Hi All. New to the MB world so please be gentle.

I'm looking at purchasing a W211 E-class Merc here in Australia. I have the option of purchasing an older model (2004 E320) with SBC or a newer 2007 model E280.

I feel that the newer model would be a better buy, even if it costs more initially. I really don't want to be replacing SBC parts and have an undriveable car in the downtime.

Thoughts? This is what I'm interested in - https://www.carsguide.com.au/cars-for-sale/D_12207821/

 

I wouldn't want to be stuck with an m272/722.9 that needs a new intake manifold, ECU replacement, engine out balance shaft replacement, $1000+ conductor plate, ATF change from underneath with a pump. Each model has its advantages and disadvantages.

 

The VIN number of that vehicle is : WDB2110542B053359, and based on that the engine serial number is: 272943 30 480840. From the info posted in https://www.mercedesmedic.com/check-...y-vin-m272273/, anyone should check their engine is above

• M272 Engine Serial No. 2729..30 468993
• M273 Engine Serial No. 2739..30 088611

The serial number is just above the "critical number". You should in theory be free of the crankshaft issue.

Now to the intake manifold, the listing indicates @128K km ~ 80K miles. Assuming good maintenance (and luck), the intake manifold may still be OK; therefore, it would be a good idea to scan for codes in case the manifold level is already broken (it does not trigger CEL engine all the time), check for oil in the hose from the PCV to the throttle body, and if you buy it, I would replace the PCV valve immediately to prevent/protect the intake manifold. The question is not if it will fail, but when.

Sis has the W211 with 165K miles (intake is damaged already), but the transmission seems solid, no issues, but it has been maintained by dealer+Indy, so the oil change nuisances were paid for.

Definitely, I would not buy a used vehicle with SBC. It was a technology failure (not criticizing the tech behind it, but no longer supported); otherwise, every MB would have it today.

 

Believe it or not every hybrid, plug in hybrid and EV being built today has has some version of SBC. They just don't call it SBC anymore because of the bad publicity. All the updated SBC systems still on the road today are far more reliable than the first gen shipped in 03.

 

WOW, thanks for the detailed response! I am also looking at a 2008 E280 - https://www.carsales.com.au/cars/det...e-ad-12062395/

With the scanner, I have a generic Foxwell brand scanner. It can clear codes as well. Will this pickup any codes or do I need a better one? (I paid around US$50 for it from AliExpress.)

Thanks for the VIN checker link. Much obliged.

 

LOL you've nearly put me off, but I'm still interested in a MB.

 

SBC in the US had a 25 year extended warranty. That might not apply in other countries. Otherwise prior to that, it was about a 2k repair to fix SBC as the pump was almost 1k and the dealer charged another 1k to put it in. Now it's all covered. There was also a 15 year extended warranty on the fuel tank. Fill the tank up and smell for fumes in the back seat. Again US only.

Intake manifold runners get stuck when the oil separator/breather cover goes bad and allows oil into the intake which gums up the flaps. When the flaps don't move or are hard to move, you get pending error codes or a CEL light at some point. On the other hand SBC can fail at any point as it's a mechanical pump. MB keeps count of how many times you use the brakes and issues a warning when it thinks the pump might fail, but again, anything mechanical can fail at any time. SBC is like driving with brakes that might fail at any point if you're near the end point of the pump life. A bad intake just means the engine runs a little rough. Intake is about $650 in the US, Pierburg is the OEM maker. I had it replaced for about 1k as you also need gaskets and o-rings for the fuel injectors. Many youtube videos on how to replace the intake. The balance shaft problems affected all 2006 models and some 2007 models that had the M272 engine, as mentioned earlier, use a vin decoder like the one below to check the engine serial number to make sure it's out of range.

https://www.lastvin.com/
https://www.fcpeuro.com/products/mer...kit-oem-515810

The ECU doesn't really go that often but it's possible. I think you might be able to get that rebuilt, at least in the US. Same with the conductor plate for the transmission, that's $200-$400 for the conductor plate to be rebuilt. Probably 1k for a new one as it also needs to be programmed by the dealer afterwards. If you rebuild it, it doesn't need to be programmed but you do have to wait while you send it out and wait to get it back. Not sure if there's a company that does that in your country. The 5 speed in the 4matic is more reliable than the 7 speed in the RWD model, but then you could have issues with some of the 4matic hardware so it's a toss up. But you could get conductor plate issues across all years.

As for scanners, there are many out there. You want one that can read MB specific codes. There might be a pending intake manifold error code that your generic Foxwell scanner will not pick up. Foxwell also makes scanners that can do MB specific codes. iCarsoft, Autel, Launch, etc all make scanners that can do MB specific codes. One of the cheapest out there from Launch is the Thinkcar Pro on Aliexpress.

https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005002100144322.html

 

Or the engine ingests the intake manifold components and you have to buy a new engine.
I wouldn't touch an m272 with a 10 foot pole.

 

That's if you ignore it. Yes, the flaps will break off if you don't replace the intake. But that's because they get harder and harder to move as they get gummed up with oil. Some people use the repair kits to fix the lever or rods that break that activate the flaps and because the replacement parts are metal instead of plastic, they don't break so the flaps end up breaking instead. So just replace the entire intake manifold and don't use the the repair parts which you can easily find on eBay.

 

Many thanks for your post. I'll most probably go with a newer model to avoid the SBC hassle and engine problems.

My Foxwell scanner is a NT301 model. Would that still pickup problems or would a MB specific scanner be better?

 

That model only does OBDII error codes which is just engine and emissions codes. It will not scan other MB subsystems. You can get another Foxwell scanner that does MB specific systems, but the Thinkcar Pro I mentioned earlier is probably one of the cheapest scanners out there that reads MB specific codes. Autel AP200 is also another one.

 

My SBC equipped car just got to 200k miles. I've never had to think about it in the 40k miles I've owned it. The system is dead reliable and has some real advantages over conventional brakes. I see no reason to avoid it.

 

Thanks. Yes, it all seems to be a bit of a lottery. I'll still be looking at the 2004 E320 because it might be a nice car and has done around 138000km or 86000miles approx.

Also, I remember reading in another thread that even the balance shaft issue appears in only 2% of cases - so the older models are still worth exploring.

 

The balance shaft only affects the 2006 and some early 2007 models. Prior to that, it had a different engine, different design. You'll have 12 spark plugs to change instead of 6 in the older engine. As to the actual percentage, hard to say, that's really a guess, there are other guesses between 10-100%. We get threads on here all the time from people who had the balance shaft problem and sometimes with high mileage, 140-170k miles so there's no safe mileage unless the balance shaft was replaced. The metal was too soft and wore away. Mercedes never said what caused it, only that the part was replaced with an updated one after a certain engine number range. It was basically a 5-8k repair or more as you had to remove the engine. Not worth gambling on as you can just buy a model that's outside of the range.

 

Many thanks for your response. I have gone ahead and purchased a vehicle!!!
I am now the proud owner of a 2007 E280 Elegance sedan, black in colour. I've never owned a black coloured car before!

VIN WDB2110542B198601
Engine no 27294330687005

When I scroll through the display on the speedo, it says Service E due in roughly 14000km. What does a Service E involve? Can I get it done now or wait until 1 year or 14000km passes?
I travel roughly 10000-15000km per year. I have yet to check when the last service was done.

 

Congratulations on your new to you vehicle. Photos? Enjoy it

Service due that far down indicates it might have been recently serviced; however, I would take to a trusted mechanic and get it checked. Call me paranoid but anyone can reset the indicator w/o truly performing the service. Take that chance?

 

Ok thanks. See photos below. Car is the same but I have different registration plates on it now. (Seller wanted to keep the old personalised plates).

I will be taking it to a mechanic soon. (Within the week.) Thanks once again to all that replied.

 

Didn't MB agree to support the SBC permanently? I have 129K, still works fine, but you have to get used to the funky-feeling pedal, kinda "fluffy".

My intake crank failed, had it set wide open and see no reason to fix it, as it runs fine, passed Calif. smog every 2 years. 27 mpg on the highway, maybe a little under normal around town?

 

Haven't heard that, it was a 25 year warranty. Originally it was 10 years then it got extended to 25. Maybe lifetime is the next step.

 

You probably are right. 2006 + 25 = 2031, doubt I'll have the old bus that long. Keep it for long road trips, as it is still great for that, 26 mpg. Otherwise, the Tesla Model 3 still works great after 4-1/2 years.