$57,000 for headbolts?!?!?! An epic read.
 

Watch the descent from purchase to madness. Yes its an R63 but still the M156. Start at Road and Track for the basic explanation, then link over to the original. Im just getting rolling on it really, its a big one.

http://www.roadandtrack.com/car-cult...-57000-repair/


No matter what, just think about the gut check moment when your service dude slides this over to you......


https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...2e8b535ca6.jpg

Glad a major publication is bringing some light to that issue and MB's handling of it.

57,000$ is not the rebuild price. That is the price to flat out replace the engine with a brand new factory crate engine. I like how it says cutting is involved? i really hope not. This is definitely not a job most owners have the skills to do on their own. He should've gone to a different dealer or someone more knowledgeable that doesnt just want to replace the whole engine. Without pulling the heads off and establishing that there is damage to the block engine replacement isnt necessary.

Agreed.

The 'fun' starts on page 7 and Im dying to hear why thats the only option.
Personally, Im buying a motor at a wrecker.

Im 22 pages in. MB did jack for this poor guy. People can debate a few aspects of this, but they could of at least cut him a break on parts. The parts price from his dealer was like 30% OVER list. Thats nasty.
This is all a familiar story, I know.
Im a little flabbergasted at the cheek of attempting to slide the guy a $57000 bill on a 9 year old minivan lol.

In the meantime, look at how the motor fits in this thing! And THAT's why buddy needs to pull the motor right out,
and why he needs a lift just to be able to do the headbolts. Whether done by a dealer (at first they wouldn't) or an indy shop
it would indeed be a massive bill that exceeds what this job would cost in our world.


https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...8ebf15e621.jpg


https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...35438b4266.jpg

from what i've seen so far without looking too hard is this the highest mileage m156 with headbolts going bad so far?

i'm at 140k now and not sure how much longer i'll have the car so wasn't sure if it was worth it for me to get mine done.

Why did he yank the engine? Once that cowling was removed there's enough room to pull the IM off.

Attachment 363818

Wonder if that bolt head bounced around at all?

Attachment 363819

Great read..... however it makes me a little sad that nobody here noticed it on Grassroots, and that the guy didn't come over here once he looked into it further.

I'm on page 10 :y

BLKROKT - I wish the guy had come over here too. He seems immensely likeable, has a great can do attitude, and is very practical and capable. Plus he just plain loves that motor and the idea of it being stuffed in a van, and I totally get that. Totally rooting for this guy. He seems a bit legendary over there and I can see why.

On the other hand, the first time someone shows him how far our hoods open and how easy it is to access the motor, it might take the fight out of him.

If he came here it would have saved him a lot of time and money.

I joined up over there, but there is a 24 hour wait before newbies can post. Once thats up I will steer him over this way, cos we gotta be able to help him. We could probably learn a couple things from him, too.

Going to ask why he dropped that motor right out as well.

I'm probably gonna sound crazy here, but this guy for 57515$ is actually getting a good deal to some degree in terms of what other dealerships around me would charge strictly. Just for fun I asked 3 dealers what they were charging, and they all quoted me around 66-70K.

I'm sure the 3 dealers thought it was "fun" to waste their time compiling you quotes for this too. I get it, a lot of people hate dealers, and I'm sure you got a kick out of that. But that's just unnecessary jackassery.

Noted. I would put it under researching though. Sure one source is gonna give one price, while another a different one. I simply just wanted to see what an average cost for a repair of this magnitude was gonna cost along the board, and share it with everyone as they may find my findings interesting. If trying to obtain primary information so I can make a reasonably intelligent claim is going to be labeled as "jackassery" then so be it. They're being paid to answer customers questions at the dealership. If my questions are unreasonable to them, or violates some terms of service they can always just refuse to answer my questions.

I always found it bizarre how some dealers jack up the prices. I had to replace a valence on my ML, and my dealer wanted $300 more than another MB dealer and refused to match or flex - so I had the other dealer ship it to my dealers parts department. It was one of the major MB supply dealers...

As a "customer" you might as well call them to ask for a Thanksgiving recipe, maybe string bean casserole, while you're at it. Because that has as much relevancy to answering a common-sense definition of "customer question" as you wasting their time with this. Which takes time away from real work that can be done for a real customer with a serious inquiry. Maybe it's just me, but I tend to have more respect for people's time.

I just called mine and they said they don't provide that service.

Next time press the info button instead of the wrench. I was told point blank, they're allowed to discuss whatever topic you like as an M-Brace member.

Ha! Get comfortable - only 27 more to go.:eek:

Well if I want to know the answer to how much a brand new R63 engine is gonna cost plus installation who should I ask? Sure I don't own the car, but I want to learn some information regarding it. Who better to know that information than Mercedes Benz them self. If trying to learn is a waste of another persons time. Well then we're all wasting each others time then. On a real note though string bean casserole sounds really good right now for some reason.

Why? It's a nearly 10 year old car with 100,000 miles on it. What do people expect Mercedes to do? They sell new vehicles and CPO the good used ones...they could care less about older Mercedes. I do agree jacking up the cost of repair parts is very dishonest though.

Now many dealerships will repair old ones for the money most of the time, but a $57K quote is a mean way of saying take it somewhere else.

BMW has yet acknowledge the rod bearing issues on their older M3/M5s either. They will service the ones in warranty, but once that runs out all bets are off.

"Common wisdom says buying a ten year old AMG Mercedes out of warranty is certain to cause immense pain and maritial strife. This money is basically year three of our three years of savings just in case. It's supposed to be sitting there in case we need it, but instead I'm going to drive it around. "

Yeah he found that out real quick and bought a car he never should have.

I don't mean this particular instance, nor did I say that MB should have paid for it, but I don't like that MBUSA CS denies a head bolt revision and says they can't tell by vin or engine serial. Once they realized such an issue existed I would have liked to have seen them repair models in the effected vin/serial range. I know it doesn't happen to every vehicle, but it was enough to warrant a change in design. If I had purchased one new, in warranty, and had a head bolt **** the bed 2k miles out of warranty I would be pretty displeased that they had refused to replace it and given me the "let's wait and see what happens".

When I bought my car, I knew some were effected but wasn't sure what the deal was and was unaware of the revision, luckily I was fine but that comes down on me. I tried to consult with MBUSA prior to purchase and I wish they would have handled it better.

When L3/Eotech realized they had sold optics with defects, they did a no questions asked buyback, probably far more costly than what it would have been for MB to replace headbolts. Somewhat apples to oranges, but I wish they would have gone about it a bit differently, I don't think the headbolt and ESL issues are confidence inspiring.

Wishful thinking I guess.

I would have to think of what they are, but I would hazard a guess that there are issues with our car that are much more common and have not had a recall because they are also with an occurrence rate deemed acceptable by somebody somewhere. There's just not as much kerfuffle over them cos they aren't as expensive to repair. Personally, I don't believe the incidence rate of this is all that high, it's not that well known in the public at large (more people know about the M3 issue), and nowhere is it better known or more widely discussed than right here in this very sub-forum. The reasons for THAT are two-fold, relating to expense vs average income and expense vs average vehicle cost. This motor is in several vehicles, and as you go up the price ladder there is less and less concern about it.

I don't think that MB is under any obligation to pony up on an out of warranty car, especially when not purchased through their dealer system. HOWEVER, it is a known quantity, and I think it would be good if they tossed in a small bag of parts (bolts & gaskets) if that work was being done at a dealership, and they should be telling their dealers parts price pillaging is not cool on this one. That would at least put their prices at little more in line with indy shops and give the appearance of caring. It's bad form to be making too much money off of someone else's misfortune, especially when you designed the vehicle. So I think they are doing pretty much just that, and they are basically out of the "must take action" window.

Turn this issue a bit so it doesn't involve a car you own and cant possibly cost you money....

If I go on Craigslist, pick up an out of warranty M3 that hasn't had the bearing job, from a private seller, and in 6 months time it all goes pear shaped, what is BMWs obligation to me? Zip. Zero. Jack Squat. Why? Cos they havent made one thin dime off me up until this point. No upside means no liability for downside either. Anything they may do is in the name of "future goodwill" and they will take that on a case by case basis, depending on perhaps my history with BMW or a dealership. Exactly what MB is doing.

People buy these cars, and M3/5's, without any check re major issues, repair costs etc. then flip when they find out that this high performance bucket of a million moving parts doesn't always work perfect all the time, and may cost real money to repair.
Buyer Beware, same as it ever was. As my uncle would say "Nobody cares about pregnancy tests until after the screwing is done".
What? There could be consequences for our actions? That don't involve a medal for the last place finisher? Yup.

I think the gentleman in question accepts full responsibility for getting there in a vehicle with such an expensive motor, and he's just minimizing the financial downside to himself. He has more time than money, and he has the ability, so more power to him. I get his thought process and admire the way he seems to be completely free of self pity on this.

A lot more than that. Im up to today and he still has to get it back together and back into the car.
Im a believer though. I think he can do it. With his apparent experience level there should be no reason he cant.

Too bad he didn't see the headbolt issue before he bought (although probably would not have changed his mind). Seems there are so few R63's there is not a lot of info on the failures, but when you look at a more volume model like the C63, there is a lot more info, I was well aware of the issues when looking for one and the headbolt issues popped up constantly when searching for c63 issues.

Rob