LZH

No, so we can hear from other owners and try to improve the database of knowledge by hearing from other owners with FIRSTHAND experience and not idiots like you who:

1. rely on magazine reviews to form their opinion;
2. have never even had their BS on a road course;
3. base their opinion of the E92 from their previous E46 ownership;
4. have no clue what they are talking about.

I've tried to be nice and respect your ignorance while others with firsthand experience in BOTH cars have agreed with me. If you want to keep taking jabs at me for no reason, be my guest. But, it's clear that your only reason to do so at this point is becasue you've been exposed as the armchair bench racer that you really are. Perhaps you would like to now tell us all how the GT3 is NOT a direct competitior to the BS and please post up a few magazine articles supporting your opinion. And since you are so interested in reading and forming an opinion rather then doing it yourself....take a look at the most recent Car and Driver comparision:

http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/...omparison_test

SL2003driver

I'm thinkin
-VW Bug
-Corvair
-Vega
-Pinto

LZH

Laughable at best. Maybe I missed it, but when comparing sports car rivals, there are a lot more attributes to consider than just performance. But, I do find it interesting that performance is the #1 consideration for someone who has never even had their BS on the track.

chiphomme

You're getting tiresome. I mentioned performance only after others (including you) knocked the M3 as not being in the same performance league.
And if you bothered reading anything I've typed you'd would have noticed performance isn't the be all end all for me (or I would have purchased a 997 Turbo for roughly the same cost or dumped the Black when I bought a GTR).
And just because I don't track my cars regularly doesn't mean that I don't understand their performance abilities. And just because you track cars doesn't make you any grand sage of cars.

And if you think the cars in the list I posted are laughable then please state why you feel that way or quit asking questions someone might answer.

ducb

Hey guys, im in the market for a new car and can't decide on these two mentioned. I know the black is in a different league compared to the new M. I test drove both and the BS made the M feel like a corolla. And it handled it's weight very well, actually I was surprised and a little skeptical but the BS put those thoughts to rest. I don't have to mention the looks, makes the already not so good looking M look even worse. but Im having a hard time deciding if I should save $20-25k on a new M3 and put that $$ I saved into BBk, SC kit, suspension, wheels, headers etc. Which correct me if Im wrong will be faster on track then the BS. Or if I should get the BS and mod it over time. I have a e46 M3 05 moded with VF SC kit stage II, alcon bbk etc. I absolutely love it but I have the itch to start a new project. Never liked Mercs until I saw the BS, my jaw literally dropped when I saw it absolutely beautiful. The car will be tracked maybe 2-3x a year. I know most of you BS owners either have a collection of cars or have owned the above mentioned. So I know I will be getting some good input from you guys..

alexander stemer

Modding for the track is much trickier and less certain than one might think. Suspension mods have predictable street trade-offs, like bouncing off irregular pavement, etc. But engine mods lead to a succession of unanticipated new issues from cooling to oil pressure to brakes. The BS works just as it comes, and spending 20K on modding something else will just lead to warranty loss and headaches.

I don't know why we are disputing BS vs M3. I haven't driven a new M3, but I have tracked a new M6, and there is no comparison. The M was wallowing, rolling its front tires under, and generally demonstrated the difference between excellent street sedan and track-worthy car.
The track issue is actually the key to understanding the BS, because only that environment shows its real strengths and displays the other car's weakness. In some ways, it's like taking the clothes off your date. The dating environment hides a lot that is exposed only in a more intimate setting. However, if you are happy never taking the date to bed, you will probably be happy with an M car on the street.
Only a Porsche comes close to the BS, but post-2002 warranty denial for tracked cars has taken the bloom off that rose.

LZH

Hence the reason why I stand behind my comments regarding first hand experience on the track. Until you have done that in the BS, you really can't appreciate just how good it really is. On the other hand....on the track, you soon realize just how difficult it is to drive the car 10/10th's and extract that last little bit that most people only see as numbers on paper.

Great post - your dating anaolgy bade me

soldier2304

Wow, i just had to post here even tho i have never driven a CLK BS (but its my future car and i have a lot of respect for it). Yet, i have driven my friends E92 m3 and the thing i liked the most is the handling, power/torque wise, the 6.3 engine would literally rape it. IMO there is no comparison between ANY ///M car to ANY black series.

IMHO

jvit27

ROFL

chiphomme

AMS Performance

Considering both cars are now almost the same price (new M3 vs. used Black series)... the choice is obvious.

King32

Not sure anyone still cares, but Car Magazine's 2008 performance car of the year testing showed the M3 1 second a lap behind the BS on the Anglesey Circuit.

http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/CAR-Fea...8/#Performance Car of the Year videos

Jim Brady

Which track configuation? Was the track wet or damp, which the UK rarely mentions in their testing. High HP tracks it'll be a lot more. Different conditions etc. etc.

Brav

Another vote - CLK BS is in a different class.

My background: E46 M3, M6, F360, Noble M12, CRG Rotax Kart

I dont own either, but have driven both. Honestly, I was never a big fan of the E92 M3, but I did love my M6 and did track it. Actually, I thought the BS was another AMG marketing ploy and wrote the BS of as just that.. bullsh*t. But I realized later that there isnt much comparison between CLK or M3 for that matter except the shadow they both make on the ground, and the cylinder/wheel count.

Part of the reason for my purchases are the emotional inspiration, which comes from a number of things, including appearance, aura (look/feel/smell/sound), stats-bragging rights and exclusivity, is usually the reason anyone buys a car at the end of the day. Its all these things (mostly perceived, subjective) that make it a "better car" - to each his own. But sometimes "your" own ain't that good

I had a track day at Cal Speedway on the Roval config, and there were 430s, Stradales, Ford GTs, 2 BSs, my Noble, Z06, pretty much everything in and around that segment. The BS is no joke, it handles extremely well. It inspires a lot of confidence, as its a bit easier to approach the limit in, and doesnt suffer too much during mistakes (thank you torque). My M6, even my Noble have had issues with heat management with brakes and engine oil, the BS had none. I have heard of some frying brakes in the BS in some conditions however.

Is the car perfect, and an end-all to sports cars? Of course not.. I would like it lighter as well, and have the euro seats/door sills (mostly for appearance). Also based on a somewhat older design. The gee-wiz factor is lacking compared to modern BMW, or MB for that matter.. gotta be the worst nav around, and no HUD or any fun things like that. But soon forgot after a drive.

Was it me, or did the BS somewhat rev-match pretty well on downshift? Its gotta have the best slushbox of all time, they've really perfected it, within its design limits.

Honestly, what sold me was the torque, widebody, and the sound of the engine with headers and exhaust! If you haven't heard a BS with headers/exhaust, I STRONGLY recommend it.. makes your soul quiver. Granted, it may be way too much for some. I'll be looking to get one in the near future. And no, the E92 was never a consideration. Another M6 was..

King32

The cars were all tested on the same day with the same driver and based on the video it looks like the conditions were similar. Who knows how the BS was set up, but the driver said the track was one that would favor a car that brakes well and handles well. Granted he also admitted that he had never driven the track before that day (from what I can remember).

My history - 2 E36 M3s, E46 M3 (competition package), E55, E63, 997 911 C2S, BS.

I drove the E92 M3 at the BMW M School and liked it, but I like my BS better. In fact, I like my BS better than any of the cars that I have owned.

forhamilton

I just got a headache reading this thread.

JamE55

Same here.

E55AMGFan

Why is this even a discussion, these cars are in 2 different leagues. The C63 and M3 can be compared but no way should a CLK63 BS compare to an M3, Edmund's Inside Line had it go against the bigger M6 and it killed the M6 in all tests, braking, road feel, acceleration, etc. The BS is in a completely different league especially with it's purpose built styling, engineering and package overall.

DFW01E55

Because this is the interweb and this is what happens here.

Brav

"Doctor, it hurts when I touch myself here.."

"Then don't touch yourself there.."

Doctodd33

i originally made this thread cuz the M3 was a new generation model, unlike the M6.

forhamilton

The funniest part about threads like this is that some cannot accept that others have an opinion based on things different than what their opinion is based and maybe, just maybe nobody is really wrong.

Doctodd33

another thing that happened since i started this thread......i no longer compare the CLKBS to the new M3. Now i compare the CLKBS to a little blue demon i have.

SL2003driver

Lets see the blue one is a Ford the red one is a MB???? You are a lucky guy.

Doctodd33

gracias......technically a Backdraft replica with a Roush engine. Not expensive either......about 53K new with the 427 engine. A used one maybe about 40-45K depending on miles. It sounds like 5 Harleys. However the price goes waaaaaaay up if u screw up. There is no forgiveness.