Just how rare are the AMG GTR's going to be in the US?
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They havent been churning them out and couple that with the huge delays and demand has stayed pretty high. I would never call the GTR/GTS/GTC etc mass produced. They still are a higher price tag unit that clearly is not a commodity unit with factory subvented leases or price points to attract the layman.
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2017 AMG GT S
What do you think is the rationale that MB financials set the GTC residuals 5 % higher over GTR across all terms, and that means residuals for the GTC coupe right ?
Does the GTC roadster have even higher residuals than the GTC coupe ?
Does the GTC roadster have even higher residuals than the GTC coupe ?
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I think that anyone who leased a GT R will be in very good shape re: potentially purchasing the car at the end of the closed end lease for much less than it’s actually worth wholesale at that time.
Bish
Bish
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AMG GTR, G63, Mclaren 675 LT S, 991 GT3 RS, 991 GT3, many more
I traded in my BMW i8 for the GT. There was a lot of hype for the i8 before it came out. But I remember reading an article in one of the car magazines that BMW would produce as many of them as it had orders for. I ordered my car from my local dealer, from whom I had bought many BMWs. Then they started to come out. People were paying $25,000 to $100,000 over sticker (sticker was around $140,000). My dealer had committed to sell me the i8 at MSRP and I took delivery in November 2014. I almost bought the car outright, but at the last minute I decided to lease it. Lucky me!
The car remained fairly rare for the next 12 months and then came the deluge. All those people who had paid over MSRP were trying to sell their i8s -- with zero miles -- for MSRP and BMW was cranking them out to anyone who wanted one.
Prices sank and a year ago BMW dealers wre reducing the MSRP price by $20,000+. The only new exotic with a worse record has been the hybrid NSX, where in some cases dealers knocked $45,000 off the MSRP. When I turned in my i8 (6 weeks before lease end -- it bored the hell out of me) it was probably worth $80,000.
Bottom line is from what I've read the GTR is going to be mass produced, too. So the price will drop. Whether it will sink the way the i8 and NSX have is uncertain. But it's a mass produced car.
The car remained fairly rare for the next 12 months and then came the deluge. All those people who had paid over MSRP were trying to sell their i8s -- with zero miles -- for MSRP and BMW was cranking them out to anyone who wanted one.
Prices sank and a year ago BMW dealers wre reducing the MSRP price by $20,000+. The only new exotic with a worse record has been the hybrid NSX, where in some cases dealers knocked $45,000 off the MSRP. When I turned in my i8 (6 weeks before lease end -- it bored the hell out of me) it was probably worth $80,000.
Bottom line is from what I've read the GTR is going to be mass produced, too. So the price will drop. Whether it will sink the way the i8 and NSX have is uncertain. But it's a mass produced car.
We are unsure what the curve will be. It also depends on the BS. But, will have the numbers soon.
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As of what my dealer told me, MB makes 2 GT R(s) per working day only, although it doesn't have a specific limit number to be produced, it will stay quite rare. The fact is that,after all, this isn't like buying an investment and hope it to grow and make money. It's a car, it's meant to be used to serve its purpose. I can't wait to see mine arrive. At the end, I don't really care how many they or if it is a limited production car, all that I want is to have my GT R delivered on time by next summer so I can have some fun with it on those upcoming track days next driving season. 
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They havent been churning them out and couple that with the huge delays and demand has stayed pretty high. I would never call the GTR/GTS/GTC etc mass produced. They still are a higher price tag unit that clearly is not a commodity unit with factory subvented leases or price points to attract the layman.
The other components in determining roughly how many GTR’s might be made in 2018 are;
— Not all dealers are eligible to receive even 1 let alone 2 or more.
— From manufacturing startup 3/17 through about 8/17 all the GTR’s stuffed all of the VPC’s full to capacity (500-600 GTR’s) and couldn’t be sold until 10/17. My guess is maufacturing didn’t restart until 9/1.
— Current supply/inventory is small and once the premiums are removed, it may be non existant.
— Cost/price will curtail customer demand.
— Supposedly the GTR is hand built so 2/day or 40/mo is reasonable.
— The 2018 manufacturing model year ends soon (Vic will know when) so they can retool for the 2019 models.
— This car seems to be one where the customer wants to configure their own. So going forward, dealer prebuying betting they can move one they configured will be low. (Green) made up over 150 GTR’s at product launch.
— It’ll be fun working up the total 2018 models manufactured guesstimates.
— My guess is 2,500
Last edited by JSwan724; Dec 13, 2017 at 02:03 PM.
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2013 650i Coupe, 2010 IS250 AWD, 1999 S500
There is no finite number to be produced as per MB. That being said, the months long delay whilst produced cars were held up at the VPCs has really lowered the number of 2018s that can be produced and imported. Hence I’m not sure you’ll even see that many for the first production year. Less than 500?
Most definitely there’ll be loads more Porsche GT3s sold for 2018 than AMG GT Rs! lol
As for production plans in 2019 I’d imagine MB will make as many as ordered and they can get the parts for, so I doubt it’ll be a residual value icon like the Porsche GT cars.
Bish
Most definitely there’ll be loads more Porsche GT3s sold for 2018 than AMG GT Rs! lol
As for production plans in 2019 I’d imagine MB will make as many as ordered and they can get the parts for, so I doubt it’ll be a residual value icon like the Porsche GT cars.
Bish
M
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AMG GTC
Production runs probably 220-221 days per year
they would be building 200-400 cars per year
i guess about 1000-2000 cars total will not be so far off
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From: Overland Park, KS
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I can’t for certain tell you that a set limit has been imposed, but we do know this. Due to the delay/hold at the VPCs, dealers weren’t receiving; delivering and ordering new GT Rs. I was told by three new car sales managers at three large MB dealerships that they wouldn’t receive new allocations until the ‘held’ cars were released and delivered to customers. Further, based on postings on this forum and what I was told; (and which forced me to purchase a car on the lot), potential owners are being told that allocations will be for early 2018 with delivery in spring 2018, and that those allocations would be ‘limited’.
Add all of the above together and, at least to me, it seems reasonable to assume that 2018 GT Rs aren’t going to be exactly plentiful. Caveat: I could well be wrong and am only applying my logic to the argument.
As for 991.2 GT3s: On RL it has been stated that approximately 30% of all new 911 deliveries are GT cars. Potential owners keep mentioning that they are being called earlier than initially told they would be to lock in their order, and early orders appear to be showing up in droves. Again, I am extrapolating from what I’ve read there, so I could easily be way off base.
If you have data that refutes my feeble attempt at trying to apply logic to the ordering process of these two phenomenal cars, please share it.
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The sales manager at the dealer where I bought two other MBs confirmed there is no production limit for the GTR. They will build as many as are ordered.
The 911 GT3 is limited, but they make a lot of them: 3000-4000 per run. Resale Values are no higher than a regular 911. A low mileage GT3 still drops about 50% after a few years.
The 911 GT3 is limited, but they make a lot of them: 3000-4000 per run. Resale Values are no higher than a regular 911. A low mileage GT3 still drops about 50% after a few years.
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The sales manager at the dealer where I bought two other MBs confirmed there is no production limit for the GTR. They will build as many as are ordered.
The 911 GT3 is limited, but they make a lot of them: 3000-4000 per run. Resale Values are no higher than a regular 911. A low mileage GT3 still drops about 50% after a few years.
The 911 GT3 is limited, but they make a lot of them: 3000-4000 per run. Resale Values are no higher than a regular 911. A low mileage GT3 still drops about 50% after a few years.
2018's are out meaning the 2014's are now 4 years out and even these cars are holding values. Look at MMR values which are sub sub and even lending values. None of these are remotely close to 50% of the original value:
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I don't know what that MMR screen is - I look at actual listings.
There are a ton of them for sale at 50% off MSRP. And these are asking prices; I'm sure you can negotiate.
Here's a beautiful one asking $89k:
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...ink=true&Log=0
Been on AutoTrader for a while.
There are a ton of them for sale at 50% off MSRP. And these are asking prices; I'm sure you can negotiate.
Here's a beautiful one asking $89k:
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...ink=true&Log=0
Been on AutoTrader for a while.
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From: THE Orange County, California
2024 C8 Z06- 2025 BMW CS- 2022 Porsche 992 GTS
I don't know what that MMR screen is - I look at actual listings.
There are a ton of them for sale at 50% off MSRP. And these are asking prices; I'm sure you can negotiate.
Here's a beautiful one asking $89k:
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...ink=true&Log=0
Been on AutoTrader for a while.
There are a ton of them for sale at 50% off MSRP. And these are asking prices; I'm sure you can negotiate.
Here's a beautiful one asking $89k:
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...ink=true&Log=0
Been on AutoTrader for a while.
LOL you show me a 2008 GT3---- thats 10 years old
MMR is auction pricing which is sub lending/bank valuation and way below retail. Its actually a number that you wont see on retail site but it gives ACV values on trade ins from a dealership owner perspective. As for my comment to your post, it was derived from that statement below. I didnt apply a few years to equal 10.
"A low mileage GT3 still drops about 50% after a few years."
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AMG GTR, G63, Mclaren 675 LT S, 991 GT3 RS, 991 GT3, many more
I don't know what that MMR screen is - I look at actual listings.
There are a ton of them for sale at 50% off MSRP. And these are asking prices; I'm sure you can negotiate.
Here's a beautiful one asking $89k:
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...ink=true&Log=0
Been on AutoTrader for a while.
There are a ton of them for sale at 50% off MSRP. And these are asking prices; I'm sure you can negotiate.
Here's a beautiful one asking $89k:
https://www.autotrader.com/cars-for-...ink=true&Log=0
Been on AutoTrader for a while.
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'18 GT R on order, F80 M3
Well just to add a little bit of info, I was contacted by my dealer today who managed to secure an allocation for this last batch of 2018’s. They were, indeed, very scarce. There were only six allocations passed out to the entire East Coast for this batch based on his info.
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The sales manager at the dealer where I bought two other MBs confirmed there is no production limit for the GTR. They will build as many as are ordered.
The 911 GT3 is limited, but they make a lot of them: 3000-4000 per run. Resale Values are no higher than a regular 911. A low mileage GT3 still drops about 50% after a few years.
The 911 GT3 is limited, but they make a lot of them: 3000-4000 per run. Resale Values are no higher than a regular 911. A low mileage GT3 still drops about 50% after a few years.
Have you seen what a 997.1 or .2 GT3 manual goes for ? Not even an RS or RS 4.0??
I sold a GT3 RS to a guy in 2011, MSRP was like $145? Those go for $180-200k now...
As for AMG, i cant find a decent E63 2014 wagon to save my life under $70k.. MSRP was $115? Thats holding value my firend...go look a black series C63, SLS or the R63 AMG
Last edited by susman@eurogermantown.com; Dec 20, 2017 at 10:28 AM.
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Well just to add a little bit of info, I was contacted by my dealer today who managed to secure an allocation for this last batch of 2018’s. They were, indeed, very scarce. There were only six allocations passed out to the entire East Coast for this batch based on his info.
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GT3
Yeah, definitely more than seven 2018 GTR allocations on the eastern seaboard. You either misunderstood or the dealer lied to you. Maybe seven total in that specific district/region. But not in total, on the east coast. There were seven in the greater VA area last I checked (from D.C. down to North Carolina).
Look, all this rarity is fake. It's manufactured scarcity. Sales 101 stuff. The same reason why the awesome ramen joint here in SF tells the line of 50 people outside every night that they are running low on their super secret broth. 15 people leave. The rest get their ramen. More people show up later and guess what... still plenty of ramen left. It keeps the air of exclusivity and desire afloat.
One local dealer told me there were only 3 green GTRs in the entire country. They tell people this so they jump on the car they have, thinking it's something super special. It's just a sales tactic. You gotta be an informed consumer. Caveat emptor and all that.
Look, all this rarity is fake. It's manufactured scarcity. Sales 101 stuff. The same reason why the awesome ramen joint here in SF tells the line of 50 people outside every night that they are running low on their super secret broth. 15 people leave. The rest get their ramen. More people show up later and guess what... still plenty of ramen left. It keeps the air of exclusivity and desire afloat.
One local dealer told me there were only 3 green GTRs in the entire country. They tell people this so they jump on the car they have, thinking it's something super special. It's just a sales tactic. You gotta be an informed consumer. Caveat emptor and all that.
Last edited by FourT6and2; Dec 20, 2017 at 12:09 PM.
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Agreed. I actually applaud MB for how they are handling sales of the GTR. Porsche turned me off the 991 GT3 because of the bull**** surrounding allocations. I was promised one, then the dealer re-negged, now I’m “supposed” to be back on a list. It’s ridiculous. The GT3 is NOT limited production! They make thousands of them each generation. It’s bogus how Porsche handles sales of the GT3. I’m not into begging people to give them $200K.
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Yeah, definitely more than seven 2018 GTR allocations on the eastern seaboard. You either misunderstood or the dealer lied to you. Maybe seven total in that specific district/region. But not in total, on the east coast. There were seven in the greater VA area last I checked (from D.C. down to North Carolina).
Look, all this rarity is fake. It's manufactured scarcity. Sales 101 stuff. The same reason why the awesome ramen joint here in SF tells the line of 50 people outside every night that they are running low on their super secret broth. 15 people leave. The rest get their ramen. More people show up later and guess what... still plenty of ramen left. It keeps the air of exclusivity and desire afloat.
One local dealer told me there were only 3 green GTRs in the entire country. They tell people this so they jump on the car they have, thinking it's something super special. It's just a sales tactic. You gotta be an informed consumer. Caveat emptor and all that.
Look, all this rarity is fake. It's manufactured scarcity. Sales 101 stuff. The same reason why the awesome ramen joint here in SF tells the line of 50 people outside every night that they are running low on their super secret broth. 15 people leave. The rest get their ramen. More people show up later and guess what... still plenty of ramen left. It keeps the air of exclusivity and desire afloat.
One local dealer told me there were only 3 green GTRs in the entire country. They tell people this so they jump on the car they have, thinking it's something super special. It's just a sales tactic. You gotta be an informed consumer. Caveat emptor and all that.
Last edited by susman@eurogermantown.com; Dec 20, 2017 at 12:31 PM.
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W463 G550 / C190 GTC //prev: W204 C63 507 / R170
That is not true.. I had to fight kick and scream to get one more GTR allocation (sold btw)... it is highly restricted.
Have you seen what a 997.1 or .2 GT3 manual goes for ? Not even an RS or RS 4.0??
I sold a GT3 RS to a guy in 2011, MSRP was like $145? Those go for $180-200k now...
As for AMG, i cant find a decent E63 2014 wagon to save my life under $70k.. MSRP was $115? Thats holding value my firend...go look a black series C63, SLS or the R63 AMG
Have you seen what a 997.1 or .2 GT3 manual goes for ? Not even an RS or RS 4.0??
I sold a GT3 RS to a guy in 2011, MSRP was like $145? Those go for $180-200k now...
As for AMG, i cant find a decent E63 2014 wagon to save my life under $70k.. MSRP was $115? Thats holding value my firend...go look a black series C63, SLS or the R63 AMG
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LOL you show me a 2008 GT3---- thats 10 years old
MMR is auction pricing which is sub lending/bank valuation and way below retail. Its actually a number that you wont see on retail site but it gives ACV values on trade ins from a dealership owner perspective. As for my comment to your post, it was derived from that statement below. I didnt apply a few years to equal 10.
"A low mileage GT3 still drops about 50% after a few years."
MMR is auction pricing which is sub lending/bank valuation and way below retail. Its actually a number that you wont see on retail site but it gives ACV values on trade ins from a dealership owner perspective. As for my comment to your post, it was derived from that statement below. I didnt apply a few years to equal 10.
"A low mileage GT3 still drops about 50% after a few years."
Saw this 2010 Porsche 911 on autoTRADER.ca's iPhone app
http://m.autotrader.ca/a/5_35271142
asking $115k USD, 2010 with only 13k miles.
I’m sure you can get it for under $100k
I love the GT3, don’t get me wrong. But the way Porsche markets it as limited is just a farce. They build thousands of them in each gen. And they hold their value no better than any 911.
The GT3 RS is another story. But it’s also more than double the price.
