'14 W212 needs engine rebuild after 50K?!?!
01-01-2018, 01:46 PM
#26
MBWorld Fanatic!
I don't think MB of years ago is the MB of today.
I didn't assume full tech support (on any forum actually) so I bought the service manual CD for less than $20 if I remember right. Just look on eBay for Mercedes w212 (or your model) service manual.
It may not be the super dealer software but it has really answered a lot of my questions. People try to help when they can and if they can't thats ok. I'm not going to complain if they can't solve my specific issue especially when a lot of the time I don't have answers either.
But back to the OP - I'm sure that's distressing even with mfg stepping up to rebuild the engine. At this point the best you can do is roll with it to the end outcome. It could wind up better than it looks right now.
I didn't assume full tech support (on any forum actually) so I bought the service manual CD for less than $20 if I remember right. Just look on eBay for Mercedes w212 (or your model) service manual.
It may not be the super dealer software but it has really answered a lot of my questions. People try to help when they can and if they can't thats ok. I'm not going to complain if they can't solve my specific issue especially when a lot of the time I don't have answers either.
But back to the OP - I'm sure that's distressing even with mfg stepping up to rebuild the engine. At this point the best you can do is roll with it to the end outcome. It could wind up better than it looks right now.
01-01-2018, 07:38 PM
#27
MBWorld Fanatic!
01-07-2018, 06:24 PM
#28
Junior Member
So much for that legendary M-B reliability!
Has a continuous knocking noise from the engine, not really related to temperature. Was always there. Initially I did think it kinda sounded like piston slap or something, but nah....this is a Mercedes. I took it in to have it looked at and now I'm told I'm getting my engine rebuilt.
I did find a TSB and even an audio file (thanks konigstiger) on this. I don't know what my engine serial number is, only that it's a 276, so I don;t know if it falls into the range of the TSBs, but it is a very early 2014 model so I'm guessing it does.
The thing that really struck me was they only had the car for about 15 minutes before diagnosing the noise, because the service manager said they've had EIGHT of the same problem come through in the last 2-3 months! Really, eight? I am in northeast PA, my dealer is in Wilkes-Barre. This is, shall I say, an economically depressed area. I can't imagine there are a lot of M-Bs coming through here for service, and to have that many of them so recently has to be a significant percentage. It's not like I;m in Philly or NYC or something where there are thousands and thousands of them.
What's the deal? Is this really that pervasive of a problem?
What issues do I need to watch out for?
I do my own service. I have done it religiously with all M-B parts and I even print out a workorder for myself and take meticulous notes. Is there any way they can come back and deny a warranty claim based on not having a dealer perform services?
Thanks,
Darel
Has a continuous knocking noise from the engine, not really related to temperature. Was always there. Initially I did think it kinda sounded like piston slap or something, but nah....this is a Mercedes. I took it in to have it looked at and now I'm told I'm getting my engine rebuilt.
I did find a TSB and even an audio file (thanks konigstiger) on this. I don't know what my engine serial number is, only that it's a 276, so I don;t know if it falls into the range of the TSBs, but it is a very early 2014 model so I'm guessing it does.
The thing that really struck me was they only had the car for about 15 minutes before diagnosing the noise, because the service manager said they've had EIGHT of the same problem come through in the last 2-3 months! Really, eight? I am in northeast PA, my dealer is in Wilkes-Barre. This is, shall I say, an economically depressed area. I can't imagine there are a lot of M-Bs coming through here for service, and to have that many of them so recently has to be a significant percentage. It's not like I;m in Philly or NYC or something where there are thousands and thousands of them.
What's the deal? Is this really that pervasive of a problem?
What issues do I need to watch out for?
I do my own service. I have done it religiously with all M-B parts and I even print out a workorder for myself and take meticulous notes. Is there any way they can come back and deny a warranty claim based on not having a dealer perform services?
Thanks,
Darel
01-07-2018, 11:10 PM
#29
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Join Date: Feb 2016
Location: Palatine, IL
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2013 E350 4Matic
I just wonder if perhaps the Eco Mode( Start / Stop) is finally causing problems with engine wear. I dont think Mercedes has changed the design much except more capable starter and the battery vs pre 2014 models. I understand that most wear occurs during a cold start but maybe there is enough wear and tear with every restart during the eco mode that its now catching up as these cars age. How many pre Eco mode have had this problem?
01-08-2018, 05:18 AM
#30
Senior Member
Thread Starter
I dunno. Stop/start has been around a LONG time now from LOTS of auto manufacturers, viurtually all of which don't have Mercedes' reputation or resources. Plus, the TSB clearly calls out a certain range of engine numbers that were manufactured with the incorrect tolerances on the wrist pin holes in the pistons.
VEKI, can you describe your noise? Is it kind of a "woody" rattle? Like someone randomly shaking a...umm...small piece of wood inside a larger wooden container? If you search around the forum konigstiger posted the TSB which also happens to include an audio file. Search for something like "piston" or something.
It's not a steady noise. Like, it's always rattling but it's not like tick-tick-tick-tick-tick.
My parts came in last Thursday and they did the teardown, no damage inside so they are proceeding with a rebuild.
I'd have much rathered wait a month or two for the factory to build me a whole new engine and ship it over, vs. a Northeast PA mechanic rebuilding it on his own, but such is life.
Is it unrealistic to ask that the 100,000-mile warranty be re-started for the engine?
I am going to raise a stink if I find they didn't replace the rings though. I am fearing the worst that they tried to same money by putting the old rings on new pistons, not honing the cylinders, not reaming the ridge to get the cylinders out in the first place, etc etc. But now I'm just being a worrywart. I do plan on requesting to sit down with both the service manager AND the mechanic who did the work when I go to pick it up. Dealing with the service manager, generous and forthcoming as they may be, when I ask a question it's like, "I dunno, it's a thingy in the engine?".
D
VEKI, can you describe your noise? Is it kind of a "woody" rattle? Like someone randomly shaking a...umm...small piece of wood inside a larger wooden container? If you search around the forum konigstiger posted the TSB which also happens to include an audio file. Search for something like "piston" or something.
It's not a steady noise. Like, it's always rattling but it's not like tick-tick-tick-tick-tick.
My parts came in last Thursday and they did the teardown, no damage inside so they are proceeding with a rebuild.
I'd have much rathered wait a month or two for the factory to build me a whole new engine and ship it over, vs. a Northeast PA mechanic rebuilding it on his own, but such is life.Is it unrealistic to ask that the 100,000-mile warranty be re-started for the engine?
I am going to raise a stink if I find they didn't replace the rings though. I am fearing the worst that they tried to same money by putting the old rings on new pistons, not honing the cylinders, not reaming the ridge to get the cylinders out in the first place, etc etc. But now I'm just being a worrywart. I do plan on requesting to sit down with both the service manager AND the mechanic who did the work when I go to pick it up. Dealing with the service manager, generous and forthcoming as they may be, when I ask a question it's like, "I dunno, it's a thingy in the engine?".
D
01-08-2018, 05:26 AM
#31
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Here's the thread with the link to the audio file:
https://mbworld.org/forums/e-class-w...o-include.html
https://mbworld.org/forums/e-class-w...o-include.html
01-08-2018, 02:35 PM
#32
Junior Member
I dunno. Stop/start has been around a LONG time now from LOTS of auto manufacturers, viurtually all of which don't have Mercedes' reputation or resources. Plus, the TSB clearly calls out a certain range of engine numbers that were manufactured with the incorrect tolerances on the wrist pin holes in the pistons.
VEKI, can you describe your noise? Is it kind of a "woody" rattle? Like someone randomly shaking a...umm...small piece of wood inside a larger wooden container? If you search around the forum konigstiger posted the TSB which also happens to include an audio file. Search for something like "piston" or something.
It's not a steady noise. Like, it's always rattling but it's not like tick-tick-tick-tick-tick.
My parts came in last Thursday and they did the teardown, no damage inside so they are proceeding with a rebuild. I'd have much rathered wait a month or two for the factory to build me a whole new engine and ship it over, vs. a Northeast PA mechanic rebuilding it on his own, but such is life.
Is it unrealistic to ask that the 100,000-mile warranty be re-started for the engine?
I am going to raise a stink if I find they didn't replace the rings though. I am fearing the worst that they tried to same money by putting the old rings on new pistons, not honing the cylinders, not reaming the ridge to get the cylinders out in the first place, etc etc. But now I'm just being a worrywart. I do plan on requesting to sit down with both the service manager AND the mechanic who did the work when I go to pick it up. Dealing with the service manager, generous and forthcoming as they may be, when I ask a question it's like, "I dunno, it's a thingy in the engine?".
D
VEKI, can you describe your noise? Is it kind of a "woody" rattle? Like someone randomly shaking a...umm...small piece of wood inside a larger wooden container? If you search around the forum konigstiger posted the TSB which also happens to include an audio file. Search for something like "piston" or something.
It's not a steady noise. Like, it's always rattling but it's not like tick-tick-tick-tick-tick.
My parts came in last Thursday and they did the teardown, no damage inside so they are proceeding with a rebuild.
I'd have much rathered wait a month or two for the factory to build me a whole new engine and ship it over, vs. a Northeast PA mechanic rebuilding it on his own, but such is life.Is it unrealistic to ask that the 100,000-mile warranty be re-started for the engine?
I am going to raise a stink if I find they didn't replace the rings though. I am fearing the worst that they tried to same money by putting the old rings on new pistons, not honing the cylinders, not reaming the ridge to get the cylinders out in the first place, etc etc. But now I'm just being a worrywart. I do plan on requesting to sit down with both the service manager AND the mechanic who did the work when I go to pick it up. Dealing with the service manager, generous and forthcoming as they may be, when I ask a question it's like, "I dunno, it's a thingy in the engine?".
D
01-08-2018, 07:57 PM
#33
Junior Member
My noise is steady,but really loud...feels like coming from deep inside the engine.. Cold engine is not that bad, but fully warmed engine is really noisy...I was told maybe i have bad injectors,or bad purge valve or bad high pressure fuel pump???just guessing... I am still waiting for dealer respond...i am still driving car...I will let you know what's going on...
01-11-2018, 05:42 AM
#34
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Going to pick the car up this afternoon. I asked to sit down with both the service manager and the tech who did the work, so I can get a good picture of what they really did (I doubt the SM even knows how to put gas in a car). She did tell me that in addition to the diff seal (which required an alignment) and alternator they also replaced the water pump and right side exhaust manifold (!?!). It concerns me she did not specifically call out replacing the rings or wrist pins though, she just keeps saying they replaced the pistons and that's it. We'll see.
01-11-2018, 01:40 PM
#35
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Savannah, GA
Posts: 377
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69 Posts
2010 W212 E550 4matic
Going to pick the car up this afternoon. I asked to sit down with both the service manager and the tech who did the work, so I can get a good picture of what they really did (I doubt the SM even knows how to put gas in a car). She did tell me that in addition to the diff seal (which required an alignment) and alternator they also replaced the water pump and right side exhaust manifold (!?!). It concerns me she did not specifically call out replacing the rings or wrist pins though, she just keeps saying they replaced the pistons and that's it. We'll see.
01-12-2018, 05:56 AM
#36
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Well, got my car back yesterday. It got new pistons, rings, wrist pins, connecting rods, chain tensioners, spark plugs, a whole litany of miscellaneous stuff (head gaskets, head bolts, 1,729 o-rings and seals, all that jive), as well as the alternator and front diff seal / alignment, plus they noticed the water pump was leaking, and they snapped off a bolt in the right exhaust manifold so they replaced those too. I sat down with the service manager (who is customer service, and NOT a car person) as well as the shop chief who's been a Merc mechanic for 30+ years to go over everything. He confirmed pistons that had the bore for the wrist pin machined improperly.
Between my wife and I, we drove it about 30-40 miles yesterday and, at least FOR NOW (knock on wood), I couldn't be happier. The car is much quieter overall, and I don't just mean from the absence of piston slap. Maybe that alternator and/or water pump were making a little more noise than I thought.
Even my remote starter works like it did before (I was irrationally concerned with that coming back nonfunctional).
They didn't recommend any specific break-in procedure other than "no drag racing for about 1000 miles" but I'm going to get another 100 miles or so of stop-and-go, RPM-varying driving tonight before a 4 hour jaunt down to DC tomorrow.
Fingers crossed!
Between my wife and I, we drove it about 30-40 miles yesterday and, at least FOR NOW (knock on wood), I couldn't be happier. The car is much quieter overall, and I don't just mean from the absence of piston slap. Maybe that alternator and/or water pump were making a little more noise than I thought.
Even my remote starter works like it did before (I was irrationally concerned with that coming back nonfunctional).
They didn't recommend any specific break-in procedure other than "no drag racing for about 1000 miles" but I'm going to get another 100 miles or so of stop-and-go, RPM-varying driving tonight before a 4 hour jaunt down to DC tomorrow.
Fingers crossed!
01-12-2018, 11:58 AM
#37
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: Savannah, GA
Posts: 377
Received 96 Likes
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69 Posts
2010 W212 E550 4matic
Well, got my car back yesterday. It got new pistons, rings, wrist pins, connecting rods, chain tensioners, spark plugs, a whole litany of miscellaneous stuff (head gaskets, head bolts, 1,729 o-rings and seals, all that jive), as well as the alternator and front diff seal / alignment, plus they noticed the water pump was leaking, and they snapped off a bolt in the right exhaust manifold so they replaced those too. I sat down with the service manager (who is customer service, and NOT a car person) as well as the shop chief who's been a Merc mechanic for 30+ years to go over everything. He confirmed pistons that had the bore for the wrist pin machined improperly.
Between my wife and I, we drove it about 30-40 miles yesterday and, at least FOR NOW (knock on wood), I couldn't be happier. The car is much quieter overall, and I don't just mean from the absence of piston slap. Maybe that alternator and/or water pump were making a little more noise than I thought.
Even my remote starter works like it did before (I was irrationally concerned with that coming back nonfunctional).
They didn't recommend any specific break-in procedure other than "no drag racing for about 1000 miles" but I'm going to get another 100 miles or so of stop-and-go, RPM-varying driving tonight before a 4 hour jaunt down to DC tomorrow.
Fingers crossed!
Between my wife and I, we drove it about 30-40 miles yesterday and, at least FOR NOW (knock on wood), I couldn't be happier. The car is much quieter overall, and I don't just mean from the absence of piston slap. Maybe that alternator and/or water pump were making a little more noise than I thought.
Even my remote starter works like it did before (I was irrationally concerned with that coming back nonfunctional).
They didn't recommend any specific break-in procedure other than "no drag racing for about 1000 miles" but I'm going to get another 100 miles or so of stop-and-go, RPM-varying driving tonight before a 4 hour jaunt down to DC tomorrow.
Fingers crossed!
