Disappointed
#1
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Disappointed
I took delivery of a new C63S a month ago, a bit disappointed with the switchable exhaust noise compared to others I’ve heard and it was certainty quieter than the standard system on my previous W205 C63 and since I had the rusty turbos replaced it has gone even worse, there is very little difference between on and off when engine is cold and no difference whatsoever when hot, throttle response is not as ‘sharp’ the car feels like it’s struggling for performance, I presume they did a software adjustment, before I get back to the dealers are there any experts on here that could explain what’s gone on and point me in the right direction.
#2
Super Member
Most people who felt the car was "neutered" found it the car was in limp mode due to being low on battery. There is no indication on this, so you'd have to go to the dealer and have them scan the car to realize that.
Perhaps when they were servicing your car, the battery was run down?
Perhaps when they were servicing your car, the battery was run down?
#3
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The car has only done 400 miles, it’s not run in yet so I don’t want to give the full beans, it went in for turbo replacement purely for cosmetic reasons, I’m beginning to wish I hadn’t had it done, without doubt it is certainly quieter and feels down on low revs power, I’m assuming if they did something to the software it was the very latest version.
#5
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You need to let the ECU adapt, it takes a 100 miles or so to fully adapt after a software update. The fact that you haven't even broken in your engine having only covered 400 miles is probably why it feels different (I assume you're keeping RPM's and engine load low). You need to let the ECU learn and adapt by doing WOT pulls, and then it'll feel great. Keep driving, break the engine in, and let the ECU re-adapt to your new driving style...which will be flooring it at every chance you get!
#6
Super Member
You need to let the ECU adapt, it takes a 100 miles or so to fully adapt after a software update. The fact that you haven't even broken in your engine having only covered 400 miles is probably why it feels different (I assume you're keeping RPM's and engine load low). You need to let the ECU learn and adapt by doing WOT pulls, and then it'll feel great. Keep driving, break the engine in, and let the ECU re-adapt to your new driving style...which will be flooring it at every chance you get!
Complaining about loss in power after only 400 miles without ever going WOT is a bit pre-mature.
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#8
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2018 C63s Estate, 2017 gla 45 [Sold] 2017 smart 44 brabus sport [for the Mrs]
hey Fordgt40 - i'm hoping it is an ECU / turbo run-in software safety measure that's temporarily holding the sound and power back. that said , when i picked my brand new c63s in feb , it was roaring like a t rex from the first engine start up when i toggled the exhaust valves through the button. there was no 100 mile calibration period on the valves. the throttle response is a different matter entirely.
. Hopefully it is temporary but the one thing i'd say is even when my engine is super cold , if i toggle the exhaust button , the valves always open and it is immediately louder. the engine though took a few hundred miles to open up a bit more. admittedly i've done 950 miles over the last 4 weeks but something doesnt sound right to me either based on what you're saying regarding the sound. the exhaust valves , i would expect, to be independent of any turbo run-in type software tweaks. the throttle response i would expect to be muted for at least 100-200 miles.
. Hopefully it is temporary but the one thing i'd say is even when my engine is super cold , if i toggle the exhaust button , the valves always open and it is immediately louder. the engine though took a few hundred miles to open up a bit more. admittedly i've done 950 miles over the last 4 weeks but something doesnt sound right to me either based on what you're saying regarding the sound. the exhaust valves , i would expect, to be independent of any turbo run-in type software tweaks. the throttle response i would expect to be muted for at least 100-200 miles.
#9
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The new one has always been quieter than my previous non perf exhaust W205 C63 from day day one, which was hilariously loud on cold start up but it’s definitely quieter now, there is a difference on and off when cold but non at all when hot in comfort, when I hear you saying yours is ‘roaring like a t rex’, mine is more like a purring lion, I was expecting more from the perf exhaust to be honest from day one.
#11
Find a road with few cars, select the sport+ mode and try to speed up then manually use paddle shifter to perform downshiftings, if you don't hear backfire/crackle sound, then something is definitely wrong
#12
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It will pop and bang on the overrun in sport plus exactly the same as my old non perf one, same volume, same sound, no difference whatsoever, I expected more after reading other people’s reports on this system, it’s the fact that it doesn’t make the slightest difference in comfort mode on tick-over which suggests to me something is not right, it might change with use, I’ve also noticed there is a slight rattle from the rear at about 2000 revs when stationary, I’ve been in touch with the dealer and I’m waiting for their response.
#13
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It will pop and bang on the overrun in sport plus exactly the same as my old non perf one, same volume, same sound, no difference whatsoever, I expected more after reading other people’s reports on this system, it’s the fact that it doesn’t make the slightest difference in comfort mode on tick-over which suggests to me something is not right, it might change with use, I’ve also noticed there is a slight rattle from the rear at about 2000 revs when stationary, I’ve been in touch with the dealer and I’m waiting for their response.
After I had the update done at the dealership (which had no idea it was even available), they couldn’t believe the difference in overrun. It’s definitey a big change compared to before... so I don’t really understand what you were expecting? You’re not even supposed to go over 4500 rpm during break in, which is where the sweet spot is for the pops... so maybe you should break your engine in, adapt the ECU, so you can go WOT and then report back?
If you get 4 rapid pops when neutral revving at high rpm, then you’re updated.
If you think it’s still too quiet, lower the center armrest section of the rear seat (or even just fold down one of the rear seats), and you’ll increase the interior volume by a good 10-15%. I always drive with the rear center armrest section down.
Last edited by AlexZTuned; 03-25-2018 at 09:04 AM.
#14
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Couple of things spring to mind, one, I assume the valves open when activated even in comfort mode which should make a difference and second I fully understand the running in procedure as I’ve built race engines in the past including the one one in my present GT40, oil changed after Dyno run, but what I don’t understand is the fact that when my son bought his new Ferrari 488, the dealer told him it could be used in a spirited manner from day one, which I wouldn’t totally agree with but it’s not done it any harm, he took it for a track day at Spa race circuit 2 days after delivery and that was last August.
#15
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Couple of things spring to mind, one, I assume the valves open when activated even in comfort mode which should make a difference and second I fully understand the running in procedure as I’ve built race engines in the past including the one one in my present GT40, oil changed after Dyno run, but what I don’t understand is the fact that when my son bought his new Ferrari 488, the dealer told him it could be used in a spirited manner from day one, which I wouldn’t totally agree with but it’s not done it any harm, he took it for a track day at Spa race circuit 2 days after delivery and that was last August.
Also, pushing the exhaust button does not mean the valves are open 100%. MB programmed it so that the valves are only partially open at idle with the exhaust button on (for noise regulation). The valves open dynamically based on engine load, rpm, etc... if you floor it, the valves will open 100%. But part throttle and even idle, the valves are only open partially. There is an aftermarket module that can force the valves open 100% all the time, and it makes a huge difference at idle and lower rpms (though there won’t be any difference in sound on the top end since the valves are completely open at higher rpm with stock programming).
As for break-in procedure, there should have been a sticker on the top driver side of the windshield on delivery with instructions. For 1000 miles of break-in, do not exceed 4500 rpm, do not put the engine under high load (full boost), and do not exceed 85 MPH. This is recommended by AMG because the e-diff needs the fluid changed out at 1850 miles, and romping on it can destroy the diff if the fluid hasn’t been swapped out after break-in. Maybe your sons 488 is already broken in from the factory? I don’t have too many Ferrari’s in my garage, so I can’t exactly speak from experience!
Here’s a pic of the stickers from my Coupe for reference:
Last edited by AlexZTuned; 03-25-2018 at 01:20 PM.
#17
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Just out of curiosity, I googled the break-in for a 488 GTB and it says in the owners manual: "avoid exceeding 5,000 rpm for the first 1000 km (620 miles)" (in "About your vehicle" chapter, there is a "running-in" paragraph in the "driving the vehicle" part).
#18
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Pretty much every performance engine needs a break-in period, this is common across all brands. Some people follow it, others don’t care (they’re probably on a lease anyway). Personally, I bought my Coupe outright, so I followed the break-in period... I’d rather not have oil consumption issues at 20k miles because I couldn’t control my right foot for a thousand miles.
Just out of curiosity, I googled the break-in for a 488 GTB and it says in the owners manual: "avoid exceeding 5,000 rpm for the first 1000 km (620 miles)" (in "About your vehicle" chapter, there is a "running-in" paragraph in the "driving the vehicle" part).
#19
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2018 C63s Estate, 2017 gla 45 [Sold] 2017 smart 44 brabus sport [for the Mrs]
I would suggest that unless you are manually shifting an/or doing lots of kickdowns, it is really really hard to overly-abuse the engine itself. (Not withstanding other parts of the vehicle may unfortunately not cope so well such as the transmission).
During my run-in with this car, at mileage of under 200 miles, in auto mode the engine would always short shift at 2.5k to 3k max even if i gave the throttle a bit too much input.
at around 500 miles, it would let me have up to 3k revs.
At 900 miles it lets me go up to 4k now.
I've been driving in mainly comfort mode. Sport and sport plus a tiny bit only on the highway in short periods to allow the revs to go up to 3k and then around 750 miles in to briefly to go 4k for a few seconds. Comfort mode just doesnt let me do that. But even in sport and sport plus, it seems like the ECU tackles any potential abuse of run-in conditions by simply shifting up when it needs to.
The only times i used manual mode was in the snow with the summer tyres and the ecu wouldnt give me the early upshifts i was seeking.
The above ecu shifting is very consistent with the gla 45 that i had run in a year and a half ago. No matter which mode i drove it in, in auto shift mode, the vehicle would shift very very early always, and then would gradually shift higher as i got towards around 800 miles. It would then go up to 4k sometimes. After 1k miles, it would just run to 6k all the time.
Ignoring properly running in rear differentials, transmission parts, brakes etc , i think the ECU does a great job of protecting the engine itself.
During my run-in with this car, at mileage of under 200 miles, in auto mode the engine would always short shift at 2.5k to 3k max even if i gave the throttle a bit too much input.
at around 500 miles, it would let me have up to 3k revs.
At 900 miles it lets me go up to 4k now.
I've been driving in mainly comfort mode. Sport and sport plus a tiny bit only on the highway in short periods to allow the revs to go up to 3k and then around 750 miles in to briefly to go 4k for a few seconds. Comfort mode just doesnt let me do that. But even in sport and sport plus, it seems like the ECU tackles any potential abuse of run-in conditions by simply shifting up when it needs to.
The only times i used manual mode was in the snow with the summer tyres and the ecu wouldnt give me the early upshifts i was seeking.
The above ecu shifting is very consistent with the gla 45 that i had run in a year and a half ago. No matter which mode i drove it in, in auto shift mode, the vehicle would shift very very early always, and then would gradually shift higher as i got towards around 800 miles. It would then go up to 4k sometimes. After 1k miles, it would just run to 6k all the time.
Ignoring properly running in rear differentials, transmission parts, brakes etc , i think the ECU does a great job of protecting the engine itself.
#20
It will pop and bang on the overrun in sport plus exactly the same as my old non perf one, same volume, same sound, no difference whatsoever, I expected more after reading other people’s reports on this system, it’s the fact that it doesn’t make the slightest difference in comfort mode on tick-over which suggests to me something is not right, it might change with use, I’ve also noticed there is a slight rattle from the rear at about 2000 revs when stationary, I’ve been in touch with the dealer and I’m waiting for their response.
*I would have them check voltages because that is an issue I and others have had and the dealership misdiagnosed it and had to take it to my personal mechanic who figured out and fixed the issue. Even after I told the MB service department the issue with the voltages they did not seem to understand. Basically the voltages were off by juts enough to cause the car to go into a sort of limp mode that affected the power in a very noticeable way. I really did not pay.
to how it affected the exhaust note when this was happening. I know of 4 people that have gone to my mechanic in West Los Angeles to have this issue fixed.
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right_mr (03-26-2018)
#21
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2021 Mercedes C63s AMG Coupe
Most people who felt the car was "neutered" found it the car was in limp mode due to being low on battery. There is no indication on this, so you'd have to go to the dealer and have them scan the car to realize that.
Perhaps when they were servicing your car, the battery was run down?
Perhaps when they were servicing your car, the battery was run down?
#22
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Thanks, tried that but because I’m still running in I can’t give it the full beans, it still indicated 495 ish though so it looks like it’s giving full power and it’s me expecting too much, also I think it’s because throttle doesn’t go to the floor gearbox won’t kick down and I’m comparing it with my previous one.
#23
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2021 Mercedes C63s AMG Coupe
Thanks, tried that but because I’m still running in I can’t give it the full beans, it still indicated 495 ish though so it looks like it’s giving full power and it’s me expecting too much, also I think it’s because throttle doesn’t go to the floor gearbox won’t kick down and I’m comparing it with my previous one.
#24
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Also check if the TRQ figures matches the factory advertised numbers. My one at WOT after 4th gear shows the factory advertised numbers, 362hp and 386 lbft torque. When I had my limp mode. HP was stuck at 250 and trq would never cross 200. Obviously these command engine data numbers are not fully accurate. It plots it from a pre programmed graph. But it serves as a fantastic indicator if everything is running Aokay with the engine.
#25
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Thanks, tried that but because I’m still running in I can’t give it the full beans, it still indicated 495 ish though so it looks like it’s giving full power and it’s me expecting too much, also I think it’s because throttle doesn’t go to the floor gearbox won’t kick down and I’m comparing it with my previous one.