefer the more conservative styling of the W204 - for one, it doesn't try to imitate the much larger S Class like the W205 does. As for the W205 interior, the tacked on screen looks very cheesy. It's no surprise to me, given the numerous critical comments, that MB is already redesigning the W205 dash to have an integrated screen.
For you to say that MoneyVSOP is "simply wrong" is not fair. You have made clear that you do not share his opinion and that's quite OK - just do not imply he is mistaken in his views because you don't share them !
By the way, your Z4 is a very sharp looking machine ! No doubt it's a blast to drive on a twisty country road !
My response to that post was a little tongue in cheek, but then you knew that right? A similarly sharp rebuttal on such a vehement view to invoke playful banter.
Just like to say the below is 100% personal opinion - and I think W205 owners are smart to purchase and drive such a nice car - but one thing bugs me about it...
The W205 interior is crazy overrated.
In my experience the interior of the pre-facelift W204 was lacking big time, but facelift - to call that a 90s-style interior - I can't agree with it. Maybe 2000s but not that far back. Big improvements in facelift interior. In terms of truly being "intuitive" - W204 blows away the initially confusing W205 interior. Obviously when you own one you'll get used to it, so this is a moot point.
In the W205, the iPad style screen looks like garbage. Deal-breaker for me. Center console is wider and definitely more cramped feeling than W204 (I am 6' tall, so not a giant) - but the seats are nicer. And don't get me started on the steering column mounted shifter. Come on now.
I do like how the cupholders are concealed in the W205, the stitching throughout and the nicer wood and trim materials. But to say that these things "elevate" the W205 above other cars in its class interior wise I think is a stretch. You can find similar interior features in a Chrysler 200 nowadays.
Exterior-wise the W205 is beautiful, even if a little soft looking. Lowering it a tiny bit could help a lot there. But even before I'd consider I'd wait for a facelift that solves the above issues.
If you just purchased a W205, congrats - and I hope you enjoy it! Sure you will not regret the purchase, and look forward to reading more about owners' experiences as I figure out what my next MB choice will be, in a couple of years.
It's interesting how perception is different between individuals as I find the w205 more spacey thanks to the shifter moving to the steering area. The center console feels less cluttered this way. The iPad is OK for me as it's just something different, at least it's something you can have an opinion about. However, they could of have used a thinner and sleeker model.
After testdriving the w205 I actually felt a tiny bit cramped when going back to my w204.
A 3 interior can be upgraded when paying the full leather option but even then it's still a bit outdated and the A4 is just graveyard black with some red leds staring at you. You might call the the interior overrated but objectively comparing it to it's direct competitors I must conclude the Benz is more aesthetically pleasing + feels like better material choices. Or it must be that you prefer the spartan look of course.
It's interesting how perception is different between individuals as I find the w205 more spacey thanks to the shifter moving to the steering area. The center console feels less cluttered this way. The iPad is OK for me as it's just something different, at least it's something you can have an opinion about. However, they could of have used a thinner and sleeker model.
You might call the the interior overrated but objectively comparing it to it's direct competitors I must conclude the Benz is more aesthetically pleasing + feels like better material choices. Or it must be that you prefer the spartan look of course.
I also feel the W205 has the most pleasing interior in its class. I initially found the column mounted shifter odd, but it makes perfect sense and does allow for added space on the console. I think most of the complaints concerning the large display are from people who have never actually used it. It functions very well, has sharp graphics, and a very wide viewing angle.
The design of this interior is in many ways unconventional, but it is class leading and acknowledged as such by the vast majority of reviews out there. To me, everything else looks dated now.
I have to disagree. When searching for a car i didn't even consider a C300/C250. Till a friend told me about the complete redesign. To me the interior of the W204 looks like it's stuck in the 90's. If it wasn't for the complete redesign i would be driving a BMW. But like you said 100% personal opinion. Also you got a great deal on your W204... and that is always good.
Originally Posted by MoneyVSOP
Just like to say the below is 100% personal opinion - and I think W205 owners are smart to purchase and drive such a nice car - but one thing bugs me about it...
The W205 interior is crazy overrated.
In my experience the interior of the pre-facelift W204 was lacking big time, but facelift - to call that a 90s-style interior - I can't agree with it. Maybe 2000s but not that far back. Big improvements in facelift interior. In terms of truly being "intuitive" - W204 blows away the initially confusing W205 interior. Obviously when you own one you'll get used to it, so this is a moot point.
In the W205, the iPad style screen looks like garbage. Deal-breaker for me. Center console is wider and definitely more cramped feeling than W204 (I am 6' tall, so not a giant) - but the seats are nicer. And don't get me started on the steering column mounted shifter. Come on now.
I do like how the cupholders are concealed in the W205, the stitching throughout and the nicer wood and trim materials. But to say that these things "elevate" the W205 above other cars in its class interior wise I think is a stretch. You can find similar interior features in a Chrysler 200 nowadays.
Exterior-wise the W205 is beautiful, even if a little soft looking. Lowering it a tiny bit could help a lot there. But even before I'd consider I'd wait for a facelift that solves the above issues.
If you just purchased a W205, congrats - and I hope you enjoy it! Sure you will not regret the purchase, and look forward to reading more about owners' experiences as I figure out what my next MB choice will be, in a couple of years.
I have to disagree. When searching for a car i didn't even consider a C300/C250. Till a friend told me about the complete redesign. To me the interior of the W204 looks like it's stuck in the 90's. If it wasn't for the complete redesign i would be driving a BMW. But like you said 100% personal opinion. Also you got a great deal on your W204... and that is always good.
I disagree with the 90s bit. I think that post-facelift W204 interior moved up a gear and was possibly the platform for current W205 interior. for me both are nice in their own way. some people even criticised W222 interior for being too futuristic . you can't please everyone I suppose
I disagree with the 90s bit. I think that post-facelift W204 interior moved up a gear and was possibly the platform for current W205 interior. for me both are nice in their own way. some people even criticised W222 interior for being too futuristic . you can't please everyone I suppose
Maybe 90s was a little extreme lol. Honestly I was never a fan of the dial buttons Mercedes had. Made it look old IMO. Again this a personal preference and opinion. I'm sure many will disagree and that's cool.
I think this is a great thread. We are all adults here. And I'm excited for the future of the W205- especially for specifics on the coupe and what later facelifts might hold. You never know what you will feel in the showroom or on a test drive sometimes...
I also feel the W205 has the most pleasing interior in its class. I initially found the column mounted shifter odd, but it makes perfect sense and does allow for added space on the console. I think most of the complaints concerning the large display are from people who have never actually used it. It functions very well, has sharp graphics, and a very wide viewing angle.
The design of this interior is in many ways unconventional, but it is class leading and acknowledged as such by the vast majority of reviews out there. To me, everything else looks dated now.
I would agree, I like a bit of weirdness in a car. The column mounted shifter took only a couple of drives to get used to and leaves the centre console clutter free. The screen, to me, is great to use and I am glad it's not a touch screen.
The whole not letting you know the doors not closed properly only after you're a ways down the road just makes me laugh with the idiocy of it- what was that about?
Just did another 250 mile trip with the car yesterday ... mostly highway, with some local driving mixed in.
Best observed fuel economy was 35.1 mpg with about 90% highway driving at 75 mph. Went through several thunder and rain storms with high winds ... car was rock solid. I am experiencing windshield wiper chatter, something I never saw with my first C300. I'll try Rain-X on the windshield or just let the dealer adjust the arms. Interior noise levels were generally very low, with some "growling" over coarse road surfaces. I had my head up by the glass listening for wind noise ... nothing on the driver's side when I was driving, and nothing on the passenger's side when my wife was driving. I can hear wind on the car in crosswinds, but it never comes through the glass.
I did get two storm warnings on the COMAND screen ... first time I've ever seen a weather alert in the car. I also got the "stop and have a cup of coffee" warning once.
The LED headlights on this car seem to light up every road sign within a 10 mile radius! It's actually dazzling in its intensity. I passed through a work zone that had reflective barrels set up as barricades, and those barrels looked like they were on fire. Oddly, with no reflective signs or markers on the road, illumination was about average.
On the way home, on an unlit section of road doing about 60 mph, a deer ran out in front of us. I swerved left to avoid it, then quickly back right into my lane. The car responded instantly with no drama, and we continued on our way.
Now approaching the 2,000 mile mark, and still no real issues. (I consider things like the windshield wiper chatter and slightly misaligned rear bumper cover to be minor adjustments that will be taken care of when the car goes in for its first service.) More importantly, the car continues to impress with its competency and design. This one's a keeper.
Now if they could only add a "door ajar" warning instead of that cryptic "gear not in Park" nonsense ....
JThe LED headlights on this car seem to light up every road sign within a 10 mile radius! It's actually dazzling in its intensity. I passed through a work zone that had reflective barrels set up as barricades, and those barrels looked like they were on fire.
I should probably use the search feature, but do you have the Adaptive Highbeam Assist?
Just did another 250 mile trip with the car yesterday ... mostly highway, with some local driving mixed in.
Best observed fuel economy was 35.1 mpg with about 90% highway driving at 75 mph. Went through several thunder and rain storms with high winds ... car was rock solid. I am experiencing windshield wiper chatter, something I never saw with my first C300. I'll try Rain-X on the windshield or just let the dealer adjust the arms. Interior noise levels were generally very low, with some "growling" over coarse road surfaces. I had my head up by the glass listening for wind noise ... nothing on the driver's side when I was driving, and nothing on the passenger's side when my wife was driving. I can hear wind on the car in crosswinds, but it never comes through the glass.
I did get two storm warnings on the COMAND screen ... first time I've ever seen a weather alert in the car. I also got the "stop and have a cup of coffee" warning once.
The LED headlights on this car seem to light up every road sign within a 10 mile radius! It's actually dazzling in its intensity. I passed through a work zone that had reflective barrels set up as barricades, and those barrels looked like they were on fire. Oddly, with no reflective signs or markers on the road, illumination was about average.
On the way home, on an unlit section of road doing about 60 mph, a deer ran out in front of us. I swerved left to avoid it, then quickly back right into my lane. The car responded instantly with no drama, and we continued on our way.
Now approaching the 2,000 mile mark, and still no real issues. (I consider things like the windshield wiper chatter and slightly misaligned rear bumper cover to be minor adjustments that will be taken care of when the car goes in for its first service.) More importantly, the car continues to impress with its competency and design. This one's a keeper.
Now if they could only add a "door ajar" warning instead of that cryptic "gear not in Park" nonsense ....
quite a dramatic trip by the sound of things. any other natural disaster that you might have missed ? i.e earthquake
Now approaching the 2,000 mile mark, and still no real issues. (I consider things like the windshield wiper chatter and slightly misaligned rear bumper cover to be minor adjustments that will be taken care of when the car goes in for its first service.)
Stan,
Didn't your first C300 have the same misaligned rear bumper issue? Could you take a picture of your current C300 rear bumper so we can see what you categorize as "misaligned"?
Didn't your first C300 have the same misaligned rear bumper issue? Could you take a picture of your current C300 rear bumper so we can see what you categorize as "misaligned"?
I don't have a good shot of that "step" where the rear bumper cover butts against the upper edge of the inner fender panel. It literally is a small step between those parts, on the inner side of the tail lights, right by the crease in the trunk lid. It should be a flush seam, but the bumper cover is usually mounted too deep ... thereby creating a small step. It is easily aligned with the use of a few small shims, but some dealers just won't do it. It is purely cosmetic, but it really should be fit properly at the plant. This is very common, and has been seen on many W205 cars regardless of where they were assembled.
I have to admit, sometimes reading all the complaints being posted here can get a bit depressing. Although the issues being discussed are certainly very real, I'm not sure they represent a truly balanced picture of what the W205 series really is.
Many of us have had some issues, and I personally had more than my fair share of them with my early build C300. Even through all of that, I always recognized the exceptional design of the car. Now that I have a new c300, one that seems fairly well sorted out, it's become very easy to appreciate this car's qualities.
I think it's too easy to get a very skewed view of the W205 ... and many prospective buyers are likely being turned away from this vehicle fearing shoddy workmanship and poor service. Many owners have had few or no serious issues with this car, and many have also had excellent service from their dealers.
There aren't many threads that praise the virtues of this car, which is a shame since Mercedes has designed a really competitive compact sedan that can be purchased for a reasonable price relative to its German rivals.
While there have been some who have loudly proclaimed that they would never buy another Mercedes product, and some have brought up the class action law suit threat as a way of addressing issues, the fact remains that this is a very good car.
I am happy with my C300, and I think it offers more than the BMW 3 series or the current version of the Audi A4. I wish MB-USA was more proactive in its customer service, and more open in how it deals with customer complaints, but this is a brilliantly designed car and we shouldn't lose track of that as all these various complaints, and rants and raves, appear on the forum.
I have been in engineering and auto racing most of my life, and I have never heard of a car with so many faults. In fact, it begs the question, why? The electrical design team should have been fired en masse. The design incorporates so many potential problems that one wonders what the chief engineer was thinking. Does he, or she, really believe that electrical components never go wrong? And when numerous cars begin to show multiple faults, there must be be something fundamentally wrong with this design. Which brings me back to my original point, there are so many faults with these cars it is almost unbelievable, almost.
Last edited by glimmer; 05-30-2015 at 08:08 PM.
Reason: Additional thought.
The latest fault to develop with my C320 is with the radio. After getting ridiculous quotes to get this repaired (back to what is now an ancient design), I pulled out the old Mercedes/Bose system and threw it away. I now have a Pioneer FH-X720BT which came with a perfect fitting kit from http://www.crutchfield.com, which has bluetooth, a CD player, and a USB port all for $150!
MassC300. Just picked up my c400 from dealer. They had to replace one of the 19" tires. Blew out on a pothole. Have tire/wheel insurance!! Out the door cost was $500. Wheel a bit scratched, but minor from rolling on it until could pull over. Suggest either less low profile tires or the insurance. Still really like the car & find it a joy to drive. On the highway it is super smooth & handles very well. Around town is also very good, but watch out for our many marred New England roads. As stated by several posters... New design, new production facility. Statistically most likely to have problems given the nature of product inception to production & organizational issues. We all would like it to be perfect, but reality is what it is.
I will not be one to turn it in as mechanically I find it to be very well made. The smoothness of the C400s power & road feel meets my expectations! I also like the C300 model & feel it is quite a leap from the last generation. You know what might be, so do your due diligence & communicate with the General Manager of your dealership if you are anxious about taking delivery. Just my dollars worth!
As you can see from above post, this is becoming a bit of a challenge. I was headed up to New Hampshire & noticed the TPMS icon on the display. Took next exit to a Gulf station & air pump. Being an optimist, I hoped it was a slow leak.
Aired it up to recommended & then noticed another blowout starting @ the rim.
Rather than wait for flat bed tow, drove back to my dealer who was only 8 miles away on route one. Steady 30 miles an hour without the tire coming off the rim.
After an email to GM, a loner was given & the day continued. Missed a visit with friends & family which was unfortunate, but glad it did not happen in the prior two days as our son was getting married & a lot of movement!
GM & I will discuss possible solutions to this tomorrow.
STRONGLY SUGGEST that if you live in a part of the world with many potholes, DON'T go for the 19" wheels. Probably fine in the American south or southwest or California.
STRONGLY SUGGEST that if you live in a part of the world with many potholes, DON'T go for the 19" wheels. Probably fine in the American south or southwest or California.
...or you could purchase a stock 19" run-flat tire and keep it in the trunk as a spare...so when you do have a tire issue, whatever place you finally make it to can easily just mount & balance the new tire.
I admit though, I opted for the 3 year wheel/tire warranty at my dealership for piece of mind. I also purchased a set of the 18" AMG wheels/tires for the Winter (since the 19" wheels come with Summer tires), and plan on using a front of whatever is off the car at the time as a spare on a long trip.
And...we are now getting close to no trunk space for usual luggage or say much of anything you might want on a trip. As a golfer my bag & cart are usually in the trunk during the summer time.
As I have thought before...shame on all of the manufacturers for setting up a dynamic that really could/can wreck a vacation. Yes, you could also get a luggage carrier for the top... However, at that point, do you have the utility of a
Luxury sport sedan or should you be driving an SUV.
I'm happy with my car (a MY2016 C300 hybrid; built in Germany). It has exceeded my expectations and the hybrid system functions really well. I was fearing I would encounter the many identified problems - but none so far; although only had it for 2 weeks (1,500 miles) so time will tell.
In the UK, the C-Class is in the small exec car sector (i.e. a glorified salesman's car) - I think that this leads me to have lower expectations than if it was sold as a "luxury sedan"; as it appears it is in the U.S. Also, having had Jaguars (although they've improved lately) and Saab's in the past, not breaking down (and having bits of the car fall off) on a weekly basis is a real plus. Also, although mine is speced up, the base C200 model in the UK is only a £26k car. Therefore I only expect the build quality of a £26k car (with optional extras) since they essentially have the same base chassis and come off the same production lines. I've also had a Lexus which had great build quality but entirely soulless.
The c class appears to have some design flaws; such as that causing the noise problems in cross winds. However, most cars I have owned have had a number of design flaws - the one that most irritates me are the dreadful seating/pedal positions that I have put up with in some cars (some manufacturers cannot transfer controls to right hand drive cars). In this regard the c class scores well with me.
However, I do not seek to excuse the unacceptably poor quality build that some have experienced. There have clearly been some problems and it is not clear that different plants necessarily have a better or worse record. It appears that some mass market manufacturers still cannot convert designs to manufacturing and quality control systems that ensure consistent high build quality. Mercedes is one of those manufacturers that perhaps relies too much on its brand rather than focus on build quality.
05-27-2015, 04:56 PM
Number two blow out
