Where is the in line 6?
06-20-2017, 08:05 AM
#1
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Where is the in line 6?
The new S450 aka base s class has debuted with "drumroll"....... the v6 3.0 TT! It seems the i6 has not worked out as expected.
06-20-2017, 09:41 AM
#3
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Its all a system.... My guess is that the I6 simply didn't prove to be any "better" than the v6, so why go through all the effort for marginal if any benefit? Furthermore, the I6 is simply space inefficient, given that cars are moving to hybrid motors any way, an engine that has the space footprint of a v12 does not seem the smartest choice.
06-20-2017, 12:03 PM
#4
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There are far greater benefits with a I6, the largest one being that it is perfectly balanced eliminating the need for heavy, expensive, loud and inefficient, balance shafts.
06-20-2017, 12:12 PM
#5
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Not to mention that there are NO belts or pulleys. I'm inclined to think that integrating the 48v electrical system (or exhausting existing 12v stock) is involved here. Been there, done that with inline 6s.
06-20-2017, 12:30 PM
#6
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It is also 40% longer! Thus a major packaging headache which is the reason almost no one uses them anymore despite being inherently balanced and cheaper to make.
06-20-2017, 12:49 PM
#7
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Dont know why you are so worried over space?, the engines are already finished and will end up in the 213 eventually.
Space lost lengthwise is gained in width, making more room for exhaust aftertreatments and ancillaries, and as mentioned above the external belt drive is also completely eliminated.
Space lost lengthwise is gained in width, making more room for exhaust aftertreatments and ancillaries, and as mentioned above the external belt drive is also completely eliminated.
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06-20-2017, 01:11 PM
#8
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Dont know why you are so worried over space?, the engines are already finished and will end up in the 213 eventually.
Space lost lengthwise is gained in width, making more room for exhaust aftertreatments and ancillaries, and as mentioned above the external belt drive is also completely eliminated.
Space lost lengthwise is gained in width, making more room for exhaust aftertreatments and ancillaries, and as mentioned above the external belt drive is also completely eliminated.
Just surprised that they would keep the V6 on their redesigned flagship, it would have been logical that it would be the place to start with the I6
06-20-2017, 04:40 PM
#10
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You seem to be taking it very personally and are concerned with demonizing something that everyone has been begging for for the last two decades. Why do you care so much?
06-20-2017, 05:27 PM
#11
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Thread Starter
Not perspnal at all. Just wondering if the i6 thing is going to be like the Honda V10 one. After years of development and being ready to go, in the end they just dropped it. The i6 on the other hand would be like the 2l 4 an engine they could drop in anything including trucks.
06-20-2017, 05:38 PM
#12
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The new I6 engines are not to be taken lightly, the OM656 predecessor OM642 has been around since 2005(!)
The V6 petrol M276 is younger, launched in 2010
New engines are developed during many years and cost millions, of course they wont drop it just like that.
The V6 petrol M276 is younger, launched in 2010
New engines are developed during many years and cost millions, of course they wont drop it just like that.
06-20-2017, 06:07 PM
#13
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Another thread based on misinformation. The I6 will roll out in Europe first of course, then other markets. There are no problems or issues with the I6. The rollout will take time as every Mercedes has a V6 somewhere in the model lineup.
The U.S. market will get the I6 for the 2019 MY in various vehicles.
M
The U.S. market will get the I6 for the 2019 MY in various vehicles.
M
06-20-2017, 07:58 PM
#14
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Another thread based on misinformation. The I6 will roll out in Europe first of course, then other markets. There are no problems or issues with the I6. The rollout will take time as every Mercedes has a V6 somewhere in the model lineup.
The U.S. market will get the I6 for the 2019 MY in various vehicles.
M
The U.S. market will get the I6 for the 2019 MY in various vehicles.
M
I think the main reason most of us are here is to be better informed....
06-20-2017, 09:55 PM
#15
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Germancar1, I am just curious, I may have missed your source of information on the Mercedes product in earlier threads , but a lot of your posts seem to start out with the same statements that folks are" misinformed". I think at this point you can probably leave that out and just state your opinion?
I think the main reason most of us are here is to be better informed....
I think the main reason most of us are here is to be better informed....
Sorry, I just hate misinformation. So many people here take something like this and then run and post it elsewhere and then it becomes fact in some people's mind. There are other forums that I can't link here where we get much better information. I guess I just wonder why people make some much out of nothing here? Like "Oh I don't see any of them on the road, so it isn't selling" Just because they didn't debut the I6 in the U.S. market S450 there has to be a problem? It's just silly IMO.
M
06-21-2017, 01:53 PM
#16
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Sorry, I just hate misinformation. So many people here take something like this and then run and post it elsewhere and then it becomes fact in some people's mind. There are other forums that I can't link here where we get much better information. I guess I just wonder why people make some much out of nothing here? Like "Oh I don't see any of them on the road, so it isn't selling" Just because they didn't debut the I6 in the U.S. market S450 there has to be a problem? It's just silly IMO.
M
M
You might be completely correct, indeed the authoritative tone you employ suggests you may well be, but you didn't give a source in this particular instance...
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06-21-2017, 04:28 PM
#17
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Do you realize that Mercedes rolls out engines first in Europe and then here?
Has anyone here read the press releases about the new engines that came wit the facelift S-Class?
This isn't even about sources, this is common sense.
No offense, but you guys seemingly don't know anything about Mercedes or how they operate.
This is such a non issue as to be a complete waste of a thread really. The engines were just introduced and haven't even been seen publicly yet.
That said, I too expected the 2018 U.S. market S450 to be the new I6, but it isn't. Doesn't mean there is a problem with the engine.
Perfect example of total nonsense:
Its all a system.... My guess is that the I6 simply didn't prove to be any "better" than the v6, so why go through all the effort for marginal if any benefit? Furthermore, the I6 is simply space inefficient, given that cars are moving to hybrid motors any way, an engine that has the space footprint of a v12 does not seem the smartest choice.
M
Last edited by Germancar1; 06-21-2017 at 04:33 PM.
06-21-2017, 04:53 PM
#19
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Originally Posted by davidjohnbamber
Having recently driven a S213 loaner for 3+ weeks, other than CAFE standards. Why doesn't M-B offer the V6 TT in the W213?
06-21-2017, 04:56 PM
#20
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06-21-2017, 05:20 PM
#21
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What I have read is that the I6 was to be out this Fall in the S class. If it is not in the S Class it's because have a problem. There is no other reason for the delay.
Secondly, the reason given for the I6 was that it is cheaper to build not because it is necessarily better. They are using the same architecture as the new I4 and that did not cost billions. The 48 volt system is where the big expense is. They are creating a new form of hybrid.
MB is reducing the number of propulsion systems they use and create greater fuel economy. Expect to see the 48 volt system in the I4 also in the near future. The V8 will eventually go the way of the dodo bird. Big displacements engines for more power are no longer necessary. Gas electric is the future. The BMW I8 is a good example of the future.
My source for most of this is like Germancar: it's a feeling.
Secondly, the reason given for the I6 was that it is cheaper to build not because it is necessarily better. They are using the same architecture as the new I4 and that did not cost billions. The 48 volt system is where the big expense is. They are creating a new form of hybrid.
MB is reducing the number of propulsion systems they use and create greater fuel economy. Expect to see the 48 volt system in the I4 also in the near future. The V8 will eventually go the way of the dodo bird. Big displacements engines for more power are no longer necessary. Gas electric is the future. The BMW I8 is a good example of the future.
My source for most of this is like Germancar: it's a feeling.
06-21-2017, 05:27 PM
#22
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What I have read is that the I6 was to be out this Fall in the S class. If it is not in the S Class it's because have a problem. There is no other reason for the delay.
Secondly, the reason given for the I6 was that it is cheaper to build not because it is necessarily better. They are using the same architecture as the new I4 and that did not cost billions. The 48 volt system is where the big expense is. They are creating a new form of hybrid.
MB is reducing the number of propulsion systems they use and create greater fuel economy. Expect to see the 48 volt system in the I4 also in the near future. The V8 will eventually go the way of the dodo bird. Big displacements engines for more power are no longer necessary. Gas electric is the future. The BMW I8 is a good example of the future.
My source for most of this is like Germancar: it's a feeling.
Secondly, the reason given for the I6 was that it is cheaper to build not because it is necessarily better. They are using the same architecture as the new I4 and that did not cost billions. The 48 volt system is where the big expense is. They are creating a new form of hybrid.
MB is reducing the number of propulsion systems they use and create greater fuel economy. Expect to see the 48 volt system in the I4 also in the near future. The V8 will eventually go the way of the dodo bird. Big displacements engines for more power are no longer necessary. Gas electric is the future. The BMW I8 is a good example of the future.
My source for most of this is like Germancar: it's a feeling.
And you know this how?
06-21-2017, 05:32 PM
#23
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Originally Posted by davidjohnbamber
My bad, I should have added sedan/coupe/cabriolet to my post.
06-21-2017, 05:57 PM
#24
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What I have read is that the I6 was to be out this Fall in the S class. If it is not in the S Class it's because have a problem. There is no other reason for the delay.
Secondly, the reason given for the I6 was that it is cheaper to build not because it is necessarily better. They are using the same architecture as the new I4 and that did not cost billions. The 48 volt system is where the big expense is. They are creating a new form of hybrid.
MB is reducing the number of propulsion systems they use and create greater fuel economy. Expect to see the 48 volt system in the I4 also in the near future. The V8 will eventually go the way of the dodo bird. Big displacements engines for more power are no longer necessary. Gas electric is the future. The BMW I8 is a good example of the future.
My source for most of this is like Germancar: it's a feeling.
Secondly, the reason given for the I6 was that it is cheaper to build not because it is necessarily better. They are using the same architecture as the new I4 and that did not cost billions. The 48 volt system is where the big expense is. They are creating a new form of hybrid.
MB is reducing the number of propulsion systems they use and create greater fuel economy. Expect to see the 48 volt system in the I4 also in the near future. The V8 will eventually go the way of the dodo bird. Big displacements engines for more power are no longer necessary. Gas electric is the future. The BMW I8 is a good example of the future.
My source for most of this is like Germancar: it's a feeling.
What you read is outdated. It has already been announced what is coming, it's a V6. What you read about the I6 coming to the U.S. wasn't official, but the part about the S450 V6 is OFFICIAL.
The I6 comes later. It's a simple as that. If there is a problem then prove it.
No feeling, its common sense. The I6 hasn't even been shown the public yet, that will happen at Frankurt and it will roll out from there which means sometime in 2018 for us. Same as with any new models that might debut at Frankfurt.
You guys are lost in misinformation.
M
06-22-2017, 10:11 AM
#25
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Is your source "common sense" or a "feeling". By the way the I6 was announced as being introduced in the S class for this Fall. If it's delayed, it's a problem. It was not a feeling that they would introduce it later. Common sense made them delay something that was not quite ready.
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