darkus

I might get my steering rack replaced do to some ongoing steering issues. If I do have to get it replaced I was thinking of going with an Indy shop that has a good general reputation.

For a steering rack do you think dealership level expertise / equipment / programming is still needed and I should goto the dealer or is this considered a piece of cake for anyone?

money is no object here. Can't believe I just said that. But what I mean is I love my car and just want the best possible work done, and lost faith in my dealership due to them misdiagnosing other issues in the past.

Thanks

knowbenz

If you find a mercedes indy that actually knows their **** its always a better route. Any reputable mercedes shop will have all the equipment to do that job easily. It will need an alignment, some shops sublet that and some have their own machine.

G_Money

Basically this! Just make sure they are a quality shop with some fellas that know their way around an AMG.

Never hurts to ask here for recommendations in your area for quality independent shops.

EMTHED

Are you convinced the rack is bad? I had to replace mine last yr, MB did it and 3k was the damage here in canada... (this was before I found a indy shop) the rack itself was 2500ish plus discount for core! And from info I've found racks aren't usually replaced... mine was diagnosed as leaking powersteering lines and later turned into the entire rack??? Which inturn for some strange reason fried the ESP module??? So at the end of it all alttile north of 5k once it was running.... after speaking to many, MB loves to throw parts at cars at our expense...

Diabolis

darkus - it's a Black Series that has so far depreciated exactly 0%. Unless the sign above the door of that indie shop says HWA, Brabus or RENNtech, take it to a dealer. Going to an indie shop to have fairly complex work done on a BS is like going to to have surgery performed in someone's basement in Thailand on a budget.

If I was ever in the market for a BS and found out that a collector car has been serviced an indie shops, I'd walk away. Why are you even asking if money is no object? Don't cheap out dude.

austintipton

100% disagree. I've taken a car that was more expensive than a C63 BS to my Mercedes dealer... and it came home with a curbed rim, two bent rims and a door ding, and 400 extra miles on it. Since then I've found my local indy (Eurocharged) and haven't had any issues. They aren't cheap, but they do good work from what I can tell. At least as good as Mercedes does.

(Side bar: I think the world of my local Mercedes' master mechanic. I just don't trust the runners)

darkus

yes my experience seems to be similar.

My local dealer has messed up some basic things which has me losing faith in them and looking at a quality Indy shop that may take more pride in their work. That's the idea anyways.

Of course if the job is more then the basic mechanical work and requires some more advanced computer work or special tools to get it right I will go to dealer.

Hoping for someone with experience in changing the rack to chime in.

Btw to @Diabolis , I take offense to calling my BS a collectors car. I use my car every day. I have an ear to ear grin everyday too I will probably get 0 dollars for my car when it comes to sell it, but it will have been worth every penny and I hope it never dies / have the sell it. So because it that I will spend whatever it takes and goto whoever will do the best job do I can keep this car as new for as long as possible.

RouteAbel

To be fair Eurocharged Austin is not your run of the mill Indy shop. Certified bad asses.

knowbenz

This is terrible advice. There are good dealers and bad dealers, good techs and bad techs. Unless you have a tech that you trust and ask for at a dealer you could get anybody working on the car. With a BS you would be more likely to have an experienced tech working on the car though. There are tons of excellent techs that have left the dealership world to go to independent shops for a wide range of reasons. The only problem with indy shops is finding one that is genuinely concerned with the outcome of your repair and wants to see you happy. There are far too many indy shops that don't follow any sort of diagnostic strategy and leave a bad taste in the consumers mouth.

Plus, a steering rack replacement on a black series is by no means complex work.

knowbenz

I follow their work on IG and would have to agree. You can usually browse through an independent shops or techs Instagram feed and get an idea of the kind of work they do.

Diabolis

darkus - for the record, I agree with you completely. What I mean by a collector car is something that you buy for the enjoyment of driving and presumably hold on to for a while because you enjoy driving it (as opposed to cars that you buy only for their utilitarian properties and that you couldn't care about and will trade in after 3 years). Cars are indeed meant to be driven and should be driven. I don't mean a collector car in the sense that you keep it in a garage and only start it twice a year.

AMGonFire

Its a steering rack are you serious. He is not rebuilding the motor. There are plenty of reliable Indy shops that know what they are doing. I would just do it myself personally but that’s me.

darkus

thanks. Actually I found this post very useful, basicly you are implying any competent shop can do this and it's straightforward?

I wish I had a lift in my house, you make it sound like I could do it with instructions.

Used to do all my own brake jobs and suspension work on bmws. Miss those days. I felt like I knew exactly what was going on under the car. With this one it's a giant black box under there, but I have no lift and no time these days.

knowbenz

Theres 6 bolts holding the rack and plate on, two nuts on tie rod ends, one bolt on the input shaft, a bolt holding lines in. Swap the tie rod ends over, put new rings on the line, put it together and align it.

darkus

Awesome, thanks for the info!

Follow-up question, when getting the steering shaft aligned with the rack, is there any experience needed for that or does it basically line up only 1 way so that any idiot could do it and I dont really have to worry about a crooked wheel or anything like that?

thanks again

knowbenz

There is usually a plastic sleep that has a mark that lines up with a mark on the steering rack indicating the center position. New rack usually comes with one installed, you just transfer the coupling. Being off a spline one way or the other won't affect much, you will do an alignment regardless so no worry.

SoCal208

It's very true on this statements. "There are good dealers and bad dealers, good techs and bad techs" . I am the customer of Fletcher Jones MB dealer in Newport Beach in the last 20 years. Some members in the forums BAD MOUTH about the price FJ charged in services. Here is my story : I bought a 2008 E350 (out of lease from MB HOI (Buena Park CA), the passenger rear view mirror do not tilt down when I shift to reverse (as my cousin's 2007 E350), after a few day I come back to HOI & ask the to activate the passenger tilt down when shift to reverse, a couple hours later, the 2008 E350 return to me : The SA said that the function had been remove from MY 2008 (some member say otherwise). I come to Anaheim MB Caliber request to activate the tilt down mirror, after an hour, the same answer as HOI. I was not happy, I come to FJ in Newport Beach (a lot closer to my house than the others 2 MB dealers). I explain to my SA Ray Schroeder. 1 hour later, the feature is activate (NO CHARGE) I am very happy. I have my MB services by FJ a long time, but I think MB HOI or MB Anaheim Caliber can activate the feature, but NOT. FJ 's foreman & techs are 1st class, FJ paid them well for theirs experiences, the have to charge the customers what the pay for the FOREMAN & techs. I know I paid FJ a little more by for the piece of mind, I trust their MB expertise, their works on my MB's cars. I NEVER force to get any services I do not want @ FJ.

Diabolis

Yes, I am serious. It's a Black Series. If I were in the market for one, I wouldn't care if all they did was replace the cigarette lighter or key fob battery. It still affects the resale value of the car. A stack of bills from an authorized service center or dealership says "I've looked after the car well with no expense spared". Having no receipts or receipts from a third party shop say "I did things on a budget", which translates into shoddy service, deferred maintenance and/or undisclosed problems. On any other car, sure. On a Black Series that is a collector vehicle, I would walk away and buy another one that has complete service records from a reputable dealership instead.

Just my $0.02.

knowbenz

Again, ridiculous!!!

I am going to assume you had a very bad experience at a crappy indy shop. Some indy shops charge around the same as dealers, many charge less. The price of the service doesn't mean they are cutting corners to give a better price. You go to a dealer you are going through a service writer, dispatcher, biller, cashier, parts personnel, car wash department, valets, tech, shop manager, shop foreman, janitor, multi million dollar facility upkeep.

You go to an independent shop you have a front desk person, service writer/manager/ shop foreman depending on shop size, tech, a porter/helper, much smaller facility with less upkeep. Might not be as fancy but you are paying for all that stuff when you go to a dealer.

Aside from yourself I would be interested in hearing other potential black series buyers views on the subject. If repairs were performed by certified techs with mercedes factory training, using factory parts, at a shop specializing in mercedes and high end cars I doubt if it would have any real effect on resale value down the line.

Maybe on something super high end like a sterling moss SLR, Enzo, Laferrari, etc. Black series doesn't really require any specialized equipment or tools.

austintipton

Some people feel that way about buying their Toyota. So yeah, you'll limit some portion of the market. But if you are putting miles on it, who cares? Just fix it however you want and move on. You are limiting much more of the market with miles than with "not so good paperwork".

FWIW, I've purchased used cars more expensive than a BS sight unseen with no paperwork. If the car is desirable enough, buyers will buy it.

Diabolis

No, it most certainly is not ridiculous. The implication that it may not have been serviced properly and/or as often as needed may indeed be erroneous, but if you've ever bought or sold a classic or collector car, all other things being equal having a stack of bills from a reputable shop makes all the difference in the world.

I've never had a bad experience in an indie shop... quite to the contrary (I actually own a part of one as a silent partner). The work that the guys (and gal) do at the shop is certainly of equal if not higher quality than the Porsche dealership next door, and in fact these days about 35% of our business comes from them. For stuff that is even remotely complex to diagnose and is not covered by warranty, they pawn the car to us (and we also get 100% of their classics). We do the work, give it back to them fixed and charge them a discounted rate while they charge their clients their full shop rate which is about 50% higher. The three senior techs we have are at least as good as the best techs at the dealership, but that doesn't mean crap when you're buying a used P-car. If you have a stack of bills from the dealership that shows the vehicle regularly went in for service there, it will easily fetch a 50% premium over an identically optioned vehicle in similar condition without the paperwork, and for some cars the price may even double.

As for this particular case, darkus has another active thread asking some really silly questions on this same topic, and furthermore six posts up from this one writes "when getting the steering shaft aligned with the rack, is there any experience needed for that or does it basically line up only 1 way so that any idiot could do it and I dont really have to worry about a crooked wheel or anything like that?" What does that question tell you about the quality of the work we're discussing? Would you buy darkus' C63BS with your money if you ever knew that about the car's history? If you would, please let me know... I have some killer deals on some used performance cars for you!

darkus

please don't make stupid posts about other people's cars or positions. My BS as I mentioned is used every day and it actually has fairly high miles. In your fantasy land you believe a high mileage super car doesn't break? The BS is not my only special car or collectors car as you call it, which is used often and has a lot of miles under its belt.

How do you jump to the conclusion that my car isn't well taken care of by the best? Because I want to goto an Indy shop? In my opinion, if I knowingly took my car to a dealer who is lazy and does shoddy work instead of an Indy shop who is meticulous about their work, that is the travesty.

I also have a pro retailer come detail my car every month. Guess what he's an Indy. I don't let the dealership touch my car with any kind of cleaning material. I guess I'm cheaping out on that too right? But like most of us know, quality work many times comes from an independent worker who takes pride in their work.

I got an alignment from the dealer and they gave me my car back with the wheel crooked by about 10 degrees. I then took it to the best aligbment shop (oh yea an Indy) who charges about twice what the dealer did and spent 2 hours aligning the car and got it back with a really nice alignment. Which dealer will spend 2 hours on an alignment? Or do anything different when aligning a BS vs an E350?

Ive said it several times here, I'm looking to an Indy shop because I'm looking for someone to do higher quality work then my dealer has done so far. Not because of money.

i could car less how much my car sells for one day. I don't buy cars to make money on them or lose as little money as I can on them. That's such a sad way to live and to look at cars. That's not what they are meant for. If you are so worried about what a car will sell for one day, then I suggest you stay away from cars because almost all of them lose their value. Cars are made to be driven or enjoyed or both.

On the broader topic of money or collectors cars you seem to keep hovering around the idea that collector cars must goto dealership. You should hang around the Ferrari community a little and see how far that line of thinking gets you.

What car, super car, fantasy car or other doesn't have things wear down or break over time? I suspect you've never owned anything too expensive car wise? If so, these types of cars usually end up needing more repairs and TLC then your average 40k car. That's just the nature of the beast. The BS has actually been super reliable in my experience and I'm more then happy with it. Having a worn tie rod or possibly a bad steering rack in a c63 nearing 100k miles I don't think is that much of a shocker, after having searched threads out here.

and your right, I don't know how to install a steering rack so no I don't know how it lines up. What does that have to do with the quality of work I'm looking for? You've honestly been completely unhelpful in this thread, but luckily you are a totally outlier in this community. Your implication that I don't have or want to spend money on quality work on my car is laughable at best. Calling people or their questions ridiculous is farcical. This is a forum...

I do want to thank the others in this thread who have been more helpful.

knowbenz

Many reputable indy shops out there.

I don't know about porsche so I'll take your word for it, most of those guys a re a bit out there anyways so not surprising.

If I was in the market I would do the PPI on it myself. He asked about positioning, I figured he is actually clueless about the lack of knowledge needed to change a rack. When you look at these cars all day long you get an eye for the quality of service done on the car.

Diabolis

Dude - if you know so f___ing much, then please stop asking the most asinine questions in 50% of the posts you have made, and furthermore stop trolling. It is increasingly starting to look like the BS in your C63 actually stands for something other than Black Series.

There is so much garbage in your posts that you are obviously having serious trouble with comprehension, as further evidenced by your assertion that you think that I called something ridiculous (hint: it wasn't me). As for our respective contributions to the forum or the board, I am afraid you're definitely projecting.

If you want to fix your BS with chewing gum and duct tape, by all means go ahead - it is yours to fix however you want. However, the moment you started trolling here by asking the same question in multiple forums and furthermore being a dick in general, you're also going to get some of what you're dishing out.

knowbenz

Just to be clear on the bold section. Indy shops with a good reputation DO NOT use chewing gum and duct tape. We get that you don't like indy shops, you don't have to keep insinuating all indy are trash.