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Anyway, after being on hold for 30 minutes, the MB parts guy came on the phone and was very helpful. He acknowledged that MB doesn't list a separate part for the clip, at least not in conjunction with the X204 chassis. Happily, the part number referenced earlier in this thread (for a W211) seemed to work for him, and he had them in stock.
I did look at the splines in the outer joint, and they're not any deeper than the "non-affected" splines on the axle, so I'm not at all worried about doing a little creative grinding on the axle.
The other "interesting twist" is that I only recovered about 1/3 of the original C-clip, so am going to power-wash the joint to flush out any remaining debris (including ground-up C-clip, spline debris, and brass particles from the drift (which no longer looks like a new drift - LOL). I'm going to hit it with degreaser, and power wash it, then clean it out with compressed air, and THEN grease it.
I should have been done with this job hours ago (and well onto the next one). ;-)
Thanks. I now have 10 leak free miles under my belt! (Twelve, if you count the two from the first test drive, before the clamps let go.) Cautiously optimistic. I have European worm clamps (also called non-perforated) on all positions except the large outer one.
I'm not at all worried about doing a little creative grinding on the axle.
The C-ring has to have a square surface to bear on, so every spline supports the ring when it's square with the c/l of the shaft (if you ever want to get it off again...). Also, you don't want to have the C-ring any farther out on the axle than absolutely necessary, so the joint can't get a "running start" to come loose,
going to power-wash the joint to flush out any remaining debris
No need to do that. The joint is easy to disassemble. Just move the star piece to an extreme angle with one ball at the peak. Keep going until the retainer piece is also at an extreme angle, and pop the ball out. (I'm not sure, but there may be one or more ***** that have more freedom in the retainer for that purpose, in other words, there is one ball to start with). Anyhow, once you have one out, you can move to the next one, and so on.
I found instructions in the WIS somewhere and they mentioned marking the star and the retainer so you can get them back in the same relationship. Can't hurt, but we never used to do that.
[Edit] Found it...
[Edit2] I think the only reason to start with a particular ball is if you have the axle in, as in the attachment. In that case the axle limits the angle you can move the joint to. Without the axle it shouldn't matter.
Last edited by John CC; 07-12-2024 at 05:44 PM.
Reason: add attachment
I got it done (nearly - the last insult was that my camera / phone battery ran out, and I'm having to wait for a while for it to recharge). I'm pretty sure that the power washing did the trick - it was interesting how tight the CV joint got when there was no longer any lube on it at all - it was nearly impossible to move. A little PB Blaster, and it was flopping around like a landed fish. More washing, and a serious grease application, and I've just about got it together. Just have to torque down the strut bolts, drive the axle in to fully seat the inner joint (on the intermediate shaft), though it's just about there now, and of course, installing and torquing down that huge axle bolt.
Oh, and THEN I get to start on replacing the two lower control arms, and do a video explaining that odd camber adjustment bolt thing. Fun day... ;-)
The closest MB dealer to me does not have an online parts dept so I go on the MB of Boston website and look for parts by part #. I will print out the page and bring it with me to the local MB parts dept and just hand them over saying I need these... Either they end up having it in stock or else they will order it and it comes in a day or two. They wont order parts for me unless I pay first so thats why I just go down, not giving my credit info over the phone. I always get the parts for the listed price.
They're reusable and don't require a special tool. I don't think there is any way you can install the large clamp on the inner boot in situ if you use the Oedtker clamp. (I couldn't see any reasonable way to get that driver out, either, without some major disassembly.) Sometimes new is not better. More often it's faster and/or cheaper.
They're reusable and don't require a special tool. I don't think there is any way you can install the large clamp on the inner boot in situ if you use the Oedtker clamp. (I couldn't see any reasonable way to get that driver out, either, without some major disassembly.) Sometimes new is not better. More often it's faster and/or cheaper.
Worm-gear clamps on a high-speed rotating assembly, with associated micro-vibrations, doesn't give me a warm cuddly feeling. Just have this picture, in my mind, of them loosening over time. Of course anywhere you use them on a vehicle will subject them to some vibration but I think the clamps would be happier on a non-moving radiator pipe.
May just be paranoia on my part (but I know "they" are watching me!)
They have an offset tool for the clamps. Lisle 30600. They do not seem to have the cutouts in the handles to insert breaker bars though I guess you can slide a pipe over the handle if more leverage is needed. I've seen unbranded ones for around $15, or Lisle which is $30+.
What about trying to clamp them from the bottom under the car? Instead of having the ear pointing up in the wheel well have it on the bottom. Wonder if there is more space.
Honestly, I don't know why / how the C-clip got so mangled during my disassembly, or if taking the joint off with a puller instead of (starting it with) brute force would have mattered. It would have to be more pleasant!
FWIW, I did start out with a brass drift and BFH, and was getting nowhere - it did seem that the joint moved a mm or two, but that was it. I ended up cutting off a narrow-headed bolt to "just the right length" and dropped it down the bore, with the outer joint axle stub pointing straight up. Then I used the old (soon to be trashed) axle bolt, and ground down the nose a bit just to avoid any issues with buggered threads way, way down inside the axle stub. That did end up pushing the joint off, though not entirely. I'm going to be putting together a video on this - I think... it's a little odd to put up videos where you run into problems, but OTOH, my most popular video was the four hours per side effort to get the rear CV axle stubs out of the hubs on my 5-series BMW. ;-)
The axle looks great - I really can't see it having any issues. The bands are tight, and the boot is on straight and where it should be. I will say that the el cheapo tool I bought was a bit short of impressive. It did the job, but took a LOT of grip to get the right "pinch" on the clamps. Maybe it's better that it kept me from any possibility of over-clamping them?
I followed that up with replacing my lower control arms, alternator and oil filter / cooler housing gaskets. It's been a fun 24 hours. Anyone got a phone number for therapy? ;-)
Worm-gear clamps on a high-speed rotating assembly, with associated micro-vibrations, doesn't give me a warm cuddly feeling.
We used them in all SAABs from about 1967 to 1985 with no issues. Easy off, easy on.
Originally Posted by MBKLUE
.Somehow seems more "sympathetic" than slide hammer violence
That's pretty slick! and would work in the vehicle, if you could be sure not to pull the inner joint apart.
Originally Posted by TimC300
They have an offset tool for the clamps. Lisle 30600.
That looks like it might work. Problem is, I need to pass all tool purchases by my CFO. With all the e-torx and triple square stuff, I've over drawn my line item.
Originally Posted by TimC300
What about trying to clamp them from the bottom under the car?
I don't think it would work. there is structure all the way around the inner joint right where the clamps sits.
Originally Posted by habbyguy
Honestly, I don't know why / how the C-clip got so mangled during my disassembly,
I think one of the ends of the clip must have gotten caught in the gap. That tool would help keep things square and avoid that problem. Maybe the spline got damaged during a previous repair, and that allowed the clip to get cocked. I wish I would have had the guts to try "the old way" on mine.
I don't suppose you have a picture of the damaged spline you encountered, do you? Or should I wait for "Film at 11"?
Here's a photo of the axle stub (the splines that go into the outer CV joint) after I got done grinding on it, with a cameo appearance by the brand new $5 C-clip.
I did the video and posted it about an hour and a half ago, and already have 22 views (I suspect it's folks here wanting to see the carnage). ;-) I never did a video where I used SO much (very!) fast-motion, and deleted SO many scenes (including way, way too many minutes of me pounding on the brass drift, to no apparent results)...
Yeah, I think those missing spline bits are the issue. When you force the ring against the spline teeth, it has nowhere to go so it compresses into the groove and the joint slides off. With the missing pieces it can get forced outward, bent, and eventually broken. The question, of course, is which came first?
That's a distinct possibility, though the CV axle didn't show signs of former work (or abuse). For whatever reason, that C-clip just got caught between the grooves and the spline teeth, and got munched. Now that it's together, I'm not at all worried about it coming apart again (errr, hopefully I'll never need to make that happen!).
I've used those for years, for coolant hose applications, although I've never heard of them referred to as European worm gear clamps. I would just consider them "common sense" worm gear clamps :-) The cheap perforated hose clamps, without rolled edges, are just a bad design and abusive to rubber hoses.
The only experience I have with the worm type clamps are when trying to repair garden hoses. It seems when I try to really tighten them down using a ratchet and socket they start skipping and will only get so tight.
I like the idea of using the OE clamps because it shows you how tight they should be by measuring the width of the crimp. I had originally thought there was a specific torque setting for them which is why I wanted the crimping tool with the cut-outs to use a torque wrench.
07-12-2024, 05:06 PM
