Faridtaheri

Hello friends!
2005 E320 CDI (with 110000 km) - cranks too many times before starting.
Battery is new; all glow plugs OK; no code.
Hint: If I turn the ignition on, but not start (i.e., turn the switch to the first click) and wait for a few seconds, the number of cranks goes down!
I believe that would eliminate the problem with crankshaft and/or camshaft sensors; wouldn't it.

I am suspecting the fuel pump. Any known way of testing the pump?
Anyone has had a similar issue?
Your help is much appreciated in advance.
Cheers,
Farid

Plutoe

Does your diesel start cold and hot with approx same number of cranks, or do you notice fewer cranks hot or cold!!

Faridtaheri

It appears it does not matter whether it is cold or hot. By that, I mean, given the fact that I live in Canada, this issue has been recently developed (summer, hot!).

Now, as to whether the behaviour is the same whether the car, say, is left over night, and started, as opposed to, say, going to grocery store, and then staring it after a few minutes, I have to try it (I do not remember the actual behaviour)! I think, however, it is more or less the same.

Plutoe

Yes I was refereing to your last paragraph!!

rapidoxidation

Given that you've not said whether you're a new DIESEL owner or not, and not knowing your diesel ownership experience, I have to ask: When the car is cold (off overnight), do you wait until the glow plug light is out (a few seconds) then turn the key to start or do you just jump in and try to crank it up?
What you've described in your original post sounds perfectly normal. A cold diesel, given no chance to warm up the glow plugs, will crank a few times before starting. A hot diesel will start quickly.

More details please...

Faridtaheri

I have had this car for 10 years! Of course I wait till the glow plug goes off before starting. It has nothing to do morning, or any time. This started happening last year; I changed the battery thinking that was the culprit. For a while it did not do it, bust started happening again. I kept battery charger on it overnight, but the same thing; so, the battery is NOT the culprit.

I was reading various threads, and several people have had similar issue, with the claim that the throttle position sensor was the culprit.

Another thing that I must reveal is that I drive the car very infrequently (usually on the week-ends), as I walk to work most days. But, again, I have done that for the past 10 years!

Cheers,
Farid

mersum1es

I would make injector leak back test next...

Is fuel filter changed when?

Faridtaheri

Fuel filter was changed less than 1200 km ago.

Is the injector leak back test DYIable?!
Thanks!
Farid

kajtek1

The cdi diesel doesn't care much about glow plugs to start with.
We drive our 2008 with faulty GP module for 3 weeks before new module arrived and on worse cold morning it would crank for 2, max 3 seconds.
So it has to be fuel.
Scanner that would allow you you seeing fuel pressure would be very handy.
My first guess would be that the system leaks the residual pressure and on restart the time is needed to build up fuel pressure.

Faridtaheri

To the dealer then!
Cheers,
Farid

Plutoe

You have be very misinformed by our forum spammer---the leak down test is a DIY---there are loads of kits available on the internet

Faridtaheri

Noted; thank you!

kajtek1

To extend the clown recommendation, when leak down test is easy DIY, it is testing injectors "pistons" clearance.
Your symptoms indicate leak on pressure valve, or the pump. Possible injector valve, but that would make smoke on start.

ptkacik

FYI my 05 CDI only is hard to start when I've just replaced the fuel filter and only the first start. That means fuel pressure is not up yet. On my old non-diesel 300TE (gas car), it was always hard to start when the fuel pressure check valve failed and it lost residual fuel pressure when shut off. That car ran 340,000 miles when I traded it in for the CDI so I had lots of data.

Peter

Faridtaheri

Jut to let everyone know that this issue might have been due to infrequent use of the car!

I used the car to various trips to do chores in this w-W-E. After the first rip (5 km), it started perfectly (literary three cranks). Since then, including on Sunday and today, immediate start.

This becomes more puzzling! For the past 10 years, I make an effort to walk to my work, and have been using my car essentially in week-ends (very low millage!). However, this long cranking after not using the car in for a week at a time, started this year. The question is WHY?
Would it be a week fuel pump, I wonder?
Thank you for your responses.
Farid

kajtek1

That confirms my guess that your residual pressure leaks.
It will hold for few hr, but come to zero in a day or 2.
Things are not getting newer on the car so such things are to be expected.
As I listed above, there is whole list of things that can cost such leak and what was easy to troubleshot on low pressure system, becomes extremely risky when you deal with 400 bars.
One of the easy things to do is run diesel purge, hoping that the problem is dirt.
That topic will get more exposure in diesel section.

rapidoxidation

+1.
Also wouldn't hurt to begin running a bit of diesel additive in each and every tank of fuel. I use FPPF in my car, Power Service in my truck. Have yet to endure a fuel related problem in many miles and versions of diesel ownership.

Faridtaheri

Thanks you very much for your suggestions. I will try to do both.
Thank again.
Farid

Faridtaheri

I am returning to this post after none months!
I thought it would be vitally important to describe the cause of the problem I noted, and that none of the suggestions posted above worked!

The problem was a small air leak into the fuel filter; that is all, which made my life somewhat frustrating and miserable for a while!

All I did, I bought a MANN filter. The previous filter was a different brand (I do not recall its brand). In any case, my suggestion to you is that do not buy cheap fuel filter!

Hope disclosing this issue would save time for other unlucky E320 owners.

Maroc_Specops

its cranck position sensor wich is faulty.
change it

Faridtaheri

Are you kidding me?!
I clearly wrote that once I changed the fuel filter, everything worked (and works) perfectly.

ptkacik

Thank you for the description, but how does an air leak into a fuel filter cause this problem? It sounds like it loses fuel pressure but I can't figure out how air into the filter can do this. Does it leak fuel out into the engine compartment? Did the car smell of fuel when parked? Was it parked in a garage or outdoors?

Thanks for the info,
Peter

Faridtaheri

Peter:
You are absolutely right! No air leak, but fuel leak!
CHeers,

kajtek1

Can you still add more explanation? My understanding is that with electric prime pump - fuel filter is under low pressure, so you had constant fuel leak on the engine?
Did you not notice it?
Than I assume when the car was not run for few days fuel would leak out of the filter and air would enter, making hard start?

Faridtaheri

Simple, the connection shown in the picture had a small fuel leak. Once I changed the filter, the issue disappeared.
Cheers,