Old vs New ( WEISTEC INSIDE) results
 

Hi guys

Here is the difference between old stage 3 Weistec vs New Gen3 Weistec

Big differences in flow and design
New
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...e5a16351f5.jpg

OLDhttps://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...bcfa06af9f.jpg
OLD
https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...ef7489fd87.jpg

NEW
https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...e6f747b3f0.jpg

OLD
https://cimg0.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...cc59f27044.jpg

NEW
https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...cdfd00547e.jpg

New
https://cimg6.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...75155138ff.jpg

Old vs new
https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...493853fc38.jpg

Together


Stage 2 and 3 and Gen3https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...ead7c09264.jpg

https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...a67964a7e3.jpg

Baseline

How much difference in hp?

Power results coming this week

If only you posted this on friday...

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...ceaab7abe5.jpg
So finally got the results for the GEN3

what surprises me is how efficient this blower is and how the boost has raised

we used the same 67mm pulley the same belt same fuel in the tank same spark plugs

Weather was exactly the same
we could only do 4 dyno passes as car snapped a strap on the dyno

ECU didn't have alot of time to learn but I'm sure with a few more passes it would of gained a little more power and that dip would of cleaned up

In a couple weeks we will be leaning on this tune a little more as car is a little boring

but I cant wait to get out there with the 60mm pulley and try and run some faster passes

https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...ceaab7abe5.jpg
So finally got the results for the GEN3

what surprises me is how efficient this blower is and how the boost has raised

we used the same 67mm pulley the same belt same fuel in the tank same spark plugs

Weather was exactly the same
we could only do 4 dyno passes as car snapped a strap on the dyno

ECU didn't have alot of time to learn but I'm sure with a few more passes it would of gained a little more power and that dip would of cleaned up

In a couple weeks we will be leaning on this tune a little more as car is a little boring

but I cant wait to get out there with the 60mm pulley and try and run some faster passes

Nice gains mate! I'm also surprised boost went up with same pulley. These track times will be killer!

Curious why you guys are surprised the boost increased? The impeller design is improved so isn't that a direct byproduct?

I think the surprising part is that boost is raised throughout the rpm range. I would have expected the improved volumetric efficiency would only been noticeable up top. Basically the new design give better airflow everywhere.

Interesting though how rough and irregular they left the casting in the previous generation. Seems like there was a lot left on the table.

TBH I wasn't sure what I was expecting but I'm.over the moon now and can't wait to try 60mm and 57mm pulley and see how much boost it makes

thought you said your car made 700whp?

Proof is in the MPH this test was done on 67mm pulley on pump fuel

Generally speaking, boost drops when a charger is ported. It's to do with the airspeed (most likely) slowing down (by a small amount) vs the increase in overall flow capacity/ability. For boost to have gone up along with increased flow (let's assume there's more flow), the revised design must have been very well thought out indeed. Either that or the original was far from optimal.

434KW == 590whp. You must also consider that he was using a Dyno Dynamics. ~600 on a Dyno Dynamics may well read out ~700 on a Dynojet.

His car traps around 140mph.

Back on the dyno this morning with a new dyno strap

30wkw gain but its leaning out looks like i need to adjust tune and fuel pressure for 98ron
https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/www.mbw...83502cc66e.jpg

Its a mix of tune and fuel

Its pretty much dropping 2000 bar of pressure from 5k onwards
Needs a fuel system mate

That blower upgrade is definitely next gen! You picked up power everywhere and boost! Absolutely no negatives from the new blower.i was thinking it would of lost power under 5k rpms

You got me wanting to supercharge mine now lol

I am honestly stumped i wish it didnt lean out i would love to see the true figure

Well done Whipple and Weistec

I didn't notice that. But now that you mention it, my car has that dip also, yet I hardly ever see it on an M156 dyno plot....

Yeah, I am 95% certain that it's a VVT thing which on my car wasn't 100% optimised because I was focused on peak power above 5000rpm. I actually think I managed to iron mine out and improve a little on the peak output, but haven't been able to dyno yet.

I'm not sure why Brad''s car has it though. He kindly sent me a log, but I'm not sure if the answer will be in there as it doesn't contain VVT numbers.

It could...just be a timing dip. My car seems hell bent on pulling 2 degrees from 5900 to 6300 rpm and then back up again after. It's not knock. I've managed to work around it, but it's not ideal.

....on that note....has anybody with a supercharger had a VVT tune done yet? It's not like they need more power, but damn I wonder what potential lies therein.

Sorry, maybe I misspoke there. I meant the variable intake length flappy things. They open (close?) around 5k rpms if I’m not mistaken? If the ECU tuning still accounts for that, and the SC’s get rid of them obviously, then you’d see some sort of artifact right around there where fuel/timing/other stuff is adjusted. I’d think that an SC tune would wipe that stuff out but maybe something is stil in there on the various maps?

Oh, yeah no those flaps have no real connection to the ECU in how they operate or their effect on the tune. I think there's only a sensor that tells the ECU if vacuum through the system is ok and it then assumes that the flaps open/close as designed. The dip in Brads curve could most likely be smoothed out with some VVT tuning though. Seems like they've only arisen since the new blower has been fitted...I wonder if the other Gen 3 guys have the same thing.

I actually performed a test on my spare manifold last year and deleted the flaps. It didn't make any note-worthy gain or drop in power according to the butt-dyno, nor did I get any CEL. I eventually reverted back to having them back in for the sake of logic telling me they would aid flow by directing air better when they're open. I mean...they're a small obstruction in themselves sure...but without them, i'm sure there would be a lot of turbulence inside the manifold. On the basis that I couldn't notice any change with or without them, i'm guessing the drop/gain must have been in the +/- 10hp range. Makes you wonder why we didn't get a better manifold for stronger peak power like in the SLS :nix: 'tis a pity I didn't have my proper HP Tuners logging software back then, as I'd have been able to have identified an approximate gain or drop in power. Oh well...

I had a look at his log and while there's more power in there up top when he upgrades the fuel system and revises the tune for E85, there wasn't a dip in timing around where the dip in power is on the dyno plot. I don't know how it will learn it's way around that dip, but I'd love to see it all the same. I'm sure that ECU 'learning' does exist, but I struggle to understand what it exactly does. For example, if the fuelling, timing and airflow is the same from dyno day to say, a month later....what makes the car run better? I'm experiencing this on my car at the minute. Not a substantial change, but an improvement nevertheless, yet I can't attribute it to anything.

Sorry for the slight deviation, Brad :smash: I'll go and cook dinner now :o:

Back on the dyno again with upgraded pumps and lines no change in tune same 67 mm pulley 20 degrees timing 550cc injectors from weistec stage 3 kit

https://scontent-syd2-1.xx.fbcdn.net...3f&oe=5C11AD19

Nice gains!!! Can't wait to see the new track numbers mate! Going to be insane

I have never seen a torque curve like that before....amazing. keep it up Brad, my gosh there's still more on th table as well. 9's are on the menu....

Perfect!

thats boost curve bud before and after

Racefuel numbers next week mate and then track

Ahhh, fair enough thank you for the clarification. I've only ever see tq and hp on a graph.

What graph are you looking at brah?

60+ hp gain for better designed components is engineering at it's finest!

LOL, was thinking the same thing. The new S/C is making the same boost @ 2500 RPM as the old made @ 4100 RPM. Still insane!

Hey Bud

No meth it was disconnected
complete bolt on
No change in tune
im trialing 57mm this week
60whp gain through whole range

THis week mate lets see how you goes

So after some more time on the dyno 60mm pulley and race fuel we have these results

https://scontent-syd2-1.xx.fbcdn.net...54&oe=5C2B3DF1

We ran into some issues with the fuel rail so we had to weld some extra tabs to keep it clamped down

These runs are without ice in the tank and you can see iats are getting up there

We will try and push fo a little more power this week and then hit the track

Just letting you guys know at these power levels the PREFL m156 engine is starting to show some wearing around rings and bearings we have found some material in the last oil change

Might be time for a build sooner then later

Impressive results.

Must now be ballistic to drive.

You need to get in a country run to Heathcote before the weather gets too warm.

Im going on sunday hopefully

hopefully sub 9.90s :)

Awesome. BTW how's the trans holding out?

First one didnt last to long but this one is holding out just fine mate

Its been a while hope all is well my friend

Too long! :y

This is an awesome comparison of our new charger designs.. Wow!

Thanks for sharing. Definitely looking forward to your future results.

:):):)

Awesome to see this big kw reading. Best of luck sunday.

Pushing big power now. Good luck for Sunday.

Good luck Brad :wootrock: