BMS

I appreciate the feedback, I don't take it as bashing at all. As you know, most of our JB4 systems are illegal in CA.
That's the main reason why we don't know of any local shops.There are lots of reputable shops though, something like this would be simple for them.

raudiace4

You should go for a ride in a ECU tuned car, vs a piggyback car and see for yourself. Don't listen to me or any of the vendors.

Also a piggyback for $2300 is a joke. *Dinan*

Swordfish99

For me, I don't really care if it is a piggyback or an ECU Tune, the results is all that matters to me and I definitely see the results with my Dinan. I'm not sure why it would matter how I get there...

Klinh

It not much faster and it got down pipes. So if you take the down pipe mods out, it could an even race.

Here’s a video ...

BMS

You should try that as well but with our JB4 system

Klinh

Based on a stock car, piggyback and ECU tuned both claim gain are pretty much even from all vendors.

DRGG

Indeed that's pretty much what I have concluded but why isn't there more discussion about the gorilla in the living room, i.e. the warranty issue? I would gladly pay $5000 for a piggyback if I knew that the company stood behind any and all warranty issues with the engine and drive train. But maybe it's a non-issue because most people who purchase these cars probably don't need to worry about dropping $75K for an engine (even though they complain about the cost of the tune).

raudiace4

It's more so how the power is delivered and lag free. The performance numbers are close, but the real world feeling between the two is easy to see once you drive the two back to back.

skim7x

That's probably true, but to me, ECU tune is a lot easier to install/uninstall than a piggyback...

I doubt a good stage 1 tune is going to do anything to the car... even stage 2 on these cars isn't much more power than the stage 1, so I doubt you'll even have any issues with the stage 2 cars... it's when you start upgrading turbos that I think you'll start breaking stuff =D

DRGG

Yes, but it's still a bit of a gamble and even if nothing "breaks" immediately, there is the issue of longevity and parts failing before their normally rated life. The other thing is we don't really know what's inside of any tuning program. Just a wink and and a nod: "Trust me," is what we get. I remember chipping my first Audi. It would keep throwing fault codes involving a temperature sensor. Although I cannot prove this was induced by the extra boost, I suspect it was.

skim7x

If longevity is what you are concerned about then you shouldn't get a tune at all... But a stage 1 or 2 tune isn't going to break the car within warranty, so I wouldn't be worried about warranty issues...

DRGG

Maybe you've stated this elsewhere, but have you actually tried the Dinan piggyback? I see there are other piggyback options out there. Also, it is highly unlikely that I am going to go through the trouble of demo-ing different tunes.

DRGG

Well, let's avoid semantic games. It's all about the warranty. MB is betting against you which is why they void the warranty and flag the tuned cars. My gut feel is that you are correct, but numbers would certainly be helpful.

skim7x

Well, all I'm trying to say is that I'd bet you that you won't have any issues with damages from a Stage 1 or Stage 2 tune as long as it's a tune from a respected company / tuner and the install was done properly. I personally don't think it's worth extra money for the tuner to warranty the engine / drivetrain because I'm playing the odds... but that's not to say everyone is like me, which is what keeps Dinan in business... they know that their tune isn't going to cause any problems, but can warranty the engine / drivetrain and make some extra money off people. In exchange, you get peace of mind.

And just to give you more options... Dinan provides a warranty, but so does Eurocharged, if you're looking for an ECU tune that is warranty-backed...

But just to address the longevity issue... even Dinan's "warranty" is only to match the manufacturer's warranty... so they won't cover anything related to "longevity"... which is why I say if you're going for longevity, warranty or no warranty shouldn't matter AT ALL.

DRGG

If I was interested in longevity I agree that I would not purchase an after-market tune. But mostly I am concerned about who pays for what if there is a catastrophic failure. I am more likely to be drawn to a company who has "longevity" and a solid reputation backed by a warranty. If I was a different sort of person I wouldn't be driving a MB.