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Well, for me it depends on the year. For a PFL car, I would go non-S as a no brainer. The S model brings an electronic locking rear differential, active engine mounts, and slightly bigger brakes. The 40,000mi. of wear and tear are just not worth it to me for those benefits. My car has 52k miles now, and I have bushing squeak when I turn the steering wheel or when the front suspension flexes vertically, and belt squeel on cold starts. Im sure my engine mounts are the next thing to go too, 8 years is toward the upper limit for their lifespan. These dynamic mounts are triple the price of non-dynamic ones. Point is I'm not looking forward to the wear and tear at 100k.
For a FL car, It's worth it depending on preference. For the FL (check me on this) I believe only the S car has amg dynamics and 9 stage TC which allows for precise control of ESC and TC. Really huge upgrades over the PFL and FL non S 3 stage TC steps. If those upgrades make the 40k mi. worth of wear worth it to you, then go for it.
Bear in mind, a member on here around 130k miles is replacing lots of timing components right now. Idk how many miles you drive but, $$$. Luckily, other than mechanical wear, this engine in known to be mostly bulletproof.
Good luck with whatever you choose, it's a great car overall.
I suppose to some extent it matters how these cars were driven. To be honest a 94k C63S that was never driven hard could be in better condition than a 54k C63 that was driven ***** to the wall. I'm not objecting driving these things ***** to the wall, only way to really drive an AMG , but it does mean wear & tear. Unfortunately, you don't really know if the 94k miles are mostly highway miles, or if the 54k miles were hard driven miles.
Having said that, the general consensus is that I probably wouldn't buy a near 100k miles C63S, either. Above poster is correct about the FL S vs non-S in terms of the 9-stage TC. I believe the non-S has AMG DYNAMICS, but the S has Race mode and the corresponding AMG DYNAMICS Master mode, where as the non-S doesn't have Race or Master. The S, either in PFL or FL form is definitely the more interesting car, though. Keep in mind that the early model years of the PFL have known issues with the dynamic engine mounts and the electronic rear locking differential. I would generally go for later model years. In my case the C63S wasn't quite what I desired until the FL came out. I was considering buying one in 2018, but couldn't convince myself. Then shortly after that they announced the FL and I was sold.
Last edited by superswiss; Feb 5, 2024 at 12:17 AM.
Thank you so much for your input!!!! This definitely makes sense with the topics you guys have added. To be honest, the idea of active engine mounts for a daily is just completely useless and expensive when it comes to replacement. The power isn't a crazy difference, and I don't suppose that 650 Nm of torque will ever feel slow.
FWIW, I got this done by my indy shop some months back - $1250 to replace the tensioners, pulleys, and both belts (duh).
Thanks for the ballpark price range, I've needed to get this done since last summer, but ended up having a lot of incidentals with the car that needed immediate addressing ($2000 worth of work) and superceded the belts. This car is the upper limit of what I can justify spending on a vehicle so sadly some non-fluid maintenence has to wait sometimes.
If it's never been cleared, you can get a hint about how the car was driven by looking at the overall trip stats (average speed, fuel consumption, etc.). I didn't see the year of the car(s), so I assumed they are the same ... if not, that would enter into my consideration, also.
You might also check with some of the "coders" on this forum (e.g., BenzNinja) to see which of the "S" features can be added to the non-S. The power of the non-S can typically be brought up to the same as the stock "S" variant (or more) without too much fanfare.
Thank you so much for your input!!!! This definitely makes sense with the topics you guys have added. To be honest, the idea of active engine mounts for a daily is just completely useless and expensive when it comes to replacement. The power isn't a crazy difference, and I don't suppose that 650 Nm of torque will ever feel slow.
Thank you all very much!
If you have decided on the ONE
and are able to have an experienced indy do an through inspection, the 2 photos below are from MB Inspection sheets that was done on my car a few years back. Print it out and have the indy complete each caption. Just an option if it helps making your decision.
Thank you so much for your input!!!! This definitely makes sense with the topics you guys have added. To be honest, the idea of active engine mounts for a daily is just completely useless and expensive when it comes to replacement. The power isn't a crazy difference, and I don't suppose that 650 Nm of torque will ever feel slow.
Thank you all very much!
To be fair, I've never come across published numbers to compare the stiffness of the fixed engine mounts in the non-S to the dynamic engine mounts in the S fully relaxed and fully stiff, and can't dispute the cost and additional complexity. But the purpose of dynamic engine mounts is that you can have the cake and eat it, too. They add comfort for around town driving by relaxing the coupling of the engine to the chassis, so less vibration enters the cabin and the chassis becomes more loose on bumpy roads, because it doesn't have to move the engine as much. Then at higher speeds such as on the highway when quickly changing lanes, the engine moves in unison with the chassis for a more precise steering and a car that's more eager to change direction. I can definitely feel this compared to other cars where the wheels want to change direction, but then the weight of the engine is lagging slightly behind. It's a win-win even in daily driving for those who value a responsive chassis and steering.
Last edited by superswiss; Feb 6, 2024 at 05:21 PM.
So I decided on the lower Mileage non-S. In the end, the S car dealer was willing to lower ANOTHER €1.5k, considering it was higher mileage, it just looked shady.
I have been kicking myself in the shins, as I thought that all black tipped exhausts were performance exhausts..... and.... only after sending the deposit did I actually ask... and it doesn't have MY MAIN option I wanted
... I've never come across published numbers to compare the stiffness of the fixed engine mounts in the non-S to the dynamic engine mounts in the S fully relaxed and fully stiff, ...
Interesting point. FWIW, when I tracked a 2016 C63 S, I noticed that the video from the front windshield-mounted dashcam always had a bit of jitter when accelerating hard out of slower-speed corners ... even though the track surface wasn't any more bumpy than it was where no jitter was evident. I always assumed that this was due to the active mounts stiffening up and passing some engine vibration through the chassis.
If that's true, then they must get "pretty stiff." So maybe a change of pS 0.6 to pS 0.9? #;-)
I have been kicking myself in the shins, as I thought that all black tipped exhausts were performance exhausts..... and.... only after sending the deposit did I actually ask... and it doesn't have MY MAIN option I wanted
The black tips and trims are the Night Package. Doesn't change any of the equipment. Lack of the performance exhaust would be a major no-no. AMG made it standard in the FL, because nobody really ordered one w/o it. I don't even close the valves on mine unless I'm just on a long highway cruise eating up miles. My usual routine is start the engine using emotion start and immediately open the exhaust valves and turn off auto start/stop, and every time I switch back to Comfort mode I open the exhaust again. With the FL I can do all this from the steering wheel, too, thanks to the AMG Drive Unit.
Last edited by superswiss; Feb 7, 2024 at 02:17 PM.
To be fair, I've never come across published numbers to compare the stiffness of the fixed engine mounts in the non-S to the dynamic engine mounts in the S fully relaxed and fully stiff, and can't dispute the cost and additional complexity. But the purpose of dynamic engine mounts is that you can have the cake and eat it, too. They add comfort for around town driving by relaxing the coupling of the engine to the chassis, so less vibration enters the cabin and the chassis becomes more loose on bumpy roads, because it doesn't have to move the engine as much. Then at higher speeds such as on the highway when quickly changing lanes, the engine moves in unison with the chassis for a more precise steering and a car that's more eager to change direction. I can definitely feel this compared to other cars where the wheels want to change direction, but then the weight of the engine is lagging slightly behind. It's a win-win even in daily driving for those who value a responsive chassis and steering.
Relaxing the mounts a lot on commute style driving is actually something I had never thought of thanks for the input.
Yeah, I'm really REALLY pissed off at myself for not checking that, as I was certain it was equipped with it. Looking for some kind of way around that now
If you have decided on the ONE
and are able to have an experienced indy do an through inspection, the 2 photos below are from MB Inspection sheets that was done on my car a few years back. Print it out and have the indy complete each caption. Just an option if it helps making your decision.
To be fair, I've never come across published numbers to compare the stiffness of the fixed engine mounts in the non-S to the dynamic engine mounts in the S fully relaxed and fully stiff, and can't dispute the cost and additional complexity. But the purpose of dynamic engine mounts is that you can have the cake and eat it, too. They add comfort for around town driving by relaxing the coupling of the engine to the chassis, so less vibration enters the cabin and the chassis becomes more loose on bumpy roads, because it doesn't have to move the engine as much. Then at higher speeds such as on the highway when quickly changing lanes, the engine moves in unison with the chassis for a more precise steering and a car that's more eager to change direction. I can definitely feel this compared to other cars where the wheels want to change direction, but then the weight of the engine is lagging slightly behind. It's a win-win even in daily driving for those who value a responsive chassis and steering.
When I was going on a cross country road trip. Driving through West Virginia, Virginia and North Carolina mountains highway with a lot of aggressive twists. I can 100% say that I felt the engine mount. Going at 80 mph, I drive an hour in comfort, then switch to sport plus after for an hour then race mode and back to comfort. I did that for 18 hours. You can really feel the engine mounts working. You won’t feel it on a short drive or on straights and less aggressive corners. It took some switching back and forth between modes for a few hours to compare and really get a feel for it
2010 BMW E63 M6 Coupe 2023 AMG C63s Coupe 2005 YZF-R1
Originally Posted by CarlosPT
So I decided on the lower Mileage non-S. In the end, the S car dealer was willing to lower ANOTHER €1.5k, considering it was higher mileage, it just looked shady.
I have been kicking myself in the shins, as I thought that all black tipped exhausts were performance exhausts..... and.... only after sending the deposit did I actually ask... and it doesn't have MY MAIN option I wanted
Sorry to hear about that you’ll be missing your main option. Not trying to make you feel worse but just about every C63s owner will tell you the PE is a must. As @superswiss mentioned, no one really spec’d these cars without the PE so it became standard in the FL.
Unfortunately, it’s not cost effective to attempt to get it retrofitted. You’d be better off just going with an aftermarket exhaust. But I’m not sure if there’s an aftermarket one out there that sounds better than the stock PE which is why you hardly ever see anyone swapping out their C63 exhaust. Any chance you can back out and get your deposit back 😬?
So I've found what the PE looks like from inside, and I might just rape my silencers and simulate this without flaps as I'd always have them open anyway
So I decided on the lower Mileage non-S. In the end, the S car dealer was willing to lower ANOTHER €1.5k, considering it was higher mileage, it just looked shady.
I have been kicking myself in the shins, as I thought that all black tipped exhausts were performance exhausts..... and.... only after sending the deposit did I actually ask... and it doesn't have MY MAIN option I wanted
My car also did not come with the factory Performance exhaust, but I do highly recommend AWE exhausts. My set-up now is a secondary cat delete and the AWE track exhaust. This would be the loudest you can get before going catless downpipes and still maintains the deep growl. If you will be using it as a daily, then I would choose the AWE switchpath exhaust to mitigate the drone sound. FYI, youtube videos do not do AWE exhausts justice, camera just cannot pick up the loudness and frequency, but sound is significantly deeper and louder
Thanks!! About youtube videos I completely understand, there's one with a STD exhaust next to a PE and they sound mostly the same, I'm PRETTY sure this doesn't happen IRL xD
I might just try to replicate the stock PE without Flaps and play around with the number of slats to tune the sound somewhat
'17 AMG S63 Convertible, '17 AMG C63S Edition 1 Coupe
Originally Posted by '1663s
Bear in mind, a member on here around 130k miles is replacing lots of timing components right now. Idk how many miles you drive but, $$$. Luckily, other than mechanical wear, this engine in known to be mostly bulletproof
Got a link to a thread or a member username? I'm at 93K miles, and CPO runs out at the end of the year, so very wary on ownership costs past the 100k mark, out of warranty...
Got a link to a thread or a member username? I'm at 93K miles, and CPO runs out at the end of the year, so very wary on ownership costs past the 100k mark, out of warranty...
Thread is called "Check engine light on.." by user iridium.c63s
So I decided on the lower Mileage non-S. In the end, the S car dealer was willing to lower ANOTHER €1.5k, considering it was higher mileage, it just looked shady.
I have been kicking myself in the shins, as I thought that all black tipped exhausts were performance exhausts..... and.... only after sending the deposit did I actually ask... and it doesn't have MY MAIN option I wanted
For the price get an aftermarket like Valvetronic. My Performance Exhaust flaps keeps rattling even after doing to copper grease fix and took to dealer twice only to have whatever they use dry up. Mine is a 2020 coupe with 5800 miles on it. Wish Mercedes would just replace it under warranty
Mercedes SLR McLaren 722 S Is Extremely Rare Example Modified by McLaren
Slideshow: A one-of-one U.S.-spec Mercedes-Benz SLR McLaren Roadster became even rarer after a factory-backed transformation at McLaren's headquarters.
, but it does mean wear & tear. Unfortunately, you don't really know if the 94k miles are mostly highway miles, or if the 54k miles were hard driven miles.
