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2012 C63;1971 280SE 3.5(Sold);2023 EQS 450 SUV 4 Matic (Wife's)
Zibby that sounds like a great idea. It will be nice to get data from a second source and lab to round out the data a little. I will do the same when I next change the oil in my C63. It will also be a relatively short service interval of ~ 5000-6000 km I think but probably not till late fall. It would be nice to see a UOA from a C63 with a longer service interval. Nice of you to offer to do this.
Zibby that sounds like a great idea. It will be nice to get data from a second source and lab to round out the data a little. I will do the same when I next change the oil in my C63. It will also be a relatively short service interval of ~ 5000-6000 km I think but probably not till late fall. It would be nice to see a UOA from a C63 with a longer service interval. Nice of you to offer to do this.
Thanks Mort! And it's my pleasure. I would not have had the idea without this thread so thank you for getting the ball rolling with respect to the verdict on this new 5W-40.
Once I've collected the sample, I should have the results/data pretty soon as I'm only a few hours away from Blackstone.
W204 C63 Coupe, W166 ML350 BlueTEC, 928GT, C5 Z06 & IS300 race cars, EQE 4Matic+ on order
Zibby - unless you're tracking or otherwise using the car under "severe" conditions (whether that means driving in "M" all the time and always upshifting north of 5K rpm, or driving it year-round in some parts of Canada and having to start it at -35 C after it's been sitting outside for 18 hours, *ANY* MB 229.5 approved oil will perform more than adequately. It is important to keep things in perspective - we're talking about minute differences here that don't make a difference in 98% of the cars, and in the remaining 2%, the quality difference between the crappiest and best MB 229.5 approved oils may be 5-10%. Just saying - there's no need to lose any sleep over it.
Zibby - unless you're tracking or otherwise using the car under "severe" conditions (whether that means driving in "M" all the time and always upshifting north of 5K rpm, or driving it year-round in some parts of Canada and having to start it at -35 C after it's been sitting outside for 18 hours, *ANY* MB 229.5 approved oil will perform more than adequately. It is important to keep things in perspective - we're talking about minute differences here that don't make a difference in 98% of the cars, and in the remaining 2%, the quality difference between the crappiest and best MB 229.5 approved oils may be 5-10%. Just saying - there's no need to lose any sleep over it.
Another outstanding post, Diabolis. Thanks man. I appreciate you taking the time to offer the perspective! Your posts are always very helpful and informative.
This has been a great thread thanks to you and Mort.
About to change my oil in my 13' C63 coupe - I have spent many hours contemplating which 229.5 oil to use. I live in the southeast where we do not see cold temps and I will probably do 2-3 DE's in the next year. I have LT headers, tune, de-catted. Most of my driving is "spirited" in nature, M-mode, not daily drive, etc. Thinking of going with a 5w 40...thoughts?
Either:
Motul 8100 x-cess 5w 40
Castol Edge (Syntec) 5w 40
Mobil 1 5w 40 (likely formula M)
Actually I have...and there is not much of a consensus statement (other than for daily use to stick with Mobil 0w 40). I am looking for some insight from those that actually track their cars and live in warmer areas of the country.
I prefaced my post by stating I have read many responses on the topic. If you don't have anything constructive to add please refrain from sarcastic responses, just trying to get a little assistance. Thanks
2012 P31 C63 Coupe Trackrat, 2019 GLE63S Coupe Beast
M1 0W-40 is the best for your engine, whether you are driving it in hot or cold or tracking. The additive package is superior to everything else tested, as are the hot/cold characteristics. I and others who track use it with no complaints. The more important thing is to change it with more frequency.
M1 0W-40 is the best for your engine, whether you are driving it in hot or cold or tracking. The additive package is superior to everything else tested, as are the hot/cold characteristics. I and others who track use it with no complaints. The more important thing is to change it with more frequency.
Appreciate the insight! May just stick with that then.
W204 C63 Coupe, W166 ML350 BlueTEC, 928GT, C5 Z06 & IS300 race cars, EQE 4Matic+ on order
Originally Posted by BLKROKT
M1 0W-40 is the best for your engine, whether you are driving it in hot or cold or tracking. The additive package is superior to everything else tested, as are the hot/cold characteristics. I and others who track use it with no complaints. The more important thing is to change it with more frequency.
^ This.
Unless you're going to change the oil immediately before and just after your track day, stick with M1 0W-40. Actually, if you are tracking the car, you should probably change the oil after a couple of events regardless of what oil you're running.
2012 C63;1971 280SE 3.5(Sold);2023 EQS 450 SUV 4 Matic (Wife's)
Here is my latest report for MB Spec 229.5 oil. I ran this oil in my 2012 C63 and the results are much better than the Mobil 1 0W40 that was in it when I bought it. The oil was changed in the car in October 2014 by the Dealer in Halifax NS. I changed it out to MB 229.5 in April 2015 and it had 2059 km on it. I put 3991 km on the car and took a sample for analysis on November 1 2015. The MB229'5 looks much stronger than the Mobil1 0w40 in this comparison. I will run the MB 229.5 5W40 for my next interval.
2012 P31 C63 Coupe Trackrat, 2019 GLE63S Coupe Beast
Visc looks improved on the top end (not sure I like higher on the low temp end), but I like that the M1 has more Moly and Boron. Also your M1 UOA shows a lot of fuel?
Calling Diabolis - I'm thinking about using the M1 0W-50 Racing Oil. Apparently it has a similar detergent package to the M1 0W-40. Thoughts anyone? The UOA's look great over at BITOG.
I would be very hesitant to use a 0-50 oil. The viscosity difference could cause trouble. check the manual, it will allow for a variety of viscosities, as long as they are 229.5 approved. I don't think 0-50 is one.
Here is my latest report for MB Spec 229.5 oil. I ran this oil in my 2012 C63 and the results are much better than the Mobil 1 0W40 that was in it when I bought it. The oil was changed in the car in October 2014 by the Dealer in Halifax NS. I changed it out to MB 229.5 in April 2015 and it had 2059 km on it. I put 3991 km on the car and took a sample for analysis on November 1 2015. The MB229'5 looks much stronger than the Mobil1 0w40 in this comparison. I will run the MB 229.5 5W40 for my next interval.
I strongly suspect contamination impacted the results of your first test. I wouldn't discard the Mobil 0-40 just yet. Also, Mercedes doesn't make oil, they just rebrand others.
2012 C63;1971 280SE 3.5(Sold);2023 EQS 450 SUV 4 Matic (Wife's)
Originally Posted by looney100
I strongly suspect contamination impacted the results of your first test. I wouldn't discard the Mobil 0-40 just yet. Also, Mercedes doesn't make oil, they just rebrand others.
I think you may be correct that the sample was impacted by sitting and being started without proper run time while the car was waiting to be sold. The question is how much. The viscosity breakdown of the Mobil 1 0W40 is consistent with other UOA I have seen. I think everyone realizes that MB does not make oil but they can have oil formulated to their specs which I believe is the case here.
My SA told me it is now Fuchs TITAN Supersyn LONGLIFE SAE 0W-40 made in Germany, anyone able to confirm?
He also said that if they have the option they still prefer M1 0W40.
That said I will be running a 5000k change interval on Motul 300V 5W40. My car uses very little if any oil so I am not too worried about cats. It doesn't have quite the viscosity index of M1 0W40 or the TBN but I get it cheap and love the additive package.
W204 C63 Coupe, W166 ML350 BlueTEC, 928GT, C5 Z06 & IS300 race cars, EQE 4Matic+ on order
Mort - just about the only conclusion I can draw from the UOA is that in the M1 0W-40 sample you had way too much water and fuel in the sump, which in turn could explain everything from the viscosity breakdown to the amount of wear metals present. While some of the moisture would have evaporated if you had taken the car for a long drive prior to getting the sample, it still implies that you drove a fair number of short trips without fully warming up the motor (which is how the moisture got there in the first place - oil is not hygroscopic and doesn't absorb water just by sitting) prior to parking it, and furthermore doesn't explain the fuel content in the sample.
The MB 229.5 oil is now made by Shell and is surprisingly decent (I ran it for two track events and it held up very nicely) - but it's still more environmentally friendly than the M1 0W-40 and has lower anti-wear additives, and furthermore tries to address the flat tappet bleed-off by making a thicker formulation which in this case comes at the expense of the cold viscosity. And, if you look at the corresponding VIs of the M1 and the MB oils in the UOA, the M1 still wins despite being diluted a fair amount - that right there says plenty about the quality of the corresponding base stocks.
Blkrocket - I would not run a 0W-50 oil - well, "anything-W"-50 - in a M156 motor as the hot viscosity (17+ cSt) is much too thick for the motor to provide sufficient oil circulation and cooling. My top choice? Shell Rotella T6. It's a 5W-40 HDEO, 14.2 cSt hot (just about perfect for track use where your oil will be at 120+ C the entire time) and a HTHS north of 4. Even the racing M1 0W-50 formulation can't touch it with the 3.8 film shear strength without starting with a 17+ cSt oil. Shell won't release official HTHS figures for it - their response is that it's "proprietary information", but all VOAs show a HTHS of 4.0 - 4.2 and it has Volvo VDS-4 approval, so the HTHS can't drop below 3.9). It's what I run in my P-cars and may run in the C63 once the warranty expires and if I don't drive it in the winter. It even has a TBN of 9, making it a great all-around oil - you don't even have to dump it after 3000 km...
W204 C63 Coupe, W166 ML350 BlueTEC, 928GT, C5 Z06 & IS300 race cars, EQE 4Matic+ on order
Originally Posted by Missionary
My SA told me it is now Fuchs TITAN Supersyn LONGLIFE SAE 0W-40 made in Germany, anyone able to confirm?
He also said that if they have the option they still prefer M1 0W40.
That said I will be running a 5000k change interval on Motul 300V 5W40. My car uses very little if any oil so I am not too worried about cats. It doesn't have quite the viscosity index of M1 0W40 or the TBN but I get it cheap and love the additive package.
I can confirm that the *current* MB-branded 229.5 oil on the dealer shelves isn't made by Fuchs - it's made by Shell. It's possible that MB may have used Fuchs in the interim between the ExxonMobil -> Shell transition (the bottles with the silver/blue labels - I don't think anyone knows what exactly was in those), but the bottles with the silver/yellow label contain Shell-made oil.
And yes, the M1 0W-40 is still a better oil for the engine.
The Motul 300V is an ester-base, motorcycle-only racing oil made specifically for shared transmission, small-displacement engines where it also has to lubricate the transmission in addition to the motor. For your C63 it's beter than, say, olive oil, but not by much... so why on earth would you do that??
Last edited by Diabolis; 11-20-2015 at 03:22 PM.
Reason: Stoooopid extra blank spaces that IE puts in
The Motul 300V is an ester-base, motorcycle-only racing oil made specifically for shared transmission, small-displacement engines where it also has to lubricate the transmission in addition to the motor. For your C63 it's beter than, say, olive oil, but not by much... so why on earth would you do that??
Thanks for the comment D, better check we are talking about the same stuff?
06-30-2015, 08:26 PM
Your posts are always very helpful and informative. 
