Eco On-Off and what I did about it
04-04-2018, 08:16 PM
#28
Super Member
09-20-2018, 05:58 PM
#29
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If any of you find it annoying to have to disable Eco mode every time you get into the vehicle, we make a solution to this issue. It is programmed to shut off Eco mode every time you start the vehicle, but the Eco function can be turned on and resumed at any time. Lots of satisfied customers. Check it out!
8 Second Demo Video Here!
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Compatibility
ECO205
C Class sedan 2015-2018
C Class coupe 2016-2018
GLC 2015-2018
E Class 2017-2018
ECO212
C Class sedan 2012-2014
C Class coupe 2012-2015
CLA 2015-2018
CLS 2013-2018
E Class 2012-2016
G Wagon 2014-2018
GLK 2012-2015
GL 2012-2016
GLE 2016-2018
GLS 2016-2018
GLA 2015-2018
ML 2012-2015
Metris 2016-2018
SL 2013-2018
SLK 2012-2016
ECO222
S Class 2014-2018
GT S 2014-2018
ECO221
S Class 2012-2013
CL 2012-2013
8 Second Demo Video Here!
PURCHASE YOURS HERE!
Also, use coupon code MBWSEP10 for 10% off your purchase made in the month of September 2018!
Compatibility
ECO205
C Class sedan 2015-2018
C Class coupe 2016-2018
GLC 2015-2018
E Class 2017-2018
ECO212
C Class sedan 2012-2014
C Class coupe 2012-2015
CLA 2015-2018
CLS 2013-2018
E Class 2012-2016
G Wagon 2014-2018
GLK 2012-2015
GL 2012-2016
GLE 2016-2018
GLS 2016-2018
GLA 2015-2018
ML 2012-2015
Metris 2016-2018
SL 2013-2018
SLK 2012-2016
ECO222
S Class 2014-2018
GT S 2014-2018
ECO221
S Class 2012-2013
CL 2012-2013
09-20-2018, 07:36 PM
#30
MBWorld Fanatic!
Can you please stop thread spamming?!
The following users liked this post:
The_Judge (09-21-2018)
10-02-2018, 12:46 PM
#31
Junior Member
I did not read the whole thread, but I agree that start stop will wear out the starter no matter if it's designed to do that. There are more than that:
1) You wear out the engine. Think of this, engine needs oil to stay between the moving surface to prevent wear. Oil is circulated by oil pump to spray onto the surface of the moving parts. Oil pump is driven by the engine. BUT if the engine stops, pump stops, oil no longer circulating and drip down to the oil pan. So when the engine starts, the first few seconds, oil is no getting to the surface of the moving parts.
This is somewhat like when you first start the engine cold. The difference is you first start the engine cold, you don't step on the gas, you let it run at idle for a few seconds before you put in gear and slowly back out ( you absolutely should wait at least 20 seconds after cold start before you even touch the gas pedal!!). But in a start stop situation. The engine only start when you step on the gas to go. You don't give any time for the oil to pump back up. This is really bad for the engine.
Of cause, oil won't drip down totally and is warm under this start stop condition like the cold start in the morning. But it is still true that the oil stop circulating as soon as you stop the engine and it will take a few seconds to pump the oil back up.
I read there were study that a bigger portion of the engine wear is the first few seconds on the cold start because of the reason described. That's why it's important NOT to step on the gas the moment the engine start from cold. BUT remember even warm start like this, you do it 30 or 40 times a day, the wear is going to add up. In my 40 years of driving, commuting long distance. ALL my cars lasted over 200K miles, never have an engine wear out. Only thing I do is wait 10 second after start no matter what, never rev the engine when first start, change oil every 3000miles ( regular oil).
2) if you are in hot weather, or even sunny days, the interior of the car gets hot when the engine stops.
BTW, what other things this unit can do?
1) You wear out the engine. Think of this, engine needs oil to stay between the moving surface to prevent wear. Oil is circulated by oil pump to spray onto the surface of the moving parts. Oil pump is driven by the engine. BUT if the engine stops, pump stops, oil no longer circulating and drip down to the oil pan. So when the engine starts, the first few seconds, oil is no getting to the surface of the moving parts.
This is somewhat like when you first start the engine cold. The difference is you first start the engine cold, you don't step on the gas, you let it run at idle for a few seconds before you put in gear and slowly back out ( you absolutely should wait at least 20 seconds after cold start before you even touch the gas pedal!!). But in a start stop situation. The engine only start when you step on the gas to go. You don't give any time for the oil to pump back up. This is really bad for the engine.
Of cause, oil won't drip down totally and is warm under this start stop condition like the cold start in the morning. But it is still true that the oil stop circulating as soon as you stop the engine and it will take a few seconds to pump the oil back up.
I read there were study that a bigger portion of the engine wear is the first few seconds on the cold start because of the reason described. That's why it's important NOT to step on the gas the moment the engine start from cold. BUT remember even warm start like this, you do it 30 or 40 times a day, the wear is going to add up. In my 40 years of driving, commuting long distance. ALL my cars lasted over 200K miles, never have an engine wear out. Only thing I do is wait 10 second after start no matter what, never rev the engine when first start, change oil every 3000miles ( regular oil).
2) if you are in hot weather, or even sunny days, the interior of the car gets hot when the engine stops.
BTW, what other things this unit can do?
Last edited by Alan0354; 10-02-2018 at 12:50 PM.
10-02-2018, 01:04 PM
#32
Junior Member
This is unrelated to the topic:
Good engineers design things to last forever...........
Great engineers design things that last.......until the end of the warranty!!!
If you look at Consumer Reports, Audi, BMW and Subaru have the best engineers, there cars have very good reliability the first 4 years. Then most gone to hell, particular major engine and other major components problems. Great cars for leasing, not for keeping.
Good engineers design things to last forever...........
Great engineers design things that last.......until the end of the warranty!!!
If you look at Consumer Reports, Audi, BMW and Subaru have the best engineers, there cars have very good reliability the first 4 years. Then most gone to hell, particular major engine and other major components problems. Great cars for leasing, not for keeping.
Last edited by Alan0354; 10-02-2018 at 01:11 PM.
10-03-2018, 01:09 PM
#33
Let me play devils advocate.....
Since the engine stops running with Eco/st/sp on, the engine is not moving anymore so won’t the engine wear out LESS over time and last longer???
A kind of similar analogy is for automatic watches NOT to be kept in a watch winder because your actually running the watch constantly.
Also besides the starter motor needing to be replaced sooner, what ELSE is going to wear out from starting the engine 100x a day???
Since the engine stops running with Eco/st/sp on, the engine is not moving anymore so won’t the engine wear out LESS over time and last longer???
A kind of similar analogy is for automatic watches NOT to be kept in a watch winder because your actually running the watch constantly.
Also besides the starter motor needing to be replaced sooner, what ELSE is going to wear out from starting the engine 100x a day???
10-03-2018, 01:18 PM
#34
MBWorld Fanatic!
I've kept some of my cars well over 10 years and 200,000 miles. I have never had to replace a starter or have work done that required opening the engine. The most serious engine work has been renewing pan and valve cover gaskets, a trivial task.
10-03-2018, 01:25 PM
#35
Junior Member
Let me play devils advocate.....
Since the engine stops running with Eco/st/sp on, the engine is not moving anymore so won’t the engine wear out LESS over time and last longer???
A kind of similar analogy is for automatic watches NOT to be kept in a watch winder because your actually running the watch constantly.
Also besides the starter motor needing to be replaced sooner, what ELSE is going to wear out from starting the engine 100x a day???
Since the engine stops running with Eco/st/sp on, the engine is not moving anymore so won’t the engine wear out LESS over time and last longer???
A kind of similar analogy is for automatic watches NOT to be kept in a watch winder because your actually running the watch constantly.
Also besides the starter motor needing to be replaced sooner, what ELSE is going to wear out from starting the engine 100x a day???
read my post, I gave very detail explanation on oil circuilation. That's where it counts, if the engine oil is well circulate, very little wear. Just like it's a myth to baby the car, never step on it hard. Bigger part of the wear of the engine is the first few seconds after start because the oil stop circulating when the engine stops.
10-03-2018, 01:51 PM
#36
Not true, When I first got my Rolex, I tried to keep it running less, if I don't wear it during the weekdays, I put it away and it stopped. That lasted less than 3 years and I had to bring it in. After that, I let it run 24/7, lasted 20 years before I had to bring it in.
read my post, I gave very detail explanation on oil circuilation. That's where it counts, if the engine oil is well circulate, very little wear. Just like it's a myth to baby the car, never step on it hard. Bigger part of the wear of the engine is the first few seconds after start because the oil stop circulating when the engine stops.
read my post, I gave very detail explanation on oil circuilation. That's where it counts, if the engine oil is well circulate, very little wear. Just like it's a myth to baby the car, never step on it hard. Bigger part of the wear of the engine is the first few seconds after start because the oil stop circulating when the engine stops.
i agree with the morning start up not having oil in the cylinder, but not when the engine is already warm, so your saying in the 30sec-1min oil in the cylinders flows down and doesn’t protect the cylinders for next fire up?
10-03-2018, 02:14 PM
#37
MBWorld Fanatic!
an interesting link straight from daimler about the ECO start / stop "feature":
Under the microscope: ECO start/stop: Sophisticated technology gives the highest levels of efficiency
my concerns... so the tranny has an electric oil pump for the swift resumption of oil pressure, but not the engine? also... the starter is designed to cope with only eight times as many start/stop cycles?
On one of my commutes home one time, just out of curiosity, I left the feature on and tried to count the stop/start cycles (CA rush hour, 24 miles total, 18 miles on CA freeway). I stopped counting at 118 cycles - too many stop - move forward 10 feet - stop, movements to keep counting. This is pretty normal traffic for my commute. There and back that would be over 1000 stop/start cycles in one week, much more than eight times as many cycles they state the system is designed to cope with. No way that wouldn't have a long-term impact on durability of engine and starter - at least for my tastes.
then there's the shudder when it restarts...
like someone posted above, mb wants to sell / market ECO start / stop as a "feature" - but it's not imo, only meant as a tool to help mb meet mandated fuel efficiency standards...
Under the microscope: ECO start/stop: Sophisticated technology gives the highest levels of efficiency
An additional electric transmission oil pump supplies the clutches of the automatic transmission with oil pressure prior to starting, so as to enable a swift resumption of the journey after direct starting of the combustion engine via the ECO start/stop function. The starter motor (starter) has also undergone thorough modification: it is now designed to cope with eight times as many starting procedures, ensuring that it will last a car's lifetime in continuous urban driving involving frequent auto-starting. - daimler
On one of my commutes home one time, just out of curiosity, I left the feature on and tried to count the stop/start cycles (CA rush hour, 24 miles total, 18 miles on CA freeway). I stopped counting at 118 cycles - too many stop - move forward 10 feet - stop, movements to keep counting. This is pretty normal traffic for my commute. There and back that would be over 1000 stop/start cycles in one week, much more than eight times as many cycles they state the system is designed to cope with. No way that wouldn't have a long-term impact on durability of engine and starter - at least for my tastes.
then there's the shudder when it restarts...
like someone posted above, mb wants to sell / market ECO start / stop as a "feature" - but it's not imo, only meant as a tool to help mb meet mandated fuel efficiency standards...
10-03-2018, 03:46 PM
#38
Junior Member
an interesting link straight from daimler about the ECO start / stop "feature":
Under the microscope: ECO start/stop: Sophisticated technology gives the highest levels of efficiency
Under the microscope: ECO start/stop: Sophisticated technology gives the highest levels of efficiency
Their safety rating is below the others also. That's why you don't see much of Chrysler on the road.
Last edited by Alan0354; 10-03-2018 at 03:49 PM.
10-03-2018, 03:48 PM
#39
Junior Member
10-03-2018, 10:54 PM
#40
MBWorld Fanatic!
...you do realize daimler makes mercedes-benz, right?
10-03-2018, 11:55 PM
#41
Junior Member
They don't run MB. MB E class is consistently above average reliability. M is at least average. Mercedes has very high safety test score, one of if not the the highest safety testing score. The roof strength is like 5 to 6 times the weight of the car. Much better than Audi, BMW, Lexus. I did a lot of research before I bought MB. When buying SUV, this is about the most important thing.
Most of the problems of MB is electronics issues. I track the reliability report of all cars since the 90s. I still have all the car issues of Consumer Reports since the 90s ( some where!!).
That's the main reason it swayed me from Porsche Macane and Cayenne. They are Audi Q5 and Q7 resp. The roof strength barely passed ( around 3 to 4 times the weight of the car instead of 5 to 6 times like MB).
You check Chrysler, their safety is less than good.
Most of the problems of MB is electronics issues. I track the reliability report of all cars since the 90s. I still have all the car issues of Consumer Reports since the 90s ( some where!!).
That's the main reason it swayed me from Porsche Macane and Cayenne. They are Audi Q5 and Q7 resp. The roof strength barely passed ( around 3 to 4 times the weight of the car instead of 5 to 6 times like MB).
You check Chrysler, their safety is less than good.
Last edited by Alan0354; 10-04-2018 at 12:06 AM.
10-04-2018, 12:05 AM
#42
MBWorld Fanatic!
what? not sure what you mean... the link i posted has nothing to do with chrysler - mb is a division of daimler, in other words, daimler owns mb... so... they kinda do run mb... based on your response to my daimler link on the mb eco start / stop system asking "Look at the Consummer (sic) Report reliability of Chrysler cars?" i just wasn't sure if you were aware that daimler owns / runs / etc. mb - so the link i posted details the mb eco start / stop system.
10-04-2018, 12:18 AM
#43
Junior Member
That's interesting, I did a little digging, here's an article:https://www.quora.com/When-did-Chrys...nz-and-to-whom
MB and Chrysler never have anything in common. Now Chrysler is more with Fiat. Yes, I can believe it, both are at the bottom of the pile in reliability and safety.
MB and Chrysler never have anything in common. Now Chrysler is more with Fiat. Yes, I can believe it, both are at the bottom of the pile in reliability and safety.
10-04-2018, 12:19 AM
#44
I disagree - my Jun 18 W213, the start/stop takes effect immediately. Just this morning, I started my car for the first time today to move it 20 yards to my other parking space but after I pulled up to the space with the intention of reversing in, the engine stopped/started when I braked to shift it into reverse. As the car had only been running for 10 seconds, I doubt it's engine temp was at "working temp". Btw, ambient temperature here today is 25 Deg C. I see this behavior every morning when I drive to work as I have to stop my car to make a left turn out of my residence. It's always at that turn with my foot on the brake that the stop/start occurs which reminds me to deactivate it.
10-04-2018, 12:28 AM
#45
MBWorld Fanatic!
That's interesting, I did a little digging, here's an article:https://www.quora.com/When-did-Chrys...nz-and-to-whom
MB and Chrysler never have anything in common. Now Chrysler is more with Fiat. Yes, I can believe it, both are at the bottom of the pile in reliability and safety.
MB and Chrysler never have anything in common. Now Chrysler is more with Fiat. Yes, I can believe it, both are at the bottom of the pile in reliability and safety.
daimler and benz merged way back in 1924, and daimler has owned / run / etc. mb ever since...
Daimler AG's origin is in an Agreement of Mutual Interest signed on 1 May 1924 between Benz & Cie (founded 1883 by Karl Benz) and Daimler Motoren Gesellschaft (founded 1890 by Gottlieb Daimler and Wilhelm Maybach).
Both companies continued to manufacture their separate automobile and internal combustion engine brands until, on 28 June 1926, Benz & Cie. and Daimler otoren Gesellschaft AG formally merged—becoming Daimler-Benz AG—and agreed that, thereafter, all of the factories would use the brand name of Mercedes-Benz on their automobiles. - wiki
Both companies continued to manufacture their separate automobile and internal combustion engine brands until, on 28 June 1926, Benz & Cie. and Daimler otoren Gesellschaft AG formally merged—becoming Daimler-Benz AG—and agreed that, thereafter, all of the factories would use the brand name of Mercedes-Benz on their automobiles. - wiki
Last edited by PatrixUSA; 10-04-2018 at 12:32 AM.
10-04-2018, 12:41 AM
#46
MBWorld Fanatic!
I disagree - my Jun 18 W213, the start/stop takes effect immediately. Just this morning, I started my car for the first time today to move it 20 yards to my other parking space but after I pulled up to the space with the intention of reversing in, the engine stopped/started when I braked to shift it into reverse. As the car had only been running for 10 seconds, I doubt it's engine temp was at "working temp". Btw, ambient temperature here today is 25 Deg C. I see this behavior every morning when I drive to work as I have to stop my car to make a left turn out of my residence. It's always at that turn with my foot on the brake that the stop/start occurs which reminds me to deactivate it.
Preconditions for the ECO start/stop function
It is not always expedient for the engine to be shut down automatically when the vehicle comes to a standstill. The auto-stop function will therefore only be initiated if a number of conditions are met:
1. The combustion engine must have attained the necessary operating parameters (e.g. the minimum coolant temperature). - daimler
It is not always expedient for the engine to be shut down automatically when the vehicle comes to a standstill. The auto-stop function will therefore only be initiated if a number of conditions are met:
1. The combustion engine must have attained the necessary operating parameters (e.g. the minimum coolant temperature). - daimler
10-04-2018, 12:52 AM
#47
Junior Member
you gotta do better "digging" - as chrylser never owned mb to sell, as your quora link would suggest... "When did Chrysler sell Mercedes Benz and to whom?"
daimler and benz merged way back in 1924, and daimler has owned / run / etc. mb ever since...
...too many off-topic exchanges short - no one posted mb and chrysler have anything in common - the daimler link i posted about the eco start / stop system has nothing to do with chrysler...
daimler and benz merged way back in 1924, and daimler has owned / run / etc. mb ever since...
...too many off-topic exchanges short - no one posted mb and chrysler have anything in common - the daimler link i posted about the eco start / stop system has nothing to do with chrysler...
10-04-2018, 02:03 AM
#49
Junior Member
I hate the Eco off. On my BMW 550 you barely noticed the restart but there’s a definite shudder with the MB.
i have resigned myself to having one more “action” in the start up procedure
Foot on brake
Start engine
Put phone on charger
Click seatbelt
Select gear
Select sport mode
Turn off Eco start
Lift off
.....no wonder I’m always late....
i have resigned myself to having one more “action” in the start up procedure
Foot on brake
Start engine
Put phone on charger
Click seatbelt
Select gear
Select sport mode
Turn off Eco start
Lift off
.....no wonder I’m always late....
10-04-2018, 03:20 AM
#50
Junior Member
^ ^ english is not your native language? - no sweat... just attempting to clarify my link did not have any association with chrysler... back on topic...
