AMGTTV8

There is no difference in paint quality....Mercedes uses a nano-particle paint process - the individual paint particles are 10,000 times smaller than a strand of human hair and made of ceramic material....this makes it almost impervious to small scratches and results in much harder paint than normal non-lead based paints.

looks like you are driving differently in this car - it's not the paint

reckrab

Not an expert on this subject but I always try to use a car wash soap specifically designed for that purpose. Some dish washing soaps could be harsh and strip wax and dull the finish. They can also tend to spot and streak. Also use a lambs wool or microfiber type sponge for best results, NEVER a brush.

As far as car washes are concerned a good rule of thumb would be not to use those with any kind of brushes which touch your paint, and wash at home whenever possible. Here in New England it's not practical to wash at home year round so I use a touchless spray car wash to fill in during the winter. They do an okay job and there's no chance of scratching or swirling your paint.

There is a seperate forum here for detailing that has quite a bit of info on this stuff as well, but they can get a little obsessive over car care there.

steelgrey

Car washes are a big no...no. Hand washing is the way to go. Buy a good quality auto wash (I use Wolfgang's Auto Bathe) and a microfiber or foam mitt. Make a lot of suds in your bucket and wash with as much suds as possible (also rinse the entire car thoroughly before starting). Auto soap is made to lift the dirt away from the paint and then rinse off. Never use soap in the sun. Sealants contain no polishing compounds. It's ok to put wax over sealants but, you should not put sealants over wax. Sealants need to actually bond with the paint to work most effectively. This is one time a wash with Dawn dish washing liquid would be appropriate to remove the wax before applying sealant. The real key to having great looking paint is in the prep work prior to using the sealant. This can involve using a number of polishes with varying cutting capabilities and a number of different foam pads on a random orbital polisher. I use Menzerna polishes, and if necessary Meguiars cutting compounds. For a sealant I use Menzerna Power Lock Polymer Sealant. It creates a very smooth, slippery surface. It also creates sooo much static electricity that when using a microfiber towel to remove it every time you touch an unpainted metal surface (grill) you get shocked. Therefore after the Menzerna I wipe the car down with Wolfgang's Deep Gloss Spritz Sealant to cut down on the static electricity. I am not a pro by any means but have gained alot of experience from owing two black cars an E coupe and a 2003 Infiniti G35 coupe. The Infiniti's paint is still perfect. Both cars are garaged of course.

Spirit Crusher

+1 on hand washing only!

Those machines leave heavy streaks and blemishes in the paint and more often than not, don't really clean the car all that well.

As far as paint durability. My car has been dealing with rocks in the road and other weather/environmental situations extremely well. I haven't even begun to notice any real streaks yet. I wash about twice a month and do a wax once every month or two.

mbuster25

Auto washes, especially the brush type/microfiber type are not good for the car because they can pickup dirt and induce many scratches/swirls. Also, the chemicals can be harsh on your existing protection as well. I use to use the laser type car washes, but now avoid them all together.

It is not a good idea to use Dawn to wash your car because it is high in alkaline; unless it is your intent to remove your wax/sealant. I would suggest getting a product like Meguiar's Gold Class, readily available in auto stores and even dept stores like Target/Walmart/Costco. It's PH balanced too so using too much of it will not strip protection on the car.

A lot of the scratches on many vehicles (even ones that dealers maintain) are caused by improper car washing and drying!

K-A

NEVER!!!! Both are terrible for your paint. Dish Soap is a good way to leave your paint completely stripped and unprotected, and a good way to make it look really dulled and "old" fast. As they've said, only if you want to strip the wax, but even then, personally, I don't like to use it.... I'm just afraid to put it anywhere near my car.

Also, if you're gonna take it to a Wash, best is to definitely find a Hand Wash place, and don't run it through those machines (my Chevy gets the drive-through treatment, but never for the Benz).


Good info. I just got on the Sealant wagon (bought "F.T.P" as it looked extremely impressive), and just Waxed my car a couple of weeks ago, so am gonna plan on doing the Sealant for my next "protection application", which will be in about 3 months or so.

What are the potential harmful, or diminishing-of-protection effects of putting a Sealant over Wax? And if I waxed 3-4 months prior, then is that a decent stage to apply Sealant? I did ask about waxing over sealant, which I was told was okay, but I forgot to ask about applying Sealant months after I waxed.

And all Sealants use no polish (no abrasives)? That's good to know. I could of sworn the person demonstrating the "F.T.P" was using the Sealant as a Polishing effect as well, but then I realized, I might have been confused as he was also using the F.T.P compound to erase blemishes as well, so I probably got them mixed up.

steelgrey

The problem with putting sealants over wax is as I stated above sealants are made to and meant to bond with the paint. If you apply sealant over a waxed surface the sealant is laying on top of the wax and not in direct contact with the paint. The dawn wash was actually a recommendation from the Zaino Bros. site prior to applying Zaino products. (Zaino has a cult following but I found it expensive and hard to use) I have also heard of using a 50/50 percent alcohol/water mix in a spray bottle. Spray on wipe off with a microfiber towel. You can use anything you're comfortable with. You just want to remove the wax and have a perfectly clean surface before applying the sealant. It is also possible to apply multiple coats of a sealant to acheive even more protection. Most sealants have a recommended drying time between coats.

mbuster25

How much protection is left on there? When the wax comes off, so would the sealant you put on top of it. Hard to judge the durability of the sealant.

Read the product description carefully to determine if the product contains any polish/abrasives. For example, if a product says removes fine scratches, is it doing it by polishing, or by hiding/fillers. Most products advertised as sealants do not have any polish in them. There are a line of "all-in-one" products from Zaino and Optimum that clean, polish and protect.

mbuster25

Yup, Zaino has a following and I am a fan.
Not inexpensive product at around $15/8oz and it never goes on sale but I did find it to do the job and have very good durability
There is often a healthy discussion betwen wax vs sealant and they concern the looks and durability. Find the right combination for yourself!

K-A

Good point. If it does have Polishing attributes, would it be cool to put over Wax?

El Cid

Per the Operator's Manual it is safe to use automatic car washes.
However, I am still hand washing mine. As car and my bones gets older, will eventually go to auto car washes.
In the past I have used auto car washes for all my cars and still do for my RAV4 and Mazda pick-up. Have never noticed any swirls, scratches, etc. And does a fairly good job, actually better than the $75 hand wash I got on the RAV one time.
The auto wash I use has long strips of some kind of fabric hanging down that can of move around on the vehicle as it goes through. Would never use one with brushes though.

mbuster25

I wouldn't put it over wax. Clean first, then polish.

OceanView

So then can you wax on top of the sealant?
Sorry for the basic question, I just get so confused with all the different products out there.

sotomd

I have a E 350 2010 with panorama sunroof and I noticed that on the black paint in the junction nwith the A pillar and roof in both sides a stripped paint spot. I wonder if MB will fix it under warranty

steelgrey

Yes, you can put wax over sealant. As a matter of fact it is quite popular on darker colors. Some people feel that sealant gives a plastic like gloss and add wax to give a deeper shine. If you are going to do this make sure that the wax contains no abrasives or cleaners. You need to use a 100% Carnuba wax. P21s is one that is well known and not too expensive at $54.99. Wolfgang's Fusion is $175.00 and Pinnacle Souveran is $95.00. I have 2 black cars and have tried it. I personally like the gloss and feel of sealant only. I use a sealant spray to QD. I should add that there are cheaper pure carnuba waxes than the ones I listed they are the most popular on the detailing forums but they tend to be wax snobs.

fromthebeginnin

Highly recommend Blackfire (especially for black cars). One of the things that amazed in addition to their products (as I mentioned this in another thread) is their service/support (I've called them three times now, and someone technical answered the phone to provide advice, guidance and product selection, "who does that these days"). Check them out at blackfireusa.com, btw I have no relationship with the company just a satisfied client.

FTB

K-A

How does a Sealant shine on a white car, compared to wax?

I wonder if after 3-4 months, they'll be enough wax left on the car to even have to worry about stripping any remnants away?

steelgrey

You know the very best way to get accurate answers to your questions would be to do a test. I would recommend using the trunk deck because flat surfaces suffer the most abuse from the elements. Do a dawn wash on half of your trunk, leave the other half waxed and then apply the sealant to both halves. This is really the only way to know what will work best. I'm not familiar with F.T.P please give the full name I'd like to google it. If they have a web site they may have suggestions as to the best way to use their product. Every one of these products have distinct characteristics and each have a following as you can tell from this thread. You have a Zaino fan, a Blackfire fan and a Menzerna, Wolfgang's fan. The only way to find what works best for you is to test the products on your vehicle and yes, if your like most detailing nuts you end up with hundreds of dollars worth of products. If you do deceide to do a test please post your results.

K-A

Will do. Sorry, it's actually "T.F.P", I musta mixed it up. If you Google it, you'll see some hits show up.

Kevwood

I bought and use a pressure washer to clean my C and CLK and take them in once a year to MB for a full detail with polish. After 5 years in the brutal Dubai heat and blowing sand, my C ('05) still looks brand new. I've only had my CLK 6 months but I'm sure the results will be the same. I never ever run my cars through an automated brush/fiber wash.

K-A

One "trick" that I have with washing, is I never use soap. Only during the times before I wax do I use it. This of course only truly works well with a garaged car, that gets washed relatively regularly.

I find that it keeps the paint looking shinier (no mild abrasives). As long as it's kept waxed, it's very easy to get spotless, and it keeps the protective (wax/sealant) coats on for longer periods of time (again, no mind abrasives to help deteriorate them).

My cars are always as sharp and shiny as it gets, and are always complimented in that regard. Therefore, I consider this formula of car-care my "trick", as I know to lots of people, it sounds crazy.