mm9351

Does anyone else believe that the "hand polished wood" on the W212 dash, door trim, and especially the console which houses the cup holders / ash tray, appears to be "plastic." Or is it just me?

In particular, if you tap real wood with your fingers it has a solid sound / feel. I'm trying to convince myself that our W212's have real hand polished burl or walnut wood as advertised. If it is real wood, it is most likely a very thin veneer with a heavy laminated topcoat. How does this compare with the S-Class or even W211 models? Isn't the wood trim on Lexus and Jaguar also beginning to look like more plastic than wood?

I know this is somewhat subjective, but after all we spent a lot of hard-earned cash for these cars. Why does it seem the older cars / models especially the Benzes of the 70's or 80's had a higher grade of wood trim? Perhaps we should not be too surprised that, as a cost cutting measure, ALL materials used on the W212 don't feel quite as plush as Benz's of years ago.

Thanks for your comments!

gaazmon

i know what you mean. it's probably thinner compared to S/CL. my e320 feels a lot thinner the wood than our 02 CL500. by far the S/CL have the best wood. even the SL's leave a lot to be desired.

MBStar

To my knowledge the wood trim on the 211 and all later models (and classes) is made of a
very thin layer of real wood glued on very thin layer of metal mold (aluminum - I believe)
to reduce splintering and to allow easy deformation upon impact.

There are many other benefits if this technology: outstanding uniformity of
grain, ability to achieve excellent topographical design, weight reduction and
others. I suppose some might feel this solution is retrogressive and that
veneer is lesser than "solid wood". I think the result is superior esthetically, and progressive technologically.

K-A

I agree. I do feel the wood in the 212 looks pretty fake and plasticy. In reality, it's probably the exact same type of approach they took on even the 211, but maybe since it's bigger and it isn't as flush with the dash/door (pops out more), it looks more plasticy to me.

I also agree that the 212's interior has for the most part, some of the worst materials of any E-Class to date, but owners usually get upset when I say that.

gaazmon

the wood in my 94 S420 cracked in a couple of places by the ash tray if i remember correctly.

petee1997

Why did I know you would come out with this. The wood on the dash does not fit flush because the ambiant lighting comes from underneath the wood. The W211 does not have this. As far as materials are concerned, I have owned both and the W212 is superior. You make a lot of comments on a car that you have not spent 30 minutes behind the wheel. You will change your opinion within 24 hours of owning one. Hopefully that will happen soon because you have been repeating yourself ad nauseum.

K-A

I didn't say the wood not being flush was a bad thing necessarily, only that it does give it a "faker/plastic" look, but comes with its own positives.

I don't think I need to own one to know which uses better materials. I would to know the higher comfort level, or maybe more comfortable interior environment/ambiance the 212 might provide. But stuff like the super cheap headliner, flimsy sunvisors, hard plastic on the doors, amongst other places, flimsy painted silver air vents, etc., etc. are all areas that are major steps down from the attention to detail in those areas VS the 211.

I want M-B to know that some are paying attention, and I assure you, even if I do end up with a 212 at any time, those areas would probably bother me more. I just find them to be unacceptable for an E-Class, for example, like I find the flimsy door shut/thud unacceptable on the 211.

mm9351

Well said, K-A. We, as owners, pay attention to the small details because it's something we see every day. And M-B should take notice, as I believe they are with a new forum called MB Advisors. As many of you know, the 2010 E-Class introductory price was about $5,000 LESS than a similarly equipped 2009 E-Class, and the new W212 includes more standard safety features and technology. That said, I believe this was made possible, in part, by downgrading materials. I would also like to add that "lean manufacturing" is being exploited by auto manufactureres to help cut down waste and save costs as well.

Please note, I could not be more pleased with my W212 and have absolutely no regrets. I love the way it looks, feels, and drives. The exterior paint work, fit and finish, and technology bits are all outstanding. But I cannot help recall the wood trim and leather interior on the 1972 MB 280SE I used to drive; it looked and felt like fine furniture.

K-A

Well said and agreed.

Yeah, I've always said, the area where I believe M-B cost cut to allow for that lower price, was mainly in the interiors materials. In a perfect world, Manufacturers would "care" enough to drop costs and up quality across the Board, but with the almighty dollar in command, this isn't always reality.

Enjoy the nice ride. And to the 72 280SE.

El Cid

I specifically ordered a luxury model with burl wood trim and steering wheel because I was impressed with the way it looked. Am more impressed the more I drive it - and look at it.
Looked at a lot of other cars, and the only one that came close in interior fit, finish and appearance was the Lexus LS 460. Still prefer the W212 though.
It may not be so much that it looks plasticy, but that other manufactures "plood" is look is looking more realistic. Also, you need a heavy coating of something to protect the wood in a car.
For comparison, many people are impressed with the "leather" in my car. It's MB-Tex, but I don't tell them that.
Of course, all of these are very subjective, so this debate can on forever.

babyjocko

I traded in a 2007 Lexus LS460 for a W212. The interior luxury of the LS460 doesn't come close to the W212. Instead, the LS460 exceeds the W212 many times over.

I traded in a 2005 W211 for the LS460. The interior luxury of the W211 was far superior over the W212. The quality of materials and design have been significantly reduced in the W212 compared to the W211 -- not even close. But, I didn't buy the E based on the luxury. I bought it based on drive performance and handling.

I would advise anyone to stay away from the E if luxury is high on their list of priorities. They'd be better off with a Honda Accord. OTOH, if performance, handling, and safety are high on their lists, then there is not much better than a W212.

gaazmon

i agree, the w212 was a big jump all around in performance from the w211. i mean i remember getting c300 and c350 loaners (and we had a 07 c230 at the time as well) and i noticed such a difference with the way the new models drove, so much better than the previous ones.

MBStar

I think in 1994 the trim was either solid wood or rather thick veneer, both were
prone to cracking - unlike the "new process" which started in 2003 with W211.

MBStar

I agree. The overall feel of the W212 interior feel just like the current C-class.

MB ownership is a complex process these days, where love and hate intertwine. If you own
one, it is likely due to the "love", which does not mean you can't hate the flaws
and unfulfilled expectations. The interior quality is an obvious shortcoming, but
there are many more. The Navi is well below the current model European
market products like Ford, Renault / Nissan Peugeot. The Linguatorionc works for
some, or not at all for others. The wiper rain sensor is poorly programmed / designed...etc

K-A

Well said and agreed. Being completely honest, I think the W212, materials wise, is like a full-class below the W211, i.e how the C-Class should be.... But we all know M-B put in a preposterously hideous inside the W204.

I'm not one of those people who will make good of something just to enhance the happiness of my purchase. If something is unacceptable in my car, I want the manufacturer to know it. The 212's materials and lack of attention to detail in that regard, is something unfitting of an E-Class, and I can only imagine how the W213 will be if nobody complains about it. It's already started with the W204, and even W212 IMO.

I think construction and fit & finish to the 212's interior is top notch, better than the 211, but my beef here simply lies in "materials"..... And design, but that's completely subjective so I won't go there.

ash_cpe

I have Ash wood trim and It feel and sounds like real wood, I rented an E350 last week in LA and it has the lighter wood color trim and it felt very very plasticy to me...

jaymoney92

I actually like the interior of both the w204 and the w212
I havent spent anytime in the w212 yet, but spent a lot of time in the w204 and everything feels solid as well as soft.

220S

fwiw, I was at the MB Classic Center in Irvine a few years ago and met a guy who does restoration. He told me how difficult it is to repair veneer in older Mercedes because of the thin layer (1/32") You cannot sand it because it's too thin and you'll hit the backing material. They have to remove the coating varnish and then either polish the wood (and sometimes also bleach it to match, etc..) or replace it altogether.



The newer material is still veneer with a backing. The veneer is meant to be flexible. You need veneer to bend around corners, etc.. The "face" veneer is very thin and bonded to other veneers (like aluminum.) If you've ever built furniture or cabinets, you'll know what that means. And as our friend from the cold and distant North, Mr MBStar, has already said, you don't want thick heavy wood that can splinter shrapnel into your body during an accident in your car anyway.

The company that makes veneer for MB (and others, including BMW) is the Sellner-Behr Corp. The polyester top coat material is now injected into the veneer instead of sprayed. That might be why it looks more "plastic-like" unlike the older wood veneer in previous MBs. According to the restorer at the Classic Center, the problem with the old MBs was the top coat cracking. That's not going to happen anymore with the new processes. They're now lacquer-free.

The amount of wood is still there but it just looks different than the older Mercedes wood trim due to modern manufacturing improvements.

ash_cpe

Well said 220S.

MB_Forever

Mercedes maybe reducing the quality (and in some cases the integrity) of certain materials for safety reasons, but you can bet that is also for cost reasons. They continue to use cheaper materials in their lower-end models that the cars' interiors keep feeling more and more "plasticy" over the years.

gaazmon

+1. very knowledgeable posts as always and very good insight on the suppliers. keep em coming

220S

Just for the record, Sellner-Behr is just one company that makes wood veneer interiors. They make them primarily for the M Class and X3 BMWs.

Dräxlmaier Group makes wood veneer interiors for other MB models. They manufactured the entire cockpit for the CLK (and the BMW 7er center console.) The gear shift levers and door panels in MBs are made by them.

Novem Group's subsidiary, CID Car Interior Design Holding GmbH (in Vorbach), also supplies interior wood, carbon fiber and aluminum veneers. They were bought by Barclays a couple of years ago.

The crazy thing with these vendors is that they get sold and bought by various companies. Everybody seems to end up being a subsidiary of somebody else. Who knows who owns what.

The bottom line is that our cars are made up of lots of different parts from lots of different manufacturers.

ipp

Have you seen/felt the Lexus's door handles? The clock? The buttons for the windows? The speedometer? The buttons for rear view mirrors? And I could go on and on... All these Toyota components doesn't belong in a car in it's price range. I'm fully aware of that the Lexus has details that exceeds the W212 in many terms, but the mix between really ****ty Toyota stuff and nice leather doesn't make it for me at all.

K-A

^^ The Lex might use plusher materials than the E, but indeed even the LS has that cheap-ish flimsy like feel to it IMO, I prefer M-B's stronger and more substantial feel and construction in that dept (fit & finish).

petee1997

What I got from 220S is that better processes are used in the finishing of of certain components. He did not say they were cheaper components but better and more durable. I believe MB aspires to build better cars and the savings are in manufacturing, assembly and distribution. They would be shooting themselves in the foot doing anything else.