Dog hauler

My wife has a 2014 GL350 Bluetec and we'll be traveling around the country some in it. Since she bought the vehicle, we learned that in some states it's difficult to find diesel #2 or 5% or less biofuel. Illinois seems to be the poster child for this but I'm trying to find out in what other states we may have trouble finding #2 or <B5.

I searched biodiesel fuel threads in this forum, but didn't find any addressing this issue. Regardless what state you live in, please post as to whether diesel #2 or 5% or less biofuel is available or hard to find in your state (or other states known to you).

One other thing, if I'm in a pinch and have to fuel up with B20, am I likely to do any damage to the vehicle in one tankful? That sounds like a question that would have been asked at some point in this forum, but I didn't see it if it was.

ImInPA

You shouldn't have any problems if you plan. With a Bluetec, you can drive across most states on a single tank, and, the ones you cant traverse in a single tank (e.g. Texas, Alaska, etc.) will have #2 diesel at every truck stop. If you have to use B6-Bwhatever, just fill up in quarter tank increments until you can find a supported fuel, then fill up the remainder of the tank with the correct fuel.

Carsy

Good thinking. JC

Dog hauler

Part of planning ahead is to know in what states getting good fuel is an issue. And as for every truck stop having diesel #2, that's apparently not true in Illinois. So if anyone out there has information about states where Diesel #2 is hard to find, please pass it along. Knowing which states have readily available diesel #2 is also very helpful. Thanks.

Carsy

Can the fuel companies give you some info ?

You could always carry 20 litres in the boot to get you over a hump.

N_Jay

There seem to be plenty of CDI and BlueTec vehicles running all over Illinois without a problem.

Dog hauler

I'm not particularly interested in voiding my warranty by using >B5, but thanks for your input just the same.

Carsy

http://www.biodiesel.org/using-biodi...retail-map#map

Christian County for one has B5 .

This maps covers info on all B5 & B11 outlets US wide.

Here is another. All googled. http://alternative-fuel.findthedata.org/d/b/B5

jkaetz

Those maps aren't terribly useful. The first Since the OP is interested in places that have <=B5 that's not very helpful.

The second map appears to be more useful, but upon filtering by stations with B5, I'm presented a list of stations that say "Biodiesel (B20 and above)" Unless you're getting different results, I'm not sure how we can use those maps to find approved fueling stations.

I researched extensively upon purchasing our 2011 Bluetec ML and came up with little to nothing for support. Even asked my dealer and MB corporate. The dealer was actually interested but also didn't have any answers for what to do in states like IL. Corporate simply sent me a brochure stating that B5 was the only approved biofuel. Ultimately we make sure the tank is full upon leaving Indiana and fill up again after we exit IL. I believe Minnesota is the other state where biofuel is heavily subsidized making owners of current gen diesels risk warranty issues. There is no doubt the engines will run on the bio blends higher than B5, the question is more of long term effects. If you're truly in need of fuel you can likely fill up with what is available and then fill the rest with good fuel as soon as possible.

Dog hauler

jkeatz, that's pretty much what I was thinking. Although I appreciate the responses with the links to stations where you can get biofuel, what I really need to know is in what states it's hard to find diesel #2 or <B5. If folks would post whether it's easy or hard to find #2 or <B5 in their state or area, it would be very helpful. If people will do that, I think that in fairly short order we'll have a list of states where finding good fuel is/isn't an issue.

Meanwhile, you may want to check this link to see where you can get #2 in Illinois: https://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=U...50faa8ddb6b1f5

I take it from your post, jkaetz, that #2 is readily available in Indiana. Please let me know.

BTW, I think I read a post on this form recently that the Minnesota subsidies weren't in effect yet, so #2 is still available in Minnesota. At least for now.

Dog hauler

I received a PM from a fellow who is familiar with some states and I'm hearing from other folks, as well. I can't personally verify any of this so if your experience in finding diesel #2 in listed states is different, please feel free to chime in. That said, it looks like the following states have readily available diesel #2:So far, it's only in Illinois where it looks to be an issue finding #2, with Minnesota perhaps soon to follow but it hasn't yet. So here's the list of bad states where it's tough to find #2 (again, keep in mind that I can't personally verify the information so if your experience is different, by all means say so):I'd love to hear from other folks about their states and I'll add them to the list. Thanks!

ImInPA

I have driven up and down the east coast extensively. I have NEVER had an issue or any difficulty at all in finding #2 diesel. In fact, only folks new to diesels are still worried about the old days when diesel was difficult to find in the US. Thanks to the huge numbers of diesel pickup trucks and VW TDis, there has been a proliferation of diesel availability everywhere in the US. The information that you seek on locations, etc. is for all intensive purposes irrelevant today. The Illinois situation is unique, but, VW, Audi, and BMW have all reconciled the >B6 issue. MB is just slow. The truth is, no damage is going to occur. If you are this obsessive about voiding your warranty due to fuel availability, a MB diesel was probably not a good decision. I would just go out and enjoy the car. When the low fuel light comes on, fill it up again, and keep going. Life is too short to sweat the small stuff, and this is truly miniscule.

balticgreen

No problems in Maryland. Or anywhere in the mid-Atlantic, as far as I know.

I-95 runs through the eastern states and it's a very popular road for all kinds of commercial vehicles that run on diesel. When you get away from 95, out in the rural and agricultural areas, then you start seeing more privately owned diesel pickup trucks so diesel fuel is common out there too.

jkaetz

I don't think the OP is being obsessive, he's just trying to be informed. Most will agree that over the short term there would be no issue with running >B6 fuel, but no one is qualified to say that no damage will occur in the long term. I for one want to see the sixth digit on the odometer climb several times before the vehicle becomes more expensive to maintain than to replace. Long term effects are therefore a concern for me. If one is content with replacing a vehicle every few years than the long term is less of an issue.

A similar situation will occur if legislation is approved forcing ethanol content > 10% into gasoline. Will the existing cars run? Sure? How long? Who knows. Nevermind the fact that increasing ethanol content will reduce the fuel mileage of every gasoline powered vehicle across the board. Changing fuel standards should be something done very infrequently or else it could severely hamper the longevity of existing vehicles.

ImInPA

Consider that Biodiesel is highly available in Europe. These same engines are running just fine overseas on Biodiesel. The politics behind it is that the US has yet to adopt a universal grading system for biodiesel, so, quality can vary. This was the case with the multitude of biodiesel startups. A lot has changed since then. A testament to that is that we are now seeing mainstream companies (Hess, Exxon, Sunoco, etc.) offering biodiesel blends. MB is standing their ground on this issue. Audi, BMW, and VW, all took the same stance initially; however, they realized that the risk to a modern diesel is minimal, while, the risk to customer loyalty is huge. MB will have to come around or ultimately become the only diesel car manufacturer that is not "50 state" certified, and, basically write off Illinois as a market for diesels. While I love my benzes, if I lived in Illinois, there is no way on earth I would purchase a new diesel until MB follows the same course as their competitors. Diesels are robust and will run on everything from diesel #2 to cooking oil. I don't understand why MB is being such a stick in the mud on this issue.

Dog hauler

Any way you slice it, ImInPA, MB doesn't want french fry grease run through their motors. I'm inclined to go with what a roomful of German engineers have to say on it, especially since I consider that warranty thing pretty important. Once MB says it's okay to run >B5, I'm all over it. I hear it's less expensive, even. Until then, if you want to fill up at McDonald's and don't care about your warranty, knock yourself out.

N_Jay

Being in IL, my plan is to use "Branded" B20 (Mostly BP) and fill up out of state with D2 as often as practical.

Since we use the GL primarily for trips, it is not that hard to keep it well over 50% on D2.

I also decided to keep the 10K oil change interval, and watch the oil level for increases (Per the VW letter), but not worry about it.

Dog hauler

Don't forget to check this link: https://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=U...50faa8ddb6b1f5 If one of those sources is near you, perhaps you'll never need to use fuel >B5 and you'll still have a warranty.

N_Jay

I bought my GL with 96K miles.

Warranty is not a concern.

Dog hauler

May the force be with you.

ImInPA

Any way you slice it, if this is truly a concern for you then you bought the wrong car. Plain and simple. I also agree with the engineers. I would trade it in on an Audi Tdi or BMW 535d in a heartbeat if I was even remotely as concerned as you. A little homework prior to purchase would have saved you from all this grief you are putting yourself through. You could always run for Governor of Illinois and mandate B5 only through executive order. Other than that, the only real issue is why MB remains so adamant about losing diesel customers in Illinois to its competitors. When you have driven diesels for as long as I have, you will learn to just enjoy your car. I was never saying you should run French fry oil through your car, only that it is fully capable, as is the case with ALL diesels. I was attempting to offer you some comfort, but, you seem to be one of the members here that is just not happy unless they are not happy. Still a great car and I hope you learn to enjoy it.

thewiz49

Just to add my 2 cents.
I have a 2006 E320 CDI.
Been all over the west, Cal,Wash,Ore,AZ,Nev,Idaho,Col,NM,UT,WY,Montana.
No problem finding Diesel #2.
I only have a problem with price, more than UL Gas, why?

Dog hauler

Thanks for your input. It's very helpful. I'd add it to the list in my post, above, but I can no longer edit that post. I don't know why. Maybe edits are allowed for only a limited period.

When I get responses to most states, I'll start a new post with a complete list. Again, thanks for your input.

Dog hauler

What I wonder about diesel prices is why they don't always go up or down with the price of gasoline. In general, gas and diesel prices move in the same direction. But, in my observation in Arizona, there are plenty of instances where the price of gas is going up and the price of diesel is constant or even going down. The opposite is sometimes true, as well. There are even times when diesel is the same price or less than regular unleaded. Most of the time, diesel is more, of course, but not always.

There are no doubt ordinary market factors that go into it and if someone knows (as opposed to taking a wild guess) why, I'd like to hear the explanation.

ImInPA

Prior to 2000, diesel in the US generally was $.50-$.70 cents below regular. It is MUCH less expensive to refine than gasoline, and provides a higher yield per barrel as well. The diesel prices in the US are artificially high. As diesel is identical to home heating oil, the oil companies did not miss a step when it came to screwing home owners using oil heat. Of course, in the US, two big oil men were placed in the executive branch in 2000. From then on, diesel/home heating oil prices no longer reflected the costs. Similar price gouging can be seen with kerosene prices. As folks need to heat their homes, the oil companies have a captured market. A shame, because diesel could really move the US towards energy independence more quickly than any other technology out there at the present time.