Mc81b

Apptech forge very good wheels all around.
Even the optional LP700-4 lightweight wheels are forged by them

604 C63

OH. I must have missed the release of the Black Series sedan. Otherwise, I would stand by Thrilla's comment. The 507 is the closest you can get to a Black series with 4 doors.

Mc81b

My bad,i was breeze reading through your comment..
But i would disagree with that,i believe the closest to the Black Series with 4 door will be the C63 DR520

604 C63

OK. You go get one. I'll wait right here. Call Jensen Button. He has one of the 20. Oh, drat. His is a wagon. Well, at any rate, I'll be here. Be sure to post pics.

Mc81b

Mate there's no need to be on the offensive.
There was one on pistonhead UK a few months ago.
When you said 507 is the closest to a Black Series in terms of a 4 door sedan.
Are you just upset i called the 507 a far cry from the Black Series?

604 C63

Actually, according to the comment Jensen sold his. I suppose that would make sense given sponsorships etc

604 C63

No, I just don't like people that have nothing better to do than nit pick the minutae of other peoples comments. Usually they drive BMW's, but there are a few of them around here.

604 C63

Im cranky today. Sorry. BTW cool coffee table. Really, really cool coffee table.

Mc81b

I started this thread a week before i got my Black Series while driving a C63 Sedan to find out if the huge premium for a Black Series was worth the bucks or not.
The very same reason i followed up on this thread is to have feedback from other owners and to share the experience(I'm a very happy converted Black Series client here).

When your answer to the 507 being the closest to a Black Series,a DR520 came to my mind as my country only allows RHD car.
Offering a debate in return for this is not nitpicking.
I myself have not tested a DR520 but i missed out on buying one before i bought my C63 Sedan as my country have a 3 year import rule which led me to be fascinated with a 2010 C63 officially produced by AMG to even outperform in HP term to a 2012 Black Series as well as a 2014 507.

The other reason why i'm monitoring the W204 thread constantly is because i am extremely interested to modify and bring my car to another level of modification as over in Singapore,most C63 owners do is exhaust muffler/RAM intake and a tune.

I do not mean to troll anybody for any reasons but am here for genuine opinions and ideas.

Cheers on that mate

604 C63

I don't think anyone will dispute the BS is some next level action as compared to the 507. Whether its worth the premium or not is a matter of opinion, with that opinion no doubt being influenced by how much spare dosh you have and how & where you drive. I think location may be a factor as I understand there are some more stringent maintenance requirements? I could be wrong there.

For me - its just not an option, cos its for use as a daily driver and I need 4 doors. So after have a C63 and a C63 w/P30 I am getting close to landing a low mileage 507. Where I am and how I use it I just can't take care of a 507 the way it needs to be cared for. Besides, based on the road quality here and my limited track time its an expense that would bring me no benefit other than the exclusivity.

Never even seen a DR520 in North America, so when you said that would be closer to a BS that echoed of "Oh yeah, well a dragon flies faster than an eagle". Possible in theory, but who the hell knows. Like I said, Im cranky today, and for that I apologize.

Mc81b

No offense taken in anyway buddy.
Everyone is entitled to their own opinion.
Yes over here the requirement for having a car is way way more strict than most countries(no mods allowed,even for exhaust you need govt cert of approval etc etc) and to bring in a used car,it can't be older than 3 years from date of first registration.
But thats off the topic.

Good luck with your purchase if it happens,apart from the exclusivity and the 507bhp,(just my opinion),i suspect if you are to keep it for long term usage that would be a better option in terms of holding it's value as a base C63 is manufactured from 2008-2012 and a facelifted 2012-2014.
The year for the 507 is rather short 2013-2015 mid(which makes it more exclusive and maybe slightly more sought after?).
That being said,i did not wash my C63 Sedan for 2 months and i smoke in it like i stole it.
LOL
Cheers buddy and i value your opinion on that and i apologize if i offended you in anyway.

604 C63

WHAAAAATTTT? That's, that's, that's so frustrating if you are a car nut!

I think you've been driving my wife's van too, then

Mc81b

You'll be even more surprised with the other rules than.
For self importation
You can only own a car for 10 years,you have to buy something called the COE(Certificate of Entitlement) which gives you a lifespan of 10 years usage which cost in the range of 55k usd + -.
Next,you have to pay a 127% import tax
100%-OMV-Open Market Value for first 30k
125% for next 20
150% for another 30
175% for the rest
20%-Government landing tax
7%-GST
20k import tax
So if you were to buy a brand new C63 W204 Sedan,it will be like
60k usd new???
60k + 100% (60k) = 120k
60,000 x 0.2 (Landing tax)=12k
60k x 0.07 (GST)=4.2k
+20k (emission tax)
So basically when you get it registered over in Singapore,
you have to pay all of the above.
It is going for 310k usd for a brand new one from dealer.
You still have to pay a yearly road tax (6k) for a 6.2L engine.

All prices stated above are in USD.

Rules and regulation of modification
Only government approved modification (exhaust slip on) with certificate
You can't change the car length/width,it is illegal for you to even add a spoiler that protrudes 1mm over the actualy car length.
Strokking engine (adding displacement will cause your car to be confiscated as you are cheating the government of road tax)

So,it is truly ridiculous to own cars in Singapore but there are definitely tons of motorheads around.

You will be surprised that 75% of the Mercedes Benz in Singapore which are 180/200/220 etc have AMG badges on.
That is because the dealers offer a AMG package to most of the purchases.

Now,that is truly retarded

604 C63

my mind reels. all I can think is that your legislator's have waaaaaaay too much time on their hands if they can make a rule book that byzantine. And that really really leaves you at the mercy of importers and foreign speed shops, cos pretty much how it comes in is how it will stay. And I can't even comprehend whats happening there in terms of currency exchange v cost.

You know from our PMs where I am located, and there is no shortage of high end and performance vehicles here, and no shortage of shops to push them even closer to the limits. If you ever find yourself in my corner of the world let me know, and we will make arrangements for you to drive some stuff that will never make it your way.

Mc81b

Will do buddy!
If you ever do pop by to the tiny red dot known as Singapore,let me know.
Will show you the super/hyper car scene here.
Pretty ridiculous even though the prices of cars here are way mad.
There's even a Koenigsegg Agera here that is registered for 3.8m USD

DARRYL D

Are there any differences between the years of the 507 edition?
cosmetics? parking sensors? etc....

Looking into getting a 2015 507 edition.

G-Von

Doubt it. I think there was only 507 editions for 2014 year Sedan and maybe 2014 and 2015 Coupe models.

AhhMyyGawd

The "507 edition" vehicles are different compares to the regular base C63 by having reinforced internals from the SLS i believe, red brake calipers, 19" rims (black or silver), 507 stripe, and of course the increased 507 horsepower. However, they can all have different options depending on how they were speced. I hope that answers your question.

Diabolis

Most of the things you mentioned (i.e. the lighter and forged engine internals, upgraded brakes, etc.) are all part of the performance P31 package in the USA and APX package in Canada (and I have no idea what it was called in other parts of the world). The differences between the 507 and the 2013 models with the performance package are the "nostrils" on the hood, unique wheels and the vinyl stripe along the door - in other words, all cosmetic. While the 507 was rated at 507 horsepower and cars with the performance package were rated at 487 hp (481 SAE), the universally accepted "truth" is that the power output of the 2012-2013 models with the performance package was misrepresented in order not to cannibalize sales from the higher models (E, CLS, S etc.) that at the time were still using the same 6.2L engine, which is furthermore supported by a number of dyno tests and comparisons between the two. Once all the other models adopted the 5.5L biturbo V8, the published output of the C63 was raised to 507 hp for the last version of the car - the "507 edition".

There were no differences between the "507" model years in places where they were offered as in some parts of the world the W205 chassis was already replacing the 507 W204 it as the 2015 model. There were also 10 "Legacy Edition" RHD coupes that were released in South Africa in 2015, which were painted in a unique Viper Green colour, had matte black wheels and a large rear spoiler mounted on the trunk but otherwise inherited all of the "507 edition" goodies and cosmetics.

AhhMyyGawd

Oh woops. i was totally drunk when i posted that haha. what he said

BadCompany

I know a lot of people suggest this as a "truth," but I just don't understand why no tuner will confirm this. While I haven't had the opportunity to do so on my C63, I've tuned/had custom tuned 5+ cars. It isn't terribly difficult to look at the tunes for the two different models and confirm whether they are identical. It's just strange. I guess if they want PP owners to believe they are making bigger gains... But that doesn't make sense given before and after dynos. Anyway, I'm just saying it is strange that whether the tunes are actually the same or not is some kind of closely held secret by all the tuners.

Diabolis

My suspicion is that it is indeed a lot more profitable to sell $1K+ tunes if you can claim that they give you +45 hp instead of just +19 hp.

And, what doesn't make sense given the before and after dyno pulls? Most people getting the tunes are the ones without the performance packs, and those cars are indeed limited from the factory so the gains on non-PP cars are in the 80+ hp range. I haven't seen many before and after dyno graphs on PP cars (or 507s) where the tune was the only change... come to think of it, the only one or two I remember seeing here had also put in new air filters and spark plugs, which completely skews the results. Plus, dynos - and the operators - are about as accurate as, say, a sundial if you're trying to tell the time. IMHO drag strip times tell the real story better.

kimeran

I had a stock P31, and did a flash on mine.
Achieved a 30whp gain.
The gains got more and more, eventually leveling out at 30whp gain.

Diabolis

There is a thread here claiming that a 507 gained 25 whp from a EC V5 tune. Someone else then posted that another tuned 507 with mother mods that was dynoed just hours earlier was reading 20 whp less. Regardless, whatever power increase you think you have gained would be the same between the P31 and the 507, and it is nowhere near 30 whp unless you are running your engine within an inch of its life.

P.S. This is what Steve Dinan has to say about your 30 whp tune... it's around the 6:30 mark if you don't want to listen to the whole thing.

skratch77

Na bmws are close to 100hp/l stock and have nothing to do with a m156.our engine is DETUNED from the factory.

My p31 made exactly 400whp stock.then 432 with a tune,then 442 with row boxes and prodrys etc.then 460 with headers and then 480 with taking cars out and adding a remus exhaust.

the sls black series makes 622hp right there with your Dinan bmw making 100hp/l and I would agree 100% that an sls black series cant make 30whp with a tune.maybe 10whp tops on race gas because that engine is maxed out in stock form but not our version of that engine.heck our TB dont even open all the way up with a tune.