ecohen2

Random question..

I keep going through tires because they get ridiculously loud. Today I was cleaning up a set of wheels and noticed that the inside edge of the rear tires is ground down considerably more than the rest of the tire. The tread is great on the outside edge and center, but the last inch of the inside has virtually no tread left.

Is this a normal wear pattern for these cars?
Is there a better alignment setting than stock? Less camber?

Thanks,
Ed

zcct04

This is a result of camber and toe-in. Well, actually, camber, toe and leadfoot.
Toe can be reduced. Camber isn't adjustable - can be changed a little using eccentric 'crash bolts', can be changed a lot using a camber adjusting plate (probably overkill for the street).

ecohen2

You wouldn't happen to know what stock toe-in is suppose to be?

Vladds

Does not have to be this way. These are my rear tires. They are toast and ready for one final session of burnouts and donuts. But they are kinda evenly worn. That surprised me.
Can't say the same about my fronts though.

C63fora2w1

What kind of milage are you getting out of a set ? My stock conti's lasted 6k and my set of MPSS was just replaced at 4500 miles... thankfully Michelin has a warranty so to replace my rears only cost $98 installed. My tires also wear unevenly and since I just had them replaced I wanted to get an adjustment to prolong the life as much as possible.

Vladds

These were the set that came with the car. When I got the car, roughly 7000 miles ago, I could see the DWS, meaning no more than a quarter of thread was gone.
The front did what everyone expects, lasted 5k miles, then the inner edge was toast. I would say possibly the total life of these has been 6k for the front and probably below 9 k for the rear.
Due to NYC traffic, I have to drive like a grandma, but I do have my moments of burning rubber.
I did have two alignments on it, first a Sears, then at the dealer.

QWKSNKE

I zero'd my toe couple of years ago to even my tire wear. Worked perfect

Ludedude

Toe more than camber. Manufacturers add toe in at the rear for stability but it's hell on tire life. My S2000 was like that. A good alignment with the bare minimum of toe in at the rear can drastically change wear patterns, even with -3 deg of camber like I had.

I haven't looked at the specs for this car, but 1/16" total toe in might do the trick.

Alex.currie44

From the set up results spec sheet on my 2013 when I got it
Camber of the rear wheels is -1.48 degrees to -2.48.
Toe is 0.01 - 0.25
Thrust angle -0.12 to 0.12

ecohen2

Excellent.... Going to take the car in and have it checked, then adjusted with slightly less toe...

Ed

Alex.currie44

I don't have time to look it up but a while back I thought they could adjust toe but someone said no they can't and my service manager agreed.
Somebody jump in here please.

zcct04

Toe is adjustable on both front and rear.

Alex.currie44

So what is it that is not adjustable in the rear of these cars? I cannot find the email.

1Lop2K5C

It is camber that you cant adjust unless you get a camber/toe kit.

K-Mac

New car industry’s best kept secret – the often quoted “Full front and rear Wheel alignment” is only “Toe” (directional) adjustment. There is no Camber or Caster to CHANGE TIRE CONTACT ANGLES!

CAMBER – Allows to resolve costly, premature edge tire wear, improving traction/understeer/over steer

CASTER – Correctly resolves steering pull, increases steering response. With better turn in and high speed directional control. Along with improved anti dive/lift under brake and acceleration

No Camber, Caster adjustment is OK if maintained and driven at showroom height. But the reality of day to day commuting encountering high cambered roads or altered height through load carrying or lowering. Fitting wide profile tires. Curb knocks.... Camber and Caster full adjustment capability is essential.

For the front (only) you can fit inaccurate, one only position fluted bolts – but they only offer a minimal 0.3 degrees (1/8”) offset!

We saw the need therefore to re-instate from the early 90’s precise/full adjustment capability – to fix it right the first time.

The K-MAC patented design front kit provides up to 3 times the adjustment range of the “one position” bolts and is PRECISE SINGLE WRENCH ADJUSTMENT – accurately on car (under load) direct on alignment rack.

Extra feature is that the front kit replaces the 4 highest wearing bushings and is 2 axis/mono ball (self aligning) without the OEM oil and air voids. Result is noticeably improved brake and steering response.

Rear kit also provides precise Camber adjustment for the first time (and extra Toe adjustment to compensate for the new Camber facility).

Also manufactured are front “replacement” top strut mounts (coil spring models) – for “Track days” Stage 2 (Street/Race) or Stage 3 (Full race) when wanting to reduce understeer – in the pursuit of hitting those corner apexes every time and going deeper into the corners with increased traction and braking response.

Another popular kit manufactured is uprated replacement bushings (12) for the ‘6’ multi link rear arms. Providing significant improvement to rear end stability, less twitch/flex, improved traction especially when applying power to lane change/overtake.

X204

Front Camber and Caster kit #502616K $480
Rear Camber (and extra Toe) kit #502226$480

Stage 2 (Street/Race) Strut adjusters Camber and Caster kit #503016-2L $545
Stage 3 (Full Race) Strut adjusters Camber and Caster kit #503016-3L $545

Rear multi link arms performance bush kit (12) #502628K $480

Delivery one kit $30 with each additional kit $20. We accept PayPal, Visa or MasterCard.

D3-AMG

I seem to recall the FAQ section talking about this some. I remember seeing Toe numbers for the C63 as being .25-.50 (this is the range allowed to be "in spec" for the alignment) vs. E63/other63 being closer to 0. Other 63s have more rear weight. But as pointed out above, you can get the toe changed to essentially 0, just need to be careful about driving.

I have the same DWS tires and daily drive like a grandma 90% of the time. I haven't changed my toe yet, will do after replacing this set of tires. I get around 10,000 miles on the rear before they are done and easily 20,000 on the fronts before the 'S' is gone and they just show 'DW'. I'm hopeful to get more out of my rears after an alignment change. My dealer said they'd do a custom setting and not just force me to have the .25-.50 range.

Kinda makes me wonder if there was a typo never caught in the Mercedes documentation of alignment settings and it should really be 0.025-0.050.

Mort

For rear toe the specs I have are:

2008-2011 : 0*48' (+/- 0*07')

20012-2014 : 0*15' (+/- 0*07')

Vladds

How do you take the second line into the specs that the shops usually give you, as above:
0.01 to -0.25


And I've seen these in the WIS for PFL and FL written even worse:
0.69+0*48' (+/- 7')


and
0.07+0*15' (+/- 7')


I mean what's 0.01 to -0.25, radians? It's an angle, it should be in degrees.

skullbox15

How do you cash in on that? We all buy these tires simply for the fact that we want good traction until we burn them off...

zcct04

Convert angles to inches of toe:

https://robrobinette.com/ConvertToeDegreesToInches.htm



and here's a good discussion about the math and about why degrees & minutes (written as * and ' in the specs above) is better than inches:

https://www.6speedonline.com/forums/...al-inches.html

Mort

Robrobinette is who I use as well when I need to convert from degrees to inches for comparison purposes. I generally measure from a string setup in inches and then convert to degrees but it is not exact because I am measuring to the wheel rim.

ecohen2

The car is getting an alignment today and will be taking a 1700 miles road trip next week... When I get the sheet on the numbers, ill post them along with a wear update...

Ill be curious how out of alignment the car was and what they set it to..

Ed

zcct04

Mort's point is good - for any degree of toe, the 'inches' of toe varies depending on whether you measure it at the tread surface or the wheel.

Fortunately, it's easy to measure the diameter you want to use (about 23" for tread, about 18" or 19" for wheel), and you can enter that into the Robinette calculator to get an exact conversion.

hachiroku

although i do not own a C63, I always zero the toe in the rear of all my cars.

1Lop2K5C

I have been running 265 19in profile with .24-.25 toe setting and getting good wear on the tires.