TundraRoads

We were going to trade in our ML30 last spring but weren't overly thrilled with the offerings. MB had nothing for electric or even hybrid. Volvo XC90 was nice but a bit too small. Porsche dealer offended my wife by constantly talking to me when she's the one buying the car (and she knows a good bit about them). Model X was still kind of new, expensive, and having some new model issues. So, we pushed a decision off until now. She's also decided that she wants to skip hybrid and get an all electric (two friends w/ Tesla's and one with a Bolt).

We accidentally got to look at a Jag i-Pace and liked it but it won't have the cargo space she wants for her gardening stuff and it's still a few months out.

Audi will have the e-tron Quatro in 2018.

BMW i-5 in 2018.

Still nothing from MB :-(. Possibly something in 2019.

She wants to pull the trigger on a Model X. I'm thinking wait until 2018 to see what else happens with electrics.

BobBass

Don't know how you feel about "Consumer Reports," but they rate it VERY low in the "Luxury midsized sport-utility vehicles" category:

90
2017 Audi
Q7
Recommended
$49,000 - $55,500

81
2017 Lexus
RX
Recommended
$43,120 - $56,495

79
2017 Lexus
RX
Recommended
$43,120 - $56,495

76
2017 GMC
Acadia
Recommended
$29,070 - $47,070

75
2017 Lexus
GX
Recommended
$51,680 - $63,380

73
2017 Acura
MDX
Recommended
$44,050 - $58,500

72
2017 Porsche
Cayenne
Recommended
$59,600 - $159,600

72
2017 BMW
X5
Recommended
$56,600 - $100,700

68
2017 Mercedes-Benz
GLE
$52,000 - $110,650
Alert

66
2017 Lincoln
MKX
$38,260 - $55,970

65
2017 Volvo
XC90
$45,750 - $104,900
Alert

65
2017 Infiniti
QX60
$43,100 - $44,900

60
2017 Infiniti
QX70
$45,850 - $47,650

58
2017 Tesla
Model X
$82,500 - $145,000
Alert

58
2017 Land Rover
Range Rover
$85,650 - $199,950

55
2017 Land Rover
Range Rover Sport
$65,650 - $111,350

Crispin

Tesla is all sizzle and no steak.

They had a lead. It is pretty much gone at this point.

You are right to wait. Good luck convincing the wife of that.

PeterUbers

Tesla has worked through many electric "issues" and have tons of experience with electric vehicles compared to any other possible future competitors

why not get the model X? I don't care for its looks too much but it's wicked fast and has tons of tech

JohnnyC

Tesla, unexciting, bland, and expensive. Those falcon wing doors are something that nobody wanted, but they stuck in there anyways. If you get in a minor collision, the repair bill will be extreme. Very low aftermarket accessories.

And i don't get the love affair with straight line acceleration. Cool bro you know how to step on a gas pedal to the floor.

I am pretty hyped about the i5, BMW is seriously pouring vast resources into electric with the i8 and i3 projects.

Wookii

Tesla, the gadgets wear off fast, and what your left with is a fast expensive econobox. It is far far far from being a luxury car. Go back to Porsche.

BulldogGLE

Looks/design of the model X is horrible IMO............

BobBass

Again, from "CR":

HIGHS
Doesn't consume a drop of fuel
Long range for an EV
The only electric SUV
Relatively quick charging
Ability to use Tesla's supercharging network
Opening the rear doors is a show stopper
Quick and effortless acceleration
One of the more sporty-driving SUVs
Large touch screen is relatively easy to use
Never needs an oil change

LOWS
Rather expensive
All door openings are fussy, requiring patience
Reliability concerns regarding falcon wing doors
Hampered visibility
Overly firm ride
Pronounced wind noise
Too much brightness can come through the huge windshield
Could use some buttons and knobs

DarrenK

After my GLE 550e was totaled, and I could not replace it, I looked around for several months for a replacement. After a lot of discussion, and a 24 hour VIP test drive (it was more like a whole weekend) I pulled the trigger on a Model X. I don't regret it at all. I understand some of the issues raised here, but the bigger picture is what I saw. Certainly, when it comes to luxury, the Model X does not compete with the GLE, at least a fully loaded one. However, I absolutely love it. And while the car may not be as luxurious as MB, the treatment you get at most stores and service centers (they don't have dealers) rivals every luxury car I have owned. Tesla is a new company, and they definitely are having growing pains.

Quite simply compared to my GLE, the X is a joy to drive. I am a tech and gadget guy, so I love everything about the car. Close or open all the doors and the rear hatch from the control screen? Yes. Homelink doesn't just memorize my garage door opener code, it is GPS linked. As I approach my garage, the door opens. When I leave, it closes. Likewise, the seat settings are easy to do. You just make a profile, and then it will save your seat position, mirror position, etc. And as a bonus, anytime you make an adjustment it asks you if you want to save the updated position. Just tap "save" on the screen and viola! You can also hit "restore" if you made the adjustment by accident, or you were just moving something temporarily, and it goes back to the previous setting.

Another thing I like is the actual distance readout to objects. I actually backed my GLE into a wall despite the rear camera, because in my work garage I was just unable to judge where the back bumper was. The Tesla actually gives you the distance in inches (until you get to 12 inches and then it says STOP...lol)

Storage space in my 5 seater is immense. Including the front trunk it is 88 cubic feet with the middle seat folded flat. Mostly due to no gas tank, no transmission, no engine, etc.

And keep in mind that Tesla has NO REQUIRED MAINTENANCE. They have recommended maintenance, but it is just that, only a recommendation. The warranty specifically states that failure to perform the maintenance doe not affect the warranty. try that with MB. Or Audi, or Porsche. And because they don't have stealerships, they don't push you for repairs or other items because their service centers are not profit centers. Cost to own is way less than any other high end car. And in my city, there are free high speed chargers scattered around. I have only had to plug in at home about two times in two months. And don't forget the supercharger network for long distance travel. Works great.

Now, there are cons. Like I said, not as luxurious as my MB. My seats are actually softer then the MB leather seats (although I loved my saddle brown). But they are comfy. YOu can't get massaging seats. Nor can you adjust the front seat bottom length, or the side bolsters. There is no surround view system for ensuring you are inside the lines when you park. There are no coat hooks! The glovebox is small, and there is no center armrest storage (but there are cupholders there). There is storage in the center console between the driver and the passenger however. For obvious reasons there is no storage space on the Falcon Wing doors (since they open up, things would fall out!) Also, some of the tech is not as straightforward as it should be. For instance, the bluetooth setup is entered by touching the small bluetooth icon on the screen. I spent a good deal of time looking for it in the setting menu. But it is a one time thing, and once set, you can forget about it. Same for linking to your home wifi for OTA updates. It was a little hard to find, but only needs to be done once.

Price is also a con, let's be honest. However, when I thought long and hard about the lack of maintenance (no belts hoses, spark plugs, transmission fluid, oil changes, scheduled maintenance (how much is that per service for A and then B?) and the longevity (Tesla warranties the battery for 8 years or 125000 miles) I bit the bullet. Current owners report less than 5% battery degradation in the first four years. And with regenerative braking, the pads see very little wear. I ran into a 2013 Model S owner with 100K miles on his car, who was still on his original brake pads. All he ever had to do to the car in 4 years was replace the tires. (I didn't ask about a brake fluid flush...I should have)

For me, the pros outweighed the cons, and I am very happy with my decision. Like I said, do a 24 hour test drive, and whatever decision you make will be the right one for you!

N.B. When I first got into the tesla, it somehow seemed familiar. that is when I noticed that the control stalks on the steering wheel, and the window controls and mirror controls were identical to my MB! Apparently Tesla and MB had a partnership, and Tesla still sources some parts from the same suppliers as MB.

BACnMercedes

I totally agree with this statement but I have an even bigger problem, range anxiety and no infrastructure to handle it.

Miki-SL500

LOL, name one electric car that compares to Tesla... Tesla is ten years ahead of the competition.

jester1

"..those falcon wing doors are something that nobody wanted."


I'm trying to picture pulling into our 2 car garage with my wife's car already in there & now next to it.I go to open the car door.
How do I avoid hitting my wife's car?If the overhead garage door is still open,reducing available vertical space,wouldn't the car door hit the garage door over it?

skw

There's sensors on the doors and they adjust how the doors open. We test drove one last year and they do work as advertised. Pricing is what kept us from pulling the trigger.

jester1

That answered my question.

BulldogGLE

The mall parking lots will get even more interesting with those gimmicky lambo doors!

robroper

I believe all Tesla are a bit over 77 inches wide. That's too wide for a lot of garages & parking spaces.

GLE43_Sube

Here are some dimensions. The Tesla X is almost 6 inches wider than the GLE43. I prefer to enter my garage with the mirrors folded "out", because I use them as a guide to indicate if I'm centered. It's a tight fit with my car. The Tesla would be EXTREMELY tight.

2.129 meters = 83.81 inches

Steve Radich

Do an overnight test drive or something if they'll offer, and test drive it right before signing paperwork..

i find the seats completely unsatisfactory and probably selling mine in less than 2 weeks. I rented one and liked it, still trying to find what could be different..

TundraRoads

Well, still in deciding mode though some recent problems with ML350 transmission that Mercedes can’t figure out may push the decision much sooner.

One recent change is the addition of the Mercedes EQC. Dealer said that they’ll have one for us in early summer which is concerning because everything we could find on it said later 2018 or early 2019. Doesn’t inspire confidence in our dealer’s sales folks.

Range anxiety appears to be a non-issue. We now know 9 people with electric cars (5 Tesla, 2 Nissan, 2 Bolt) and all have said that there are no range issues. The earlier Nissan’s and Volts were kind of short on range but all new one’s have enough range for any normal day of driving. All have mentioned waking up with a full tank of fuel every morning is a big plus. As well, we've never met a dissatisfied Tesla owner. All say they'll never buy anything else.

Long distance trips (several have done 2000 mile trips to Florida and AZ) is a cinch with Tesla but getting easier and better with the others as more charging stations appear.

Some thoughts in no particular order

Mercedes Pluses:
- GLE is more luxurious, smoother riding and seemingly quieter than X. This may be the deciding factor for my wife and may trump all other issues.

X Pluses:

- X is smoother in some ways due to electric vs gas engine. X suspension seems a little harsher though.
- X is much quieter when driving slower or on smooth roads but noisier on highway or rough roads.
- Not having to stop at gas stations. No smelly hands, no taking 15 minutes to stop and fill up when you’re already late. This is very appealing.
- Altruistically, not using gas/oil and not adding to pollution.
- Remote control. Being able to start the heater or A/C or set it to be pre-warmed/cooled at a certain time is really nice.
- Being able to leave the heat on during snow. Went to lunch with a friend yesterday. While everyone else was having to scrap ice and snow from their windows, her X was completely clear (and warm inside).
- Summon. It pulls out of parking spaces which makes it much easier to get in.
- Maps are always up to date. They are updated continuously.
- Routine software updates (take place overnight) add features.
- Navigation is much better than Mercedes and improves with updates. Or at least better than ML350’s. Rumors that it will have Waze by this summer!
- Always starts. The much simpler drivetrain requires less maintenance and is, theoretically, much more reliable. Given recent ML3550 issues this is very appealing.
- More cargo space. No fuel tank, engine or transmission so there’s even storage in the Frunk. Not sure how useful that would really be though.
- X can be warmed up while in garage. And no fumes in garage.

Other Thoughts:

- Resale value? There has been a very noticeable decline in resale values for cars that compete with the S as people want an S much more than competitors. Will the same happen with SUV’s that compete with the X? How will the resale value of a GLE be affected by all of the electric SUV’s, including the EQC, coming out?

- Gas Stations? One near us recently closed and said in an article that it was because of all the electric cars (we do seem to have a bunch in our immediate area). I find that hard to believe and think it was more that the place always seemed dirty and gross to go in so people preferred to go elsewhere. However, if electric cars do catch on, will gas stations become harder to find?

GLE43_Sube

https://mbworld.org/forums/gle43-cou...-tutorial.html

Which one to buy is a personal decision. I can only speak on my opinion. That doesn't make me right or wrong. It's just how I feel. Here are my feelings:

• Range and the availability of charging stations is a major concern for me. Charging stations may be plentiful in large, metropolitan areas. But I don't want my travels determined by where I can charge my car.
• Quietness might be a plus for some, but the exhaust sound was one of the reasons I bought my AMG Coupe.
• Lifespan of the batteries is another concern for me. ALL rechargeable batteries reduce their charge capacity with repeated discharge/charge cycles. Two years from now you likely won't get the same range as the day you drove off the dealer's lot.
• Cost of replacement batteries is something I never hear discussed. We all know they can't be cheap.

TundraRoads

Some of my concerns as well. Here's what I've learned so far;

Every Tesla owner we've talked with (a lot) has said that range is a complete non-issue. The car charges overnight at home and starts each day w/ 300 miles of range. There are enough Tesla superchargers now to reach anywhere in the lower 48 and some bits of Canada. Tesla has also given thousands (tens of thousands now?) of their standard chargers to hotels, restaurants and other businesses to install. Tesla can apparently also use any other car charger available.

My wife likes quiet. I can't get enough of listening to the thump thump thump of the V8 in our boat and there's nothing like a McLaren. BTW, we went to the Formula E races in NYC this past summer. Really strange compared to F1 that I've been a big fan of for most of my life. Reminded me of the hover scooter races in Star Wars so I was sure Jabba-the-hut was around somewhere. OTOH, the torque and speed of Tesla's totally blows any non-racing car I've ever been in. Performance vs sound? :-)

There have been several articles on longevity of the batteries. In general they seem to loose 5-7% over the first 100k miles and 3-5% over the next 100k. This would certainly be usage dependent but the best data so far are for Taxi's in use in LA and Amsterdam which have gone through thousands of full charge cycles which is apparently much worse for the batteries than the shorter charge cycles most of us will use so this doesn't seem to be an issue.

My understanding is that the current replacement cost of a 100kWh Tesla battery is $21k. That's a lot but if it's only needed after 200-400k miles then maybe not so bad. The cost of batteries is also declining so future replacement cost shouldn't be as high.

TundraRoads

More thoughts... We've been driving a new fully loaded GLE for the past week while we're waiting on them to figure out the problem with our ML30. Very good way to know the good, bad and ugly.

+ I like the new screen control and especially the trackpad. Tesla has a touchscreen which seems like it would be a bit more difficult to use while driving.
- Logo puddle lites don't provide much illumination. Very cool, but some light to see would be appreciated.
- Maps/POI are out of date (though dealer says they're the most recent available). Restaurants & roads that have been around for 2 years are still not listed. Tesla is easier since it is Google based so just begin typing the name and the place pops up including brand new places or streets.
- Pre-heating requires starting the engine and having it running for a while spitting out pollution.
+ Remotely pre-heat seats and steering wheel.
- Connection to MBrace is very spotty. Will only connect about 2 or 3 out of 5 attempts.

Tesla:
+ Traffic based navigation. Our GLE shows traffic but doesn't seem to use it for navigation like Waze or Google?
+ Electric opening/closing front doors. I don't much care for them but my wife fell in love.
+ Can pre-heat or cool without starting an engine
- Cannot pre-heat the seats or steering wheel.

peter2772000

Tundra, I believe you may have made a believer out of me.

I have a client who had bought an X and was less than impressed with it, but that was when it first came out. Complained about the doors, among other things. Ended up trading it in for the newest S. $235k CAN. Nuts man.

I recently sold my company car, a 2014 Grand Cherokee SRT. Been driving my good ole FJ Cruiser while deciding what to get. Had my heart set on the awd S, but there's no way I'm spending a quarter of a million dollars on something that will be driven on salty roads every winter, just not happening.

Yep, the X is lookin' mighty purdy right now....

DarrenK

Peter,

Definitely do a VIP test drive. Try to arrange it for a weekend so you can have it for an extended period. Also, Tundra did not point out that the electric doors can be used manually if you wish when closing from inside or exiting (there is a pull handle).

Some cool features that I like about the Tesla that Tundra did not mention are:

Configurable dash screen. There are multiple options for what you can view on the right and left side of the speedometer. Choices include Current Music selection (with album art), tire pressure, trip meters (and you can select which ones show up), clock, energy usage, and navigation. I trhink there is a spot reserved for future use as well.

Voice command of music. There are some cool things you can do, including directly asking for a particular song or artist. Every Tesla comes with a free slacker account. So for instance you can say "Play All About That Bass" by Meghan Trainor and it will play. You don't have to have it saved on your phone or on a card or chip. It will also set up a station with similar songs or artists, which you can save or not save. There are also tons of podcasts. For a while I was listening to "Car Talk" every night (they have a ton of episodes) but now I have been listening to a daily news podcast on my way home. You can also manually search for stuff, but it's best to be stopped, or have a passenger do it. It is amazing to be able to find just about any (but not all) piece of music on demand. You do need a cellular signal to get all these (so it may not work in a parking garage underground, etc.) but the car comes with a free data connection (at least for the first 4 years I think).

The large screen in the center can be split into two screens. This allows you to have the nav screen and music or phone screen or whatever (I keep an energy chart up) you want up at the same time. But you can also make stuff full screen. The relative positions can also be swapped. The rear view camera can also be turned on any time.

The center console is also a touch screen. That means you can pinch and zoom the nav map at will quite easily. My GLE you had to use the wheel by the touchpad, IIRC, and it was not super responsive. Plus you have more granular control over the increments of zooming. Mercedes limits you to their preset settings.

Also, with regards to the touchpad in the GLE, as a lefty, it was pretty much impossible for me to use. The Tesla pops up a keyboard which I can use with my right hand. I can also pinch and zoom on the screen with that hand.

Tesla's Autopilot and Mercedes Drive Pilot are very similar. Autopilot is better, and is continually getting better. I liked Drive Pilot a lot. Autopilot is Drive Pilot on steroids. And it is continually getting updated. Plus, you can change lanes by turning the blinker on. The car actually knows if there is something that would make the lane change unsafe, and won't go unless the way is clear.

Tesla also shares the "Hold" feature that the GLE has, meaning if while stopped you press the brake hard, the car will stay put where it is, even in drive.

The dome lights are controllable from the front touch screen. Also, the rear dome lights are touch sensitive to turn them on or off. It's nice to not have to get out and get in back to turn on the lights.

Lastly, there was a complaint above about straight line acceleration. Yesterday I had a little incident which proved to me the value of the instant torque and speed of the Tesla. On my usual route to work, I was in the right lane. The car on my left decided to make a right turn from the left lane. I saw this happening and knew I was about to be smashed on my driver's side. My only option was to get out of the way or get hit. I mashed the pedal (thankfully there was no one ahead of me and literrally in less than a second I was past that idiot. Myheart was racing and adrenaline poured into my body because it was that close of a call. Remember, my GLE was totaled by an idiot who turned left directly in front of me. The tesla was able to evade and avoid the crash. It is also the safest car on the planet if there was a crash, and I feel safe every time I put my 9 month old into it. Somethings are worth more than what you pay for them.

DarrenK.

P.S. Tesla has a referral program that usually provides incentives to the referrer and referee. The current program ends today, but I am sure they will have another starting tomorrow. Most recently the referee got free supercharging for the duration of ownership of the car. If you decide to buy one, make sure you get a code. I am happy to share mine.

Ronglos

Go to Tesla X forum and read about the shudder. That issue alone decided the purchase for me. I'm waiting for the 2019 GLE 53. As far as the I-Pace goes I don't want a $90K vehicle that is going to become a taxi by Waymo.